Is Media Attention Bad for Linux? 90
Ender_Stonebender writes "Yahoo's Internet Report news page has an interesting article on why why media attention could be bad for Linux development. They have a byline saying it's from salon.com, but I can't find it there. "
Linux is not predictable by Salon (Score:1)
Yes. In certain cases anyhow... (Score:3)
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hmm... (Score:2)
Where should I go with all my linux questions? (i.e. Websites, IRC channels...)
Didn't we already see this article? (Score:1)
We are notorious are we? (Score:1)
Right boys go get 'em!
Re:Yes. In certain cases anyhow... (Score:1)
With support e-mails bogging programmers down, they need to organize things like listserv help or newsgroup help. I recently subscribed to a listserv for the 3Com network driver to try to figure out a problem with the driver and a newer card that 3Com released. I chose this over going to the programmer first.
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Basically... (Score:2)
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Re:We are notorious are we? (Score:1)
It's only temporary... (Score:1)
a millenialist sort of approach to tech: teams, like some more familiar sport, and playoffs, with winners and losers. Let's face it: computer operating systems are not primetime material. When you get past the idea that 'there can be only one', a lot of the sexy image dissapates and leaves us plain old folk, working as before.
Reminds me of some of the script-kiddie comments in the cDc interview. They come, they go, some small percentage stay behind. A natural life-cycle...
Is someone not paying attention? (Score:5)
While, I think the idea of a survey of Open Source data-points (e.g. employment, work habits, motivation, etc) would be great, I don't get this. If you actually read Eric Raymond's writing, most of it is based on real-world experience with the projects that he has worked on and those that he has had direct contact with. Netscape, for example, provides a wealth of data in their release of the Mozilla source. How much work can be harnessed from the community? Look at the changelogs....
Same goes for things like GNOME. We know exactly how fast a given sized group of hackers can put together a large Open Source software effort, because we've seen it.
What we don't have numbers for, and I don't think that a survey can establish this any better than ESR can, is this: what happens if your company wants to create an Open Source effort around your product? Answering that requires the answers to these questions:
For example, if Sun opened up the source to their C++ compiler, I'm sure the GCC/EGCS folks would enjoy getting a look at how Sun handles some of the SPARC optimization, but I can't see a lot of developers clustering in to help Sun develop their product. It's just not technically interesting enough. It's not portable, it has less than 5 language front-ends and it just doesn't have the clout in the community that GCC has.
On the other hand, if Adobe were to open up the source to Illustrator, and really convince the community that they wanted to jump in with both feet, the way Netscape did, they would have a huge developer interest.
In the end, Open Source is not so much a "phenomenon". This is the way software worked pre-80's. Hiding source seemed to make about as much sense to most people as trying to hide how a lightbulb works. Now, we're coming full circle, and people are cluing in to that. The "Open Source Phenomenon" is just a bunch of people trying to figure out how to make the intervening 20 years of industry make sense....
There ain't no such thing as bad publicity (Score:1)
they've got it wrong i've got it right - nya! (Score:1)
Tis the sad truth (Score:1)
Andrew Leonard: Legend in his own mind (Score:1)
Gotta go, I have to contact Eric Allman on howto write my Sendmail config file.
Re:We are notorious are we? (Score:1)
Wrong, wrong, wrong. (Score:1)
Think about Linus. In the very early days he did it ALL by himself. Now he does very little coding (as far as I understand).
I think this pattern will "trickle down" to other big name developers, who will find themselves being the "executives" of their project or area of development.
The Linux "X-Factor" (Score:3)
Even if Linux, the commercial proposition, died tomorrow, we'd still have a bunch of handy distros that are sold for the sake of convenience, but built for the love of the system.
Andrew Leonard has been pretty good at covering the movement, but the thing that he (and most others) tends to miss is that the traditional rules just don't apply to Linux. If they did, we wouldn't have gotten this far.
- -Josh Turiel
Open Source Evangelists? (Score:3)
I actually enjoy it a bit when I get feedback, even if they are reporting bugs/help, etc.
