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Windows Domination May End Next Year 231
Non-Newtonian Fluid writes "The Register has an interesting article which explains exactly how Linux could rise up and defeat M$ by taking advantage of the Easy PC specification and Micro$oft's own inability to keep pace with the demands of new hardware. " The article also mentions BeOS and other possible Windows competitors. A good "makes you think" piece.
FUD crap (Score:1)
Dude, if you can't see the difference between KDE and Gnome 1 year ago and KDE / Gnome today and then extrapolate that to 1 year from today, then you are a short-sighted nit picker.
Whats with the terminology "rogue Linux developers"? You are a fudding stupid sh*t. The well organized and highly productive team of KDE and Gnome have surpassed MacOS and Windows both in a number of areas and are rapidly catching up in others.
And because we have these highly competitive, productive forces, crap GUIs like MS consumer OS are quickly looking less attractive (they have always been less stable).
Re:Linux != Easy to use (Score:1)
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:1)
Re:Linux != Easy to use (Score:1)
History will speak for itself.
Re:Oh come on, give me a break... (Score:1)
Logitech trackball (Score:1)
I use:
Section "Pointer"
Protocol "MouseManPlusPS/2"
ZAxisMapping 4 5
Device "/dev/mouse"
EndSection
Re:Ahem... (Score:1)
Re:Easy PC Hardware Spec (Score:1)
And besides, nobody in the PC industry really planned to support legacy hardware ad infinitum. It's gotta go at some point, after all. The industry was just waiting for the new technologies to be a little more mature (mainly for the hardware makers to make more USB devices for the USB-enabled PCs that have been around for years now) The difference between the PC OEMs and Apple being that Apple touted themselves as being revolutionary for doing what PC makers did two years ago - include USB
Apple did do a good job of timing their switch to USB to match when the USB hardware was becoming widely available, and as usual their marketing folks did an excellent job. But it was the people making devices for Wintel machines that are mostly responsible for USB and its growing popularity. So in this case, it is Apple following the industry, not vice versa
Apple does have the lead in incorporating FireWire, though I suppose that's to be expected since it is their technology.
Re:Scrap legacy hardware? (Score:1)
There are obvious benfits to using a frame buffered console, for one you can include graphics in it, such as when the system boots. Also if you are using a frame buffered console you can actually possibly run graphical programs without X11 (like Mac-on-linux or XF68_FBDev, a frame buffer based X server based on XFree86). This saves some of the bloat of X when you don't need it.
And yes, since kernel 2.2, x86 machine also support frame buffered consoles, but you have to spefically enable them when compiling your kernel.
Re:If Windows domination ends ... (Score:1)
Yea, and if that happens the people running the "servers" will be able to charge by the hour for app usage.
This would be a Bad Thing(TM).
Re:Dream on... that's not for Linux (Score:1)
USB is inferior (Score:1)
Re:Dream on... that's not for Linux (Score:1)
(1) It crashes very rarely: important for people who depend on their computers (NOT casual users)
Actually this is important for a casual user. They want a box that, to borrow a quote, "just works". They don't want to have to deal with the fallout from crashes all the time. Even if they don't depend on it, they simply don't want to have to wonder if it's crashed after having been left alone and untouched for a week.
(2) It's a tinkerer's dream -- if you don't like something, go and change it! Again, the casual users couldn't care less.
Again, they will care because of one thing: they don't care to tinker, but the guy who set it up for them does. If the box can be tweaked, I can sit down, tweak it to exactly what's needed, lock it down so they can't touch things and duplicate the result 200 times for 200 different people.
Windows != Easy to use (Score:1)
Later, when my nephew asked why sound didn't work when playing his game, it was all I could do to keep from swearing at him.
Conclusion: anyone who thinks Win95 is easier than Linux must have a hole in their head.
Re:Nice optimism, too bad it's completely wrong (Score:1)
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:1)
They'd probably sell 20-50K copies in a year or two. Much more down the road as Linux gains in popularity (and it will).
And supporting Linux would make all the sense in the world for them to do. Right now they're barely managing to stay ahead of M$ at its own game (Win and Mac software). It's highly unlikely that we'll see a M$ Money for Linux for a LONG time (we will, of course, when Linux achieves Domination(TM)), so Intuit could have a couple years' head start.
