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Introducing Linux to Joe Average 371

Posted by michael from the frenetic dept.
eco2geek writes "The local "alternative newspaper" is running a cover story titled 'The Rebel Alliance: An unlikely army of hacker hippies, geek visionaries, idealistic teachers and corporate giants is making Portland ground zero of a digital revolution.' I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call Portland 'ground zero' of anything, but the article does give the average reader a good introduction to what Linux is, why it's important, and some of the politics surrounding it. (The article also mentions 'the frenetic Slashdot.org.' :-)"
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Introducing Linux to Joe Average More

Introducing Linux to Joe Average

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  • So many funny quotes (Score:5, Funny)

    by debilo ( 612116 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:01AM (#8149974)
    Check these out:

    Torvalds, now a 34-year-old tech superstar whom some see as the love child of Thomas Edison and Che Guevara,...

    "Linux wasn't started as any kind of rebellion against the 'evil Microsoft empire,'" Torvalds told The New York Times last year. "I'm not out to destroy Microsoft. That will just be a completely unintentional side effect."

    "In a school, it's public money. How should it be spent? Is it ethical to buy software instead of hiring an art teacher? Me, I want an art teacher--not the Microsoft help assistant dancing on every student's desktop.

    "Why spend billions," said one Amazon tech guru at the time, "when you can spend millions?"

    So funny. I'd post more quotes but I'm too lazy too read the rest of the article. :)

    • Overated ---- Rebellion ? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Taco Cowboy ( 5327 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:37AM (#8150058) Journal


      I've heard so much about the so-called "Rebellion" whenever Linux is mentioned. Sometimes I gotta admit that I dunno what they are talking about.

      I use Linux not because I rebel against anyone, it's just that I got tired of the blue-screen-of-death cum you-gimme-more-$$$-and-we-still-won't-fix-the-bug thingy so I switched.

      No rebellion, just got tired with you-know-who.

      In other words, the "Rebellion" thingy may be overated.

      Just my thoughts, anyway.
      • I've heard so much about the so-called "Rebellion" whenever Linux is mentioned. Sometimes I gotta admit that I dunno what they are talking about.

        A lot of Linux users think like you do... many also don't have anything particularly against Windows, they just like Linux better.

        However, Microsoft views this as a war, and is acting accordingly. Many Linux users realize this, and are fighting back, because sometimes non-violent resistance isn't the best strategy.



        • You sez:

          " ... sometimes non-violent resistance isn't the best strategy"

          True.

          But for those who have tore thru "The Art of War" knows that many times the best way to fight a war is to let your opponents fighting amongst themselves - which btw MicroSoft is doing, with SCO against the Unices world thingy - and if M$ can do to us, so can we.

          M$ has a lot of vulnerabilities, it's practically a leaking dreadnaught. To keep M$ busy, point out to the investors (aka WallStreet) those leaks, one by one (or

        • Re:Overated ---- Rebellion ? (Score:5, Insightful)

          by kfg ( 145172 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @10:12AM (#8150301)
          . . . sometimes non-violent resistance isn't the best strategy.

          There has been violence? I must have missed that. Perhaps you are making the sort of conceptual mistake that Gandhi warned about, mistaking nonviolence with passivity.

          Nonviolence as a technique is often based on direct confrontation, even to the extent of provoking it.

          KFG
      • Well, but Linux and other Free Software play their important parts in the revolution, because they empower their users to emancipate themselves and be free of heteronomy.

        Also, the notion of sharing the software with your neighbor emphasizes the important aspect of solidarity in this world.

        Still, if you only use Linux because you like it better than Windows, more power to you. It only means that Linux does not have to compete on ideology, but that it can compete on merit alone. But be assured that the re

      • Re:Overated ---- Rebellion ? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by HawkingMattress ( 588824 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @10:17AM (#8150318)
        To me, there is a rebellion, but it's not about OSes, it's about freedom in the digital world.

        There really is a war going on between heavy capitalism, who tries to do all it can to restrict the use of everything digitally distribuable, and the people from the base, who have the skills to circumvent the rules, and organize hastily a counter attack to each offensives from the big boys.
        The point is, even Joe Sixpack, who doesn't care at all about the political or economical issues of modern technologies, is starting to understand when he sees he cannot play he's favorite mp3s in his xbox, or play the latests cds in his car stero and asks his tech savvy friends why this is.