Linux will get media hype, that's a definite -- it just means that we'll have more evangelists, that enjoy speaking about Linux than writing code, which those people are just as important as the programmers.
I personally love it when people come up to me and say, "Hey -- I heard about that linux thing in and it looks pretty cool, but does it run on windows?" -- I often times wear nerd shirts (Including free shirts from VA,etc) -- then they get enlightened when I say that it is a replacement for windows, they ask where to get more info, and I give them a list of about 5-10 URL's to check out. Silly me.. aside from me I can't think of any developers that get their valuable time taken away. Thank you, drive through.
-= Making the world a better place =-
It's only good. (Score:2)
??? (Score:2)
And that's precisely what this is all about. People who take Linux too seriously. I've got no truck leaving Linux on a whim. It serves my purposes for the time being, but I'm not going to break a sweat trying to beat it into the media or writing flame-email to a CEO who didn't spell Alan Cox' last name correctly. It's not worth the time. Open Source, is great, and I do care about that, but the specific code (like Linux) aren't that important to me.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Overanalyzation by the industry? (Score:4)
I care as much about OpenSource/Linux as the next guy, but I'm sick of reading journalists and web-publishers telling us why something is the way it is. Here's the truth: Stuff happens in complex systems and to try to explain it using two or three examples (like Linux and Apache to explain Open Source) is silly. The computer industry is complicated and I guess I'm just tired of all this hoopla over stuff.
My point? If you like something, and you believe in it, then do it. Write the code you find useful and use the programs you like. Stop worrying whether Linux will overtake Microsoft. Don't lose any sleep over how the Mozilla project is doing. Use what works, and work on what doesn't -- Or don't. But talk is cheap and predictions are even cheaper.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
It's actually quite simple (Score:4)
A: Hey, check out this (algorithm/program/driver) I wrote.
B: That's pretty cool, can I take a look at it?
A: Sure [mails foo.tar.gz]
B: oh man, that's a lot of global variables you're using there
A: I know, gotta get around to fixing that
B: here have this patch, I've managed to kill about half of the globals [mails foo.patch]
A: that rocks, thanks!
scale, repeat
-Laxative
Salon.com (Score:1)
Its the closest section about Free Software/Open Source and Linux.
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the linux era (Score:1)
Re:hmm... (Score:2)
Re:the linux era (Score:2)
Linux might overtake Windows. Then again, it might not. The bottom line is that the end result won't make a huge difference on computing. The real revolutionary stuff isn't tied down to specific operating systems because it's mostly hardware related.
Take speech-recognition for example. It will inevitably replace the majority of keyboard text entry -- I think that's a safe bet. But it doesn't have anything to do with any particular platform. You could write a speech-recognition engine for any platform that can handle a microphone. The only thing it depends on is CPU power and software algorithms. Any algorithm that depends on an OS isn't worth looking at.
So Linux? It's nice, yeah, but I'd leave it in a second if something better came along. So while I'll invest my time in making Linux better, I won't kid myself in thinking that it's anything special. It's just an OS. A tool that I use to run my programs with.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
What's the point? (Score:2)
The Slashdot Headline has very little to do with "why media attention could be bad for Linux development." This issue is brought up in the first paragraph, but is stated in order to bring the real point of the story in a silly by-the-way manner. Did either the submittor or the moderator _read_ the article?
The article itself doesn't say anything except, "Gee, I wonder if this study will get Slashdotted." There isn't a single hard fact in the whole thing, except that there's going to be an acedemic study about Linux GUIs, and that the name of the study is a bad pun of a song by the Kingsmen.
Bad Slashdot. No biscuit.
Bad Salon (or whoever wrote this silly thing) No biscuit.
Re:hmm... (Score:1)
That's my $(2^4*3+1/7%3*2/100)
PR is necessary for world domination (Score:1)
Re:Overanalyzation by the industry? (Score:2)
This may sound melodramatic, but keep in mind that many businesses fail exactly because they are not paranoid enough. Once open source software has been accepted as harmless, you see a lot less of this sort of thing, but that will take some really amazing success stories.
