adraken writes "It just seems like minutes ago that 2.3.1 was out, but 2.3.2 is out... " Remember folks: use a mirror. Standard "don't use unless you know what you're doing" disclaimer applies.Update: 05/15 02:43 by J: There seems to be a ChangeLog available.
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If you think they are a waste of space (and time) Then: Don't click on articles pertaining to them Don't post messages about them Just ignore dev kernel release articles Are the people who run slashdot under your pay? I don't think so...
I know that there is a slashbox available for kernel releases already, the LinuxHQ box. How about expanding this box slightly, so like the poll slashbox, there is a link for people to post comments. The comments could be cleared after every new release.
In this way those that are interested in reading kernel anouncements have a handy single source of announcements and furthermore a forum to discuss them (yeah, I know the right place to discuss problems etc is on the kernel ml, but for other issues that aren't appropriate there).
I think most people will agree that they are a waste of space in the main news section, but there is definitely enough people to warrant there inclusion somewhere.
by Anonymous Coward writes:
on Friday May 14, 1999 @06:08PM (#1891361)
I noticed on the changelog for 2.3.2 that it has
16 color VGA framebuffer console driver added.
So what exactly is this? Is this along the lines of a stripped down GUI for the console? (obviously not something to the extent of an X server.) I'm guessing a use for it would be akin to Win95's install, where it dumps to a low color GUI for the entire thing. Anyone care to shed some light on this?
(sorry for the AC post, as moderating the thread from evildoers and for insightful users prevented me from posting )
Oh and if you are interested, you can find the archives for the debian-boot list at the [debian.org] Debian mailing list archive page. They had an example boot disk made (it would show you the copyright screen but had no hard disk support or such so that it wouldn't actually do anything) but I can't remember the address for that.
> That's exactly what it's good for. Have you seen a fully graphical, > one-floppy linux install? You will.
Yes you certainly will, if you use Debian in the future. As we speak the Debian boot-floppies team is working on a graphical installation disk set for a future release of Debian. It won't exactly be one-floppy (it's hard to fit the 2.2 kernel and the root.bin ramdisk on one floppy) but it will certainly be much nicer than the old newt-based install.
Those people who don't like to have to look at the small title and articles for new realease of kernels don't have too. I might be the only one, but if you sign in and goto prefrences you can select what articles see or don't see. I use this so I don't have to read all the damn star wars articles.
I'm expecting to see the development kernel numbers climb pretty rapidly.. Probably a new one every day, with the occasional twice-a-day ones and the occasional skipped day.
Perhaps Rob/Hemos/someone can make a special 'Kernel' or 'Kernel-Development' news type that people can filter out. I'd actually recommend both types. That way, normal people can hear about the fixes to the stable end of things, and the people that love the bleeding edge can go out and grab the devel kernel..
Of course, I'm sure someone could just write a nifty script that fingers linux.kernel.org to update that stuff automatically (or maybe a slashbox.. hmm..)
On one hand, I enjoy reading Slashdot discussions of the new Linux kernels. Success/failure reports are good, as are discussions of new features of kernels. A Slashbox, while good for announcing them and keeping up with the latest, wouldn't allow that discussion.
But please only announce development kernels when there is some REAL news. Like when USB is mostly working, or when the journaling FS is added.
I was informed of this a couple days ago. The "edge.linuxhq.com" (I think?) slashbox will show you what kernels are current (both devel and stable). Pretty useful, and it would be moreso if kernel updates weren't already announced on slashdot all the time...
- A.P. --
"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
The latter is obviously a greater waste of bandwidth. It contains zero useful information, whereas the former contains the information that there is, in fact, a new kernel out. The signal-to-noise ratio of the news about the kernel updates, however low, is therefore infinitely higher than that of the whiners, which is zero.
>Looking at the Changelog, it seems that the real news here is: Centaur C6 MCRs now supported. Does that deserve a Slashdot article? I think not.
Of course you Mircosoft flacks would think this because posting a "bunch of kernel updates" as you losers express it on Slashdot exposes the lies (See the Mircosoft "Linux Challenge" WWW page for an example of this) that the Mircosoft PR department and it's allies try to spread about Linux for all the world to see.
How? Filter out everything relating to Linux? A "Linux Kernel" category would be nice. I can't imagine what the icon for it would be. But really, unless there's something significant about a new kernel, I don't see why it needs to be posted. Especially since the hackers are in the development tree now, and kernels are going to be popping up once every few days.
