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Linux Software

Update On Linux For PowerPC 58

Posted by Hemos from the lotsa-fun-with-the-g4-world dept.
Smitty825 writes: "On Tuesday, LinuxPPC released a beta of their next product, while SuSE has announced that they will be shipping SuSE 7.0 for PowerPC on November 20! Both distros come with XFree 4.01 and KDE2, as well as the MacOnLinux emulator product."
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Update on Linux on PowerPC More

Update on Linux on PowerPC

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  • If the 100 MHz ppc mac is a 8100, you won't be able to run LinuxPPC on it, these first-generation NuBus PPC macs aren't supported. It's due to the lack of a PCI bus and of OpenFirmware. The only version of Linux that runs on them is MkLinux, which is dog slow.
  • I heard somewhere that linus didn't like the mac arcitecture. I just don't see how he can leave it out when there obvously so many people out there that want it (maybe linux should be moved to some sort of cvs).
  • Actually, I'm fast coming to the conclusion that the best of both worlds is going to be OS X.

    no, seriously. OS 9 software running on demand, All-singing-all-dancing Aqua guiness on top and a crunchy BSD core (just remember ps -ax not ef. Write it on a sticky note. Chant it a hundred times in the shower every morning)

    This is an honest opinion, not just blatant evangalizing.

  • In fact there are some sound applications wich cause problems on PPC. For example soundtracker and ogg123 compile fine under ppc, but produce nothing than white noise! AFAIK it is a problem with byteorder, if programmers program too close to the hardware (ie byte shift operations).

    Bye,
    Stefan Heimers

  • Actually it's a PPCLinux kernel bug (Score:3)

    by Ian Schmidt ( 6899 ) on Saturday November 18, 2000 @05:34AM (#616225)
    Most OSS audio applications on Linux use an ioctl SNDCTL_DSP_GETOSPACE to control audio timing (it tells how much data is free in the sound driver's output buffer). This isn't implemented in PPCLinux's "dmasound" driver, so applications must detect the breakage and work around it (XMMS does, and a small sound player I wrote myself does as well after someone loaned me an iMac to play with).

  • They have the complete 7.5.3 available at ftp://ftp.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple_Softw are_Updates/English-North_American/ Macintosh/System/Older_System/System_7.5_Version_7 .5.3/ and have the update to 7.5.5 at ftp://ftp.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple_Softw are_Updates/English-North_American/ Macintosh/System/System_7.5.5_Update/ (/. forced line breaks are a pain) updates for other versions of MacOS are available too. I have upgraded my SE/30 and my emulated mac on x86 linux (using Basilisk II) to 7.5.3 and then 7.5.5 [the SE/30 also runs Debian 2.2 w/ X]

  • Sorry if I put out a typo there, first the URL http://students.washington.edu/~mpalczew/ or just go to google and type mpalczew and hit I'm feeling lucky, you shoulf get his site. Remeber to bug him about the sound driver...
  • I know IBM was working on the POP boards, and I don't know when they'll be done. Their website says that there has been a few parts-related delays. Hopefully they'll figure it out.

    http://www.chips.ibm.com/products/powerpc/linux/?p rint=1#POP [ibm.com]

    On a side note, has anyone been able to get a journaling filesystem to work on a PowerPC linux?
  • For those of you who might wonder, linux on ppc is fairly nice at this point, on iBooks like mine the initial setup (partitioning etc) is a bit of a pain, but after that is over with it functions much the same as any other linux box. For iBook owners who are thinking about giving linux a try give a look to: htttp://students.washington.edu/`maplczew/ He's written a good turtorial on how to get things working. He is also working on a better sound driver so send him lots of email and bug him to finish it.
  • 7.5.x went all goofy before apple released 7.6
    There was:
    7.5
    7.5.1
    These were only for Nubus PPC and 68K Macs.
    7.5.2 was only for early PCI Macs, upgrade from this version now if you have it.
    7.5.3 once again all Macs could use this version
    7.5.3 Rev 2 Only some Macs needed this long winded version and it was superceeded by 7.5.5

    7.5.4 was only available for about 12 hours before a serious bug was found and removed and rereleased as 7.5.5
    7.5.5
    This is probably the "best" version of System 7.5.x to be using. And when I say best I mean if you have a computer that can run 7.6, 8.1, 8.6, or 9 use the newest version you can. Personally I use 8.6 and I think it is the best version for any PPC Mac, but YMMV.
  • Don't forget the 68k...=) I'm running Debian 2.2 on an 68LC040. No FPU... =)
  • Companies (an independent concern, Moto, IBM etc) could just turn out boards based on the CHRP spec, but the CHRP spec would need to be seriously rejigged - it needs AGP and USB, and needs to shed the old shit (ISA, for example).
  • Hi!