        But that's nothing, what's important are the implications of such things in a world where everything will be digitalized.
        The technology, and the extensions we can try to forsee ten years from now can be the thing that will give the power back to the people, or the thing that will allow a control on us that even sci-fi books couldn't imagine.
        [ here fade in of terminator 1 music :)]

        And personnally, I first see Linux as a *nix system for x86, which allows me to play with UNIX on my laptop. But I also see it as a safe harbor where I can go when i'm fed up with corporate crap. Linux is people-centered, when you have a problem you just chat about it with some other users, or the developpers. Windows stinks corporatism everywhere, you know that the people on the other end want your money, not to help you, or to make things better. They'll lock you as soon as they can anyway. So in a sense to me linux is indeed a rebellion, a rebellion to fight the power of money, to circumvent the people I wish I could tell to go fsk themselves when I'm at work. If I can contribute to this little grain of sand in the wheel of capitalism, I'm all for it :)
      • I agreee. I think the counter-culture has been trying to adopt Linux as Member of the Movement. It's a little embarrassing.

        I have a friend who claims to be a geek. He can italicize and link in his livejournal. That's it. He put LimeWire proficiency on his resume to bulk out the "software" section. Yeah, yeah, I know in these enlightened times you can be a film geek, a music geek, a political geek, a goth club geek, or a football geek. In fact, virtually everyone has some kind of interest, so the wor

      • I thought the Willy Week article was pretty neat, and I really liked the cover picture. But, like you, I think "rebellion" is the wrong word for this.

        It seems to me that calling this a "rebellion" is underrating what is going on. The increasing acceptance of Linux and OSS in general is the visible manifestation of a major revolution-- in thought and culture. The idea that a thousand eyes makes all bugs shallow-- cooperative development of new software wealth-- is as astounding and revolutionary as the ide

    • Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:5, Interesting)

      by questamor ( 653018 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:40AM (#8150066)
      Unfortunately for every good article there's another full of FUD about *ix systems. take this one [winnetmag.com]

      "A new email virus called MyDoom is spreading rapidly across the Internet through UNIX mail servers, bringing with it a dangerous attachment that, when opened, can give attackers access to users' computers through an electronic backdoor."

      Amazing what they'll print these days? unix systems, one of the systems so amazingly resistant to worms like mydoom, and still we have the press implying they're to blame for the spread of windows viruses.

      • Re:Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:2, Funny)

        by Anonymous Coward
        spreading rapidly across the Internet through UNIX mail servers

        Well, of course. You can't expect exchange to be powerful enough to meet the email demand. You need a quality, robust unix server!
      • This is the same Unix that SCO claims ownership of?

        HH
        --

      • Re:Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:2, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward

        unix systems, one of the systems so amazingly resistant to worms like mydoom, and still we have the press implying they're to blame for the spread of windows viruses.

        You know, the Windows fans are always the first to blame Sendmail if there happens to be a bug in it. (Typical *NIX fan reply is a gigantic yawn and something along the lines of "switch to Qmail or Postfix already, dammit, those things are already time-tested".)

        In this case, they're just jealous that most of the E-mail - including viruses

        • Re:Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:5, Insightful)

          by BiggerIsBetter ( 682164 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @09:22AM (#8150182)
          Pretty dumb yes, but at the same time, it's not hard to build an email server with virus filtering built into it. It costs all of about $300 for a server license from most antivirus vendors, and there's free virus scanners available as well.

          As much as I think Windows blows goats, if you're putting an email server on the net I think it's the admin's responsability to ensure it doesn't propogate viruses. I put implementing virus scanning on the same level as making sure you're not running an open relay. It wasn't always like this but that's the climate we operate in now.

          • Re:Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:5, Informative)

            by SkArcher ( 676201 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @09:40AM (#8150226) Journal
            Clam Antivirus [clamav.net] is a GPL anti-virus scanner that can be set to scan all passing mail.

            Oh, and it was the first AV software to have a working definition of MyDoom (which they labeled "Worm.SCO.A") - faster than all of the commercial antivirus vendors.

            Chalk another one up for Open Software. Working together you can analyse virus code faster!

            Well shit, who would have thought it...
      • More articles of same author (Paul Thurrott):
        here [winnetmag.com]

        And here is thurrott@winnetmag.com [mailto] his addy, in case u wanna say "hello" ;-)

      • Re:Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:5, Funny)

        by HeghmoH ( 13204 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @09:20AM (#8150176) Homepage Journal
        He does have a point.

        If every mail server on the internet ran Windows, e-mail would never work well enough to function as the vector for a worm.
        • I read it somewhat like that too.

          Or even more devious, the author knows that most email and web is being server by unix derivatives, so he's only admitting that - but to the masses, he just pointed the finger at the culprit, the poor messenger.

      • Re:Paul thurrott blames *ix for MyDoom! (Score:2, Funny)

        by Anonymous Coward
        There's an old old old joke my father used to tell me when we were all out camping. It was a bonding time, between parent and child. You know those moments, when essential truths about the world are passed down. And he'd say to me:

        "How can you tell when Paul Thurrott is being a biased, lying windows Shill?"

        the punchline... oh and I used to wait for this one and laugh

        "His lips are moving!"

        and we'd cackle together around the fire, and eat another marshmallow.
      • Blaming the "UNIX mail servers" for spreading MyDoom is like blaming the USPS for spreading anthrax.

