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LinuxPDA EPOCH 32? 52

mindscream writes "I am starting a project to port Linux to the EPOCH 32 architecure which is what PSIONs amungst others use. I need information about what Linux needs to know from the boot loader and what it would usually need from the BIOS, or if you know a reason why what I intend to do is impossible please add your comment! There should be some info on my web site soon, ALSO I am looking for others who would like to help even if you only would like to beta test drop me a line! "
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LinuxPDA EPOCH 32?

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  • by Anonymous Coward
    Hi, I am attempting to port Linux to my Tamagotchi, I need info on how to interface with the three little buttons. If successful I will attempt to port it to related platforms such as my Digimon. My goal is to get x running in less than a week. If you have anything to contribute or a reason why this is impossible please let me know.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 29, 1999 @11:57PM (#1494656)
    I am starting a project to port Linux to the Intel Pentium architecure which is what DELLs and GATEWAYs amungst others use.

    I haven't done any research on the subject so far and am also ignorant if it has been done already, but never mind.

    I need information about what Linux needs to know from the serial mouse and what it would usually need from the keyboard, or if you know a reason why what I intend to do is impossible please add your comment!
  • OK, forget the first part of his question, but what about the BIOS? Does an up-and-running Linux system use the BIOS at all? I've seen comments indicating that it doesn't, but I see plenty of picbios calls in driver source. And what part does the BIOS play in the boot sequence? Inquiring minds want (and need) to know...

  • Linux already runs on the Series 5 and Geofox 1 (EPOC/32) palmtops. You can find out about it at Calcaria [calcaria.net], home of the Linux-7110 project (for Linux on the ARM 7110). Note that Linux-7110 uses 2.2 series kernels, rather than the 2.0 kernel (mentioned by the originator of this thread at his project web page [freeserve.co.uk] (which was incorrectly referenced in the original article).

    A project that is worth pursuing without reinventing the wheel would be to fix the ARLO boot loader so that it works on the OS5 release of EPOC/32 used in the Series 5MX, Series 7, Revo, and NetBook computers. Because of substantial device driver changes in this release, ARLO doesn't work any more and some porting work is required.

  • But this only works if you can actually spell "EPOC" ;-)
  • Looks like it, the fron screen isn't refreshing anyway.

  • You can already do NFS over the serial port using p3nfs [ic.ac.uk]. I use it all the time with my series 5mx, for easy backups and access to data like that *snaps fingers*. :-) Now, this is with the Psion as the NFS server; you can't go the other way around, which is perhaps what you meant.

    I love Linux, but EPOC32 is already a very solid, responsive OS for a palmtop. I don't see the need for my Psion to run Linux.

  • what you should be doing is looking @ the ARM arch !


    yes rebel and netwinder but thats not all ARM do !

    think of all those 3com NIC's they all have ARM inside

    INTEL have payed money and I wonder what intels SOC chip is going to be based on (-;


    a poor student @ bournemouth uni in the UK (a deltic so please dont moan about spelling but the content)
  • by 198348726583297634 ( 14535 ) on Monday November 29, 1999 @11:55PM (#1494663) Journal
    http://www.calcaria.net/ [calcaria.net]

    The Calcaria Linux project already boots linux on the psion series 5. I'd have tested it, but I'm lazy. ;) Also, I can't quite understand the use of linux on this device. The Epoc32 operating system already interfaces with the touch screen, which Linux doesn't (yet.) Epoc32 has a lot of very useful apps built in, that the Linux command-line would have trouble replacing... and I hardly see the advantage of running Linux /and/ and X server on the palmtop, just to replace the word processor that Epoc already provided in the rom. The file management is well-enough thought out that you don't need to do anything through the command line (no, not that linux console is only command-line-based, but that midnight commander won't do a better job than epoc's file manager.)

    The one advantage of Linux that I can see is the interfacing. if you were running linux on the palmtop and on the desktop, you could do nfs over the serial port for easy backups and access to data like that *snaps fingers*

    In fact, that's the one thing I regret about the psion- it doesn't have any easy way to access the gigs of data I have on my hard drive. Granted, I've got desktop apps for that, but it'd be /kinda/ cool to have the interoperability in both directions :)

    anyway, sorry for the rant...

