System76 Launches AMD Ryzen-Powered 'Serval WS' Portable Linux Workstation (betanews.com) 52
Linux computer maker/seller System76 has been offering AMD processors in its Thelio desktop computers, but believe it or not, the company has never offered an AMD-powered laptop -- until now, that is. From a report: You see, starting today, you can buy a "Serval WS" powered by AMD. No, System76 is not offering mobile Ryzen chips in this laptop, but instead, desktop-class processors. As you can expect, this 15-inch portable Linux workstation is quite chunky and heavy as a result. With that said, it is simply impossible to cram this much power into a thin and light notebook. "The Serval WS comes with either the 3rd Gen Ryzen 3600, 3700X, or 3900 CPU. The latter is equipped with 12 Cores and 24 Threads, making this laptop perfect for taking on heavy computational loads. Having this kind of desktop-caliber power in a laptop body helps if you need to run complex simulations at your desk or quickly render 3D scenes while on the road. AMD CPUs are also known for having the an extremely high price per performance, which means you get maximum bang-for-buck," says System76. The laptop starts at $1,300 -- and BetaNews has all the specs.
Nvidia graphics (Score:4, Insightful)
The workstation uses Nvidia graphics, for which no good free drivers exist. Nvidia graphics are a bad choice for a GNU/Linux computer.
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Nobody gives a shit about GNU
Re:Nvidia graphics (Score:4, Interesting)
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I'm hoping this changes significantly as time goes on. ATI graphics hardware should be more than capable.
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Re:Nvidia graphics (Score:4, Insightful)
A significant subset of someone who might buy a monster laptop like this.
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In my experience, most of the people who depend on Tensorflow are the same sort who don't really care able GPL at best and would like everything ported to BSD licensed tools (so they can use those tools in their own proprietary work.)
Wish it weren't so.
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Not all Linux users care about using 100% FLOSS. I use a good amount of proprietary engineering software for work, so I really don't care if my graphics drivers are open source or not, just that they work. In my experience, the proprietary NVIDIA drivers for Linux not only work quite well, but they work out of the box with minimal to zero configuration. That said, my last AMD card was in 2004, back when they were still ATI, so I admit ignorance on that side and you should take my post with the appropriate a
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From what I've read they can be quite problematic when using an AMD APU with an Nvidia GPU.
Many people seem to have problems, Here's a current example I found within a few seconds with google [reddit.com].
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Not all Linux users care about using 100% FLOSS...
I would be in that group. As long as it works, I'm not really fussed if the video driver is open source or not. The machine I have is dual boot so I can play graphic intensive games when the mood strikes, but most of the time I run Linux for office-like work and database work and don't really stress the GPU at all...though I should really check out more games for Linux on Steam to see what they have.
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Yeah I'm sure the people who need this really a give a shit about binary blob drivers.
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The workstation uses Nvidia graphics, for which no good free drivers exist. Nvidia graphics are a bad choice for a GNU/Linux computer.
You know what's a worse choice for a high end workstation? Everything else.
Someone always needs to let perfect be the enemy of good. I hope you don't like computers because it sounds like none will ever please you.
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I have to admit that when buying laptops, I often spend a lot of time considering my options, not being really happy with nearly everything I see (and availability of free drivers is an important aspect for me; I am willing to use non-free firmware, though I'd prefer free firmware). Fortunately this is not so much a problem with desktops, where i can just build my own.
But I have been looking to get a new laptop for months, and just finally made a decision a few days ago. I wanted something powerful for comp
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Wish I had mod points for you
Because it is using Nvidia, in a few years it will be a boat anchor for Linux. Why ? Nvidia does not support their driver on Linux after a few years, that means you will need to use nouveau, which may very well not work.
This occurred last year on a Desktop I have. But because it is a desktop, I was able to purchase a non-Nvidia card and that card works great.
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Wish I had mod points for you
Because it is using Nvidia, in a few years it will be a boat anchor for Linux. Why ? Nvidia does not support their driver on Linux after a few years, that means you will need to use nouveau, which may very well not work.
This occurred last year on a Desktop I have. But because it is a desktop, I was able to purchase a non-Nvidia card and that card works great.
Yes they do. My 5 year old nVidia graphics card still works fine with the newest Linux kernel and the nVidia driver.
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Wish I had mod points for you
Because it is using Nvidia, in a few years it will be a boat anchor for Linux. Why ? Nvidia does not support their driver on Linux after a few years,
My Nvidia card is so old it doesn't need a fan. Had an official Linux driver update last month.
You might have tripped over the packaging system on your Linux distro - Ubuntu by any chance?
Transposition (Score:1)
I believe they mean, an extremely high performance per dollar (price). Advertising an extremely high price for the performance you get seems counterintuitive.
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I was trying to see where they wrote that on the System76 website, but failed. The people who maintain that website can speak English rather well (is that a given in Colorado?) so it seems uncharacteristic.
Still, does this really count as news?
heat? (Score:2)
This thing will thermal throttle to nothing.
If you are doing serious compute, which requires heat, you already know that you need serious thermal management. That's why I have a big box with lots of fans for my FPGA place & route tasks. I'm never doing this on a laptop. Not sure who is buying this.
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Not necessarily. AMD Desktop CPUs can be configured to a TDP of 65W. That is not that much more than the 45W of the high-performance mobile ADM CPUs.
So in a slightly thicker-than normal laptop it shouldn't be a problem to cool a desktop AMD processor.
Schenker also introduced a AMD desktop CPU (up to Ryzen 9 3950X) / Nvidia GPU mobile workstation (XMG APEX 15) with CPU TDP configured to 65 W a while ago. I don't remember any throttling in the reviews.
