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Apache Software Linux

Apache Binaries Available for PS2 Linux 183

cant_get_a_good_nick writes: "From ApacheWeek, probably the best net resource for Apache, comes the announcement of a binary build of Apache 2.0.39 for PS2 Linux. You too can have a server farm for web serving, and GTA3. Be nice and don't kill this guy's downloads page."
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Apache Binaries Available for PS2 Linux

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  • Neet. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by autopr0n ( 534291 ) on Saturday July 06, 2002 @10:31PM (#3835322) Homepage Journal
    Of course, if you really just want low cost, Old PCs or laptops (to get low power consumption) would probably be a better bet. I use an old 200mhz P1 for my linux mail server, and it has more ram then the ps2 :P

    Now as far as coolness factor, OTOH...
    • Exactly! (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      People keep touting stuff like this and how it'll revolutionize everything and provide low cost computers to everyone and herald an era of world peace.

      Right. Most console hardware blows chunks. There's no other word to describe it. You know what the important things in a console are? Sound and video.

      Every cool thing like this I've seen has something to do with turning a console into a server. Servers do not need sound and video. To put it geekily, if you proposed this as a Borg, they'd deactivate you for your lack of efficiency.

      I'm not even sure this is cool any more. They've been tossing Linux on consoles since the Dreamcast (at least).. And some guy had a webserver running off a C= 64 awhile back.

      I mean, I respect the efforts of those who brought us Apache on the PS2, but only from a technical standpoint. As far as cool, though, porting to consoles has become All Your Base - just not as funny.
      • Most console hardware blows chunks.

        This, if I may be so bold, is total garbage. Consoles may not have much hardware, but what they do have smashes all those crappy ia32 machines - armed with a hardware mindset that even Bill Gates was moved to call "brain dead" a decade and half ago (well, almost - 12, 15, who's counting?) - that we are all using into outer space.

        $50 buys you a Dreamcast - better graphics than a PCI graphics card for the same price.
        • Dreamcast ruled. They had better graphics than PS2 over a year before PS2 was released. These graphics included antialiasing and Z-buffering, both of which Sony still doesn't have. Plus, they had an innovative controller that both Microsoft and Nintendo have copied. Sega, with the Dreamcast, is also the first company to ship an internet-ready console to every customer. Each and every Dreamcast came with a modem (well, except for some non-Japan Asian model Dreamcasts that came without a modem).

          Only now, 2 years later, has Sony figured out how to graft on a VGA interface to its PS2. And that VGA interface requires rewriting software and will only work with Sync-On-Green monitors.

          Sega was so far ahead of its time, it's not even funny.

    • Now as far as coolness factor, OTOH...
      You could always take apart the PC and put it together in a pizza box or something for the coolness factor...
  • Webserver (Score:2, Insightful)

    So what? You might as well get a decent webserver box than waste your PS2s superior graphics capabilities on just dishing out webpages.

    Another bizarre, ridiculous and completely useless application of the technology.
    • by PacoTaco ( 577292 )
      Dude, this is Slashdot. If I got my ass to run Linux, they'd post that too. :)
    • Re:Webserver (Score:5, Insightful)

      by WasterDave ( 20047 ) <(moc.pekdez) (ta) (pevad)> on Saturday July 06, 2002 @10:54PM (#3835404)
      Another bizarre, ridiculous and completely useless application of the technology.

      Which is exactly why it's so cool.

    • Re:Webserver (Score:5, Interesting)

      by NanoGator ( 522640 ) on Saturday July 06, 2002 @11:20PM (#3835486) Homepage Journal
      "Another bizarre, ridiculous and completely useless application of the technology."

      Only if you have no imagination. At work, there's a rack-mount web server that's basically an appliance that somebody bought for used for $300. They say it originally cost over $2,000. The nice thing about this type of appliance is that it has few parts to go bad on it. However, it does suffer from lack of features. (It's basically just an HTTP server, no PHP support etc...)