  • It'd take a lot of convincing for me to get involved with helping someone:

    1. Who can't spell EPOC.

    2. Who doesn't know that EPOC is the OS, not the hardware platform - the platform is an ARM chip.

    3. Who doesn't know that someone's already got Linux running on a couple of the Psion units.

    Open source doesn't mean "I propose something and thousands of people do it". It means "I do my own research, and I get something going, and people get involved then."
  • It's an admirable aim, but... a) it's already being worked on - the project was started, IIRC, by Ed Bailey of Redhat, and b) It's EPOC32, not EPOCH32. :-)

    For those Psion S5/5mx/7/Revo/netBook and Ericsson MC218 users who read slashdot, check out epoczone.com [epoczone.com] (freshmeat-like) and epocnews.com [epocnews.com] (/.-like). :-)

    Jon.
  • www.calcaria.net


    Kaa
  • This is an Ask Slashdot back in July: http://slashdot.org/asksla shdot/99/07/29/2213213_F.shtml [slashdot.org], posted by Cliff.

    This post number #13 (can't get the URL to work) talks about the port, already, back then.

    --Donate food by clicking: www.thehungersite.com [thehungersite.com]

  • Come on moderators, this is pretty funny.

    --Donate food by clicking: www.thehungersite.com [thehungersite.com]

  • by Dacta ( 24628 ) on Tuesday November 30, 1999 @03:15AM (#1494669)

    I've seen a few pretty bad stories posted on Slashdot befoer, but this is.. well.. embarrassing.

    Before you even consider a port of Linux to another architecture, it might be good if you had a little look at the source, and did one or two web searches.

    As for the story.. well it has been pointed out that there are already ports running.

    Guess what a search on linux EPOC port on www.google.com turned up?

    Calcaria Linux7k [calcaria.net]
    ...a project to port the unix-like operating system Linux to a small...
    ...running on the 5mx, but changes in the EPOC OS mean that our boot loader,...
    www.calcaria.net/ Cached (5k) [slashdot.org] New! Try out GoogleScout [slashdot.org]

    Calcaria Linux7k [calcaria.net]
    ...the Linux 7k project. A series of developers have set out to port...
    ...the EPOC operating system, since it will be replaced by Linux....
    www.calcaria.net/engppro.html Cached (15k) [slashdot.org] New! Try out GoogleScout [slashdot.org]

    As the first two results. Cliff, normally your stories are good. It would take two seconds. Enough said.

    --Donate food by clicking: www.thehungersite.com [thehungersite.com]

  • Ports of the linux kernal to Psion are relatively useless... If you really want a linux-based palmtop, then, pitch your idea to venture capitalists, and design one that is really useful, because, as far as I know, EPOC32 is a very easy to use/quick/simple Operating system for these systems.

    Another great project could be to create a Linux clone of Psi-Win, that would be useful.

    If I've offended anyone over this, then I am Sorry, Linux is a great OS, on desktops/workstations/servers/etc. but on palmtops it will need a lot of work before it will be a viable option, and frankly, it would be a more useful expenditure of all of our time, to make the current options (PalmOS, and EPOC32) Syncronize, etc, with Linux. Lots of people use these devices, the operating systems work fine, and these people would have one less reason to not use linux if they can sync up these devices quickly and easily.

    Oh, and you really don't need a Beowulf of these things.

    Just a Rant people...
  • you should however blame cliff for not picking up on it. Do a little research befor posting an ask /. letter

    Its obvious the guy who asked /. didn't know other work was being done. Thats why he asked /. I dont know how hard it is to find out...

    I would however go down to the bottom of the main /. page and SEARCH [slashdot.org] for psion and click on the 5th LINK [slashdot.org].

    At least that is what i would do if i were given the oppoturnity to decide what would be posted on /.

    john


    john
  • by sufi ( 39527 ) on Monday November 29, 1999 @11:46PM (#1494672) Homepage
    http://www.gumbley.demon.co.uk/psion-c.html has some psion/linux related material from people working on the psion-c project.

    Also check out previous /. story:

    http://slashdot.org/articles/99/09/16/2354216.sh tml

    Which has a few threads about running linux on it. I can't see any reason why not, you can get it running on nokia phones and palms, and there is very little technical reason why it wouldn't that I can think of. Keep us posted!

  • There is already one project with similar goals, which has been able to run Linux on a Psion Series 5, which is originally an EPOC (sp!) device. See Calcaria Linux 7k Project [calcaria.net] for more information.
  • And he spelled his own URL incorrectly. It should have been:

    http://www.cubicle2.freeserve.co.uk/ [freeserve.co.uk]

    Care to explain the confusion, mindscream?

  • I think what the people behind the Linux for Psion PDAs have in mind is that they really like the form factor and keyboard of these little and very portable devices. They really don't want an organizer - they want a Linux portable that fits in your shirt pocket.

    In addition, the porting experience will prove helpful in designing future PDAs possibly based on Linux, such as the Itsy [digital.com] (BTW, I saw Itsy 2 in action at the International Symposium on Wearable Computing 99 - it's smaller than the original Itsy and runs X. I think Linux does have a future on palmtop-sized devices as well.)