    • Re:So many funny quotes (Score:5, Interesting)

      by gaijin99 ( 143693 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @11:09AM (#8150614) Journal
      Torvalds, now a 34-year-old tech superstar whom some see as the love child of Thomas Edison and Che Guevara,...
      Ick. Why would anyone want to compare Linus to that looser Edison? I mean, he invented two bloody things in his entire life, the rest was invented by other people who had signed contracts that gave Edison all rights to their inventions and let him take the credit. I'd say Bill Gates is closer to Edison (remember, Bill didn't actually code anything for DOS or Windows, he hired it done). I suppose I should complain about the Linux/Che comparison too. I don't want this "Free Software == Communism" BS to spread either; but frankly the Edison comparison is more personally offensive to me.

  • Wow! (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Pingular ( 670773 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:02AM (#8149977)
    I'm pretty impressed as it's only a 'local alternative newspaper' that it's not buckling under the Slashdot effect, in fact it hasn't even slowed down!
    Even stranger is the Netcraft 'what's that site running?' [netcraft.com] results, showing that the server was recently running MacOS!

  • Farmers using Linux? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by RinzeWind ( 413873 ) <(gro.dniweznir) (ta) (amehc)> on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:04AM (#8149980) Homepage
    Oh, yes! Right here [linex.org]! The average Joe can handle Linux just as well as he can handle Windows. Teach a little boy Linux from the very first moment he touches a keyboard and he'll be just fine. The sad part is the national government is in bed with Microsoft. Let's hope that little project keeps going.

    • Re:Farmers using Linux? (Score:5, Informative)

      by dcw3 ( 649211 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:16AM (#8150015) Journal
      The sad part is the national government is in bed with Microsoft.

      Wow, you need to take off the tin-foil had buddy.

      I've been working for 26 years on govt. contracts using just about every flavor of *NIX you can think of. There's no great love for Richmond any more than there is for other large companies. Now if you're talking about lobbists being in bed with govt...that's an entirely different story.
      • There's no great love for Richmond

        The Civil War is over, buddy. Jeff Davis, Robert E Lee, and good ol' Stonewall are all dead and buried. It's time to let Virginia back into our hearts.

        Even the Great Emancipator has stopped by [weeklystandard.com] to say hello.

  • Advertisements (Score:4, Insightful)

    by PuffCammy ( 739447 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:04AM (#8149981) Homepage
    Frankly I see advertisements of Linux as a good thing, I mean more people should merely just know of Linux.

  • If you want Joe Sixpack (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    If you want Joe Sixpack to use linux, you just have to show him how fun it can be! Like this picture from a wild linux-party :)

    http://linuxforum.dk/2003/billeder/chlor/r001724 3. jpg

    Oh, they're a wild bunch!

  • Open source: competing for new users? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Debian Troll's Best ( 678194 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:10AM (#8149992) Journal
    The story about Portland being a hotbed of Linux activism and getting a lot of new users into the community reminded me of a recent experience. I just built an Athlon XP PC for a friend who needed a cheap system just for the standard sort of computing tasks, you know, web, e-mail, some word processing and maybe a bit of light package management. Of course the finishing touch to a nice, budget Athlon XP was going to be Debian, with Mozilla for web/e-mail and OpenOffice.org to take care of office needs. But when it was time to break out the install CDs, my friend asked a very surprising question: "So are you going to install FreeBSD on my system?"

    It took a while for the words to sink in. I mean, my friend works in the publishing industry, and while she uses computers all day for word processing and presentations and stuff like that, I didn't expect her to know about FreeBSD. So I asked "Why FreeBSD? Have you been reading OSNews again?"

    She gave me a strange look and replied "No, because FreeBSD is free, and I've heard all sorts of things about Linux getting picked up by the big corporates. Those IBM ads are everywhere! I thought Linux was going to be expensive...more expensive than Windows!"

    I went ahead and install GNU/Debian for her, lecturing her solidly on the finer points of apt-get while we installed all 6 CD-ROMs from my laptop over a heavily degraded 802.11b link (I'd removed all the RF shielding from her PC's case to 'lap' the hard drive). But it got me thinking. Are Linux distros losing out to FreeBSD when it comes to new users simply because of their names? I mean, who's going to know that GNU/Debian Linux doesn't cost $699 per seat? FreeBSD says immediately that the product is free

    I'll put a question to the community...do people think that it might be worth re-naming Debian in some markets (like campus bookstores, for instance) to FreeDebian? I mean, Tux could even hold a pitchfork or something. Do people think that a 'marketing friendly' name is important? Would this get the Debian developers off-side with the FSF, or would they understand? Would the viral nature of the BSD license necessitate distribution changes because of the 'Free' in the name? I welcome comments from the GNU/Linux and FreeBSD communities equally!