      Well, they got Apache running on a PS2. That means that PHP and all those other fun features of it will (presumably) work as well. I don't think it's too far away from burning a DVD, popping it in the PS2, turning it on, and boom you have a webserver running. The neat thing is that this $199 (new, and will always get cheaper) device should, in theory, stay up to date with Apache.

      PS2's will eventually go the way of the Dreamcast, and will reach ridiculously low ($50) prices. Personally, I'd rather set one of those things up once and reboot once in a while rather than having to maintain a machine with failing hard-drives and so on. If the thing breaks, buy it with one of those 1 year warranties for $20 and have them swap out with a new one. Heh. I bet you can't get a web appliance with that kinda guarantee! Setup is a breeze!

      I'm tempted to look into how to build a PC that boots off a flash card so I can remove all of the moving parts from it. That'd last forever, I bet. Actually, if anybody knows of a good place to find that info, fire a link to me. (I'll do a Google search later, but I'd much rather hear from somebody who's gone down that road.) In the mean time, I have finally found an interesting use for a PS2!

      • I see what you're saying, but I really do think you overestimate the practical applications of such a device. Reading webpages from the DVD drive would be slow under moderate usage (because of large seek times) and read-only.

        Either that or you are limited to a very small website, of say only 16 Mb (the other 16M being used for Linux, Apache, etc.)

        And it is still a huge waste of such a device. You could build a webserver that does the same thing (read-only small website) for much less than the price of a PS2. Like the LART [tudelft.nl] project, for example.
        • Thanks for posting the LART link, I'm looking at it now.

          I envisioned that the pages would be served up from a small 8-meg RAM disk.

          You bring up an excellent point about the limitations of the machine. I wasn't picturing a huge site in my mind, I was picturing something like a small 'brochure' kind of site. Don't they make a 40-gig hard-drive for the PS-2, though?

          • by Afrosheen ( 42464 )
            Yeah the linux ps2 kit comes with a keyboard, mouse, vga-adapter cable, hard drive, toothpaste and sony branded comb. That way you can look as good as you feel.
        • Re:Webserver (Score:3, Informative)

          by danheskett ( 178529 )
          A more pratical usuage of the PS2 though would be to boot Linux; mount and NFS share, and server pages from that. With a preconfigured distro on DVD, it could be as simple as inserting a disc and booting, and bamo, instant serving capacity.

          Boss comes down the hallway "we need more capacity by the ned of the week.. what can you do?"

          "I'll stop by Toys'R'Us tonight and add 25% more capacity for about $800. Sound okay?"

        • http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT2614444132. html



      • I have finally found an interesting use for a PS2!

        Hmmmm what about PS2 games? :)

      • depending on your budget, if you want reliable hardware with moving parts which do not break, you might wanna look at refurbed or new apple hardware.

        Back in early '96 i bought Apple's first "PCI Mac", the PowerPC 7500/100. The thing has been on 24/7 every single day for the last 6 years and has run a slew of operating systems, and i have crashed the thing many, many times while never corrupting a single hard drive.

        While in college, i used it as a TV, video capture platform, web surfing, web serving, web authoring, C programming tool.

        Then it was used for about 3 years as a dedicated web server on a T1 connection, serving filemaker-pro-db/lasso/webstar-driven sites [barakatgallery.com] for multiple clients until they'd migrate to their own boxes.

        And for the last two years it has been happily sitting on my kitchen table running LinuxPPC Q4 2000 24/7 serving some hobby sites of mine off of my DSL connection [earthlink.net]

        I've upgraded its processor to a 250mhz G3, added an Ultra2 LVD SCSI card, a 9gig 8.5ms 10,000 rpm IBM cheetah hard drive, boosted the ram to 200MB (could be up to 1gig in theory) and other nifty things.

        I've been opening the case and cleaning its guts about once every 2 years whenever i fellt the need to mess with it.

        in any case, it has been my experience that apple hardware just doesn't break, no matter how much i fuck with it. I still see 5 year-old apple laptops still running MacOS 8.5 and allowing you to surf the 'net. Sure the battery no-longer holds a charge, which is to be expected, but once the power supply is plugged-in, they still work.

        and i bet you could get an old 100mhz PPC 7500 CPU for around $300.