    I agree with you, Linux is great on the desktop, though there will need to be made a lot of work to make Linux the best, especially in the user interfaces. My personal preference of course, but I find almost any other OS desktop to be more comfortable than KDE, Gnome or any other window manager.
  • by jocks ( 56885 )
    Hi,
    I shall be attempting to drink a bottle of port which is alcohol based and sold amungst other drinks at the bar. My aim is to get an epoch sized hangover and send gibberish to slashdot.

    If you think this is a bad idea or wan't to join me at the bar then please send your comments via the porcelain telephone.
  • Of course, it helps that Epoch32 is the operating system that currently runs on Psion architechture (which runs on StrongARM processors).
  • The Linux7k [calcaria.net] Project is already working on a port to the Series 5. I've had Linux booting on my Psion before, but it's not very usable. They're after help on the Series 5mx if anyone's interested.

  • See http://www.gumbley.demon.co.uk/plptools.html

    plptools allows you to mount a Psion's disks on your UNIX version. I'm working on the Series 3 support when time allows.

    (BTW, the person who mentioned the old psion-c project earlier... sorry, wrong architecture: that was for the Psion Series 3.)

  • Thank you, some people these days, no sense of humour...
  • by stuart_farnan ( 75498 ) on Tuesday November 30, 1999 @12:11AM (#1494681)
    I am currently working on a port of Linux to the Sinclair ZX81. I am not sure if this has been attempted before, but as I have not done much research on the topic, I don't know. If you can help me with any details, such as what Linux might need from the cassette player or the toilet roll printer, please add your comments. Also, if you have any reason why you think what I intend to do is impossible, please let me know.
  • Quite apart from the fact that there are other projects already out there, you ouight to at least get your own URL right...

    Try http://www.cubicle2.freeserve.co.uk/ [freeserve.co.uk] instead
  • yea and Im trying to port a full SuSE distro to my Casio sports watch. Anyone want to help? it'll be real kewl when its done.
  • wont work on any soft toilet roll printer. But Im doing a port to an HP shiny toilet paper printer half works I'll post the source soon. honest
  • by mr ( 88570 ) on Tuesday November 30, 1999 @03:24AM (#1494685)
    Given there is already a 'working proof of concept' at http://www.calcaria.net/ for what you want to do, a NetBSD/Linux CE project, and a few others I don't know about, your time would be better spent thinking small apps.

    NO ONE TO DATE (pubically) is thinking about the address books, e-mail, calander, find, word processor, spreadsheet, web browser, encryption, sync utility (My little 4 meg of DRAM handheld has all of these features...+TCP/IP and 20 megs of FLASH storage for data...and plays quicktime-esque video with sound) to big brother (Desktop, not Big Brother) versions of the same utilites. Oh, and a TCP/IP (or serial/IR) based link to the handheld from the desktop so from your main machine keyboard/screen is an extension of the handheld world.

    Think of the poor 16 megs of handheld DRAM, and the lack of a hard drive. Then, think of the gnome or KDE app you use as a address book/email. Can you shoe-horn your favorite apps into 16 meg, with no hard drive? (Like that PostgreSQL backend for the app....exactly HOW are you going to get that on your handheld?)

    (If I could find the link, I'd post it for the 'replace X on handhelds with this graphics model' effort.)

    And, without a set of apps, no one is going to use ANY OpenSource kernel on a handheld. Because its the app space that makes the kernel useful.

    And I see no evidence of any of the 'productivity apps' I listed above thinking about what needs to be done to have small memory footprint, remote-linking, or much else that is important for the handheld market.

    If you are looking for a project, why not spend time thinking or talking to the designers of the productivity apps to start thinking and designing for small-space apps, and linking to small memory space apps.
  • I think it's impossible because you're not smart enough to do it.

    He was taking the piss I assume BTW

    And if he wasn't - elks
  • Why would anyone want to port a different operating system to the Intel architecture?

    There's already a group in Seattle the writes software for Intel systems. I hear they're working on a Unix port called Xenix, too. Plus, if you want an open-source model, there's a unix-like operating system being worked on by professor Tannenbaum. I'm sure he has done enough for the rest of the world.

    If you really have a burning desire to code, you should help him. You can visit his website at http://www.minix.com.

  • The bizarre thing is that the guy's web page already has a link to the Linux7k project [freeserve.co.uk]. With the correct spelling of EPOC too.
  • The link on the front page blurb leads to http://www.cubicle2.freeserve.oc.uk/ which should be http://www.cubicle2.freeserve.co.uk/ -AC
  • virtual moderation



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