Cuba Switching to Linux 1149
Tony Montana writes "According to several news sites the government of Cuba is dumping Windows in favour of Linux. Cuba's director of information technology, Roberto del Puerto, says that Cuba already has approximately 1500 computers running on Linux, and is working towards replacing Windows on all state owned computers."
Lets start counting (Score:5, Funny)
this is 1
At least one (Score:4, Funny)
I am just curious to know... (Score:5, Interesting)
Microsoft is an American corporation, it isn't legally allowed to profit from or provide goods or services that are shipped to Cuba. If I am understanding the US Trade Embargo correctly...
Re:I am just curious to know... (Score:3, Informative)
You'll recall that the former Soviet Union copied the IBM 360/370 design for their Ryad series of computers. I vaguely recall reading long ago in Datamation that Cuba tended to rip off DEC designs (e.g. the PDP-8).
Re:I am just curious to know... (Score:5, Interesting)
Cuba used Windows. But they can't legally purchase Windows from Microsoft due to trade embargo, so they pirate it.
Now, Cuba does not want Windows any more. They want Linux.
So MS should be delighted that Cuba is no longer pirating their software. It's a win-win situation. I can't wait to hear MSs take on this.
Re:I am just curious to know... (Score:4, Insightful)
While this may be a net-zero cash flow move for Microsoft, there is a possibility that this may influence another Latin American country to follow suit, possibly one from which that Microsoft might actually get cash out of.
My guess is that there will be no official comment out of Microsoft.
Re:I am just curious to know... (Score:5, Funny)
That still doesn't explain... (Score:3, Interesting)
If the copies are illegal and thus MS is not profiting off of them. Nobody in Cuba should be able to run Windows Update.
If the copies are legal, then MS Windows Update should check for and disallow any Windows running PCs from Cuba to access and run updates.
I am just saying...
FOSS is collaboration without an enemy (Score:3, Insightful)
Communism makes some people see red (:-), so leave it out.
More relevant here is that Linux and open source in general is about cooperation and collaboration without an enemy, whereas sociopolitical systems usually have an enemy within and always have an enemy without. Our collaborative community has no real similarity to any of that, despite the political FUD occasionally dished out by the vested interests that we're treading on.
So yeah, we'
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Funny)
Marxism Linism?
The Shining PATH?
Mao's Red Hat?
chkguevarra?
This is the sound of C.. [muziekcentrum.be]
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Funny)
They already have a health care system that costs a fraction of U.S. care and provides a similar mean population longevity. Linux seems like a natural complement to that efficiency.
But what if they decide to host the North American linux conference some year and nobody in the U.S. can go?
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
I think you'll find they are wanting to use it as it is 'free' as in 'not produced by a company in the country that has maintained a remarkably schizophrenic attitude to Cuba, attempted numerous coups and asassination attempts against the leader and is currently forcing the general populace to live below the poverty line by punitive trade embargoes all based on misplaced ideology' :).
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:5, Insightful)
The reality simply is that Cuba is run by a corrupt and incompetant military dictator whose only prior qualification was being a spoiled rich kid and lawyer. The complete mismanagement of the economy by his everlasting regime led to scarcity, and the spoils system inherent in any communist regime has led to a disparity whereby most Cubans live in abject poverty, but the priveledged few live in opulant comfort.
Cuba is not even a good example of how a communist ought to be run, but it is an excellent example of how communist governments eventually are run.
Re:Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:FUC#ING LIAR!!! (Score:5, Informative)
Cuba had the lowest malnutrition rate [fao.org] in Latin America from 1979-1992, before the US intensified sanctions. Its estimated number of malnourished as of the report date (2000) was 1.8 million, i.e. ~5%. This is almost completely due to the increased embargo; not being able to buy from the US (its nearest potential supplier) increases costs by about 30%; caloric intake during the time dropped 38%. Even still, for comparison, about 30 million Mexicans (~%28) are malnourished. Who is crying them a river?
As for your "ex-cuban" relatives, you are staring in the face the classic example of "selection bias". If they weren't anti-castro/anti-communist, they wouldn't have fled to the US, now would they?