      • THey are $199? Man.
        The thieves here are still trying to charge about $900.

      • Doesn't modding your PS2 like this void the warranty, though?
    • All you have to do is pick out three things wrong with this parent!
  • Woah (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 06, 2002 @10:33PM (#3835333)
    Now I can set up a webserver on my PS2 and visit it with my Dreamcast! Once they get the Xbox running linux, we'll be all set.
    • Leave it to generation Y2K to bring networking to a whole new level.
    • "Now I can set up a webserver on my PS2 and visit it with my Dreamcast! Once they get the Xbox running linux, we'll be all set."

      Three web-servers?

      Can't the Dreamcast handle the load of both your friends visiting it? Heh.
  • $W33t (Score:2, Funny)

    by dotgod ( 567913 )
    bUt wh3n wIll I b3 abl3 to s3rVe mY WaR3z fr0m mY l337 PaNa$0n|c 3D0?
  • "Be nice and don't kill this guys downloads page."
    That's like standing in front of the running of the bulls and asking for them to spare you -- it's just not going to happen! :P
    • Yeah. "Here's the link. be nice and don't click on it!"

      Now that's responsible journalism. :)

    • Isn't it more like shouting to a herd of bulls "IF YOU NOTICE ME PLEASE DON'T RUN OVER ME!" so they sure will notice you and sure will get mad to you and sure will run over you? I believe most of the readers wouldn't even have checked out the page if there wasn't request not to slashdot the page..
  • i hope this is finally the showdown between the slashdot effect and a bank of ps2's.
  • PS2 apache might be nice, but since you have to buy the special ps2 from sony for more money than a regular ps2 anyway, i would rather buy a computer.. until i can run linux on an XBOX anyways
  • The PS2 is great and all, but it's cost effectiveness for power is not matched by the XBox. The PlayStation 2 also costs a lot more than an XBox after you consider the cost of both the PS2 _and_ the overly restrictive Linux kit.

    Regards, Adam.
    • Wow you have a good point there. The cost effectiveness of the PS2 isn't matched by the XBox, a run-of-the-mill, cut-down pc which COMPLETELY LACKS THE ABILITY TO RUN LINUX OR APACHE at this time.

      If you hadn't noticed yet, the PS2 can run linux and Sony supports it. OTOH, the XBox can't run linux and MS will never support it, in reality, they've done all they can to prevent it thus far.

      Let's do some more comparisons if/when the XBox runs linux and there's a post about Apache running on linux/Xbox ok?
    • I believe Esther Dyson said once (going from memory so it may not be a direct quote, but a close paraphrase):
      "If you wait, there will always be a cheaper and faster computer later. But while you wait you have nothing." I see a PS2/Linux box acting as a webserver today. I don't see the XBox doing the same.
  • now I see it from the flamers' perspective... WOO-HOO. Oh looky looky, someone said the word "Linux". Let's post it on Slashdot! Whoah, someone actually downloaded a file, ran configure, and built a binary? Like everyone else in the world does? WOW! ... Ok. I'm not trying to be flamebait here, but ... it's that easy. ./configure --prefix=~/package/usr make make install tar czvf apache.tgz ~/package/* ... and presto-chango. You have a file called apache.tgz, which you unzip in / and you have apache. /me ducks from the mods, and hopes for well-done M2...

    • it's that easy.

      Read his announcement, it was non-trivial.

      And we had the Lego mathematical models a few days ago, anyone can click Legos. He did it cause it was cool, and thought the community at large would like it. And it's on Slashdot cause using a game machine for doing real work is kinda cool to a geek.
      • Yes, I realize that. Sure, it's kinda cool. Now if they had done something OTHER than just recompiling, like a little bit of porting to get it to run on... say... NewOS [sf.net] (ok, bad example. pick something with a network stack and try again.), that would be REALLY /.-worthy.