Re:If Windows domination ends ... (Score:1)
Suppose Windows dominion does end next year. Without the platform holding people back ....
Keep in mind that operating systems are no longer truly applications; they have descended into the realm of infrastructure.
Thus a great benefit of the dominance of the x86/Windows platform has been that it has provided a common infrastructure. It benefits the market if programmers don't have to spend precious resources porting the same program to every architecture under the sun (Mac, alpha, linux, Win9x, NT, BSD, BeOS, etc). Those same dollars are invested in a single product for a single platform, and the quality is higher because of it. Consumers benefit. (Of course, it often makes for cleaner *code* when one has to write it so that it compiles on Solaris, BeOS, linux, BSD, MacOS X, and all the other unices, but this is tangential to my point.)
So Microsoft has been greatly beneficial in providing a platform that almost all computers can be assumed to have. It has gone a long way in making Win32 (be it 95, 98, or NT) a required infrastructure. Where they have failed consumers is that their infrastructure is bad. The UI is currently unparalleled, but the internals are a mess!
So though your analysis of potential OS fragmentation may be accurate, I don't think it will be A Good Thing. The software market needs to be able to write for a common platform.
OTOH, the processor market can fragment and competition will actually be beneficial. Especially if Open Source applications become the norm, compiler writers will hide the processor differences from the software developers. One can even envision a self-compiling program, much like a MS setup.exe or an rpm that would be distributed in source form and would automatically unpack, configure, compile, and install itself for the host environment just by double-clicking. When we all have 10GHz machines on our desk, compile time will be negligible.
Re:Mouse swapping? (Score:1)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:Linux != Easy to use (Score:1)
I had a lot of problems with this when I was using vid cards with non-accelerated drivers (Rendition Verite 1000 / 2100 ). When I moved to a video card that had accelerated drivers, my linux ended up being as fast as windows. Actually I really think Netscape is faster in linux, but that might be an optical delusion.
2)Installation Sucks
To date - something like 30 windhuuhs installs
To date - something like a dozen Linux installs
Linux is always easier. Finding drivers and getting them to cooperate under windows can be a major hassle. I remember installing Slack 2.0, that was a pain. Modern linux installs are easier than windows IMHO.
3) Applications
Not a boatload of them, but they're getting there. I spend the majority of my time in Linux doing things, not futzing with my backgrounds. Gimping, programming, running newsbot programs, looking at pics, surfing, CivCTP, putzing. Your right that there is not a lot available for Linux currently, but it is changing, and rather quickly.
4) I don't have trouble generally with this, PNP is supported fairly well in Linux now, USB is starting to be supported, it's getting better.
5) KDE is not bad at all, what are you missing from windows? Blue screens? Actually I have those also thanks to jwz & xscreensaver
Basically, I like it, and so do 10-15 million other people. And it's growing, soon enough I will be able to play games and run the whiz-bangiest software available.
VGA (Score:1)
as far as hardware accelliration for text, it probably dosn't do much on pIIIs, but still
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Uh-huh. (Score:1)
Re:XML might kill MS Office (Score:1)
MS-DOS (Score:1)
actualy, i'ts pretty slow, even in mode 13h(320x200x8) on my p200mmx
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:Uh-huh. (Score:1)
Windows for linux, with that silly cga flag running with svgalib
Re:Only OEM Win98 CDs are bootable (Score:1)
What about USB modems? (Score:1)
Paranoid in Atlanta (Score:1)
(Yes I know this is off topic.)
3 words (Score:1)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Scrap legacy hardware? (Score:1)
Who am I?
Why am here?
Where is the chocolate?
Re:If Windows domination ends ... (Score:1)
> This would be a Bad Thing(TM).
Would it, really?
I'm sure that there would be more than one company running these "netserver-apps"... with competition like that, we could watch for the prices getting very low very fast.
You'd probably see stuff like:
Well... okay, maybe not quite, but you get the gist. Comapnies would make a killing off of stuff like that due to multiple clients, and yet when you get right down to it, the end-user would probably end up paying less than today (compare $5 per month to $500+ every couple of years to buy the software yourself (don't forget the upgrades!)). Simple economies of scale.
And given that the primary OS'es will be Open Sourced (in this hypothetical future), I see no reason why the Application Servers shouldn't be as well.
Hell, if you're really concerned about the cost, you can shell out a bit of money up-front and run your own.