If you ever want to see the data on that HPFS partition again, don't. Using a development kernel, you're assuming that you will lose all your data. Be careful.
Some of them (2.1.44 comes to mind) can even trash your file systems.
Mind you, it sounds as though 2.2.8 could do that for you, too. That said, the `stable' branch does get a lot more attention paid to stability before each release, so you should at least bear that in mind before grabbing whatever the latest 2.3.x is now.
With a new slashdot forum automatically created for new kernel releases, in case people want to discuss them. Obviously only important new releases should get a mention in the `main' slashdot. Perhaps only post if a new release is seen as a major milestone, or if it contains fixes for a major data loss/security problem (e.g. 2.2.0 would have been announced. 2.2.9 would probably get a mention because of the filesystem problem, but 2.2.8 wouldn't).
I don't think the other guy was being unappreciative of Slashdot, and he's well within his rights to constructively criticize Slashdot (assuming Rob welcomes such comments, and I would guess he does). Remember Slashdot is a commercial website now... I'm sure those banner ads add up. If they're smart at/. they're also using the polls to generate refined profiles of this community.
A kernel filter would be nice, and it would also have been nice for this story to at least summerize what's new. There's no information here other than "new kernel". I guess I'll find out when I run buildkernel to tweak for the AMD K-6 450 I picked up at the computer show today..:-D
I agree with the previous poster about this. A Linux kernel slashbox would rock! Id have it as my first one listed, you could have a script that reports the current stable and devel kernels as links that would by default take you to linuxhq or something.
No kidding. I was just about to download 2.2.8 when I realized that 2.3.2 was just released. Best advise, don't download it unless it has something necessary or something you REALLY want to mess with.
Slashdot has always announced the devel kernel releases. Please search Slashdot for "kernel 2.1 released", if you doubt this. Go on. There is a reason for the little "search" thing down there at the bottom of this page.
If you don't like an article, don't click "Read More". I really cannot see how this is difficult to comprehend.
Please stop whinging about a free service and let Rob and friends run their site as they please. Slashdot might not be the quickest place to report the releases, but it does give a good place to see discussion about problems others have had with the release. But obviously not this article, today.
as written wrt 2.3.1 i think only announcements should be made that feature a real news element. but thats only my opinion, so why not make a poll:
how would you like your kernels? * i want it all * no development kernels, please * kernels -> slashbox * let me filter them/new category * only important ones * medium with chili and sauce hollondaise
No, 2.3.x is a DEVELOPEMENT tree. It's not intended for general use. That's what 2.2.x is here for. The developement releases come out often and are not thoroughly debugged or tested. They often contain unknown and sometimes dangerous bugs.
The difference between 2.2.8 and 2.1.44 is 2.2.8 could cause problems under heavy I/O. I think 2.1.44 pretty much was just about garanteed to trash your fs.
The really short time between 2.2.8 and 2.2.9 was due to a nasty bug that could cause fs corruption. Other than that it's averaging about 1 every 2 weeks, not too bad. And remember just because there is a new kernel doesn't mean you have to upgrade. Unless the kernel does something for you specifically there is no need. Some of us (my self included) like to stay on the bleeding edge, but then again I don't complain about how fast they come out.
I like this idea, maybe even with some kind of discussions linked to the slashbox. That way the people who want to see what the latest kernel is on slashdot can and those who don't want to won't. I certainly like the idea better than having every devel release posted as a story.
They can (and often are) quite unstable. Some of them (2.1.44 comes to mind) can even trash your file systems. Basically don't play with them unless you are willing to deal with your system being rendered useless.
I'm not saying that all kernel anouncements should be ignored. Just the devel ones. A) because newbies might get bitten. B) There are going to be a lot of them and it's quickly going to get very annoying, espeically when it gets to the point where there are 3 releases on the same page of slashdot.
They aren't relevant for most slashdot readers and there are going to be a LOT more of them before 2.4 comes out. Posting them to slashdot is just a waste of space.
I knew about the existence of the driver before, but didn't want to use it until it hit some level of stability... I figured that if it had been included with the kernel now, it probably was worth trying out. (Unfortunately right now I'm getting kernel oopses galore from the driver.)
Besides, 2.3.2 is not too far out from 2.2, I'm not using any other experimental stuff (like USB), and my system's running fine otherwise.