    • Re:Open source: competing for new users? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by The One KEA ( 707661 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:44AM (#8150078) Journal
      Whoa - your friend just proved that despite the efforts of IBM, Red Hat and others to defend Linux against the FUD being spread by its competitors, that some of it is still getting through to the enduser. Her comment about Linux being swallowed by the corporations is a frightening one, and proves (at least to me) that we need to be much more proactive when it comes to explaining the philosophy and history of the Linux distribution, so that people don't continue to make this mistake in their thinking.
    • Might be a troll (first clue: Debian Troll's Best), but good point about FreeBSD. My guess is that this person didn't know that much about Linux, saw all the IBM ads, and figured IBM was going to start charging. However, would Joe Sixpack make the connection? I guess some of us should have gotten 30 seconds on the Super Bowl to explain Linux to Joe Sixpack. Also, the pitchfork is a bad idea. They say that the penguin is cute. Making him hold a pitchfork implies that it's Depenguinated to geeks, and evil to
    • Renaming any Linux distro is fine by me (Redhat -> Fedora), but it's like any other brand that thinks it can change its name to improve its image. There's always a backlash...

      So just tell ol' blondie that you're installing FreeDebian. It doesn't sound as cool as FreeFedora, but it just sounds much better than FreeMandrake.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • As one who develops enterprise level data-center solutions for high end customers (hardware and infrastructure, not usually code) I'd have to say I'm just not buying this 'holier than thou' BSD tirade.

        While it's true that "Linux" is not the answer to every question, neither is *BSD, or Slowlaris, or AIX... etc.

        Yes, many people are "Linux Zealots". Many are "Windows Zealots". But, for my money, if not in numbers, certainly in snobbery quotient, *BSD zealots win... :)

        Face it, all of them, from AmigaDOS t

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • I'll put a question to the community...do people think that it might be worth re-naming Debian in some markets (like campus bookstores, for instance) to FreeDebian?

      Ogg/Vorbis. Need I say more? Sounds "foreign", where "wav" files sound friendly, and its easy to guess what it stands for. This is like the Linux pronouncing debates 3 or 4 years ago (Lie-nux vs. LEE-nux vs Lin-ux) In the end, it doesn't matter because new users are going to pronounce it how it looks.

      One thing that OSS developers can learn

    • I recently posted on how I feel about the names like "FreeSomething" or "OpenAnything". Here are some of my further thoughts.

      I think this stuff is redundant. Freedom or Openness should be in the heart, not the name. I can understand if open source apps want to use unnecessary advertising of the parent project in form of "GNU Something" or "GNOME Anything", because that's just normal kind of titles (not too far from "Microsoft Whatever", which people will then casually call "Whatever".)

      But "Free" or "Ope

  • Target Acquired (Score:5, Funny)

    by kfg ( 145172 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:12AM (#8149999)
    I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call Portland 'ground zero' of anything. . .

    Rain?

    KFG

    • I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call Portland 'ground zero' of anything. . .

      Rain?

      Funny you should say that. Portland's average rainfall when I moved there was 2 inches less per year than Dallas, where I was moving from - it's just that Dallas only got a few storms a year, whereas Portland has a nice little drizzle at least weekly. I miss that weather.

      I was laid off from my network engineering job there in 2002, and had to move back to Texas. But if Portland is finally really becoming an IT hotbed ("

    • I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call Portland 'ground zero' of anything. . .

      Rain?

      actually, it rains a lot more in seattle than in pdx. 36" avg annual rainfall in seattle, 28" avg annual rainfall in portland.

      mp

    • Surrealistic multilingual bands [pinkmartini.com] ?

      Chorus to Pink Martini's Sympathique:
      "Je ne veux pas travailler / Je ne veux pas dejeuner / Je veux seulement oublier / Et puis je fume"

      Which means:
      "I don't want to work
      I don't want to have lunch
      I just want to forget
      And I smoke, too"

      Those guys are great musicians, but I do hope the one who wrote that song is not part of a local Linux internationalization group...

      Thomas Miconi

  • Simplistic but well written. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Artega VH ( 739847 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:12AM (#8150002) Journal
    Sure there are small things (not a GNU/Linux in sight) which will probably be the cause of much criticism here but for an INTRODUCTION to Linux, and a brief update on the who SCO joke I thought it was rather well done.

    At least it didn't leave me thinking: "What idiots wrote this garbage..."

    Kudo's to a small newspaper standing up the /. effect too... :D

  • Tux not copyrighted? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Guiri ( 522079 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:13AM (#8150006) Homepage
    From the article:

    The Tux cartoon is not copyrighted--anyone can use it for free

    Does that mean that any company (SCO, M$) could copyright the Tux logo and we won't be able to use it anymore?