*shrug*
Call me an idealist, but I actually see that situation as much preferable to what exists today.
--
- Sean
Re:I feel your pain (Score:1)
If...If...If... (Score:3)
First, while I'm sure consumers won't care if their "net-only" box runs Windows, I disagree that the Net-only box is going to be popular enough to dethrone Microsoft. There just aren't THAT MANY WebTV boxes out there right now for me to believe that this is the wave of the future. People will still want office apps (at the very least a word processor) that work as well and as easiliy as MS Office. As a long time user of Star Office, Applixware, KLyx and more recently Abi-Word, it's my opinion that we're not there yet. We're getting there...but we just aren't there.
Stop right there oh ye of the itchy flamethrower trigger finger
I'm not not not saying that Linux won't over throw MS in the near future (although "near" is up for debate). I'm merely saying that Internet-only boxes based on Intel's sketch "Easy PC" roadmap is not the way we're going to over through the giant.
To me, it all comes down the same stuff it's always come down to. Stability, Applications, GUI, Ease of Use. And we're already tackling those quite nicely I think.
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:1)
Right now, for me, USB seems to be Windows' key advantage over Linux in the hardware department, neglecting all those WinPeripherals (modems, printers, etc.) Anyone know when we'll have this on the clear horizon?
Easy Peezy Lemon Squeezy... (Score:1)
So the company must build, load, and support these machines, while selling them at a low cost. While the software could be open(free) source, the hardware and support could not.
Any takers?
-Adam
Oh where, oh where has my little
Fun Tech Support (Score:1)
The EasyPC site (Score:3)
Romen
Re:Game support (Score:1)
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:1)
USB lets you plug in a device and just use it while the computer is running.
The main advantage of USB I see in Windows is that you can connect new hardware without having to restart the computer as much!
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:1)
from
Section "Pointer"
Protocol "PS/2"
Device "/dev/mouse"
SampleRate 100
Resolution 200
Buttons 3
EndSection
/El Niño
Re:Nice optimism, too bad it's completely wrong (Score:1)
What is experimental about the USB and PnP support in 2.2 ? PnP seems just fine (I don't mess with USB just now).
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:2)
When Linux has good support for USB, I'll be set. In the mean time, I either boot Winblows when I need to scan, or scan from my kid's machine and then put it onto my server with Samba.
I can see the same thing happening with a digital camera or some other USB interface device (mice, keyboard, bah).
Re:If Windows domination ends ... (Score:1)
AbiWord, the WP I'm using right now, runs on Win, Mac, *n*x, and BeOS. It uses XML, and its documents are much nicer to read - they're actually hand-editable.
Try out AbiWord - it's not finished, but it's quite usable if you don't need to do fancy formatting.
http://www.abisource.com
Corel Word Perfect (Score:1)
WP for Linux Works absolutely fine, and comes on the RH6 CD. It may not be as huge as MS-Word, but it does what it has to do pretty well.
The Gnome/Enlighenment combo that comes with RH 6.0 is sufficiently easy to use that, if it's preconfigured with apps, any random windows user could use it.
RedHat 6.0 Default install is usable NOW (Score:1)
If it were pre-installed on a computer it would be usable out of the box just as quickly and easily as MS-Windows, and it would have more software avalible.
Eithor the Gnome+E or the KDE which is included on the RH6 CD is totaly usable by any random user who happens to feel like doing so.
Does Windows come with Corel WP? -- no -- you have to go pay $50 to $500 to get a good word processor.
Installing windows software (Score:1)
I think a better question would be what version of windows *you're* using, certanly not the one I am, (windows 98), every once in a while you'll find a program that just "runs" without needing to do anything else. Next buttons are a pain in the ass, and after you're clicking them (witch isnt' really that hard) They've invariably put a bunch of obsolite crap in the windows\system directory, probably breaking other applications (I really *hate* that, I'd almost rather install the software by hand, and stick all the dll's in the same DIR as the app)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ouch, this gave me a crick in my neck... (Score:1)
Many like this view, but it won't happen. (Score:1)
I don't think so (Score:2)
First, a casual user's understanding of "just works" mostly means "it does what I mean" and doesn't have much to do with crashes. Again, it's a question of the appropriate GUI and considerable underlying program intelligence which has to guess correctly what did the user mean. And anyway, crashes can be made relatively painless (fast reboot + session management) as I pointed out.