Re:FUC#ING LIAR!!! (Score:5, Informative)
As an example: Cubans eat a large portion of their calories from rice. Currently, they import most of their rice from Europe, which has to be shipped across the Atlantic. Yet, some of the cheapest rice in the world is grown in Texas, right nearby. It's things like this that make food have an effective "embargo surcharge" in Cuba. Incidentally, it hurts US farmers at the same time.
Re:cuba facts (Score:4, Informative)
Yes, you don't have freedom of political speech in Cuba, and that is a shame. However, lets not overstate the situation here. For the vast majority of people (who choose not to involve themselves in politics and political institutions), as with Iraq before we invaded, it doesn't affect their lives much. Their main issues are things like economics, healthcare, education, security, etc - the things that citizens all over the world concern themselves with. Different individuals will differ as to how much of Cuba's problems are Castro's fault and how much are America's (often to extreme degrees), but the most even a very vocal dissident generally faces is jail time.
Re:Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:5, Funny)
The reality simply is that Cuba is run by a corrupt and incompetant military dictator whose only prior qualification was being a spoiled rich kid and lawyer.
It sounds to me like Big Bill would be quite comfortable here, when he decides to retire. At only $33 Billion, he could just buy the whole place. Imagine him growing out his hair and having his image replacing all those of Che.
He could be just as corrupt and incompetent as he wants to be and no one would notice the difference. He'd have to get used to making eight hour speeches about the evil imperialist Linux worms, but we got pills now that make that no problem.
As for the rest of us, we'd finally get a real high quality English/Spanish translator built into
Windows!
Re:Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:5, Informative)
Castro was a rich kid and lawyer, but he only took from that his education, if you knew anything about the revolution you'd know he lived in poverty in the revolutionary camps out in the boonies. You'd also know that the rich folks like his family tended to support the corrupt Batista regime, and that Castro had the courage to fight against the inequality, while nearly ALL other rich families supported Batista.
You complain about the average Cuban living in poverty but you miss the following - ALL Cubans have access to government-issued food, education, and medical care. That's EVERYBODY, from the chauffer who drives Castro around to a dentist in Havana to a farmer in la Isla de Juventud.
You also complain about poverty but neglect to mention 90% of that poverty is due to the trade embargo by the USA. Cuba is a third-world country, that is definitely true. Now if you look at its income and compare to other countries of similar income you'll see that Cuba is far far ahead of other countries. Many residents of Latin America admire Castro for what he has done for Cuba, especially in light of all the aggression the USA has against them.
Re:Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:5, Informative)
I was in Cuba in I think 1992, in the middle of the periodo especial, when western press reported of continuous power outages, no running water, oppressive policing. We (me and dad) were in a group of 8 tourists, and there was no VIP among us, so no chance they were polishing the country for us (though the tour guides obviously did not bring us to the worst conceivable places).
Facts observed:
Is Cuba a place that had the same leader for too long time? Granted. Is Cuba a place that has a low GNP, much lower than the US'? Granted too. Were the kangaroo trials on three men who tried to hijack a boat to the US and a few days later got executed a shame? Sure bet. Would Cuba be better off with socialism out and market economy in? I say, look at Haiti.
Lesson learnt: if it's about a country your country does not like, for any reason do not trust the information you get. No matter which country is yours and which the other. Either go and check for yourself, or simply guard your doubts.
Re:Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:5, Insightful)
Brilliant logic, the people that emigrate from a country do tend to hate the government (or economy or other factors). You then extrapolate from extremely specific subset to all people.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
The US doesn't maintain crippling economic embargos against most of them.
If you think the US attitude towards Cuba is *anything* other than a relic of the Cold War and the political consequence of the relatively large power wielded by exiles in the arena of Florida politics, you are sadly mistaken. And the sad truth is, Cuba does have the high ground in this.
Re:You seem to have forgotten... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
Look, however much governments (US or otherwise) wish to pretend that their foreign policy is based on morality, it isn't. OK? Foreign policy is solely about protecting your national interests : in terms of finance and security, and the sooner you recognise that, the more sense you'll make of it.
It's not about good guys vs bad guys, and it's especially not about democracy vs. dictatorship. A dictator friendly to US interests (the House of Saud, for instance) is always going to treated more favourably than an unfriendly democrat (say, the President of France, or "Old Europe" as we like to call ourselves).