    I wondered if it is possible to install LinuxPPC on top of an existing MacOS installation without losing all the data. Like with fips on x86.

    I couldn't find much info anywhere else.
  • I have several linux boxes, one of them is my home iMac DV 400. networked with my PIII600 laptop. the laptop reports more Bogos, but the imac does many things faster; it has a 66 disk for one thing, and the video is faster too.
    They both run 2.4.0test11 without problem, using the same source tree.
    Overrall, I'd say they compare quite well; hard to notice any difference when working. Yeah, buy yourself a 3 button mouse G4s have an extra boot, using the Altivec instructions to do cache prefetch and other strategic places like memory copies gives a tremendous speedup.
  • don't like MacOS?
    Ooh, sorry but you eventually will!

    You'll be amazed at Mac-On-Linux. I did'nt say you'll have to use it all the time.
    It's just I love it when I can instantly boot my emulator in its saved state, get my encyclopedia/dictionary working, play the stupid quicktime/flash movie, save state again, and switch back to beloved sawfish.

    Get the best of both worlds :-)
    Cheers

  • I run my server/site on a 90 mhz ppc 7200 box. It works great. I usually just telnet in. It runs X ok when I'm on the console, but its not a speed demon either. Its good for coding and surfing etc...


  • It's cool that Linux could run on all kinds of hardware like that©

  • Linux and the iBook FireWire SE (Score:3)

    by Xenex ( 97062 ) <xenex&opinionstick,com> on Saturday November 18, 2000 @12:59AM (#616238) Journal
    In the last few weeks I have been seriously considering an iBook as my first notebook computer. Myself being a x86er from way back, moving to the PPC world of the Mac would be a big step, but with what I have seen and read about OS X, it seems like a good future...

    If I were to purchase an iBook, it would most likely be the 466mhz Graphite with 128meg of RAM and a 10gig hdd (unless I can scrape up the ~ $AU500 to afford the 20, with our dollar so low the iBook prices have risen lately). And the one thing that worries me - do any of these Linux distros run on these iBooks?

    After looking around for info on Yellow Dog, LinuxPCC, and SuSE, I have not been able to find a definate answer. Are there any docs or faqs around? What the the best resources for Linux on Macs? Are the iBooks really any good with Linux at all?

    I'm sorry to all you Mac people that see these as stupid questions, but I am new to your world, and hope to be joining it soon with my own iBook. I just need a few things cleared up...

  • Hello,

    Don't forget YellowDog guys. They are about ready to release their 2.0 version. They are also working with OpenDocs to produce a book for them.
  • yes i used to have Linux-PPC on my iBook (i lost it due to using Norton Utilities - hint - never use that piece of smeg), u may need a special kernel. my HP has info about installing Linux on an iBook _plug_mode_

    http://www.btinternet.com/~trash80/dp/linux.html

  • >It's [was] a x86 world.

    You said it, friend.

    x86 has been useful, but it's going away.
  • The binaries are still linux ELF format no matter the cpu. So long as the source doesn't make any assumtions or kludges for specific hardware it shouldn't require more than a recompile on the new hardware.

    As well, most of the popular daemons and apps are coded multiarchitecture (love those ifdefs) from the get-go.
    ---
    Where can the word be found, where can the word resound? Not here, there is not enough silence.
  • no such thing but it'll be running something in between:

    7.0, 7.1, 7.5, 7.6 probably

  • There is a monolithic port (read: no Mach layer as in mklinux) underway of linux to the first-generation PowerPC's. The (brief) sourceforge page is here [sourceforge.net].

  • Forget about my kernels (Score:3)

    by BenH ( 4366 ) on Saturday November 18, 2000 @02:28AM (#616245) Homepage
    With recent 2.2.18pre's, all that support has been merged in the main tree. You can either pick Alan latest 2.2.18pre or use Paul Mackerras usual rsync repository.
  • I know, but it doesn't seem to be quite there yet. In fact, it's rated pre-alpha.
  • Pretty much all my Linux experience is on PPC and it is a wonderful platform to work on. There are a number of things that still need work (that StarOffice port being one of them) but it is very quickly making significant progress.