Besides casual users do not leave their computers running for a week and they don't care if it crashed while sitting untouched -- it's not like they are going to access their machine remotely...
Again, they will care because of one thing: they don't care to tinker, but the guy who set it up for them does.
You miss the point completely. The whole idea of those Easy-PCs is that nobody has to set them up. You bring it home, plug it into the outlet and the phone jack, and it works. That's it. Nothing to cofigure, nothing to select, nothing to tweak. I am not sure the actual machine will pull it off, but that is clearly the goal.
Kaa
Re:Hmmmm (Score:1)
For the Saudi release, perhaps -- they've got plenty of time until 2000 Ante Hegira....
/.
Re:The EasyPC site (Score:1)
It's aimed at my grandmother who would like to be able to talk to her grandkids over this here new fancy email thing 'cause they never phone any more.
It's aimed at my brother who wants to get the latest sports scores at espn.com, but otherwise has no use for a computer. Like, whatever!
It's aimed at people who probably don't use a sound card, ethernet connection, external CPU, etc, etc, etc. at all, let alone care whether or not they can get a third-party one that isn't built into the motherboard.
It's not aimed at anyone who reads Slashdot regularly, that's for damn sure!
And that includes you.
--
- Sean
...and what is wrong with WinCE? (Score:1)
Built-in pocket applications *work*, and provide the minimum functionality.
It seems like the right platform is closer to a souped-up WinCE than Linux, Palm OS, or Linux on a Palm. I still haven't seen a "good" browser for the Palm Pilot!
Anyway, hate to burst a bubble, but Linux still have a LONG way to go to point-and-drool interface!
Re:Customers Will Care, but... (Score:1)
I was thinking more along the lines of showing people using Corel WordPerfect, GNUmric, Netscape, Quake *, all on a flashy desktop, flashing back and forth between a user on Windows getting BSODs, waiting for applications to pop up, Dr. Watson, having the autodetect find their serial port for the 800th time but not finding what ever it was that they just installed. With Linux, don't show the command prompt, and make desktop look similar enough to MS Windows to make people think that it wouldn't be hard to switch. I personally use Gnome on top of Enlightenment but I think KDE would be better suited for this task.
Just my 2 cents.
Telnet with a firewall (Score:1)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Linux, the PC, and Everything (Score:2)
2. AOL releases their set top box, which with AOL's popularity deals a heavy blow against Micro$oft's WebTV. AOL offers cheap @home service to it's box owners which increases the set top box and AOL's user base. The AOl box runs an uber-hacked linux kernel.
3. Platforms like Nintendo's Dolphin and the PSX2 offer WebTV-like net access and multi player gaming over the internet.
4. Intel's 810 chipset becomes widely used in the sub-500$ PC market making PC's less and less upgradeable but drastically reducing their price while adding a little more *umph* to their multimedia capability.
5. SGI changes their logo yet again. Their campus is stormed by angry nerds who attack them with all forms of pointy metal objects. SGI changes their logo back to the cool infinity cube, the nerds rejoice.
6. Amiga never decides what to base their new kernel on and merely changes the version number to 4.0 and hope no one notices. 7. With the popularity of the iMac pretty undistputed, many other PC makers get the idea that your average user probably will never open up their computer to add anything so cute cuddly user friendly designs flood the market. Only techies and true believers build and use legacy systems and are never bothered with annoying questions like "How do I turn it on?" ever again.
8. Silicon Valley sinks into the ocean.
Mouse drivers (Score:1)
video drivers are a *bitch* beacuse the computer can't really work right without them (it's the same with linux I belive...)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:Dream on... that's not for Linux (Score:1)
DUH! What the hell do you think these things are? The are just faster WebTV's with somewhat better resolution and the ability to do java.
--
- Sean
Re:If...If...If... (Score:1)
Re:I Know! I Know! (Score:2)
I like tapioca...
Ill be damed if im gonna let intel and microsoft ruin my tapioca!
Re:If...If...If... (Score:1)
If your average homeowner could get a stand-alone webified system for less than a mid-range television set, they probably would.
ian.
Re:This just in (Score:2)
let's see...
banner -w 80 "Linux is obsolete."
I bow before your amazing h4x0r sk1llz.