    • Re:Tux not copyrighted? (Score:3, Informative)

      by ianezz ( 31449 )
      AFAIK, the copyright on Tux belongs to its author, Larry Lewing [tamu.edu] (he doesn't explicitly states that, but art works are copyrighted by default, right?), who then granted permission to everyone to use/modify it, provided he and The Gimp are acknowledged.
    • Actually, it is copyrighted. However, the license is extremely liberal: see the Linux Penguins page [tamu.edu] for details.
    • I don't think so, due to copyright law and automatic copyrights (he didn't state copyright, but it's there, except for where he explicitly gave some rights away), but they could copyright a modification.

      From his site:
      Feel free to do whatever you see fit with the images, you are encouraged to integrate them into other designs that fit your need.

  • Anything would be better than.... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Bowie J. Poag ( 16898 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:15AM (#8150009) Homepage


    Any effort to familliarize the public with Linux that doesn't involve a creepy-looking 9 year old with yellow hair has my support.

    That, and anything that doesn't involve Laverne talking about "chaos theory"..sheesh.

    What the hell would be so wrong about simply putting a few kernel/distrib contributors infront of a camera, and letting them talk for 30 seconds? "Hi, I'm Dave. I wrote the part of Linux that makes this camera work. I did it because it's fun....and because the manufacturer wouldn't." Sure, most of us are pretty damn ugly but there's gotta be a few photogenic nerds among us. With good stories, too.

  • Luki (Score:5, Informative)

    by Elektroschock ( 659467 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:15AM (#8150010)
    Luki.org [luki.org], a German organisation for the spread of the word of Linux in Christian Churches, created a very good "Uberzeugungsmappe", a convincement paper for Joe Enduser. It is slightly outdated and probably not available in English but you could try to tranlate it via Babelfish and correct the mistakes.

    Download the German paper in OpenOffice Format [luki.org] or as pdf [luki.org]. More about the Luki-Organisation in English [luki.org]

    It would be very helpful to get an English translation of this very good LUKI "Uberzeugungsmappe" paper
    • That would be an excellent idea - have you tried advertising this on some of the more general-purpose mailinglists and forums to see if anyone would be willing to do a translation?
    • have contributed a lot to *nix... but my favorite is Knoppix [knoppix.de]

      I keep burned CDs of knoppix with me, so when I start talking to one of my coworkers about linux (I work in a hospital... I'm about the only geek here), I hand them a CD and tell them to give it a whirl, pretty much risk-free to their PC.

      I've found that to be one of the best little CDs I have ever encountered... and I looked high and low for a paypal link so I could throw Klaus Knopper a few bones...

      Anybody know of one? I, for one, believe

  • The argument's wrong... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:36AM (#8150056)
    It should be titled: Introducing Linux to Joe User.

    Linux is still a techies OS. Any headway made swinging it into the mainstream is by Linux bending towards what the user wants (Start Menus etc.), not by bending the public at large (i.e. not us) towards Linux.

    • Re:The argument's wrong... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by mwilliamson ( 672411 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @10:29AM (#8150367) Homepage Journal
      Linux is a techie OS because it works, and works well, and works with minimal fuss. These attributes, as well as a constantly-improving UI will push it into the mainstream. The fact that it is a techie OS should not deter Joe User.

      While linux is a strong techie's OS, it's also reached the point of being less of a pain in the arse to install and maintain than windows. Windows is such a pain in the arse to install that, if not for the fact it's usually pre-installed or supplied as a ghost image, most end users would have considerable difficulty installing.

      It is possible to have a fully operational Fedora box in as little as 15 - 30 minutes that will keep itself updated. Everything that needs configuration can be done right from the GUI nowadays, from partitioning to building your firewall. You can make a kickstart disk to carry your efforts in package selection to other machines. You need not face an interrogation every damned time you change a major piece of hardware, or a few pieces of minor hardware.

      While the techie community is capable of using operating systems that are difficult to install (openBSD, Darwin-i386 + Xfree86), the fact a good OS is easy to install/use/maintain will not drive them away.

  • How about "It's free. It works. Duh." (Score:5, Insightful)

    by dpbsmith ( 263124 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:48AM (#8150089) Homepage
    (That would make a good slogan...)

    • remove the "Duh" (Score:3, Insightful)

      by real_smiff ( 611054 )
      "It's free. It works."

      a better slogan i think :)

      • What might get more people to at least try GNU/Linux is putting either Live CD distros or full distro installer packs in shops, a la AOL CDs.

        Sure, it will require a lot of CDs, but it is in a good cause.

        I think AOL gives away about 1000 CDs for every new user (and less than that once you take into account people who just use AOL for the free time and then chuck it away) - does anyone know a CD manufacturer who can do us a good deal on a LOT of CDs?