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
The Saudi's are still appalling violators of human rights, and the latest Amnesty International reports suggest they're not about to change. The difference between American treatment of Saudi Arabia and Cuba is based on two things
i) Cuba is near, and the spectre of a communist boogeyman still plays well with the US electorate.
ii) Access to one of the world's largest reserves of oil is of more strategic importance than access to the world's best cigars.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Informative)
Fulgencio Batista was a ruthless dictator, but that was all fine and dandy with the US because he was friendly with them. Not so with Cubans, which why Castro et al managed to overthrow him starting off with only 16 people.
And in Chile, Salvadore Allende was democratically elected, yet the US helped to overthrow him because he wasn't right-wing enough for them, and so that bastard Pinochet got run run roughshod over Chile for the next few decades. And that was all okay.
And in the Dominican Republic, Rafael Trujillo ("he may be a son of a bitch, but he's our son of a bitch") ran a brutal dictatorship all with the help of the US. So why was he okay?
And in Nicaragua, Anastasio Somoza ran a disgraceful dictatorship all nicely sponsored by the US for decades. But once again, somehow that was okay but Sandinistas were not.
And let's not forget that good buddy of the US, Saddam Hussein, who received assloads of military equipment because it suited the interests of the US.
US history is so overrun with embarassing stuff like this it's depressing. But the worst part is that it keeps happening, and most Americans just don't seem to give a damn.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Informative)
Mind you I'm American, but a lot of us are complete fools scarfing down whatever propaganda our leadership feeds us. I've seen the lie become truth so often in the past few years that I've developed a completely new respect for the foresight of George Orwell. The guy looks like a damned prophet today.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
Interesting. When I was at school in Britain, every morning we said a prayer to God. In America I believe your kids pledge allegance to the flag of the United States of America. Now you might just accept that as a normal thing, but from this side of the pond that looks rather like like "brainwashing starting in kindergarten."
But today it is a different dynamic (Score:5, Insightful)
See here is the problem: During the Cold War, the US implimented a policy of helping Cubans who didn't much like Castro immigrate to the US, where they now make up an indispensible voting block on one of the most important states (Florida). In doing so, we have essentially imported Castro's oppoisition to the US, where they are now a formitable force. Sort of a tail wagging the dog....
So now, anyone with presidential aspirations cannot afford to alienate this group. So while we can pursue free trade with China (which seems to be helping to force them to transform their economy to more of a market one), it is politically impossible to do this with Cuba.
Furthermore, lets look at this idea of placating evil. I have only a few names to mention: Joseph Stalin, Saddam Hussein, Manuel Noriega, Ho Chi Minh.... Each of these people have either been close US allies or CIA operatives. With friends like these, who needs enemies? Just like the Germanic tribes and the Romans, only former allies can beat the world's largest superpower. We saw that with Vietnam, and we may be seeing that today with Iraq.
Today, things are probably a little better, but we still see issues with the regimes of countries like Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Pakistan, Uzbekistan, Indonesia, Malaysia, Russia in terms of systematic oppression of their peoples. Yet these are still our current allies. China was left off the list because I don't think that they are really being seen as an ally at the moment. So I ask again, with friends like these who needs enemies?
Interestingly if oyu look at Africa, those countries which during the cold war associated themselves with the USSR are now further in their transition to democracy than those dictatorships that the US propped up. Sometimes I think that we are our own worst enemy in these regards.
Our embargo of Cuba is an anacronism, and a relic of days gone by which has unfortunately institutionalized itself. Free trade is the one weapon we could use with impunity against Castro and which his government could not withstand. Yet it is off the table because it is seen as placating him.
Re:But today it is a different dynamic (Score:4, Informative)
There were actually a series of three wars in what we now call Vietnam which the US was involved in. In the first, we provided material support and training to the Viet Minh, lead by Ho Chi Minh as part of our fight against European colonialism. When Ho Chi Minh came to power, however, the US decided they didn't like his idea of land reform.
So a little while later, when the French decided to reinvade and the "Second Vietnam War" begun, the US provided material aid and support to the French. This lead to a stalemate, and the division of North and South Vietnam.
The third and final war in Vietnam is the one where the US sent large numbers of combat troops. The US was, however, deeply involved in both prior conflicts, having largely decided that they didn't like their former ally.