NOT
Re:If Windows domination ends ... (Score:1)
Re:the rats are leaving the sinking ship. (Score:2)
Considering that he's left Microsoft, I assume he has good reason to (i) diversify his portfolio, and (ii) move away from a company he may have lost confidence in.
http://www.forbes.com/asap/tech100/98/49.htm
D
----
Ctrl+Z (Score:1)
Actualy, in my opinion, installing OSs isn't really that hard at all. I got slack 2.0 working fine. I've played around with the redhat in stall, and it looks pretty simple. and windows, wasn't *that* hard....
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:Linux != Easy to use (Score:1)
that's beacuse youre a Mac using idiot. I bet you think win9x dies every 10 minutes, and PCs are a lot slower then macs to, right?
I read up on DHCP, it dosn't look that hard to use at all. or are all of these "commands" beyond you?
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:SSDD (Score:1)
some peoples scores start automaticaly at 2. I guess if *a lot* of there posts are high, or somthing
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:Ahem... (Score:1)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Mouse swapping? (Score:1)
-----
Linux user: if (nt == unstable) { switchTo.linux() }
Tweakable VCRs (Score:1)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
cut and paste (Score:1)
Re:Linux is easy, you are just being difficult. (Score:1)
We in the Creatives Services (graphics) department spend ZERO in support for our Macs, since we pretty much can troubleshoot our machines ourselves. Usually problems will occur but they're always just isolated to extension files installed by stupid shareware someone downloaded (toss it in the trash) or just download patches to programs recently released.
It's funny to hear the WinXX people (database and cataloging folks) across the partitions complain "Oh no, my computer crashed. Let's call tech support quick!"
-----
Linux user: if (nt == unstable) { switchTo.linux() }
free software?! (Score:1)
free programms,open source
they will support windows anyway because windows supportes the rippoff
Re:Mouse swapping? (Score:1)
ADB is one of the examples of Macs had such superiour hardware for so damn long. It was easy to use. Better then AT/PS2/Serial mouse/keyboard connectors ever were. I mean, can you even plug your PS2 mouse into your PS2 keyboard today? That would be one less wire going back behind the computer.
(P.S. The author of this statement, in fact, hates Apple computers and most of what they do. So his praising them probably means a fair bit)
Linux Software is a pain to install (Score:1)
No Command line? (Score:1)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
Re:Ahem... (Score:1)
Hey, maybe your VCR does need to be "rebooted" after recording/playing tapes for a full week in a row. How would you know if it did -- have you ever used your VCR for that period of time nonstop without turning it off? Of course you haven't. (If you have, please put your white jacket with the straps back on...)
Actually it's run continuously for about 31 months now. The unit I have doesn't have a physical power switch, just an electronic one that sends it to a low-power idle mode. The CPU is still running the whole time.
Re:Even If... (Score:2)
Ever notice how a new PC user starts by saying "All I need is word processing (or email, or whatever)..." but down the line a year or so, they end up wanting more functionality just because they now realize there's so much more it can do?
The same thing will happen here. Aunt Bertha will get her computer to do email and web surfing and then will see someone running the latest version of Micros~1 Outlook with God knows what new whiz bang feature she now wants. She'll want to run it and won't be able to, unless we want to write an app to do what she wants. And most of the kind of apps we value don't fit into the mold of what Aunt Bertha wants, so there's a high probability for conflict.
If this comes to pass, I bet it'll be followed by a "consumer backlash" against Linux or whatever OS ends up running on these boxes.
Re:If Windows domination ends ... (Score:2)
Re:Customers Will Care, but... (Score:1)
The funniest thing right now is that the letter X seems to have a huge appeal to the average consumer, X-games, eXtreme blah, the X-generation, etc... It would be fairly easy to market X-Windows and LinuX right now just by taking advantage of the market's fixation with the letter X.
RedHat, Caldera, SuSE, Penguin Computing, VA, Corel, Storm, etc... the list of companies who either sell Linux, or sell stuff that supports Linux. None have done much in the way of marketing, outside the net, to try and draw average people to become customers. The number of companies depending on Linux to make money is increasing very rapidly, and although the base of users is also growing at an astounding rate, there is no way that these companies will survive unless they push to draw the masses to Linux, which will require marketing.
*Could* happen...we'll see :) (Score:1)
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:1)
I appreciate the open-source movement, but until GNU Cash does everything Quicken does right down to online account access, identical file format, etc., it won't be good enough for me.