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Oh no (Score:2)
You better hurry up and let System 76 know of your findings!
Too big & heavy for me (Score:1)
I use a laptop when I am not at home. At home I have an 8 core AMD FX8150, 32 GB RAM, 4 TB disk (mirrored) - oldish but performs well.
So: I don't need a laptop with a lot of grunt. As long as it can run firefox & ssh (to get home) then I am happy. In the trade off between performance & battery life I will always choose battery life. To make it easier to carry: a screen about 12" is adequate and as light as possible. Oh, it must run Linux Mint. Not too pricey so that I won't cry too much when I lose
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Well duh, it's too big and heavy for almost everyone. It's a niche but for the right people this is exactly what they want. I lugged one around as a consultant, 99% of the time I was on AC power at a desk it just so happened it was rarely the same desk all week or even all day because 2-3 client projects would overlap. All I wanted for portability was to be able to close the lid, put it in my backpack (not carrying that monstrosity in a bag very far) and be on my way. The rest was all performance.
If you think this is big and heavy... (Score:4, Interesting)
... You don't know the history of portable PCs [oldcomputers.net]
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I think they called these "luggables" back in the day...
Fatally flawed. (Score:4, Interesting)
I've been looking for a "workstation-class" laptop for a while, and had high hopes for this one... right up until I saw the keyboard.
I can understand why the "must be thin-and-light" boxes end up with the sort of keys that wouldn't look (and feel) out of place on an 80s calculator, but a machine for serious use should have a proper keyboard...
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If you truly need a "workstation" class laptop, I'd advocate the Thinkpad P or W series. I've been running Linux on Thinkpads for nearly two decades now and have never had significant problems. I primarily use the T series, although I have owned a few W series for work over the years (unfortunately had to use Windows for work).
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Definitely. Even the new Thinkpad keyboards (which are crap when compared to the old ones) are better than most laptops these days. And you get the Trackpoint, too.
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But... Intel...
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I, too, have used ThinkPads for many years, but the keyboards of recent models have ranged from "poor" to "atrocious".
I get the sense that they (and not just Lenovo) are putting basically the same keyboard mechanisms on their entire range now as a cost-saving measure...
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In my opinion they took a step back around the T430/T440 era, but are trending better again. My current personal laptop, a T480, seems to have a decently built keyboard (at least by today's standards). It was a step up from my T430s although my older T-series (T21, T400, etc.) had a better feel.
Keyboard? (Score:2)
Keyboard? What keyboard? It looks like Scrabble tiles. And I'll bed that Scrabble tiles have more travel when you press them on a marble table.
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At least the scrabble tiles are right next to each other instead of having 1/4 inch of framing around each one like on Dell laptops.
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but a machine for serious use should have a proper keyboard...
It is a proper keyboard. You press a key and a letter pops up. I guess you mean a "true" keyboard which is a no true Scotsman fallacy since there are a large number of people out there who actively prefer having less travel on their keys, which is precisely what makes the Microsoft Surface keyboards and the Apple Magic keyboards so popular.
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I guess you mean a "true" keyboard which is a no true Scotsman fallacy since there are a large number of people out there who actively prefer having less travel on their keys, which is precisely what makes the Microsoft Surface keyboards and the Apple Magic keyboards so popular.
I think that's more to do with the users being idiots and not knowing any better. They might not notice if the machine was turned off.
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Nope. People actually go out of their way to get these devices, myself included. But thanks for telling me that you know better than I do about what I prefer to type on.
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Just carry a wireless real keyboard and mouse with you. For that matter, if you're working in one place for a while you want a big external 4K display too.
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Why wireless? I remember it was annoying when the battery used to run out on the wireless mouse I had 20 years ago. I soon went back to using wired mice and keyboards.
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Because the stores don't carry anything else. This recent fad for wireless keyboards and mice has been quite annoying.
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I use one of Logitech's wireless keyboards that also doesn't need additional batteries... it's solar powered, a K750. The only drawback is that it uses Logitech's USB dongle instead of Bluetooth.
Note that I "grew up" using squishy Atari ST keyboards, so my preferences won't line up with folks who want big clicky keys.
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I am fine with such keys. Especially if the make a laptop a little bit thinner and lighter for me to carry around.
After all, for me, those keys don't get used that often. Maybe three hours per week on average (e.g. when I use the laptop on a train). The rest of the time, the laptop sits on some desk attached to a USB HUB that provides a connection to a normal keyboard.
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Yeah, I hate the chicklet keys... poor sense of center.
But at least it has a removable battery so you can carry a spare...
Waiting for 4800u, ultralight workstations (Score:1)
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Hopefully we can get a few laptops that support ECC memory.
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Hopefully we can get a few laptops that support ECC memory.
Absolutely, a machine like that (which can come with a Ryzen Pro desktop CPU) pratically begs for ECC memory support. Which the Ryzen Pro supports. Unfortunately, it seems System76 dropped the ball on this one: an option for ECC RAM isn't even listed in their "Design & Buid" page. Probably because the 'motherboard' System76 is using doesn't have the traces, and/or its ROM doesn't enable it :-(
Looks like a Clevo/Sager notebook (Score:2)
This look like its a Clevo/Sager notebook, at least from the outside. I can't find anything that looks like an exact match component wise, but the case is definitely a match and the components are very similar. System76's prices seem relatively good to similarly spec'd Clevo/Sager models.
I have a 2012 System76, and it's still kicking. The SSD is on its last legs, and it recently started taking an agonizingly long time to boot, but it still runs.
ECC memory support? (Score:1)