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When Teachers Are Obstacles To Linux In Education

Posted by kdawson on Wed Dec 10, 2008 06:46 AM
from the height-of-ignorance dept.
jamie found this blog post up on the HeliOS Project, which brings Linux to school kids in Austin, TX. It makes very clear some of the obstacles that free software faces in the classroom. It seems a teacher came upon a student demonstrating Linux to other kids and handing out LiveCDs. The teacher confiscated the CDs and wrote an angry email to HeliOS's founder, Ken Starks: "Mr. Starks, I am sure you strongly believe in what you are doing but I cannot either support your efforts or allow them to happen in my classroom. At this point, I am not sure what you are doing is legal. No software is free and spreading that misconception is harmful. ... This is a world where Windows runs on virtually every computer and putting on a carnival show for an operating system is not helping these children at all. I am sure if you contacted Microsoft, they would be more than happy to supply you with copies of an older version of Windows and that way, your computers would actually be of service to those receiving them..." Starks pens an eloquent reply, which contains a factoid I have not seen mentioned before: "The fact that you seem to believe that Microsoft is the end all and be-all is actually funny in a sad sort of way. Then again, being a good NEA member, you would spout the Union line. Microsoft has pumped tens of millions of dollars into your union. Of course you are going to 'recommend' Microsoft Windows."
+ -
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[+] News: Followup To "When Teachers Are Obstacles To Linux" 626 comments
An couple of anonymous readers wrote in to let us know about a followup to last Wednesday's story of the teacher who didn't believe in free software. The Linux advocate who posted the original piece has cooled off and graciously apologized for going off half-cocked (even though the teacher had done the same), and provided a little more background which, while not excusing the teacher's ignorance, does make her actions somewhat more understandable. Ken Starks has talked with the teacher, who has received a crash education in technology over the last few days — Starks is installing Linux on her computer tomorrow. He retracts his insinuations about Microsoft money and the NEA. All in all he demonstrates what a little honest communication can do, a lesson that all of us who advocate for free software can take to heart. "The student did get his Linux disks back after the class. The lad was being disruptive, but that wasn't mentioned. Neither was the obvious fact that when she saw a gaggle of giggling 8th grade boys gathered around a laptop, the last thing she expected to see on that screen was a spinning cube. She didn't know what was on those disks he was handing out. It could have been porn, viral .exe's...any number of things for all she knew. When she heard that an adult had given him some of the disks to hand out, her spidey-senses started tingling. Coupled with the fact that she truly was ignorant of honest-to-goodness free software, and you have some fairly impressive conclusion-jumping. In a couple of ways, I am guilty of it too."
[+] News: Teachers Need an Open Source Education 440 comments
palegray.net writes "Teachers are sorely in need of an education in what open source software is, what it isn't, and how it can benefit their students. A recent news story at the Reg discussed the case of a Texas teacher who accused those distributing Linux to students of committing criminal acts. A HeliOS blog entry exposes a 'higher education' culture of apathy, lies, and fear of open source software. Things have got to improve, and that improvement needs to start with misguided teachers getting their facts straight."
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  • by CRCulver (715279) <crculver@christopherculver.com> on Wednesday December 10 2008, @06:50AM (#26057613) Homepage
    I don't think it's worth attributing the teacher's support of Windows to some kind of fanatical support of union directives. From postal workers to teachers, truckers to plumbers, in my admittedly anecdotal experience I've found that the average professional has very little clue about his union's sources of funds and its goals.
    • by mgblst (80109) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @06:58AM (#26057655) Homepage

      Yes, but they don't go around confiscating discs, and writing strongly worded letters. This sounds like it actually came from Steve can-i-have-that-chair-for-a-minute Ballmer.

      Is anyone else reminded of the religous teacher confiscating a biology book from a student, and writing a letter to their pro-evolution parents?

      • by HungryHobo (1314109) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:17AM (#26057833)

        I recently had a conversation with a recently retired friend of mine.

        He barely uses the net- I think he has an email address with his ISP and that's about it.

        He was complaining about how everything was so expensive and how he's had to pay for some antivirus software after their old computer got infected with something. etc.

        I ask: "why didn't you just get some free one?"
        His response: "There's so such thing as a free lunch! Either it's stolen or they'll be cheating you somehow"
        I then tried to explain about linux and FOSS but he had grown up with the solid idea that nothing worth having is ever free unless you're being scammed in some way.
        He could not be convinced that FOSS was legal and genuinely free. There had to be a catch. There had to be a law being broken.