This is the two-edged sword of business involvement. Several years ago, we all wanted to see how far all this could go. Now, we see how far it will go, and some of us, I suspect, are getting cold feet. Yes, the future of Linux is going to be more in marketing than in what the code actually does. Yes, Apache's biggest hurdle in the next 5 years will be building "vertical markets" (whatever the heck those are), and you'll hear no end of it all if you can still stand to read the trade rags.
Nature of the beast. People like RMS thought they could change the world. What they all failed to consider is how much the world would absorb their work and go right on acting like nothing had happend. That's what humans do. Otherwise, we'd still be sitting in a corner kibbying over the implications of the wheel.
Re:Yes. In certain cases anyhow... (Score:2)
Until you REALLY look at it... (Score:1)
a) Begin Design
b) Argue with Marketing about feature excess
c) Argue with Management about timetable
d) Learn Hindi (to talk to your programmers)
e) Write code
f) Debug partially
g) Run out of time
2) Sell Software
3) Make lots of money
4) Aftermath
a) Find horrible bug that kills the computer
b) Find security flaw
c) Release patch
d) Find more bugs and holes
3) Package all patches and fixes into SomeSoftware 2.0
a) Charge $100 for new version
Re:the linux era (Score:1)
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Re:Tis the sad truth (Score:2)
What a great point to bring up! I've been waiting for this subject to pop up for a while. Here's my angle:
This reminds me of something my friend said to me. I was lamenting about how unfriendly the Linux install and setup was to people new to the system, particularly for people new to computers in general. He replied, "no offense, but we, I mean the people who develop Linux, don't really give a damn about those kind of people."
Needless to say, I took offense. It is kind of hard not to.
Now, I understand that point of view. It makes sense for most of the hobiests and moonlighting developers of Linux. But I find it terminally sad that there isn't somebody out there that cares about the newbies. As a "community," if there is such a thing, I'd think you'd be insulted that companies like Microsoft think that they have a better handle on user friendliness than you do.
For the concept of training new developers, it makes perfect sense to be surly and cold towards the newbies. Forcing them to Read The Flatulant Manual first is actually a good exercise. And then after reading the manual having to put the ecoteric connections together breeds a better programmer. And if Linux is only for programmers, that's fine.
And it made me feel smart having to do all that. It was fun.
But, isn't there somebody out there in the development world who thinks that an OS like Linux, with the quality of Linux, could be developed for the layperson?
Wouldn't it just be damned neat?
Can it not be done?
Of course, I'm an art student, and I don't program worth beans. Maybe that's why I care. And maybe my opinion doesn't count in this, because I can't contribute the code. And since I can't contribute the code, I'm not part of the community.
I love Linux, I use it. I love /., it rocks. But attitudes blackenned against the welcoming of new users just leave the public cold, and are bad overall for any sort of movement. And if there is indeed a movement, like OSS. Then somebody needs to put some thought into this.
Until you REALLY look at it... (Score:2)
whoops... sorry (Score:1)
Re:the linux era (Score:3)
Tux the penguin has nothing revolutionary going for him. It's just an implementation of Unix. It's a good one, but it's still comparable to Solaris and others.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
"The media" does not exist. (Score:1)
There exist people in this world that are open to the truth, and there exist people in this world that will be forever ignorant. The latter will always be the majority.
So please, say "bad article" when reading crap like this, but don't fall into the same trap the deluded reporter fell into. Acknowledge that if every media agent was as clueless and careless as Andrew Leonard, we might as well live in a propagandized state.
But also acknowledge that there are a lot more reporters who get it.
On the other hand, reporters (especially for those with a general audience) are supposed to write their stories from the perspective of someone clueless. It illustrates how shallow one's point of view can be.
So in that case, it just goes to show how confused people can be about Linux. This is something I'm assuming everyone reading
J.
Re:Overanalyzation by the industry? (Score:3)
Sorry - back to the topic at hand: I don't think that companies will see Open Source as being "harmless". I'm all for Open Source. It's better for the end-user. But it's far from harmless to software companies. To develop software through open source, companies have to pay developers less. Don't kid yourself about support. Read the GNU manifesto, if you need an outside opinion - Programmers don't have to go hungry, but they won't rack in the bucks through free software.