The great tragedy here is that Ho Chi Minh could have and wanted to be an ally of the US. If we hadn't decided that his policies of land reform (which were *completely* in line with our support for him against the French colonialists) were too similar to communism, neither of the other two conflicts may have happened, and we might actually have had a sound ally in that area, sharing a border with China.
Also regarding Stalin--- I see him as a primary example of placating evil. Of any of the leaders in WWII, he was the *only one* to successfully destroy an ethnic group (the Kossacks) as a cohesive unit. Even Hitler did not succeed there. Indeed, the fallout from Stalin's rule was far worse than anything we saw from the Third Reich. For example, estimates are that the Red Army killed 98% of the Kossacks, and the Cultural Revolution in China cost (by the official estimates of the Chinese Communist party no less) twenty million lives. Granted Stalin was not directly involved in the Cultural Revolution of China, but they had substantial material support from Stalin's regime.
Secondly, I am not really sure that we needed to coordinate with Russia in the war nearly as much as we did. I think it would have been sufficient to say "Ok, we will share intelligence, and provide limited information on our troop movements, but unless you commit to certain reforms, we will neither help you nor coordinate with you strategically, nor will we help you rebuild after the war. If you do these things, we will gladly welcome you with open arms."
One book that really opened my eyes to the nature of the cooperation between the US and USSR during WWII was "Ten Years and Thirty Days" by Admiral Karl Doenitz. It is an interesting read from a very different (German nationalist, but not NSDAP) perspective.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:4, Insightful)
Funny, I think the same thing when I see someone with a Bush/Cheney bumpersticker.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Insightful)
It is ironic that the real communists want to use GNU/Linux because it is free as in beer.
I just went back through the three articles cited in the story, and I didn't see any mention as to why Cuba was going through the conversion to Linux. Where did you get your information?
Other than the "free as in beer" reason, these possibilities occur to me:
I also question your use of the word "ironic" in this context, but I'll leave discussion of english metallurgy to slashdot's esteemed group of grammar nazis.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:5, Funny)
I can Imagine Castro doing a commercial for Linux:
"Linux. Works for computers as old as myself!" (smokes cigar)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Insightful)
whoo hoo 1500 ! (Score:5, Funny)
yeah 1500 computers !!, eat that AMIGA !!
Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:3, Insightful)
My thought exactly. And, if you RTFA (very short, all three of them) you'll find the following: "Del Puerto said his office was working on a legal framework that would allow the replacement of the Windows system". I wonder which legal framework is that? In a country that has the dictator with the longest time in office in the whole world, how much of a "legal framework" is needed, anyhow?
(BTW, congrats to you, twelfth comment and the f
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
It's up to Cuban copyright law to decide whether you should have to pay Microsoft to use copies of their software.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
Intellectual property doubly so.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:4, Informative)
You got that exactly right.
In any country in the world, the government has the "right" to take your property, and pay you a price that they determine (which is sometimes zero).
In some countries, the government is up front about this, making it clear in property documents that you are merely granted use of the property until such time as the government wants it.
In others (such as the US), there's a pretense of private ownership. But when the government wants your property, they simply take it by "eminent domain" (google for it), and it's no longer yours. You have no recourse, unless you have the funds to bribe the right people.
You can talk all you like about property being yours. But it's just a nice social myth, belied by the actions of your own government.
A few years ago, there was a notorious case in Detroit. The city grabbed a big chunk of land by eminent domain, kicked out the people, tore down the houses - and sold it to an auto manufacturer for a price below market rates. This taught a lot of Americans just what "private property" really means to them. Some of us still remember it.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
Remember, rights are not universal; they're granted at the discretion of the country in question, however much we might wish it otherwise.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Informative)
If Cuba isn't a signatory to the international copyright convention, then Cuba has every right to do whatever it wants with Microsoft products.
However, it seems it is a member of the WIPO [wipo.int], so I suspect it is legally bound to recognize Microsoft's copyright.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
He is not nuts. (Score:5, Insightful)
He is educated and cultivated, when he talks to friends he prefers to talk about literature, poetry and movies than about politics. He would put to shame most other world politicians on a debate or discussion, and very often does when given a chance.