    You probably want to search the linuxppc-user list archives from here [geocrawler.com] and check out penguinppc.org [penguinppc.org] for other useful resources and info.

    As for the iBook, the archives indicate that it does work quite well. There doesn't appear to be support for Firewire though (or at least not good support).

    The cube also seems to run LinuxPPC just fine as does those new dual processor G4s (drool). Though the multiprocessor support is in early stages. Did this just not port well from Intel or does multiprocessor support generally suck in Linux?

    Aside from LinuxPPC, you may also want to check out YellowDog [yellowdoglinux.com] which is a very similar distro to LinuxPPC but apparently has an auto-update feature similar to apt-get as well as rpm support. Then of course there's SUSE [suse.com].

    Personally, I'd strongly recommend buying a PPC for Linux - the computers are substantially faster than Intels (despite the Mhz ratings, look at the benchmarks). I'm also looking at buying an iBook to go with my G3 desktop so I'd like to hear your experiences with it. Oh, and yes you can buy multi-button mice for Macs. Get one. :)

    Adrian Sutton.

  • i thought the flash plugin was done in partly
    in java, and the next in C .. if the .so is
    portable enough then why not ??


    "The world is coming to an end. Please log orff."
  • I saw an Apple Cinema at our local computer store a few days ago, and thought it looked pretty good. Lots of big pixels (I seem to have difficulty with >90 pixels/inch)...

    Does anyone know whether Linux PPC has X support for the Cinema and its video card?

  • Re:Actually it's a PPCLinux kernel bug (Score:3)

    by puetzk ( 98046 ) on Saturday November 18, 2000 @12:18PM (#616250) Homepage
    As a matter of fact, GETOSPACE works just fine (I know this, since I was down in dmasound recently to fix kde2's soundserver.

    I also hooked up GETCAPS, and fixed a small bug on our SETFRAGMENT behavior.

    So hopefully, it's all better now :-) If you know of any other problems, drop me a line at puetzk@iastate.edu

    I use ogg vorbis myself without any trouble at all, though I haven't ever tried ogg123 (I ues the xmms plugin). Will have to investigate that.

  • There is no netbeans or jbuilder support (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I almost bought a g4 mac last summer because I worked as a help desk support technician with both pc's/macs and running linux/macosx on the same machine gave me a woody.

    However I was let go (dot.com company. enough said) and decided to look into java and c++ programming.

    I downloaded netbeans and the free version of jbuilder and fell in love instantly! Not even the enterprise version visual c++ had all the cool features that netbeans/jbuilder had and I was using the crappy free versions!

    Both of these excellent products have ported to Linux, but only to x86 Linux.

    There is also no opengl support in the powerpc version of linux and if you buy third party hardware not from apple then forget about support or even drivers for that matter.

    IF apple had at least 25 to 30% market share then I would try it, hoping on future ports but unless the share goes up, I will see my beloved netbeans outside of x86 or sparc. As well as 3d games like quake3 which depend on opengl support.

    If you use a mac for a living as a graphics artist and you happen to own one or buy one for work then buy powerpclinux. If your not an artist, save your money or buy an equilavent smp dual pIII for the same price!

    They are both around $2,600 you can run opengl as well as third party apps. Its also faster then a single processor g4 mac. Just go to Dells website and look under workstations.

  • > If only Macromedia could also please release their fscking Flash plugin for ppc ! (now that
    > RealPlayer for ppc is there;)

    PPC Linux's Netscape doesn't do plugins. At all. RealPlayer has a standalone app...

    OTOH, I hear Konqueror supports Netscape plugins...

    -Hollis
  • Like fips? No.
    You *do* need a separate partition for your linux installation.
    But the good news is, you're not screwed, if you have a bit of resourcefulness and anwhere to store big chunks of data outside your computer.

    If your HD is already partitioned into more than one virtual "drive", you're home free. Same if you have several hard drives- just dedicate one of them to LinuxPPC. Otherwise, see below...