In case you haven't noticed, I'm not sure that Open Source is the wave of the future. It remains to be seen, in my eyes, whether OS isn't just an industry fad. Only time will tell...
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Re:Tis the sad truth-tis true (Score:1)
You're always going to have that attitude to a certain degree, because Linux will always *need* programmers (success or not). As for 'laypersons' it is not all that unreasonable for the community to ask that the ones coming in have at least the willingness to learn. And at most for them to contribute to the best of their ability. If we were the 'proprietary' industry what newbies could do would be much differant, but we're a community and the rules are different. Were you'll see problems is caused by newbies coming in and wanting to change the community[ make in thy own image], and the community will resisting the change(s).
In answer to your questions can it be done? Short answer is yes. You say you can't code, but you're an art student. Join either the Gnome or KDE teams the gui's could use the touch of someone with an artistic bent. You could join up with a writer and help with documentation. The possibilaties are endless let your imagination wander on that.
Opensource projects & "PR Maintainer" (Score:2)
This guy could also maintain the website, for example, or run the announcement mailing list. In fact, I'd be surprised if there aren't major projects out there not doing this already.
You don't have to be a coder to help with the coding
Sesame street for programmers? (Score:1)
No no no... you don't get it (Score:1)
;)
***Beginning*of*Signiture***
Linux? That's GNU/Linux [gnu.org] to you mister!
What really sucks about media attention ... (Score:4)
I've worked for the last four years as a developer for media institutions, and I've seen how they operate. I've seen positive stories written about Linux, and I've seen negative stories written. However, I've seen very few stories written by people who know Linux.
I don't like journalism, and I don't like writting. But, I feel that it's important that I do write about Linux in the press, only because there are so few people that know what they are talking about. And to be honest, I don't see the situation changing -- not too many journalists are going to be picking up Linux any time in the near future. And, I honestly believe that when and if the initial hype over Linux dies down, the fact that few journalists know Linux will ultimately hurt the system.
So what's the solution? Well, I'll continue to write pieces occassionally for publication. And, if you can write, I suggest that you write articles as well. It's easy -- did you write good essays in English? If so, you can probably write for publication. Write a piece -- it's easier if it's something you believe in -- and contact the editor of some magazine. Ask them if they'll read your article. If it's any good, they'll run it. It's also easier to get published on the Web (and possibly more effective) -- paper's expensive.
Cheers,
Travis
Hmm.. (Score:1)
Well, by its very nature, "open source" is a kind of marketing buzzword. It was designed to be that way, because the term "free software" was considered too "threatening" to big business. Certain elements of the free software community, including RMS, weren't particularly concerned with this, IIRC. After all, the objective was to create and promote free software, not to court proprietary software.
Besides, as I pointed out in an earlier conversation, companies had already started producing distributions of GNU/Linux some time before "open source" was coined, and because of the Internet and the Web, we don't need "big business" to help us out with distribution. Anyone who wants, can get. Back in the day it wasn't so simple. You had to have some corporate backing so that they would produce your product en masse for anyone who wanted it to have access to it.
Since those rules have changed, part of ESR foundation for his efforts, that he doesn't want to see another hacker project "fail" even though it is technically superior, is highly unfounded. The corporate machine is not needed to drive accesibility and/or popularity in this case. That must be hard to see for some, but it seems painfully obvious..
That said, hey, AJS, while I will begin by saying I do indeed have the deepest respect for you, I might inquire what you meant by "Several years ago, we all wanted to see how far all this could go."? What I mean is this: Did you mean the free software community in general, hackers in general, etc.? Neither of the above would make sense with such a blanket statement because not everyone shares the same outlook. Far from it, of course. ;)
No such thing as bad press?? (Score:1)
Media like THIS is bad for any movement. I never seen a link to a survey here, let alone received a secret handshake and told to *wink* vote early and often.