His ideology may be unrealistic but it is not irrational. Christianity is also irrational but follows a dogma. In general nobody calls the pope nuts for this reason.
The failure to encourage Cuba to become a democracy has a lot to do with the underestimation of the capacity of Fidel Castro as a politician.
Cuba would perhaps be a democratic country today if successive US goverments would have treated Fidel Castro as the able politician he is and offered him a dignified way out of his isolationism.
The US have done so with far worst dictators.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
What happens when cuban sysadmins start submitting patches into linux? is this not then code that is a product of cuba? that would be Illegal to bring into the USA.
which then comes into a linux used in the USA?
This worries me, as then microsoft could use this as a legal loophole to prohibit the use of Linux in the USA.
That would be a big boon for them as then they would have no competition.
Think about it. How ridiculous does it sound. Or not?
Sorry for the digression (Score:3, Informative)
Actually the embargo has nothing to do if a profit is made or not. An US citizen with a permit to travel to Cuba (and that's very, very rare) can bring back Cuban goods up to a value of 100.00 USD. Others are not permitted to import anythi
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:4, Insightful)
Not being American, and therefor being FREE to go where I please, I can tell you that a rum and COKE is not hard to come by. Funny, I thought Coke was an American company?
Looks like the US has a much larger problem with Coke smuggling than they thought.
Haven't any of you sheeple figured it out yet, it is only illegal if you are not a giant corporation. If you have 30 employees and you trade with Cuba, look out, those Southern redneck senators will hunt you down like dogs. If you employ 30,000 employees, and pay of the douchbags on the hill, you can do as you please.
The US policies against Cuba are bad for Cuba, but great for the rest of the world. It has left a Carribean island with great weather, great beaches, great cigars, affordable accomodations and best of all, NO Americans. It's like vacation heaven. Besides, none of you would like it there. Really.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
Well I'm glad you conceited snobs enjoy the embargo while the people of Cuba suffer because of it. The embargo severely cripples the Cuban economy, but hey, let's keep those people in poverty just so a few snobs like yourself can vacation on the Island free of American influences.
Perhaps you're not aware that not only can the USA not trade with Cuba under the embargo, but any international vessel that trades with Cuba cannot trade with the USA on that same trip. So if you are trading anything, you will aim most of your travels to the USA, because the Cuban imports/exports will not add anythign appreciable.
You may love keeping the embargo intact so you can take small vacations there like the conceited snob you are, but Cubans have alot of difficulty buying everyday necessities such as medicines, light bulbs, automobile parts, etc because of it.
You may love great beaches and cigars, which explains your reasons for going. When I (a US citizen) went we brought tens of thousands of dollars worth of medicines that US hospitals were disposing because they were just past their expiration date (but still good for all intents and purposes). The hospitals we visited were extremely gracious for this, medicines are really in short supply there because of the embargo.
You may like not dealing with Americans travelling in your little vacation paradise, but most cities are poorly lit, with only every 3 or 4 streetlights on. I thought at first this was to save electricity, but it's because they have a very short supply of light bulbs they can get through the embargo.
You may love the antique cars still driving around (with ridiculous amounts of air pollution), but Cubans have tough times getting automobile parts through the embargo. That's why they still have many old cars from before the embargo was placed. They have tough times not only buying new cars but even replacement parts for old cars. But hey, let's keep them in this state just so you can go and visit this quaint island.
It's funny how you dislike Americans so much, yet you're in reality far worse than the average American you despise so much.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:5, Insightful)
Or even Microsoft Canada. We don't buy into the isolationist argument up here, and we don't get our knickers bent out of shape trying to "prove" that communism doesn't work but undermining Cuba at every opportunity.
And that children (Score:5, Funny)
Are they really? (Score:4, Interesting)
I think this snippet sums up a lot of the recent Linux "migration" stories:
Which is sad, since I've had a fairly painless transition to Linux a few years ago. Given the state of WINE these days, there's very little that a Linux-only box can't do that a Wintel box can.
Positive Image (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Positive Image (Score:5, Insightful)
Linux is a good deal for Cuba, as they can't legally buy Windows given the US embargo...actually they can't buy most software under the circumstances. Also, their currency weakness doesn't allow them to trade for services very well. Given that Linux will make the every-day person's life more productive I can't see anyone reasonably opposing Linux adoption in Cuba...the government won't benefit from this directly.
