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Linux at the Macworld Expo 80

haaz writes "Linux has a big role behind the scenes at the Macworld Expo in San Francisco: the entire OC-3 Internet backbone runs on Linux. All the DNS, IP management, security, etc., is running on Linux. LinuxPPC Inc. is exhibiting, marking their debut as the first Linux exhibitors at a Macworld Expo."
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Linux at the Macworld Expo

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  • Posted by zaha:

    what does that mean, exactly, when an "entire OC-3 Internet backbone runs on Linux" ?

    MacOS _will_ get better, and there are some important applications still only available on Mac (genome mapping, for example)... i would expect Linux or some other Unix to bear the bulk of the connectivity and security needs of the conference, but the above quote is rather vague and hyperbolic.
  • Posted by zaha:

    that wasn't the issue
  • Posted by zaha:

    solaris wasn't really ever about speed. it's _reliable_.

    and cheap intel hardware is exactly that.

  • by spacey ( 741 )
    what does that mean, exactly, when an "entire OC-3 Internet backbone runs on Linux" ?

    FYI OC3 is a leased line that is, I believe, 155 Mbps max. It's the kind of capacity that can make a lot of people happy.

    As for the rest, the design of the MacOS has never impressed me with its ability to scale. From the paper that Alan Cox has online on porting linux m68k to the mack68k, I don't think the hardware is entirely well designed either.

    MacOS *has* been getting better for about... 8 years now. In the same time, linux has become remarkably better. MacOS is still mostly more of the same.

    IMO the less you have running on a mac, the less often you have to save against unrecoverable crashes.

    Macs are obnoxious computers.


  • Actually it has gone GM. and almost all other tech news sites are saying it will be released this week. As for if its going to be preloaded on any systems...thats another story.
  • I had the same idea. I also would like to start a business making and selling PPC systems running Linux and MacOS X. Even AIX. CHRP is not a closed standard and its cleaner than X86. But I don't agree that Apple has a strangle hold on the PPC. They don't even manufacture them. Motorola and IBM do. They are not popular for the desktop because INTEL has a strangle hold on the desktop (not really Intel, but any X86 chip maker).
    If you look around, there are PPC system makers, like Bull computing, IBM, PIOS (They changed their name), etc.
  • I'd say Mac's for people who want to get media done. Yes, linux is a great OS and I tell people about it every day. But it still isn't there in media. I'm not talking about X11Amp and xanim. Linux is getting there, Blender is GOOD. Gimp is aproaching photoshop, but is never planned on having CMYK, so it won't make it in the DTP world. Linux has nothing like Illustrator. Now video editing in Linux. Don't bash the Mac, cause it's good at what it's made for. And because of ease of use, my parents can surf on a Mac all day. They aren't interested in upgrading lib's and uptime. They just want it to work.

    Linux is great for behind the scenes, but it has a way to go before it's on the stage.
  • Ok linux people. Here's one that X still can't touch. What's with the bass ackwards fonts support in X? Who the hell is going to load a daemon/server/app whatever just so you can make the ttf's work? Fonts are one of those things that should be system wide, build in, not to mention beautiful. X has pisspoor font support. Even if you can find a font, they are a jaggy as hell.
  • The majority of people that view slashdot do so with MicroSloth machines, so why not advertise for things that you people can use?
  • I imagine Rob & Co will take an add from anyone who wishes to pay for one, not unreasonable.

    I have noticed that Visual Cafe is advertizing here, does anyone know if they are considering a linux port?

    (PS I'd probably buy a copy if they did)
    --Zachary Kessin
  • head on over to AppleInsider [] and check out what apple has instore for tomorrow. a playstaion emulator, bringing over 1200 games to the mac. so, where's that game argument now?
  • You said:
    But you have to move the mouse a lot further from where you are working to get to the menu bar.
    The designers of the Macintosh (well, Lisa) interface thought about this. Perhaps you're trying to carefully position the pointer over the menu you want to pull down like you have to do with some other systems... On the Mac, you only have to use such fine motor skills to select the command from a menu. Thanks to a real acceleration curve and the fact that you can't normally "overshoot" the menu bar, gross motor skills suffice to allow you to pull down a menu.
  • Well, for one, the advertisers paid for it. Second, they are supporting /. by paying for the service. Third, they skrew themselves by placing and ad about a product not many of you would buy anyway. E.g., you wouldn't place an ad for refigerators in Greenland, would you? So, /. benefits the most for this. We win!
  • > Some things are single click, some are double click.