    I was able to install LinuxPPC on my Macintosh at work, without disrupting my existing MacOS setup and, actually, using only fairly primitive tools. That was in 1997.
    Step 1: repartition disk.
    Step 2: restore MacOS, install linux on the various partitions. In a nutshell, the procedure was

    • Back up your Mac system throughly, and save the contents on some other media or on another computer (for instance, via file sharing).
      You can save disk images; or even a bunch of Stuffit archives will work, if you lack space.
      *NOTE* - do NOT attempt any of this if you haven't more than enough free disk space on your Mac for a linux install in the first place. A warning for the impetuous. Check LinuxPPC's website for space recommendations.

    • Make sure you have a bootable MacOS CD or other media on hand. Make sure the CD contains disk utilities, notably "Drive Setup", your partitioning tool in this case. Make sure you know network settings and other details you will need to return your Macintosh to itself once this is over.

    • Boot the CD! Erase your hard disk, and use Drive Setup to repartition it, adding a partition for LinuxPPC. Make sure each partition is large enough for its intended use- one should hold your MacOS installation with room to spare, and the other LinuxPPC. Don't worry about special settings for the LinuxPPC partition: for now, it is enough to create the partition, and the filesystem type is irrelevant. For your MacOS partition, set the same filesystem type as was used previously; either HFS or HFS+, depending on the version of MacOS.
      Note that if you want to read/ examine your MacOS volume when in Linux, you may want to use HFS if possible, or to create an extra MacOS partition which is HFS; this is for data exchange, as (check me on this!) last I was aware, there were no reliable Linux drivers available for the HFS+ filesystem.

    • Copy everything you backed up, to the new partition which you want to use for MacOS. Depending on your resources, ie, where the backups are saved and whether or not you can access them while booted off the CD, you may need to perform other tricks...
      For instance, you can install a minimal MacOS on your soon-to-be-LinuxPPC partition, boot that, and use it to access your backups / copy them to your "permanent" MacOS partition. Then select the "permanent" partition as your bootable drive, and reboot to test that it works.

    • Restore any network settings, etc which got mangled... or at least check them. Test things to make sure they are stable. Of course, at this point it's too late to do anything about major foul-ups (like incomplete or corrupted backups), but you can always try again until you get it somewhat right.

    • Now you're ready to install LinuxPPC on "drive" 2 (or 3)! But you'll need special tools: "pdisk" or the equivalent to actually create a unix filesystem on the partition, and other bits and pieces to actually perform the install. Unless someone has thoughtfully written a program to roll all this into one, which in the intervening years I wouldn't rule out. Check linuxppc.com and linuxppc.org for details: you're out of my hands now.

    --
  • (btw intel is un able to do SMP yet, because of a low level "oops")

    Intel have been doing SMP for years.
  • I have been using Linuxppc and MkLinux for several years.

    I do agree with you about the forums and newsgroups for Linuxppc compared to X86. The Mac crowd has always been a tightknit world. The PC is a computer, the Mac is a community. We have had to stick together. Many of us came to Linux when it appeared that MS was going to crush Apple. We refused to surrender to them. We also knew that if Apple survived that knowing the Nix's would be helpful. You could say that they let see a hint of the future of the MacOS.

    I am running YDL 1.2.1 with the newest Helix-Gnome, on a beige G3/266. It is fine with me.
  • I didn't have as good an experience on my beige G3. Mostly it was X stuff. I cannot find XF86 4.0.1 anywhere. It was not in the upgrade, and I don't see it anywhere on ftp.linuxppc.org. Any clues? Thanks, Paul
  • Actually, my 200mhz PPC box (604e) runs exceedingly fast in LinuxPPC. I was able to use the box to serve 150,000 static page hits in a couple days (bandwidth limited, not processor). I ran remote X, so I don't know how good the local X server is, but it ran pleasently well on my BeOS box.
    ::BeOS::

  • A note about the Public Beta (Score:3)

    by haaz ( 3346 ) on Saturday November 18, 2000 @01:14PM (#616258) Homepage
    No one seems to have noted that you can install the public beta over _any_ existing (installed) RPM-based Linux/PPC distribution. It doesn't have to be LinuxPPC, either. It can be SuSE or some other distro, and the beta will happily install on top of it.

    Enjoy!

    Haaz: Co-founder, LinuxPPC Inc., making Linux for PowerPC since 1996.
  • Could you repost this URL? Every permutation I tried came up 404. I eagerly await with a properly partitioned iBook, LinuxPPC installed and tired of using the CD to switch from Linux back to the Mac. Argh.