Re:Positive Image (Score:4, Insightful)
You did know that Canada is Cuba's biggest trading partner, right? Yay Helms-Burton law. Really effective....
Pre-crime dangerousness (Score:3, Informative)
That's the most ridiculously self-contradictory statement I've read all year. For some specifics on the human rights abuses you mentioned, see this page [ishr.org]. A choice quote that's relevant at the moment, since numerous people are being arrested for "pre-crime dangerousness" lately:
Re:Are you talking about the US or Cuba? (Score:3, Insightful)
First, there's an issue of degree. There are far more ordinary people in Cuban prisons, who would not be imprisoned in any free country. This imprisonment doesn't require national-level exceptions to normal rules of due process, it's a routine thing. That's not the case with Jose Padilla.
Second, I wasn't defending the US, I was pointing out that Cuba is still a very repressive place, and those who want to pretend that everything's cool and its problems should just be accepted with a wink are
Re:Are you talking about the US or Cuba? (Score:5, Insightful)
First, there's an issue of degree. There are far more ordinary people in Cuban prisons, who would not be imprisoned in any free country.
Perhaps. They jail political dissidents. We jail pot smokers. Thus, the US has the highest imprisonment rate in the world. (Or very close- we don't know North Korea's) Cuba's not even in the top ten.
Second, I wasn't defending the US, I was pointing out that Cuba is still a very repressive place, and those who want to pretend that everything's cool and its problems should just be accepted with a wink are themselves collaborating in the repression of the Cuban people.
I'd be one of the last to defend Cuba- it's a wreck of a country due to a meglomanical dictator. The world will be a better place when Castro is worm food.
But other countries simply don't see Cuba with anywhere near the level of hatred in the US. They see us pointing fingers at Cuba's repressive practices while we're busy keeping people in legal limbo forever in our own tiny slice of Cuba.
If we had cleaner hands other countries might be more willing to listen to us about Cuba.
Re:Positive Image (Score:5, Interesting)
Its tough to leave Cuba, its true, but even if you could leave Cuba would the US willingly accept everyone, provide them with green cards and citizenship etc? People risk death for a multitude of reasons, and its not just to escape the Castro boogey-man. I also submit that Cuban boat-people refugees make good media copy, but represent a small statistical segment of a) refugees risking entry to the US and b) segment of the Cuban population.
For the record, I've been to Cuba, toured the countryside ~alone~, and have been invited into people's homes and had dinner with 'normal' people. They're not living in constant fear of the Gestapo, they're not starving poor, and they're not uneducated hicks.
Che Tux Revolution! (Score:3, Funny)
Another communications barrier (Score:3, Funny)
So much for spying (Score:5, Funny)
Great... (Score:5, Insightful)
That's cool... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:That's cool... (Score:5, Insightful)
But oh, I forgot, this is slashdot, where the US is a horrible fascist dicatorship and Cuba is a magical wonderland of sharing and human kindness.
Re:That's cool... (Score:5, Interesting)
And maybe you should keep in mind that a lot of these "innocent" dissendents that are being arrested were or are actively plotting to overthrow the Cuban govenment, or even the assasination of Castro. Look at that shady CIA Posada character that's here in the U.S. now for a great example of one of those "innocent" dissidents.
I suppose you think the U.S. government wouldn't arrest people plotting the overthrow of the government or the assasination of the president?
-Eric
Re:That's cool... (Score:4, Insightful)
Amnesty International is hardly an American lapdog of an organization. Just because you don't like the USA, don't delude yourself into thinking that any enemy of the USA is righteous and noble.
Re:That's cool... (Score:3, Interesting)
> dicatorship and Cuba is a magical wonderland of sharing and human kindness.
It's Slashdot, where some people are aware that America has tried to murder the Cuban head of state several times. Can you imagine how the US would have reacted had Saddam Hussein acted the same way. I don't think that one would have been taken to the UN before action was launched. The lesson we learn from this is `might makes right`.
Re:That's cool... (Score:4, Insightful)
The country is full of murals saying how wonderful they are and how they defeated the US. The people are piss poor and you see disabled people walking around on improvised crutches made out of branches. Everything is a lie in Cuba...