It's called "LinuxHQ Kernel Versions." Gives the current new and old versions of stable and development kernels, with links to the files and the patch browser.
I see, since you can't flood the comment section with dumb crap, it's Rob's perl scripts that are buggy. They're not buggy, he probably just never expected anybody to do anything so dumb. Maybe it's you that are buggy.
Well, it really doesn't matter who wrote the vgafb, it just matters who uses it better. IMHO, Debian is ahead of everyone else in this respect, so I think they will have the better one. Of course, I'm sure RH and SuSE will do an excellent job with theirs. =)
This is what I reckon: * Announce all stable kernels under topic 'Linux' * Announce all dev kernels under topic 'Linux Kernels' except when they are so fantastic that everybody wants to know about them. Then they too can be announced under topic 'Linux'
Is the new development kernel going to use BitKeeper [bitkeeper.com] or some other similar source management system?
I've been wondering on this for a long time now , I heard Linus at least some of the other kernel developers were interested, what's the current status of such a move?
It seems that only yesterday that 2.3.1 came out. Actually it was;). I think we need to stop posting when every new kernel comes out. Anything in the development branch shouldn't be installed by anyone bu those who are doing development or like the bleeding edge and these people will find out that a new kernel is out through different channels anyway.
So, let's stop this madness; Slashdot is news for nerds, not Linux Patches and by the way did you hear that...
As I recall most, if not all of the 2.1 kernel releases were announced. There's at least a day, usually 2 or 3 between releases, so unless you have a LOT of headlines on your page, its unlikely you'll see more than one at a time.
As for newbies, I don't see this as a big deal. Assuming they're as unexperienced as you claim by the time they read enough documentation to get the kernel installed they should be able to understand that development releases are possibly unstable and potentially dangerous.
Since there are hardly any postings about the kernel release itself, it seems obvious that certainly not all development kernel releases earn an announcement on Slashdot.
Nobody is really interested in talk about a bunch of updates. Software updates is what Freshmeat is for. Slashdot is for news.
Looking at the Changelog, it seems that the real news here is: Centaur C6 MCRs now supported. Does that deserve a Slashdot article? I think not.
No reason to be that scared. Backup anything important; if you are lazy and have lots of space, just backup the whole raw partition to somewhere else on the network. Then no matter how badly the kernel mangles your disk, it is very easy to return it to a known good state. The NTFS module is quite unstable; even read-only it has locked up solid (repeatably, so I should work on finding the bug, *sigh*). But I've never lost any data to it, and only a little time.
I realize that its not practical if you are low on disk space and don't have the luxury of a Sun server full of big disks nearby, but I often find myself using gzip and an rsh pipe to send an entire partition or disk over the network to a file server before attempting something questionable. (Heck, I occasionally reinstall Windows boxen that way:)
Also, it might be good to look into the history of the HPFS r/w code... if it is known to be relatively stable, and has just been waiting to be mainlined because of the feature freeze preceding 2.2, then I wouldn't be too nervous about using it. (I don't know in this case; not an OS/2 fan, personally.)
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:1)
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:1)
Then:
Don't click on articles pertaining to them
Don't post messages about them
Just ignore dev kernel release articles
Are the people who run slashdot under your pay?
I don't think so...
Slashbox proposal... (Score:1)
In this way those that are interested in reading kernel anouncements have a handy single source of announcements and furthermore a forum to discuss them (yeah, I know the right place to discuss problems etc is on the kernel ml, but for other issues that aren't appropriate there).
I think most people will agree that they are a waste of space in the main news section, but there is definitely enough people to warrant there inclusion somewhere.
Opinions??
question about framebuffer (Score:3)
- 16 color VGA framebuffer console driver added.
So what exactly is this? Is this along the lines of a stripped down GUI for the console? (obviously not something to the extent of an X server.) I'm guessing a use for it would be akin to Win95's install, where it dumps to a low color GUI for the entire thing. Anyone care to shed some light on this?(sorry for the AC post, as moderating the thread from evildoers and for insightful users prevented me from posting )
Re:question about framebuffer (Score:1)
archives for the debian-boot list at
the [debian.org]
Debian mailing list archive page.
They had an example boot disk made (it would show
you the copyright screen but had no hard disk
support or such so that it wouldn't actually do
anything) but I can't remember the address for
that.