  • Whole article on one page (Score:5, Informative)

    by shfted! ( 600189 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @08:55AM (#8150110) Journal

    Using a little hack called page five of a four page story:

    http://www.willametteweek.com/story.php?story=4764 &page=5 [willametteweek.com]

  • Amusing quote (Score:2, Interesting)

    by 3Daemon ( 577902 )

    "IBM's endorsement of Linux has added credibility and an illusion of support and accountability," Ballmer wrote.

    So, backing from a huge corporation only gives an illusion of support and accountability, by Ballmers own admission? Something to keep in mind next time "corporate backing" is flounted as a Windows highlight :)

  • "It's all about what a friend of mine calls 'the mark of cred,'" says Accardi, a Portland State grad who works as a Linux developer at Intel. "You either have it, or you don't."
    I think I probably don't have it, and I'm thinking that's a good thing too.

    Or maybe Bill Gates and Linus Torvalds will turn out to have been switched at birth, and will have to swap places, because it's discovered that the wrong one has "The Mark of Cred" (dun dun DUUUNNNNN!)

  • Portland is also the home of 6 semiconductor fabrication plants that Intel uses to test development processors.

    • World class in: Bookstores, Art dealers, Parks... (Score:5, Informative)

      by Futurepower(R) ( 558542 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @10:17AM (#8150319) Homepage

      Linus Torvalds can go anywhere. It's probably no accident that he and the The Open Source Development Lab [osdl.org] are in Portland. (Beaverton is one of the towns that are part of the metropolitan area of 1.4 million people called Portland.)

      Portland has the largest bookstore in the world [powells.com].

      Portland has one of the largest and most successful dealers in contemporary art in the world [therealmothergoose.com]. The gallery has a funny name, but shows the work of over 1,100 artists.

      Portland has the largest park [portland.or.us] inside a city in the world. The park has over 74 miles of wilderness hiking trails.

      Portland is the home of Pink Martini [pinkmartini.com], a band that writes multi-cultural songs. One of Pink Martini's songs was once one of the most popular songs in France. You can listen to the music video [64.157.30.206].

      It's a 55 minute drive from downtown Portland to the ski areas [ohwy.com]. "World Class Skiing in Your Own Backyard."

      The K-12 Linux Project [k12ltsp.org], in Portland, is one of the more successful projects for giving Linux to average users, who in this case are students.

      Portland borders on the confluence of the Willamette River and the Columbia River [fs.fed.us], one of the largest rivers in the world. The Columbia River Gorge, on the eastern edge of Portland, is a world class wind-surfing area.

      On the other hand: Q. Why do hippies come to Portland? A. Because there are no jobs.

      Many people don't like the months of rain every year. They say Portland is the perfect place for slugs and ducks. (However, the rain cleans the air.)

  • Why People Don't Like Linux... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by severoon ( 536737 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @09:13AM (#8150152) Journal

    I've talked to several non-linux users about why they don't use it, and I'm not talking about the die-hard MS supporters. I'm talking about people that have tried it at one time or another, ran it for a while, and just gave up on it.

    Why did they give up instead of switching over to it as their primary desktop? Answers ranged over several salient (if not because they're real, at least because they're perceived) problems.

    Die-hard linux people see variety as a good thing. That's true, and it's not true. Variety always has to be put in context, especially if there's a lot of it. Here's an example that even die-hard linux people can understand (assuming you're not chefs too). Let's say I'm making salsa and I send you to the store to pick up some heat. You don't know the first thing about peppers, and it just so happens I live next to a produce mart the likes of which you've never seen before. To choose from are: jalapenos, habaneros, anaheim, chipotle, ancho, pablano, thai, serrano, scotch bonnet, etc. What are you likely to do? That's right--grab the jalapenos, cuz that's what you've heard of before, even though they're probably not the best solution. Some die-hard linux people would argue, hey, if your goal is to help your buddy out, you'll head over to your favorite bookstore and read up, and then head back to the produce mart armed with this newfound knowledge. To these people I say, you are truly a die-hard fan of linux if you didn't get this point.

    This is the pressure novices feel at every turn with linux, not just from what OS to install, but what is the install process? (Depends on the distro you've chosen.) How do I install an application? (Ibid.) Which application do I install if I want, say, an email client? (Good luck wading through all of the available options.) Why is it that everytime I head over to my buddy's house, he always knows about all this crap that I've never heard of, and he's got this smokin' setup that I wouldn't have the first clue how to begin assembling? How does one even keep up with all the choice that's available?

    All frustrations that don't happen with Windows. You only rarely head over to a buddy's and see him running Mozilla instead of IE and think, hmm, I'd like that and didn't know about it. 99% of the time, you're both running the same media player, picture editor, etc, and if you're not, there's only a small handful of well-known choices to choose from.