If only the US would understand it's their embargo that's keeping Fidel in the saddle.
Re:That's cool... (Score:3, Interesting)
Cuba would be a de facto 51st state in less than 5 years if we dropped the embargo. Even if Castro remained in power (doubtful, but possible), in the end the country would become a democracy and Castro would eventually die and go to the flaming dung pits in Hell to hang with Mao and Stalin.
Figures (Score:3, Insightful)
I look forward to the day when people stop letting themselves be consumed with hatred.
hmmmm (Score:3, Funny)
Now wait a darn minute (Score:3, Interesting)
Linux might not be as good a fit as they think... (Score:3, Interesting)
Other counteries (Score:5, Informative)
Australia [slashdot.org]
South Korea [slashdot.org]
Brazil [slashdot.org]
Spain [slashdot.org]
India [slashdot.org]
Vienna [slashdot.org]
French Police [slashdot.org]
Dutch [slashdot.org]
Venezuela [slashdot.org]
Germany [slashdot.org]
Windows 98 license says: (Score:5, Interesting)
7. EXPORT RESTRICTIONS. If this EULA is not labeled and the SOFTWARE PRODUCT is not identified as "North America Only Version" above, on the Product Identification Card, or on the SOFTWARE PRODUCT packaging or other written materials, then the following terms apply: You agree that you will not export or re-export the SOFTWARE PRODUCT to any country, person, or entity subject to U.S. export restrictions. You specifically agree not to export or re-export the SOFTWARE PRODUCT: (i) to any country to which the U.S. has embargoed or restricted the export of goods or services, which as of March 1999 include, but are not necessarily limited to Cuba, Iran, Iraq, Libya, North Korea, Sudan and Syria, or to any national of any such country, wherever located, who intends to transmit or transport the SOFTWARE PRODUCT back to such country; (ii) to any person or entity who you know or have reason to know will utilize the SOFTWARE PRODUCT or portion thereof in the design, development or production of nuclear, chemical or biological weapons; or (iii) to any person or entity who has been prohibited from participating in U.S. export transactions by any federal agency of the U.S. government. You warrant and represent that neither the BXA (as defined below) nor any other U.S. federal agency has suspended, revoked or denied your export privileges.
Free as in beer, then (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Communists! (Score:3, Funny)
Nah (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Nah (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:WMDs (Score:3, Funny)
Re:WMDs (Score:5, Informative)
But all I heard from citizens was gripes about the government. The "free" healthcare is worth about as much as you'd expect a dictator's promises to be worth. The capitalist things, like the taxi system, work gloriously. The hotels, being right under the government's thumb, are a model for poor service and bizarre rules. For instance, you can't take your Cuban girlfriend up to your hotel room without paying a bribe.
I read a lot of books on Cuba before I went, and it seems like people who go to Cuba with an ideological agenda are shuttled carefully to the right places, where things look shiny and new. This is a potemkin village that impresses the heck out of people who want to be impressed.
But if you go a few blocks away, you see scenes like I did [amazing.com]. All these pictures were taken on what would be prime real estate in any other country, a block or less from the Malecon, the giant seawall that faces the ocean and is a major gathering spot for Cubans.
Cubans live in their decrepit and dangerous housing until it collapses, because if they maintained it the government would take it over and give it to someone else. No joke, sadly.
To put this slightly on topic, Cubans are generally not allowed to use the Internet, at least not at prices Cubans can afford. The Internet connections in the tourist hotels are closed to Cubans; only non-Cubans can use them. This is part of an effort to keep tourists on the busses and away from contact with the Cuban people.
The Cuban computers I saw were woefully out of date, with truly ancient versions of Windows on display. If my memory serves it was mainly Windows98, and I went in December 2002. So I doubt that this mandate from Castro will have that much effect. It's probably a propaganda effort to make Slashdotters look at his rule more favourably.
Even open source tyranny is still tyranny.
Alas.