    You won't mind if I remind that you can have single, double, AND triple clicks on a Mac (plus Cmd-click and Option-click).

    > Menu bars at the top of the screen. Means you only have to move the mouse up and to the right x location to hit a menu, you won't miss and go over. It reduces the dexterity needed to manipulate the menus.

    Well, good thing KDE will feature this very same thing. Better yet, it will be optional, so you can have whichever you like best. Still not yet available for GNOME, but it might get there too.

    > The screen fonts are well thought out. _Nothing_ has the clarity of the original mac fonts for screen (low res) readability - Chicago, Geneva and Monaco.

    Sure, X's default fonts don't win any beauty contest (if there's anything as a default font for X; I should say "the fonts that are included with the X distribution"), but you can change them to whatever you want.

    > Two mice is not a problem. Great for people who suffer from RSI if they make the same motion too often.

    Well, you might get pumped up more by using two mice, but not everyone is ambidextrous.

    > It may be hard for you all to realize it, but the mac actually does a large number of things right.

    This I agree with. The Mac's user interface is still a reference point from which everyone builds upon. It's the kind of design that lets you work the way you want to work, not the way it wants you to work.

    Nothing's bloody perfect. The Mac UI is far from perfect. But it's a choice; if you like it, go for it. If you don't, there are other choices. And if you're into Open Source, you can change it what's out there, or you can make your own.
  • Are we surprised by this? If I was Rob I wouldn't turn down any revenue within reason. (Beyond reason would be plastering a giant WHERE DO YOU WANT TO GO TODAY banner on the page, and changing everything to MS colors ;))

    There should probably be a reminder here to keep an open mind. I mean if Microsoft came out with a good product that was meant to actually WORK and work well, I would support it... I'm not holding my breath though.

  • Sheeplike thinking? Maybe, but probably not.

    Smart thinking? Yeah....

    You own a business. Your business makes programs. You pay your programmers. If you find out that 99.9% of your customers want Action A to be performed by Method M, are you going to put forth the time and money it takes to let people do it another way? Probably not. You're going to save your time and money, focusing on some other problem that's will affect more people (like not firing the HD platters out of the front of the machine, though that would look really cool :-) ).

    Sure, that 0.1% gets the shaft, but many companies thrive on serving that 0.1%, unless that 0.1% amounts to ten which case, they just have to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them and suck it up and deal. Then again, they can learn to program and figure something out themselves....hello open software!

    By the way, it is very easy to have multiple DNS servers and multiple connections in Open Transport. In the TCP/IP control panel is a Configurations options, which lets you store prefs for multiple connections....on the downside, I believe you have to manually switch them, but that's probably no big thing, and you could probably write an Applescript to do that for you. Furthermore, simply change the user mode (under Edit) to Advanced or Admin to add DNS servers.
  • ColorSync
    Strong PostScript font support
    Easy to administrate
    intuitive interface (artist like it)
    and probably most important:
    Printing and publishing industry standard
  • ColorSync
    Strong PostScript font support
    Easy to administrate
    intuitive interface (artist like it)
    and probably most important:
    Printing and publishing industry standard
  • Yeahyeah... ;) was it you we talked to about it?

    OK, so the OC-3 ITSELF doesnt run on Linux.. ;-) thats why /. is known for quality accuracy in reporting from us blokes who can't report something right the first time.
  • You should look into KDE my friend. It's about as touchy-feely with consistency as you can get.
  • by gambit ( 3767 )
    Jeeze...just a suggestion for those needing something of a warm and fuzzzy desktop. Part of your slowness could be due to the LinuxPPC dist. which is not quite up to speed with the x86 Linux versions.

    As for your last comment, I too have work to get done and my Mac doesn't cut it (not to mention my NT box...ugh)...that's why I've switched to Linux for good.
  • Mac OS X and Mac OS X server are not the same. Mac OS X server is basically just Rhapsody renamed. Mac OS X is a more consumer oriented release that will allow most legacy MacOS apps to run, after minor tweaking, with protected memory and preemptive multitasking alongside yellowbox apps. Mac OS X server will soon be released, while the release date for "Mac OS X is not slated for widespread release until at least the third quarter of 1999".
  • I'd heard that OSX server had gone GM. Anyone know if it's getting any prominence at macworld? Also, what about the quicktime server (open?) that jobs was maybe going to demo at the keynote?
  • duh- the keynote doesn't happen until tomorrow. hopefully some slashdotter will attend and let us know if anything important is rolled out.
  • by brindle ( 8241 )
    Its getting to the point where I am almost surprised this is considered news. It seems Linux is everywhere behind the scenes. Now I would be stoked if the hardware it was running on was PPC!!