    The next barrier to installing/using linux on a long-term basis with these folks is what I call the annoyance/showstopper problem. Eventually, usually sooner than later, these people run into something that's either really annoying (they can't get X to run at a desired resolution, for example), or a really serious problem that impedes their ability to move forward (they can't connect to the web). They also don't really know where to look for help, or even how to find out where they should start. I myself ran into a problem years ago with RedHat, I simply wanted to upgrade the asteroids game, but the web of library dependencies that had to also be updated made it hardly worthwhile. Eventually, I rolled up my sleeves and got to work--I finally got to the end of a long dependency chain and discovered that, no matter what I did to upgrade this particular library, it wouldn't go in because it was replacing a basic graphics library that is used by virtual terminals. Because it was always in use, it couldn't be replaced, even in single-user mode. So I know this frustration well...even I was asking, how great can this OS be if a simple game can't easily be upgraded, and then it turns out when you finally commit yourself to an afternoon of hunting, it simply can't be upgraded at all? The bigger issue here for most users is, why should I have to know about library dependencies to upgrade a game, why are virtual terminals relevant to the problem I'm having, and what is a virtual terminal anyway? (The point is, whatever it is, it's totally unrelated to what I was trying to do, and most people find t

    • Sir, you have NAILED IT!!!

      IMO your description of your experiences and thoughts on this matter is exactly the sort of material that the developers of the Linux desktop and distro need to see. You need to get a website somewhere, put this up and point people to it - this mini-essay should NOT get lost in the bowels of Slashdot.
    • Very well written. Thanks.

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
      Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • The installing Linux issue is relevant, more so than installing Windows precisely because most Windows users have had their OS pre-installed by their PC manufacturer. How many people in comparison have Linux pre-installed on their PC?

        And how are these users going to switch to Linux? By installing it themselves. (Sure, some people will be able to call upon a Linux old-hand to help them out, but not everyone will be so fortunate.) The Linux installation needs to be easier, or at least more user-friendly, to
    • I've run into five people in tha past two weeks and asked them, "Ever tried Linux?" Strangely they all said something like, "Yeah, but it doesn't do what I need." Me: "Oh really, when was it you tried it?" Them: "About five years ago."

      I think one major problem Linux faces is that Joe Average can't comprehend the speed that Linux has been changing with. Five years ago, you had Win98, which looked a felt a lot like Win95 which still strongly acts like WinXP in many areas.

      So if MS has been pretty muc
      • I think one major problem Linux faces is that Joe Average can't comprehend the speed that Linux has been changing with.

        And that's another important point why some people (like myself) don't use Linux. I run a business. I don't play games. My computers are 100% vital to me being able to eat. A new kernel is released every other day it seems, and for a while, Red Hat was doing a new distro every 6 months. 6 months?!?! Are you out of your fucking mind? My computers need to run for *years* without "upg

    • Ok, I'll bite. :) I think you're overcomplicating the matter, although you made a lot of good points.

      You don't know the first thing about peppers, and it just so happens I live next to a produce mart the likes of which you've never seen before. To choose from are: jalapenos, habaneros, anaheim, chipotle, ancho, pablano, thai, serrano, scotch bonnet, etc. What are you likely to do? That's right--grab the jalapenos, cuz that's what you've heard of before, even though they're probably not the best solution.

  • Uh... hello? OSDL? (Score:3, Informative)

    by BiOFH ( 267622 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @09:54AM (#8150259)
    I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call Portland 'ground zero' of anything...

    Why not? The Open Source Development Lab (OSDL) is in Portland. I'd think that counts for _something_. Then there's Intel's first real [huge] Linux farm which was instrumental in designing and modelling the Pentium 4 (howdy DPG). Not to mention several Linux developers, coders and doc maintainers and that Randal guy (hey, Randal).

    Sign me,
    A BiOFH who will always call PDX home
  • to send the school a licensing agreement now that they've been on /.?

    -A

  • Joe Average (Score:5, Interesting)

    by NixLuver ( 693391 ) <stwhite&kcheretic,com> on Sunday February 01, 2004 @10:27AM (#8150357) Homepage Journal
    Wonderful, amusing article

    I've been working with lots of 'Joe Average' types in the past couple of years, and there have been many abortive attempts to 'Linuxise' my offerings (to friends, family, and moonlighting clients). My wife was a ginea pig for me, switching from her blue-screen plagued windows install on a toshiba 8100 laptop to RedHat 8 + Ximian. She's never looked back. Encouraged by this success, I've brought several other family members and a couple of moonlight clients (barter system - including a veterinarian and a law firm) over to the 'free side'. Very few have experienced any real trouble.