Re:question about framebuffer (Score:1)
know this. I believe the person who wrote the
vgafb driver is a Debian developer though...
Re:question about framebuffer (Score:2)
> one-floppy linux install? You will.
Yes you certainly will, if you use Debian in the
future. As we speak the Debian boot-floppies team
is working on a graphical installation disk set
for a future release of Debian. It won't exactly
be one-floppy (it's hard to fit the 2.2 kernel
and the root.bin ramdisk on one floppy) but it
will certainly be much nicer than the old newt-based install.
Always posting new kernel releases. (Score:1)
Get used to it (Score:5)
Perhaps Rob/Hemos/someone can make a special 'Kernel' or 'Kernel-Development' news type that people can filter out. I'd actually recommend both types. That way, normal people can hear about the fixes to the stable end of things, and the people that love the bleeding edge can go out and grab the devel kernel..
Of course, I'm sure someone could just write a nifty script that fingers linux.kernel.org to update that stuff automatically (or maybe a slashbox.. hmm..)
Announce ALL stable kernels, only important devels (Score:1)
But please only announce development kernels when there is some REAL news. Like when USB is mostly working, or when the journaling FS is added.
Just my $0.03,
Micah
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:1)
Slashbox exists. (Score:1)
- A.P.
--
"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
Re:question about framebuffer (Score:1)
Re:Stop posting 'Stop posting linux kernel updates (Score:1)
Re:Why not just announce new kernel features? (Score:1)
Of course you Mircosoft flacks would think this because posting a "bunch of kernel updates" as you losers express it on Slashdot exposes the lies (See the Mircosoft "Linux Challenge" WWW page for an example of this) that the Mircosoft PR department and it's allies try to spread about Linux for all the world to see.
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:1)
Re:Read-Write HPFS! (Score:2)
Re:problem? (Score:1)
Slashbox (Score:1)
Linux Kernel
------------ Stable: 2.2.9 (5 comments) Development: 2.3.2 (2 comments)
With a new slashdot forum automatically created for new kernel releases, in case people want to discuss them. Obviously only important new releases should get a mention in the `main' slashdot. Perhaps only post if a new release is seen as a major milestone, or if it contains fixes for a major data loss/security problem (e.g. 2.2.0 would have been announced. 2.2.9 would probably get a mention because of the filesystem problem, but 2.2.8 wouldn't).
You're BOTH correct..somewhat (Score:1)
A kernel filter would be nice, and it would also have been nice for this story to at least summerize what's new. There's no information here other than "new kernel". I guess I'll find out when I run buildkernel to tweak for the AMD K-6 450 I picked up at the computer show today..
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases.I tot (Score:1)
I think we need (at least) 3 linux topics: (Score:2)
2) linux kernel, stable
3) linux kernel, unstable
This way folks can have the flexibility to filter out some/all/none of the linux related posts.
Kernel Slashbox! (Score:3)
How about a "software update" category? (Score:1)
Maybe have a raw steak for an icon, as a reference to freshmeat [freshmeat.net]
Re:question about framebuffer (Score:1)
Re:Just Wondering... (Score:1)
Get over it! (Score:4)
If you don't like an article, don't click "Read More". I really cannot see how this is difficult to comprehend.
Please stop whinging about a free service and let Rob and friends run their site as they please. Slashdot might not be the quickest place to report the releases, but it does give a good place to see discussion about problems others have had with the release. But obviously not this article, today.
POLL IDEA: devkernel announces? (Score:4)
should be made that feature a real news
element. but thats only my opinion, so why not
make a poll:
how would you like your kernels?
* i want it all
* no development kernels, please
* kernels -> slashbox
* let me filter them/new category
* only important ones
* medium with chili and sauce hollondaise
Re:Just Wondering... (Score:1)
Re:problem? (Score:1)
Re:Just Wondering... (Score:1)
Re:Kernel Slashbox! (Score:1)
Re:problem? (Score:2)
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:2)
Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:3)
Re:Read-Write HPFS! (Score:1)
Besides, 2.3.2 is not too far out from 2.2, I'm not using any other experimental stuff (like USB), and my system's running fine otherwise.
Read-Write HPFS! (Score:2)
I hadn't planned to install a 2.3.x kernel this early, but I guess I'll do it for that feature by itself...
Re:Get used to it (Score:1)
There IS a kernel version SlashBox... (Score:4)
Happy?