  • "For instance, why can't I setup my wife's MAC to have two DNS servers? Because 99.9% of Mac users don't have a home network in addition to their dialup connection."

    Sorry, wrong. I've got three name servers, and can enter all three.

    What are you doing wrong?
  • Basically I feel that someone selling advertising space should allow anyone to buy it as long as the ad or the product being advertised does not have a negative impact on the media that is displaying it. I find it almost amusing that Microsoftish things would be advertised on a typically anti-M$ site. Oh well. It's their money. ;)

    Ex Machina "From the Machine" []
  • No one ever said the Mac OS was a good server OS. There's more to an OS than stability and power. If you want a rock-solid server, Linux is a good choice. But the Mac OS is still way ahead of the alternatives in consistency, intuitiveness, and seamless integration. Only on a Mac can you plug in a peripheral with a reasonable expectation of it working right without fooling around with configuration files. So if you want to get work done with minimal hassle, the Mac OS is still the best choice in many areas.

    Besides, many of the Linux boxes were probably Macs running LinuxPPC, and Mac OS X will make the Mac far more stable and powerful, making it a competitive server OS.
  • I bet you a $1 that you use the same damn qwerty keyboard everybody else in the world uses.

    How delightfully American. English and the qwerty keyboard are in the minority on this planet.
  • Don't I recall it going GM about a month ago? I think Apple's supposed to announce it at this expo.
  • If your only OS is linux, pretty soon every computer looks like a server.
    ehehe, you're probably right, i'm beginning to think that about my 486 at home anyway :o)
  • This isn't the debut for Linux exhibitors at Macworld, LinuxPPC has been exhibited there for at least the last 2 expos.

    At the SF one last year, the last one I was at, LinuxPPC has a really small showing, but one of the developers was onhand and we talked about Linux for awhile; me being a Linux newbie at the time.

    The point is, the important part of this news story is not that Linux is running in the backroom, it is that Linux PPC is actually convincing 'GUI-loving' Macheads to try linux.

  • What is it with everybody going off on MacOS being so superior when it comes to design. Not that I like Windows, but I would rather use Windows any day over MacOS when it comes to design. What apps and strongpoints does MacOS have over Windows in that area?
  • TrueType Fonts? Who invented them again? Apple or Adobe..I know that much....
    Sorry, just reminding you that even if you hate Macs, they're responsible for just about every development in the computer industry, for had apple failed, IBM wouldn't have made any PCs, now would they? And what OS would there be to rip off for windows95? (Innovation my foot!)
    Sorry. Mac Rant.
    LinuxPPC 5.0 Will RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • The pc is used for Finite Element Modeling (nt unfortunately)

    Funny that's what I thought UNIX was for.
  • Love that menubar. I keep on selecting the wrong one, and bringing a window forward.

    The one thing about the mac is not the interface, it's the finder ( the thing windows tries to emulate, so poorly).

    On windows, a file has an extension and is asssociated with a program with an extension. This means files of certains types, eg tif, jpg, gif can only be associated with one program. I can not double click on a gif file created in photoshop and have it open in photoshop after IE has clobbered the file extention associations. you need the damn mouse, and hand to hold down the shift key, and get "open with" command in menu (unless you do some more custom configuration).

    Now the mac is killer. The OS is resposible for file associations. A file created in an application, opens in that application.

    on windows, you find the application, and tell the os about the application.

    on a mac, the OS finds the application, and discovers the applications capabilities (reads file types gif, tif, etc)

    This is why macs work so well when the OS is reinstalled, the os finds the applications.

    And why you need to reinstall the apps or the registry after windows is reinstalled.
  • Well, most complex apps have their own cut+paste buffer for complex stuff (like pasting images, or keeping things in the cut buffer for a long time), but for simple get-the-data-into-the-app sort of things, there's a universal X selection buffer. Just select something and middle-click in the correct widget of the window you want it in. If you don't have a middle mouse button, your X server may be set up to emulate one when you click the left and right buttons together. If you only have one mouse button, I'm afraid you're beyond salvation. :)
  • Umm...sorry, we've only been serving fonts off of an Appleshare server to about 60 Macs for the past 6 years.

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