    In short, right now, if a given person doesn't absolutely require windows-based apps (like custom applications or games, etc), Linux is ready for the desktop of Joe Average Computer User. The small business office or home user that's not a gamer can recieve significant value increase from Linux, and I have at least 22 happy customers right now.

  • More good press from the BBC. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by twitter ( 104583 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @10:32AM (#8150381) Homepage Journal
    Everyone's favorite "alternative" news source, the BBC is also running a nice summary of the impending Linux stampeed [bbc.co.uk]. The rebellion is on:

    If you spend a dollar with a local company working on Linux, that dollar stays in your economy," said Simon Phipps of Sun Microsystems.

    "When you spend a dollar with a multi-national corporation as a license fee for a piece of software, that dollar leaves your country."

    "It's about keeping the money in your local economy, developing skills and developing the local economy to be strong in its own right in a global context."

    Also quoted are Bruce Perens [slashdot.org] and Eric Raymond.

    Not mentioned, however, are The Free Software Foundation [fsf.org] or the GNU Project [fsf.org].

  • I'm pumping Linux into the mix around here too. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by pair-a-noyd ( 594371 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @11:53AM (#8150912)
    I recycle used computers, I have a contract with a *large* corporation to pick up their old PC's and other "goodies"..

    They wipe the drives in them, which is FINE with me, so I take them all and install Linux on them, clean them up like brand new and resell them at rock botton prices that EVERYONE can afford, with a 30 day warranty.

    I offer them only with Linux installed, take it or leave it. They are Internet appliances and they do a magnificent job of it, leaving the new owners to enjoy the computer without the headaches of using windows.

    I give them 15 minutes free instructions on using it, if they want FULL instructions then I set up an appointment and charge $20 an hour which is $15 an hour cheaper than anyone else in town charges.

    If they don't want Linux, that's tough. I don't offer any other options. They can install windows when they take it home but I won't help them if they have problems.

    Like it or not, people around here are getting introduced to Linux. They want a cheap computer, they get one but they are at least going to play with Linux a little before they wipe it out.
    But if they wipe out Linux and install anything else they void *my* 30 day warranty and they are own their own from them on..

  • Microsoft Will Bring This On Itself (Score:4, Interesting)

    by rgainford ( 739386 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @01:49PM (#8151637)
    I being a Microsoft croonie am sorry to say that I don't see this revolution of linux and freeBSD slowing down. I have always worked developing in microsofts products and their latest .Net platform is a pleasure to work with. That being said I also realize that the only reason Bill comes up with these development platforms is to increase his hold on the desktop market. Yet WHY then with the success of open-source software on the rise would they still be charging schools and university's for their products. This is where their user base is created from!! In addition this this fact( which bothers me immensly ) they have also come out with their latest aggravating anti-piracy tool "pain in the ass" activation. Now I can't even move my legal copy of XP from one computer to another without having to go through the activation process again. This is a big mistake in my opinion. I know there are already hacks for this feature but if they ever come out with a version of their operating system that can't be used illeagally I see them going down in
    FLAMES
    . If people in poor developing countries can't use their system to learn on along with the educational community in first world countries, there choke-hold on this industry will quickly be loosened.

    • I've been dreaming of that day for a while now (Score:5, Insightful)

      by freeweed ( 309734 ) on Sunday February 01, 2004 @03:31PM (#8152424)
      if they ever come out with a version of their operating system that can't be used illeagally(sic) I see them going down in FLAMES

      I went back to University a few years ago and am just finishing up once again. The level of software piracy around here absolutely astounds me. As a personal goal, I've spent the past couple of years trying to rid myself entirely of any software that isn't 100% legit (whether it's free "educational" MS product, or OSS, or whatever). The time I sometimes spend trying to get work done is frustrating (need to print something that isn't in a University-approved file format? ie: anything not a Word doc or PDF?), but the personal satisfaction is worth it.

      I rant almost daily about professors requiring us to hand in our work with MS-specific file formats, and my fellow classmates yawn and hand me a warezed copy of MS Office. OpenOffice is SO close, but still not 100% (as I learned after initially receiving a 0 on an assignment - thankfully the prof was understanding and let me re-submit it).

      I really, REALLY would like to see upcoming versions of Windows and Office be 100% unpiratable. Most students I know aren't going to be shelling out hundreds of dollars to keep up with software when there's a free alternative that does what they need just fine. Give it a few years, and we'd have an entire school generation almost entirely unexposed to Microsoft's software. Other than games (about 99% of which are also pirated, incidentally), I just can't see Joe Student *needing* Windows, to the tune of paying for software licenses for it.

      Hell, I've seen students fire up Visual Studio .NET to write and compile a 20-line console program using only standard C libraries. Apparently gcc is "too much typing" for them. I say, bring on working copy-protection for all commercial software, please! And yes, I do realize what a pipe dream this is :)

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