      • It IS that easy. Here's his announcement. As far as I can tell, it's only non-trivial if you're brand new to Apache or compiling software in Linux. This guy admits to being "new to all of this".

        The greater benefit of downloading pre-compiled binaries for PS2/Linux is that compiling things on the PS2 takes a very long time. Compiling xmame for example, takes roughly 2-3 hours.

        Hi all.

        I've been a regular user of Apache now for about a year, 1.3 and more
        recently 2.0. Recently Sony released a kit to turn their PlayStation 2
        console into a fully featured Linux machine (hard drive, Ethernet etc etc).
        This kit has been gaining great popularity amongst the Linux community, and
        several users (such as myself) have already decided to use it as a webserver :)

        Anyway: to get to the point: the PS2 only has a 300mhz MIPS processor, and
        the compile time for Apache is quite hefty. Another discouraging factor for
        any would-be Apache on PS2 users is that compiling "anything" can be quite a
        daunting task for many people. For this reason, I've decided to provide
        compiled Apache 2 binaries for download.

        These are currently available from http://www.phi-web.co.uk/ps2-apache/ and
        I will endeavour to provide the binaries for each new release of Apache 2
        within a day or so of it "emerging". I just thought I'd let you guys know
        about this potential (admittedly small) market for Apache. With any luck, by
        making binaries for it more high-profile, more people will purchase the PS2
        kit, and hence get interested in Linux.

        I hope you don't mind me posting here, but it seemed like you guys should be
        the ones to know. Given that I'm quite new to all of this, I compiled it
        using the binbuild.sh script, but this has produced a fairly large (>11megs)
        archive: is this normal? Or is there an alternate method to provide a
        smaller archive?

        Thanks, and keep up the good work.

        Chris Taylor

        chris@phi-web.co.uk - The guy with the PS2 Webserver :)
  • comon... (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    example from /.

    "A guy is running apache on a timex watch!! heres the link to his site"

    5 hits later, the site goes down.

    angry /.'er everwhere:

    a) "its /.'ed"
    b) "heres the google cache, gimme karma now!"

    comon ppl...
    • You forgot the other option:

      c) clever link to goatse.cx disguised as a google cache link along with the words "frist pots!!!"
  • Rack Mount Kit? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by peterdaly ( 123554 ) <<moc.mocten.xi> <ta> <yladetep>> on Saturday July 06, 2002 @10:51PM (#3835394)
    Ok, now its time for someone to come out with the Rack Mount Kit for the Linux edition of the PS2, complete with mounting for HD etc.

    How else is one supposed to make a decent server farm out of these? Has anyone done any serious benchmarking of Linux on this hardware? What's the price/performace for one of these doing (tiff to) pnm to png conversions? (I have the need for small cluster for that, have been looking into AMD's)

    I am only half joking.

  • I thought about getting one of these kits for our PS2. But then I realised that while I'm messing around on the PC my boyfriend can play games which keeps him quiet. If I started hogging the playstation he wouldn't have anything to do ;)

    Maybe we should just buy another PS2 now that they've come down in price so much....no there's an idea!

    • i have no idea what you look like but ... marry me!

  • by nakaduct ( 43954 ) on Saturday July 06, 2002 @11:02PM (#3835426)
    Does the distribution include mod_chip?
  • Awesome! (Score:3, Funny)

    by Wakko Warner ( 324 ) on Saturday July 06, 2002 @11:06PM (#3835441) Homepage Journal
    This is just what I bought my PS2 for!!!!!

    Oh wait.


    It was to play "Gran Turismo".

    - A.P.
  • Be nice and don't kill this guy's downloads page.

    As deterrant as telling children they may get their own cookies from the jar, but to take only one.

  • by NanoGator ( 522640 ) on Saturday July 06, 2002 @11:12PM (#3835460) Homepage Journal
    "You too can have a server farm for web serving, and GTA3."