  • Re:Help! (Score:1)

    by hime ( 5963 )
    if you're not able to run OS 9 (check the apple site to see what they recommend for that model, ram, etc) you might be able to get an older 8.x version on ebay or at Sun Remarketing. that's where i got system 6 for one of my old toaster macs.

    Those guys have an interesting business - some of their prices are great, and some are just REALLY bizarre.
  • Actually, they are not getting out, but rather farther in. The have created soi chips with speeds of 1gz and they will be called high end g4s. They also are slated to create a 64bit 2ghz chip in about two years. Apple and motorola are just find, ibm better get it together though.
  • LinuxPPC will really be worth it if any ever builds a ATX PPC board.

    Untill then, this is such a small market with such a high price (Hardware, Time to Port Apps)that the majority of the people on here dont give a damn.
  • according to this interview [linuxfr.org] of Mandrakesoft people, they're on the works for a ppc release too.
    And of course, don't forget potato was released for ppc too. Very nice turn of events. Hum, relief...
    If only Macromedia could also please release their fscking Flash plugin for ppc ! (now that RealPlayer for ppc is there;)
    It's [was] a x86 world. *gasp* I guess alpha people is going to complain right ahead.
  • Sigh... if only it didn't suit Apple's business interests to have MacOS run exclusively on their hardware...

    Of course, for now, you can always get one of Motorola's ATX boards, the ones aimed for the industrial machine-control market. Only $1000+ a pop. ("These things are built like a tank," sayeth the company rep at LWCE2000)

    Man, the G4 kicks ass. If only the market economy didn't get in the way :P
  • What I'm interested in know is where can I get an older version of MacOS (7.9 I believe) to cover up a blothced install.
    And what are the HardWare requirments for PPCLinux? I just claimed a 100mhz Mac over at www.freeboxen.com? I kno wit will run, but will it run disantly, or like a 486 booting NT?
    Thanks

  • Running Linux on Cube? (Score:3)

    by Idaho ( 12907 ) on Friday November 17, 2000 @11:25PM (#616266)
    What I'm wondering: has anybody tried to install Linux on the Cube? I mean, it looks very cool and I've heard they're pretty fast too....

    Anyway, I see it runs on the G4. Has anyone tried how fast and stable they 'feel' compared to Intel-based computers? I'm wondering this, because I like the design of both G4 and Cube very much but don't like MacOS :-)

  • Sweet update... (is XF86 4.0.1 in it?) (Score:2)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I installed the linuxppc beta update on Nov. 16. It worked like a charm. The update script ran perfectly, and it was all finished in a few hours.

    Anyway, major props to the LinuxPPC crowd. It really is sweet. I'm also grateful to slashdot, for not immediately releasing the news. It is sooo nice to let us devoted fans get a chance for a clear download.

    Anyway, the updater checks to see what packages you have installed before upgrading... and for some reason it gave me the new Helix Gnome release, but not XFree86 4.0.1. Anyone else experience this? I didn't report it as a bug since I was probably due to my funky hand install of X. Anyway, to make a long story short, I just grabbed the XFree86-4.0.1 rpms off the ftp server (in a subdirectory called 'beta') and they installed flawlessly.
  • After a little bit of fun I finally got Debian running on my iBook (Rev. A - a lovely blueberry shade - which makes it go faster)

    I am really waiting for YDL to release what was going to be YDL Gone Home, now rolled into the main distro. They showed it at MWNY and it seemed to agree with iBooks.

    'topher
  • I was curious as to what the original version of the rpm being updated was (and what surrounding versions were), so I added this small patch to upgrade, the script that updates all the rpms on your system (which is at ftp://ftp.linuxppc.com/linuxppc-halloween/install/ updates/upgrade):

    --- upgrade_orig Sat Nov 18 01:42:55 2000
    +++ upgrade Sat Nov 18 01:43:18 2000
    @@ -275,6 +275,7 @@

    # First check to see if duplicate rpm types are already installed
    my_print "Upgrading new $type: $path\n";
    + system "rpm -qa|grep $type";
    @files = split "\n", `rpm -q --root $path_to_root $type --queryformat=\"%{NAME}-%{VERSION}-%{RELEASE}\n\" `;
    if( $#files ne 0 ) {
    ### This means that duplicate RPMS are already installed
  • first of all, there is no mac OS 7.9, and if you have a 100mhz PowerPC box, you should be able to run OS 9, which is the currently shipping - and thus only available - OS for that mac. if you let me know the model number, and thus whether it's a Nubus (x100) or a PCI box (x500, x600, etc), that will determine how well it runs linuxPPC, if at all.