Maybe Andrew Leonard aleonard@salon.com [mailto] doesn't think there really is so much open-source support out there, and it must all be propaganda. Feel free to mail his editor at letters@salon.com. [mailto]
Not quite.. (Score:1)
Linus did more of it himself back in the "very early days" (unless, of course, you mean that as in "the days before he ever posted anything about his kernel to comp.os.minix"), but he didn't go it alone for very long. IIRC, he had a fair share of help before approaching a 1.0 release, and certainly before it was the friendliest kernel in the world. ;) Actually, the only truly worthwhile thing about the book, Open Sources (besides hearing Linus slam Emacs, among other things.. and no, I'm not a vi fan, I'm an Emacs fan, but I still think its funny! ;), is the appendix which has compiled a number of the postings from comp.os.minix, which revolve around an argument between AST and Torvalds, but has a healthy dose of information contained within them.
The introduction, on the other hand, only serves to prove how clueless the editing staff is, even if most of what they say was true. The some of it that wasn't was really.. sad. =P
Witness Slashdot.. (Score:2)
..the hub around which hackers organize their efforts! *cough* get a life idiot media types *cough* ever heard of Usenet? *cough* Seriously, though, people who work on projects in the free software community tend to organize their efforts around the most unlikely of things.. like the developer's mailing list for the project(s) in question? (and what's this damn CVS thingie!? ok, so I'm not being totally serious.. who cares? you'll get my point or you won't)
During the cDc discussion someone was saying how cDc made "us" [Slashdot] look like a bunch of hackers who were concerned with our public image, and this was somehow exemplified by the hacker/cracker debate that would go on for years to come. There is, however, a glaring contradiction. Any hacker (and indeed, anyone motivated enough to look at the Jargon File or read a copy of John Levy's Hackers.. or, for that matter, exist for very long around somehow who is clued in) knows what a hacker is, and what a cracker is. Anyone who thinks the terms mean the same thing, or that "cracker is only a food product", is obviously not a hacker.
The other interesting note is this: how many hackers really care about their "public image"? If that was really the case, there would be more of an effort to debunk the media's inappropriate usage of the term. But then, I haven't seen any Web sites chalk full of hacker != cracker propaganda (that is, it is devoted solely to that purpose), which is likely what it would take a /lot/ of. Point is, most hackers prefer to spend their time, hmm.. hacking? ESR is not our "brain leader" (less people agree with him than he or the media seems to think, at least with regards to any number of his "major" stances on issues.. I doubt anyone disagrees with /everything/ he does/says). Hackers are not Borg. Most boring, pointless generalizations will fail to stick, and only serve to prove that the speaker really doesn't understand the topic of their discourse.
So, since there is so much controversy on the subject, it seems reasonable to conclude that, indeed, most of Slashdot's readership does not include hackers. This is "News for Nerds", not "News for J. Random Hacker". Geeks, supposed uber geeks, and yes, hackers, read this site, but if you think most of the people here are hackers.. well.. heh. What can I say?
Ok, now I'm going back to sleep. Maybe I'll wish I had edited this, because I tend to do some pretty odd things without caffeine and/or rest. ;)
Re:Not quite.. (Score:1)
I also think he did much more on a day by day basis from the original post to 1.0 then he has been lately.
Of course this is all based on highly questionable sources on the internet!
Anyway, I stand behind the idea that it is a "normal" open source phenomenon for the "key" developer(s) to become the "manager(s)" of an OSS project.
-Peter
Door swings both ways. (Score:3)
Good Effects: Joe User walks into Software Hut and sees a box of {insert your fav. distro here} sitting on a shelf. Thinks "Hey isn't this that new OS everyone's trying?" Joe has just supported the Cause. Due to supporting the Cause, Mr. Software company sees Joe's purchase and decides to build more apps, thus furthering the Cause. Joe may see something in the OS that he doesn't like, and may learn programming to fix it. Joe gets that nice feeling of accomplishment, posts fix to a user group and gets mild recognition for his discovery.