D
Bartender as your employment reference (Score:3, Insightful)
I remember our local left-of-center rag going on about American profligate use of energy, pointing to color TVs as offenders, how black and white TVs use much less energy and are preferred in . . . Cuba. Never mind that modern solid-state color TVs use about as much electricity as an average light bulb and that Cuba's energy conservation kick may have more to do with their economics rather than Uncle Fidel being friends wit
Re:WMDs (Score:3, Informative)
Very high literacy rates and low infant mortality at USA level, among other tidbits : Population, Health and Human Well-being : COUNTRY PROFILE - Cuba [wri.org]
Re:Fidel never liked monopolies (Score:5, Insightful)
How does the government having sole control over an industry make it any less of a monopoly?
Re:Fidel never liked monopolies (Score:3, Insightful)
You should probably do some research [walterlippmann.com]before posting:
Re:State owned computers (Score:5, Informative)
I submitted it here as a YRO story, but it was deemed less relevant to Your Rights Online than Darl McBride's new open letter in response to Groklaw's new open letter to Darl McBride.
Re:You consider this a win? (Score:5, Insightful)
But that is the "great" thing about the GPL and similar OSS licenses. Its free to anyone dispite ideological differences. If it wasn't, a F/OSS advocating developer could bar me from using their software because I also use non-Free software. A staunch pro-life developer of a scheduling package could bar an abotion clinic from using their software. If something is going to be free, it needs to be free, not "kinda-free, only when you agree with us"
Re:You consider this a win? (Score:3, Interesting)
Another reason is that putting any political agendas in software licenses is not leagally right (You can put them there of cource, but they have no effect)
Re:You consider this a win? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:You consider this a win? (Score:3, Insightful)
What's worse: a country openly proclaiming communism, or one that espouses freedom -- all the while attempting to deny it's own citizens the right to freely travel and increasing surveillance in the name of "fighting terror". Oh, and not to mention all of the "detainees" held in Gitmo. These folks, while probably a bad lot, are being held without being charged with a crime, denied access to legal representation, and in some cases have had thier HUMAN RIGH
Re:Viva (Score:3, Informative)
Not that we could import windows due to the trade sanctions anyway ;)
Maybe not, but I've seen Windows blue-screening at a Cuban airport! I don't know where they would purchase it from (or even if they would purchase it), but there were many products I'd view as US products available in Cuba - for dollars ;-)
Re:Países tercermundistas... (Score:4, Interesting)
Third-world countries...
This are one more of the migrations than they will occur on the part of the third-world Latinoamericános countries (desire not to be contemptuous, since I am of Mexico).
This migration of Windows towards Linux in these countries (on the part of the GOVERNMENT) will occur for several reasons, first, because the countries will wish to spend less// in software, or símplemente to obtain _ more value by its money _ (as for me I believe that that is Linux, since although the TCO is equal or superior, long term Linux offers better valos than any propietary platform).
On the other hand, the governments also will wish to separate of Windows since is a fastening towards the American government (you do not have that Word do you), although Microsoft is directly not bound to the government, indiréctamente having licenses of software of this company promuebe the economic dependency of the country towards the United States.
Finally, the governments will begin to use Free Software within their systems by the nature of the same one, that is to say, the capital inverted in Free Software is a capital that goes (or can go diréctamente) towards the people who develop software and also the generated technologies disposition of ALL the citizens has left directly. Thus, a government can contribute bottoms for the development of some product that consider necessary (simpelemente to way of/bounty/) and see obtain the necessary programs.
This last one is plus a reason that I have thought. As citizen I would prefer that my taxes were used to subsidize Free Software instead of subsidizing to a Estadounidense company. And it is precise to indicate that between the Latin American citizens there is a resentment towards the government North American at issue economic (good... and in other questions who do not come to the subject).
As for me, it seems to me excellent that Cuba is optador by Linux, although like other people have written, in Cuba was not possible "To buy" Windows, but I am sure that the use of Linux in Cuba will generate a strong aid to the development of the same software, since Cuba has people and minds very, very able.
In addition, I must express that I would like much that my country (Mexico) followed the same route, although desafortunádamente Miguel de Icaza did not know to raise the situation (E-Mexico) arguing for the Costs like the advantage of Linux on the propietary software.
That is everything, I hope that it does not bother my commentary to them in Spanish, but, I considered pertienente.
Re:Cuba - computers? (Score:3, Informative)
Internet users (per 10,000 people) 106.8 (2002 est) Personal computer users (per 100 people) 3.2 (2002 est)Cuba [tiscali.co.uk]