    Well you don't really need a PS2 running Linux to do that. Just use a Windows 2000 box running Apache, then you can serve web pages while playing GTA 3.

    You can't do that on a PS2!!!
    • "I hate Linux because it made me type man mount."

      I like it because I can finger twatt.

    • No chance... GTA3 is a HEAVY game and I'm pretty sure apache is not very light, and running them BOTH on a M$ Windoze box might be too much...
      • It wouldn't be that bad unless the site got slashdotted. Most of GTA3's slowdown comes from drawing the graphics, not from calculating stuff. A faster video card would = smoother frame rate.

        Too bad the game's not as fancy as Quake when it comes to settings. It does NOT degrade gracefully.

        It wouldn't take much horsepower to get Apache to spit out a page within 90 seconds.
  • That's Cool (Score:2, Insightful)

    by tealover ( 187148 )
    How much RAM does the PS2 have? I'm just wondering how truly effective it can be as a webserver.

    • Re:That's Cool (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      32MB...see here [playstation.com] for the rest of the specs.
    • According to Sony, it can serve a quarter of a billion "hello world" pages to itself. Based on that number, it's the most powerful web server in the world.

      (Anybody who remembers Sony's 'The PS2 can handle 66 million invisible polys a second' marketing will find that amusing.)

  • Can you imagine web serving paradigm smashing possibilities of this?!?!!?

    Me either...

  • The announcement [fluxcapacitor.net], and the two files: binaries [fluxcapacitor.net], readme [fluxcapacitor.net].
  • Ironic (Score:2, Interesting)

    by stere0 ( 526823 )
    Apache 2 binaries] are currently available from http://www.phi-web.co.uk/ps2-apache/"

    The site www.phi-web.co.uk is running Apache/1.3.22 (Unix) [...] on FreeBSD. [netcraft.com]

  • Be nice? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by nochops ( 522181 ) on Saturday July 06, 2002 @11:29PM (#3835511)
    Be nice?

    Why post a link if you don't want people to click on it? Why not include a list of users with the story, so we know who is allowed to click on the link and who is not? This way, we won't exceed our quota.

    That's rediculous, I know. But saying "be nice..." in this context just says to me "hehehe I know all about this thing called the Slashdot effect, but I don't really care. Just to make it a bit funnier, though, I'll tell everyone to 'be nice' in my most sarcastic tone."
  • by zmooc ( 33175 )
    blablabla beowulf cluster of those blablabla
  • Why would anyone want to make your game console a web server? With all of that graphic processing power for a single display, why would you want to server web pages? Why? Whhy? God, oh, gawd WHY!!!
    • Why? Whhy? God, oh, gawd WHY!!!

      Because gaming companies usually take a hit on the hardware portion of the game console system and hope to get their profits on games instead. Consumers will be more likely to invest in a cheap hardware system not knowing the extreme markup of the games. If the systems are cheap enough, geeks can get a bunch of them and save on the hardware costs compared with buying conventional hardware.

      I havn't worked it out price / performance ratio-wise, but I think it is not totally out of the question. Regardless, it is a cool thing to do.
  • "the PS2 only has a 300mhz MIPS processor, and the compile time for Apache is quite hefty."

    I built Apache 2 on a Pentium 100 running OpenBSD (and ended up using the 1.3.x binaries that came with it anyway:) and it only took a couple of hours. How bad could it be on a machine that has not only 3 times the clock speed, but many more times the raw processing power?

    Now X11 or Mozilla (it's sad when a web browser takes nearly the same amount of time to build as a windowing system, but I digress) might be bad, but I can't see a huge chunk of time for Apache.
  • I'm trying to do one from source, but that's not easey/fun :/. BTW there's a debian project @ sourceforge for the PS2 Linux Kit....
  • Of course this has uses on some levels. Will a bank of PS2's ever be the backbone of EBAY, NO. But it can be a useful hobby/ learning tool for someone who happens to already own a PS2 and not a computer.