    if you're not able to run OS 9 (check the apple site to see what they recommend for that model, ram, etc) you might be able to get an older 8.x version on ebay or at Sun Remarketing [sunrem.com]. that's where i got system 6 for one of my old toaster macs.

    in any event, 100 mhz PPC should run linux like a champ, and, if the video is decent, should make an excellent X box.
  • Mac OS up to 7.5.5 is free for download off apple.com
  • I've heard it works as long as you use the Open Firmware video driver (which is very slow and you really don't want to do that).

    -Hollis

  • Re:Running Linux on Cube? (Score:3)

    by CodeToad ( 58852 ) on Friday November 17, 2000 @11:56PM (#616273)
    Yes, installing and running LinuxPPC on the cube It is fully possible..But you'll want to head over to http://ppclinux.apple.com/~benh/ to pick up his (renouned in the ppclinux community) special kernels for the newer hardware(Which includes airport support).. About "feel": Provided you get the video card configured as the frame buffer, and such, you'll be crusing along on ppc! In fact, I'm typing this from my bed while on my iBook SE, running LinuxPPC Halloween Edition :)
  • No, I need the older version for my sisters mac, and it is running 7.4.4 I believe.
  • You should check out Yellow dog Linux [yellowdoglinux.com]. It runs a modified version of Redhat and is 100% stable. I run it on an old 8500 with a g3 card with no problems. X isn't as fast as my athlon box, but it's decent.

  • Real world experience on LinuxPPC (Score:4)

    by tsciortino ( 249502 ) on Saturday November 18, 2000 @07:37AM (#616276)
    I have used and worked on x86 Linux for quite some time. I had been offered to work on linux for an embedded system but it used a ppc processor. I started to check out MAC's just to see what they have to offer(never used one) much of the reading I did made them look to far surpass the x86 world. This includes studies by NASA for example. So I purchased a Dual Processor G4 500 with a DVD/RAM drive and Apple Studio Display monitor. Everything is USB. Within a week I had LinuxPPC up and running fully. SMP, usb keyboard/mouse/sound and a beautiful X 4.01 display running at 1280x1024 32bit color Helix Gnome 1.2
    Now, this is not for the novice Linux user, but for the power user, this has been the best setup I have ever seen. x86 never ran or looked so good as it does on this MAC hands down.
    iBook, LinuxPPC sure runs great there too.
    Check out lists.linuxppc.org for answers to everything.
    Here is the slap to x86 Linux users. You know those annoying linux newbies who have all those stupid questions about things you have done and they just don't get it and the reply they all get from better linux users, RTMF, read this HOWTO or read the man page. But hardly ever give the correct answer. Now I hate to repeat myself also, but to my surprise, in LinuxPPC land the most advanced users and kernel contributers take a moment to help where they can.
    Linux in the PPC word is way way more friendly than x86 land.

  • As others have mentioned, running LinuxPPC on the cube is quite possible (and rewarding).

    BUT!! One major detail - the mouse. Trying to use X/Gnome/KDE/whatever with a one-button mouse is an exercise in frustration, to say the least. I'm not at all a fan of 'just hit this key-combo for right/middle' style of advice. Just get a 3-button mouse and have done with it.

    Fortunately, the newer Macs all have USB, and the state of Linux and USB seems to be a bit ahead on the PPC (or at least Mac) side of things. So there are plenty of choices for replacing the crippled mouse that comes with the Mac. I've used both the Logitech and MS optical mouses on Yellow Dog Linux, and they work perfectly (and provide the middle mouse button). Presumably most USB-mousen would work.

  • I'm sorry, but I had to say something. I could of either modded you down, or flamed you. I chose the latter.

    IBM has to get their act together!? How mis-informed are you? IBM created SOI for chips, that's why they're using it in their new Power4 chip. They're being held back by Mot cause they can't get their act together. Steve Jobs himself said "It'll be great in a few years when we're not using your chips". IBM did most of the G4 with some Mot technology on the side, but due to whacked out deals, IBM can't do anything with the chip. It's been stuck at 500Mhz cause of Mot, while IBM has had it clocked to much higher speeds.

    Better luck next time.

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