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:1)
read it at slashdot anyway - from linux-kernel-announce@vger.
Bzzt, wrong, try again (Score:1)
-----BEGIN ANNOYING SIG BLOCK-----
Evan
Re:Just Wondering... (Score:1)
-rw-r--r-- 1 ftp ftp 13497506 Mar 28 22:54 linux-2.2.5.tar.gz
-rw-r--r-- 1 ftp ftp 13588897 Apr 16 14:46 linux-2.2.6.tar.gz
-rw-r--r-- 1 ftp ftp 13677325 Apr 28 11:42 linux-2.2.7.tar.gz
-rw-r--r-- 1 ftp ftp 13808890 May 11 12:59 linux-2.2.8.tar.gz
-rw-r--r-- 1 ftp ftp 13827947 May 13 16:54 linux-2.2.9.tar.gz
-Chris
Re:question about framebuffer (Score:1)
Re:A new kernel poem (Score:1)
Kernels are great!
Kernels are good!
Kernels are a song to the ears,
Kernels drive our thoughts,
:)))
----
As somebody said, we could just post the
new features on the new kernel to slashdot.
On a second thought, why do people peep into
the new kernel release discussions? They are
surely interested and so...
So, let the new kernel release news be posted
in the main slashdot news...
Flames are welcome, but they will suffer packet loss!
Re:POLL IDEA: devkernel announces? (Score:1)
* Announce all stable kernels under topic 'Linux'
* Announce all dev kernels under topic 'Linux Kernels'
except when they are so fantastic that everybody
wants to know about them. Then they too can be
announced under topic 'Linux'
Bitkeeper? (or similar Source Management System) (Score:1)
Is the new development kernel going to use BitKeeper [bitkeeper.com] or some other similar source management system?
I've been wondering on this for a long time now , I heard Linus at least some of the other kernel developers were interested, what's the current status of such a move?
Re:Get used to it (Score:1)
Skippy
Re:Your perl scripts are buggy Rob! (Score:1)
Skippy
WE ALLREADY GOT ONE! (Score:1)
it doesn't affect me either, but i like hearing it (Score:1)
besides, like it's affecting you.
Another Patch? (Score:2)
So, let's stop this madness; Slashdot is news for nerds, not Linux Patches and by the way did you hear that...
Those who need it will find it.
Re:Please stop posting devel kernel releases. (Score:2)
As for newbies, I don't see this as a big deal. Assuming they're as unexperienced as you claim by the time they read enough documentation to get the kernel installed they should be able to understand that development releases are possibly unstable and potentially dangerous.
-Restil
Why not just announce new kernel features? (Score:1)
Nobody is really interested in talk about a bunch of updates. Software updates is what Freshmeat is for. Slashdot is for news.
Looking at the Changelog, it seems that the real news here is: Centaur C6 MCRs now supported. Does that deserve a Slashdot article? I think not.
Re:Why not just announce new kernel features? (Score:1)
Why would this have anything to do with Microsoft? This has to do with Slashdot and replies like yours.
FYI, I am running kernel 2.2.8 and will soon upgrade to either 2.2.9 or 2.3.2. But there are dozens of ways to find out about new kernel releases.
Snapshots of egcs are not discussed on Slashdot, so why should development kernel release be discussed.
Re:Read-Write HPFS! (Score:1)
No reason to be that scared. Backup anything important; if you are lazy and have lots of space, just backup the whole raw partition to somewhere else on the network. Then no matter how badly the kernel mangles your disk, it is very easy to return it to a known good state. The NTFS module is quite unstable; even read-only it has locked up solid (repeatably, so I should work on finding the bug, *sigh*). But I've never lost any data to it, and only a little time.
I realize that its not practical if you are low on disk space and don't have the luxury of a Sun server full of big disks nearby, but I often find myself using gzip and an rsh pipe to send an entire partition or disk over the network to a file server before attempting something questionable. (Heck, I occasionally reinstall Windows boxen that way :)
Also, it might be good to look into the history of the HPFS r/w code... if it is known to be relatively stable, and has just been waiting to be mainlined because of the feature freeze preceding 2.2, then I wouldn't be too nervous about using it. (I don't know in this case; not an OS/2 fan, personally.)
Re:Please help me! (Score:1)
gcc for kernels for some reason. I'm running 2.2.8 with no probs.