Bad Effects: Joe User thinks that the install will be just like it is on Windoze and tries to use it on some non-supported stuff. Joe User is not familiar with the concept of checking for a more recent build or drivers. Joe User is fustrated by lack of boxed software and keeps on using Ms Windows. More people start to think that Linux can "Save the World" and get really upset when they find that "Yes, it breaks like any other piece of software out there"
As a community we really to need to make sure that the Media knows that Linux is not a cure-all, yet. It is an excellent option for someone who knows what they are doing and is not afraid to tinker. We must avoid the "Holier-then-thou" mentality that I see perodically affecting the Mac world. Most newbies are really skittish about not being comfortably in the majority where each need is attended to by some thing you are not allowed to change. This is a brave new world gentlemen, and we must see that the way is made ready for the huddled masses yearning to breath free. I ask each of you to take a newbie in hand and explain to them the ins and outs, don't send them packing off to a FAQ without an explanation. Remember, you were once new as well.
But, in all seriousness, whatever attention Linux gets at this point is good. Look at what John C. Davorak did for the iBook.
Open source "hackers"... (Score:2)
Choosing one's battlefields (Score:3)
Media attention can be bad for Linux and the OSS community, but only if it deludes the community into playing by the media's rules. You see, you have to understand how the media operates.
Take political coverage, for example. In politics, liberals complain that the media is biased towards conservatives, and conservatives complain that the media is biased towards liberals. Both camps are missing the point. The media does have a bias, all right, but it's not towards liberals or conservatives -- it's towards controversy, which sells newspapers and attracts eyeballs. Thus, the Prime Directive is, if controversy exists, great; if not, find something that could be construed as controversial and put it front and center -- even if the controversy is artificial.
You can see this same dynamic occuring in coverage of the open source movement. Every journalist who wants to write about Linux wants to do so in the context of Linux vs. Windows. When will Linux push Windows off the desktop? This is the only question journalists care about. Why? Because it's dramatic -- and it's easy to get people to pay attention to a story with inherent drama.
The problem with this is, a story about Linux vs. Windows isn't, when you think about it, really about Linux. Linux is just filling the "designated MS challenger" role in these stories -- ten years ago it would have been Apple, five years ago Netscape, now it's Linux. It's an artificial controversy. Nobody here really believes that Linux is ready for the consumer desktop, right? What's important is that Linux is smacking NT around in the server space, Apache is wiping the floor with IIS in web serving, etc.
But the danger here is if people in the community start believing those stories -- and decide that Linux's destiny is to kill MS. This fits the media's agenda more than it does the community's, because it will stir up huge amounts of controversy around something that's basically very silly. And then, because Linux isn't really ready for the desktop yet, the media will declare MS the winner, and go looking for the next story -- and the bubble of interest in Linux will burst. It's the classic game from the schoolyard, "Let's You and Him Fight", writ large -- and just like in the schoolyard, it'd be a mistake to get suckered into playing.
Re:Tis the sad truth (Score:1)
Somebody has. They're called TiVo [tivo.com] . :-)
Seriously, though -- it's an interesting question. IMHO, Linux will get more suited for the consumer desktop when one of two things happen:
I would say that the best prospects for a consumer-friendly Linux aren't in the realm of general-purpose computing, but rather in specialized devices like the TiVo, where consumers are going to expect a crash-free user experience, and you can expect once you get the device configured nobody's going to tinker with it. (Good luck building a crash-free appliance around WinCE!) Which is actually probably good news for Linux, since there'll probably be more growth in demand for these devices in the next several years than there will be for desktop PCs anyway...
Wanting to know the future (Score:2)
They want to know: do I brush up on my Unix skills and get Red Hat Linux certification? For my Oracle skills, should I be W2K certified, or is *nix certification more marketable?
We know where the future is going, but they don't.
Are you sure ...? (Score:2)
Re:you got some balls... (Score:2)
If you are a newbie it is okay to ask questions to gurus as long as you tell them that you have looked for the information and give them some idea that you know what you are doing. Don't worry about being flammed unless you are being a jerk. Half the gurus are jerks themselves. You need to sound confident and not desperate.
I speak from personal experience.
***Beginning*of*Signiture***
Linux? That's GNU/Linux [gnu.org] to you mister!
Re:Linux is not predictable by Salon (Score:1)
Most of their Linux articles are pro-Linux.