Re:Nice optimism, too bad it's completely wrong (Score:2)
This post should be moderated up.
The guy is right on - Microsoft is driving the hardware specs, and there's no way that Intel is going to release a platform that doesn't have MS backing. (Especially after the USB f-up, where they shipped hardware for a couple years without drivers.) The idea that Linux will ever have more hardware support than Windows (by next year!) on a commodity platform is silly.
These cut-down PC plans (PC99, EasyPC) might as well be called "WinPC". Dropping things like VGA text mode, BIOS support for non-PnP OSes, 'legacy' ports like serial and parallel, and forcing things like ACPI is bad news not only for Linux but also anyone who wants to run commercial OSes such as WinNT 4.0 or OS/2.
(In fact, the non-PnP Windows NT 4 is the *only* reason Microsoft isn't more aggressively pushing WinPCs rignt now. Once Windows 2000 is out, expect to see some very Linux unfriendly hardware. the Not that the Linux folks won't catch up, it just might take a while. And I fully expect the typical corporate purchasing department will try to save $100 and skip the 'OS-Independant' checkbox.)
--
Re:Linux != Easy to use (Score:2)
(Warning: rant ahead)
I tried to install a frontend to MPG123 because I'm sick of listening to my mp3's in alphabetical order. It told me there were two libraries I had to install first (of course, it didn't say that in configure; I had to look in the README). So I try to find these other libraries using the ftp addresses provided. One of the sites is down so I have to hunt around for it elsewhere. One of the libraries requires two MORE libraries. I get those. I install everything, mixing up the order a couple of times, sometimes being baffled before realizing I forgot to 'su root' before typing 'make install', and the last library ends up not being able to find the other one anyway. In other programs, even though I have all the libraries and it can find them, they still don't compile, telling me to edit the Makefile, most of which I don't understand, and God forbid that I should have to edit some file in
I thought I could get around this by downloading
Even if the inexperienced user moves to Linux and gets the package system working, I can bet you'll have most people using their root account to do everything, because it's too much of a pain to switch to it to install stuff. I know that this is not a good idea.
I know that all of this is more powerful than running setup.exe in Windows. But if the average user finds some nifty new software, having a Windows version with setup.exe and an 'everything else' version requiring a process resembling the above, they're going to stick with Windows.
--
I feel your pain (Score:2)
I broke out in a cold sweat, installing those video drivers had been a major struggle before.
I don't remember what happened after that, the human brain tends to block out traumatic memories.
Re:Fun Tech Support (Score:2)
With the release of Windows'95, MS has turned fixing those problems into a form of voodoo magic! Today, fixing the average Win'9X problem involves yanking or masaging the system drivers, 20 reboots, and 10 dances in full witch doctor apparel! And don't forget the ceremonial chants! This is the only way to fix Win9X problems, and sometimes yields an 80% success rate. Hehe
Nice optimism, too bad it's completely wrong (Score:3)
a) The OS whose company was deeply involved in writing the spec and which is coming out with a specific version just to support it (Millenium)
or
b) The OS that gets little, belated info about new hardware initiatives, can't run WinModems (which are surely a central part of EasyPC), and only has experimental PnP and USB support now?
The real future for Linux comes when more hardware vendors are willing to write drivers for the LinModems of the future. Oracle's $150 Linux NC will be a nice start. And if Corel gets good penetration, it will certainly help.
--JZ
Re:Dream on... that's not for Linux (Score:2)
Yeah, I deleted about three sentances and replaced it with that parentetical note, so I deserve the DUH.
What I meant is that a "WebTV" is only advertised to surf the web and get mail. Anyone can build one of these right now. My understanding is that an EasyPC falls in between a webbox and a real computer. You can surf the web, and use a (cut down?) version of Excel, and play non-accellerated Quake.
The problem comes when consumers figure out that only thing these boxes are real good at is web surfing, and it's difficult to run the hardware and software they need. (Kinda like the old Atari 8-bit machines - great at games, bad at word processing).
--
Customers Will Care, but... (Score:2)
I think that customers will care, but not for good reasons. Unfortunately, Windows has dominated the market for long enough that "PC" and "Windows" are linked together in most consumers' minds.