    I can't figure out what "makes" a story here, I've seen readers praise less interesting re-invented wheels than this one. I could cure cancer and you guys would say "so", but let some guy setup Linux to auto-flush his toilet and he'd be a hero.
    • Of course this has uses on some levels. Will a bank of PS2's ever be the backbone of EBAY, NO. But it can be a useful hobby/ learning tool for someone who happens to already own a PS2 and not a computer.

      but for the cost of Sony's Linux kit and a PS2, you could certainly have much more computing power than a 300 MHZ processor if ya knew *anything* about computers...

      And if ya didnt know anything about computers, would ya be running Linux on a PS2?
      • Notice I said "someone who happens to already own a PS2 and not a computer". So, I'm not talking about going out and buying them together for $400. I'm saying that some kid who HAS a PS2 and NOT a computer could benefit from the addition of the kit and apps like Apache if they wanted to break into programming etc. and not spend the time and money on MS products.

        You're making the assumption that one has to be a Slashdot Linux nerd to want to get interested in running linux on a PS2. I think the PS2 getting Linux, Apache, and etc. can spark the interest of others who aren't like us. The kit isn't useful to me right now. It doesn't sound like it is to you either.... but none of this means that it doesn't serve a logical purpose for others.
  • GTA3 and a webserver farm at the same time is not going to happen. You have to shutdown the linux to get to the game side of the PS2
  • they discover the first ps2 mp3/divX site

  • Irony (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Kirby-meister ( 574952 ) on Sunday July 07, 2002 @05:22AM (#3836220)

    It's kind of funny - Sony, known for its extremely successful Playstation, wants the PS2 to be more like a PC. Microsoft, known just about only in computers, wants the Xbox to be seen only as a gaming console (and/or "entertainment hub").

    Sony distributes and supports Linux for its systems, while Microsoft is doing everything they can to stop (non-Microsoft-licensed, therefore not profiting MS directly) PC software from running on their gaming-console/entertainment-hub.

    "Hobbyists" port and program software for the PS2, while "hackers" port and program software for the Xbox. (actually I'm pretty sure hackers are doing/have done more to the PS2 right now)

    Sony's plan is probably to attack MS in the computer market, what with recent announcements of OS experience they've gained from the Linux project and the Vaio and the handheld Clie and the such. Microsoft's plan is to penetrate the entertainment market, a place where Sony, ironically (or coincidentally?), happens to have a strong foothold in (although I prefer Panasonic, myself, but my friend's Sony VVega is nothing to scoff at).

    And through this all, Nintendo sits, GameCube in hand, planning on how to continue in the console gaming market. With the recent retirement of Nintendo mastermind and uber-zombie President Hiroshi Yamauchi, and the recent announcements of the company focusing more on software than hardware, it's anybody's guess as to what is going on at Nintendo of Japan headquarters.

    (Don't even begin on the handheld gaming market - Nintendo owned that market for 10 years with a handheld that could only do spinach green and black sprites, and GBA will probably last at least another 5 on its own).

  • by valmont ( 3573 ) on Sunday July 07, 2002 @07:17AM (#3836323) Homepage Journal
    ... whole clumsily-arranged, ill-balanced, awkwardly-vertical, babel-tower-defying, sky-scraping beowulf cluster of those!

  • i'm curious why he doesn't just cross compile the code from a bigger box?

  • But can we get windows emulation with direct x support? :)
  • Seems to me these boxes would be ideal for a bit of streaming - load the DVD in and away you go. Anybody doing that?
  • Huh? (Score:3, Informative)

    by detritus. ( 46421 ) on Sunday July 07, 2002 @05:53PM (#3838120)
    Uh, Apache (older version) was already ported to the PS2 with the PS2 Linux 1.0 distribution. IMHO, I don't see what the big deal is, especially being that the source doesn't require any modification to compile on the PS2.

    As far as i'm concerned, i'd rather hear about developers porting over applications/libraries/new linux kernels which need modification to run on the PS2 architecture.

I am more bored than you could ever possibly be. Go back to work.