Linux and newbies (Score:2)
You are talking about one guy, how can you make a generalization from that? There are obviously lots of people involved with Linux that care about newbies - who do you think is putting together the new graphical installs, the KDE gui stuff, etc, etc? Who writes all the howtos? And there are lots of Linux companies coming into the game that care a lot about newbies. There are also zillions of people out there hanging on chat channels for the express purpose of helping newbies (incidently, most of them are hardly out of the newbie category themselves).
Just remember that if you're a complete newbie, you have to be careful not to jump into the middle of forums where developers are exchanging ideas and start grabbing the bandwidth for yourself. Better to just sit and lurk, soak up what you can, then go off to find a more suitable forum for your questions.
Re:Yes. In certain cases anyhow... (Score:1)
Pay Attention to your media's needs! (Score:2)
Have you developed a proper maintenance schedule for your media? Checked for bad sectors and lost files?
Have you defragmented lately?
Do you make frequent backups?
Not only is media attention good for Linux, its good for any OS.
Re:the linux era (Score:2)
Tux the penguin has nothing revolutionary going for him. It's just an implementation of Unix. It's a good one, but it's still comparable to Solaris and others.
Yes and no. The greatest difference isn't the specific technology but the development model. In a commercial world where a company wants to make a profit, it doesn't pay off to keep working on a released product, it's more profitable to publish a new full version instead of just an update. Whatever is released is already outdated at the time of public retail, the creators are already working on a better version that is supposed to replace the old one once it isn't selling well enough anymore. The moment you buy some new software, it's already old stuff for the producer, they don't want to fix it (for existing customers) but concentrate on the successor (which is supposed to bring them more new customers). That's why products die and are replaced so quickly in the commercial world.
But Linux is different. The latest technology is already there right now, publically available for all who're interested (i.e. developers), open to be examined and enhanced. That's the special thing about Open Source. Sure, there are many other benefits, but the best thing is the guaranteed evolution. Open source software will be maintained as long as there is interest, and with all the time and energy invested in Linux already, people won't just drop it once something "better" comes along. Instead it can be made better all the time, it is actively evolved, it thrives in the open (contrary to commercial proprietary products). The philosophy is not to reinvent the wheel all the time, a problem should be solved only once, so all that energy can be used for other work that has not been done before. Sometimes there are drastic changes but thanks to Linux's open source nature, it's pretty easy to adapt it to a different environment, and you can always keep the theory and design principles if the actual code ever became useless (Quantum computing or something totally different from our binary computers). If anything, it's Linux and other open source projects that have best chances to be useful and up-to-date for a long time to come...
Re:hmm... (Score:1)
Re:We are notorious are we? (Score:1)
Well, ok.. :) (Score:1)
Of course, that could either be when he announced the project or when the AST vs. Torvalds debate began. I believe it was bootable at that point as well (before either, actually, though I could be wrong.. I haven't looked into it that much because I wasn't /that/ concerned).
Hopefully you didn't regard my reply as any kind of attack. After all, I used a qualifier, which has now been cleared up. *grin*
Yeah, especially now, what with Transmeta and all. I believe he spends more time rejecting so-called kludges and having people who want their code in the kernel rewriting it a few times than doing any actual code himself, which is fine, though amusing, given the "history" the media suggests surrounding Linux. Ha!
Face it, all sources are highly questionable unless you /are/ the source. Sucks, but it's true. I sure don't trust the media at /all/ since I can debunk most of their techno-babble. If they don't research anything, how can I be assured of their veracity? Ugh. I need better quality news..