In the world the I (and probably a good number of Slashdot readers) live, surrounded by geeks, it's easy to forget that most people, most current computer owners even, haven't even heard of Linux. At best, they saw an article in a trade mag, but they aren't giving it a lot of thought. Plus, those magazine articles are often loaded with FUD, and they make the customer less likely to want a computer sans Windows.
This is why everyone needs to read the Advocacy HOWTO [linux.com]. Yes, most people will prefer Windows to an operating system they haven't heard of (even if it means waiting a few months...and I'm sure Microsoft won't let anyone think that it'll be more than a few months' delay), but we can work to make sure people have heard of Linux (as well as BeOS, BSD, etc.), and that they know that they have a choice right now. When these EasyPCs come out, and they only customers can have Windows is to wait, the choice will be clear.
If Windows domination ends ... (Score:5)
First off, Linux-based systems will not be the only ones to benefit. The Macintosh will be right there, of course --- Apple's holding a comeback, and everyone's invited. The iMac has already done a bit to cut into Windows's market share, and we can expect the iBook to do likewise. Other OSes can also take their share, of course --- if Amiga ever gets its rear in gear, they can do nicely; so can Be, for that matter. Still, as there's little evidence Amiga or Be can get their rears in gear, I think we'll see Linux-based systems and the MacOS as the primary successors to Windows on the desktop.
Second off, x86 dominion will go away slowly. Macintoshes, of course, are non-x86 systems. So are Amigas. However, a good portion of the non-x86 market will be running Linux-based systems, not MacOS or the Amiga OE. Already there are the NetWinder and Qube which use non-x86 processors; there's also Linux for the PowerPC chip, though so far PPCs outside of Macintoshes are hard to come by. Non-x86 Linux systems will start as servers (like the Qube and NetWinder) and expand in the direction of the consumer desktop as demand materializes. The x86 isn't that great to begin with; it's been held on to largely because of binary compatibility, which isn't an issue in the world of free software.
Finally, the applications field will change. It's possible that Microsoft could lose Windows and yet keep the Office dominion by porting to Linux and other systems as they emerge. However, I suspect that in their hubris they will fail to do so in time. Thus, applications diversity will increase. This may mean a world of using translator applications all the time --- or it may mean a world of public standards for word processing documents, just as we now have public standards for images (JPEG, PNG) and sound (MP3). I for one would greatly prefer the latter
It's an exciting time to be in the field. Let's not blow it.
SSDD (Score:2)
Intel is putting together a platform that is suboptimal for Windows. Microsoft is not planning to optimize Windows for that platform, but they will offer something that will limp along on it. The conclusion: this is an opportunity for alternate OSs to beat Windows.
Will somebody explain how this "Windows running suboptimally on an Intel platform" differs one iota from the situation today? Windows running suboptimally appears to have little effect on their market share.
Re:XML might kill MS Office (Score:2)
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Re:Dream on... that's not for Linux (Score:2)
Here's where the 'consumer electric' model falls down as far as "Easy PCs" go. If you are on a cable system that your TV/VCR doesn't support, you have go out and buy/rent a seperate cable box and daisy chain it through channel 3 or something. We're already beyond the comprehention of Joe Sixpack here. Thank god for cable installers.
The computer approach is to just add another software/hardware doohicky to make your computer do what it needs to. A computer (not talking about simple webtv things here) which can't do that is going to frustrate people pretty quickly, and people will get a clue and either buy a real computer or give up.
We've already been through this in the early 80s with $200 plug-n-play boxes like the C-64 and Atari 800. Not that they weren't great machines, but when many people figured out that they needed a $300 disk drive, $200 modem, and $200 printer to do anything other than video games with them, interest dropped off.
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Re:I Know! I Know! (Score:3)
Re:Quicken for Linux? (Score:2)
I've used this exactly twice in the month that we've had this. The first time was when I lugged it upstairs to install the software on my windows partition and do a test scan with a couple wedding album shots. The second time I wanted to scan in a couple "refrigerator art" drawings my daughter had done. I got on my son's PC while he wasn't using it and just dropped the image file onto the Samba share I've set up on our server.
I'll have to look into this. I'm not sure this would be the best solution for a couple reasons which really don't have anything to do with the suitability of SANE or anything.
1) My son has lots more desk space than I do and he is using it more right now anyway.
2) I'm a SCSI 'virgin' so I'm not sure I have the time right now to take the plunge, esp since my son is using it daily right now.
3) The scanner didn't come with any SCSI hardware, I'd have to buy something.
4) So far, the USB seems plenty fast for scanning purposes. I'm sure the SCSI is faster, but it ain't broke right now with USB.
5) I'm wondering how well this would integrate with the windows scanning software that came with the unit (its nice, it does a preview, allows you to select a region for scanning, select the output format, scan straight to the printer - copier mode - or to a file.)
So, yeah I could probably get by without USB, but it is a pretty damn convenient setup for now.
Easy PC Hardware Spec (Score:2)
"legacy hardware is going to be ripped out. ...ISA, parallel, serial and floppy and substitute[d with] USB and Firewire..."
Now I don't know about you, but I can think of a hardware platform that has already done this. And it can run linux [yellowdoglinux.com] too. This platform got a lot of flak for going to USB only. (the pro models have firewire) And in particular, they got a lot of grief over the elimination of the floppy. And whats this? Is the rest of the PC industry following suit?
What is this mysterious platform [apple.com]?
Re:Sub-optiminal performance (Score:2)
Amusingly, it's still better than on Intel. I wasn't able to crash my WinCE box...
Dream on... that's not for Linux (Score:2)
The simpler-than-the-toaser-PC must, absolutely must have a user interface that's comfortable for people who are not able to find their ass with both hands and have problems dealing with their coffeemaker. These people do not really care about the stability of the OS: if there is a large clearly labeled button that will reboot the machine in 5-10 seconds with session management (reconnect to the 'net, open same documents, etc.), then these users will not have any problem with crashes.
Linux has two strengths:
(1) It crashes very rarely: important for people who depend on their computers (NOT casual users)
(2) It's a tinkerer's dream -- if you don't like something, go and change it! Again, the casual users couldn't care less.
The Easy-PC battle is going to be over user interface and nothing but user interface. This is not a strong point of Linux (though not a glaring weakness, either) and I don't see Linux developers going out of their way to develop a GUI for idiots -- and that's what's going to be needed. I am not even touching upon the scarcity of good user interface designers...
Easy-PC is pure point-and-drool -- not a good market for Linux.
Kaa
Re:SSDD (Score:2)
a) Moderator: non-biased, eh? I'm sure if he had said "Will somebody explain how this "Linux running suboptimally on an Intel platform" differs one iota from the situation today? ?" He would have been moderated out. I'm saying this comment should have, but please, show us a little consistancy.
b) I'm not sure if "Windows running suboptimally on an Intel platform" will be the window of opportunity everyone thinks it will be. Look at Wince in the Palmtop scene. Palm Computing has held them off because they came out first with a lighter, more efficient OS. Even with that in mind, a year later, it's only them and Wince.
Where are the alternatives? Why didn't any other OS survive? Methinks it's the Microsoft name. It as recognizable in the computing world as Gap is in the clothing world, and makes marketing incredibly easy.
The the GUI problem everyone keeps talking about is another biggie. The berlin project and the twenty other GUIs out there are nice, but MS has a polished OS _today_. Not "soon" or "in beta", but on the shelves at Walmart. Does it work well? Well...look at it this way, Corvettes run like crap, but look sexy so they sell like hotcakes. iMac, even with Apple on the rise, is still based on a platform that commands less than 10 percent of the market, but it sold 1.9 million in less than one year based largely on appearence. Most people want appliances that, among other things, look cool.
I don't know...maybe people just want one stop shopping...not a kernal from linux, GUI from somewhere else, an office suite from eastbumblefudge...even if they buy crap from MS, at least it's consistant crap...
Ack...I just read through this...Don't mean to sound bitchy, I just need sleep...
the rats are leaving the sinking ship. (Score:2)
greetings mond.
This just in (Score:2)
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I think you're partly right. (Score:2)
Absolutely. The coders who did the Linux kernel for the most part aren't cut from the same cloth as the types of programmers who do well with issues of ergonomics or user-interface.
However, those aren't the only types of coders that hang around in the Free Software community.
It's only now that the basic infrastructure has solidified, that the more UI-oriented developers can really start getting to work. I can certainly see this happening with the Berlin project.
Rogue Linux developers working independently can't create the next generation UI.
Rogue developers working independently can't produce a usable OS kernel, either. Fortunately, that's not the way Open Source projects work.
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