Quite true. Whether or not the key development team remains the maintainers is entirely another story, however. .. ;)
Re:"The media" does not exist. (Score:1)
I don't think the attention is bad (Score:1)
Re:the linux era (Score:1)
once people start using it at work, and kids start learning C in 4th grade, who knows what sort of stuff can happen, but open source will be at the core. open source makes better software than corporations (unless the corporation is exactly the right size, but it will rarely happen because when a company of 8 close friends makes awesome software, they become millionaires and stop coding) and thats what these university professors are interested in.
but it's going to be tough because we're a bunch of 5h1t disturbers that won't think twice about skewing some lamer's website pole. but as i said before, the whole idea of trying a website pole is retarded and so is salon for thinking that pointing that out was news.
don't worry everyone, i have finally figured out how to do a 'br' to start a new paragraph. {8']
speed typing (oftopik) (Score:1)
but one thing i do want is two clipboards. so like ctrl-x, ctrl-c, and ctrl-v deal with one set of copied text, and like ctrl1,ctrl2, ctrl3 deal with another set. so you can paste a big huge chunk, then another big huge chunk.
get it? anyone?
code it! call it Harvey.
hehehe.
Media attention is just part of the LifeCycle (Score:2)
Like others have said here, the Media doesn't get Linux any more than they really get the elegence of shared memory. But the Media has become a fine-honed nose for that ineffable shift in social winds, and they pounce on it.
So, in the case of Linux, what are they really sensing? There's several assumptions that have been laid down by interested parties in the IT industry that are being challenged by Linux:
1) Quality software can't be created unless it is by a micro-managed team of programmers.
2) The commercial marketplace will never stand for an 'unsupported' product for their mission-critical applications.
3) Closed source software is inherently more secure than open source versions of same.
4) The best programmers are motivated by money, not fame, or the satisfaction of producing a quality product.
Obviously, we in the Linux community know these assumptions to be nothing but commercial pap. But as more commercial users quietly integrate Linux and its bretheren into their IT workloads, enlightenment occurs, and the established closed source companies start feeling pressure from lost sales and less control.
That is the phenomenon that the Media senses and is reporting on. They may or may not connect the dots, and realise that the internet and linux have blown open the doors of information distribution in other ways, eventually toppling dictatorships and two-party systems alike. Now there is a story worthy of print.
But beware: there will come a time when Linux is on the downslope of its lifecycle. Most of the hip hackers will have moved on to the Next Great Thing, and those who stubbornly cling to the glory days of linux will be viewed much like the BBS operators today who view the internet as the technology which put them out of business, and out of control of their own little domains.
The article was on Salon ! (Score:1)
I was actually wondering why no one submited that story a long time ago.. Thought of doing that myself, but having submitted about 5/6 so far and having all of them rejected by our friendly CmdrTaco, I decided against it
Maybe next time !!
Manifest
Re:Linux and newbies (Score:1)
Too, true.
I imediately regretted the tone of my words and logic after I posted my reply. Although, I figured it would get some good responces anyways. I apologize.
However, I was addressing an attitude that is prevalent in some people that really gets my goat. I suppose that's flamebait, but... I coulda worded it differently. I'm not a complete newbie, but I think that the newbie's first impression of things can be important sometimes. Don't you?
Again, I apologize for my rashness.
Re:Tis the sad truth-tis true (Score:1)
Indeed. And despite my previous language, it should be no other way. Actually, it would be difficult to define a community as something that is so all inclusive. But these problems that arise can lead to some pretty good results, as well as some pretty bad results.
The pressure might cause the community to close up and become xenophobic in some areas.
It might cause it to refine its "imegrant" mechanism to increase or decrease the experience of the people allowed "in."
And it might cause the community to suffer a grand paradigm shift, or to buckle completely and split.
Or it might just change a few attitudes here and there, just enough to prevent too much strife with neighboring communities.
I guess I was adding to the strife...
Anyway, here's an interesting question for the benefit of us newbies: What seems to be happening along these lines in the OSS community?
I wouldn't expect anyone to speak for the whole community, that'd be naive. But speculations would be interesting, no?
Linux media attention (Score:2)
Programming and speech recognition (Score:1)
you might be wrong there - in a world of keyboards, programming languages are designed to be typeable, not pronounceable. yet who said this is the only way to describe algorithms exactly?
i predict that when speech recognition is widely accepted, a coding language that could justly be called "talk" will come up. it will not look just like c, probably longer through replacement of characters by words and it will use keywords easily distinguishable by sound. maybe it will sound like mathematicians' talk.
this is just such an idea i just had, maybe you can improve on it.
Kiwaiti