        This attitude is common with the older generation who aren't used to the net. "Free" rings alarm bells and this is an issue I rarely hear mention of when people talk about the problems linux has spreading.

    • by daniorerio (1070048) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:01AM (#26057683)
      It's still less ignorant than what this teacher is saying. Maybe this teacher has no clue how the union is funded, it doesn't mean that millions of MS advertising dollars are at work doing a fine job here...
    • by Yvanhoe (564877) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:04AM (#26057709) Journal
      That's what I thought at first. Then I read the full letter. I have a hard time believing that someone who actually installed and tried linux in college would believe it was illegal. If the teacher thought it was some sort of install party for pirated versions of windows, well she was right in what she did and was just ignorant of the facts but then she goes on to say that she understand what linux is, to have tried and installed it. How could she be uninformed to the point of saying that no software is free and that linux is illegal ?
    • by unlametheweak (1102159) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:31AM (#26057921) Journal

      After confiscating the disks I called a conference with the student and that is how I came to discover you and your organization.

      I am not sure what you are doing is legal. No software is free and spreading that misconception is harmful.

      I think it's more a mindset. I've experienced the same attitudes in school and by teachers long before Microsoft became a recognized name. It seems that many teachers still think "no pain, no gain" (or like the kid athletes said during one of the Olympics, "No pain, no Spain"). I also remember that we were not allowed inside the school during sub-zero temperatures during recess because recess is about being outside. Yep, I even remember one teacher confiscating a ball from a kid at recess (the kid told his parents who had that teacher suspended)... and not too recently my mom talked to one of the neighbour kids who was suspended from school for being late for class. It's an authoritarian attitude. Things need to be bought; if they aren't bought then it's either stolen or its communism or "socialism".

      I also remember when a person from a British government copyright enforcement agency emailed the Firefox foundation to inform then that their software was being distributed and that punishments for those offenders will be forthcoming. That person had a hard time believing that software could be free (I believe this was a Slashdot story many moons ago).

      • by L4t3r4lu5 (1216702) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:20AM (#26057845)
        Starks was handing out discs at a school? I thought it was a co-student (as stated in the stub, so no Ring of TFM necessary) and Starks had no prior contact with the institution, or its representatives, before that time.

        Starks didn't try and indoctrinate anybody. You're talking rubbish.
  • by TheNarrator (200498) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @06:59AM (#26057663)

    The teacher has nothing to do with the NEA getting money from Microsoft. She's just a low-level drone who's only source of information was maybe an education tech conference she went to and the mainstream media.

    A better letter would have pointed out that Linux is being used in industry, in the world's largest companies, the U.S government and so forth and that children should have the skills to compete in the workforce by learning Linux. The whole free software thing should also be explained in the letter throughly, perhaps with a page or two containing a complete idiots guide to the basics of the GPL, etc. Perhaps reprinted from C-Net or some other technology media source.

  • by JohnFluxx (413620) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:01AM (#26057687)
  • Oh dear god (Score:5, Insightful)

    by GreatBunzinni (642500) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:01AM (#26057691)

    Was this real? The letter snippet reads as if the supposed teacher was ranting about drug use or some other evil of society. So much righteous indignation, so little understanding of the real world.

    I pity the school system that relies on these characters to educate and "guide and discipline" any child.

  • Who broke the law? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Mostly a lurker (634878) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:04AM (#26057713)
    Here is a teacher, accusing a student and an Open Source software organization of breaking the law (and no doubt intimating as such to her class) and confiscating the student's property for no valid reason. I believe the teacher is guilty of criminal acts. I also believe she leaves herself and the school board open to civil action. I am not an admirer of the US legal system, but this might be a good time to use it to send a message to the world's ignoramuses that, yes, some software is both good and free.
  • by jim0203 (980945) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:09AM (#26057759)
    In the article, this hapless bint (how can we stop people like this getting near children?) says "I along with many others tried Linux during college and I assure you, the claims you make are grossly over-stated and hinge on falsehoods." I think she has got Linux confused with either (a) LSD or (b) [insert adventurous sexual practice here].
  • by MrCrassic (994046) <mrcrassic AT gmail DOT com> on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:09AM (#26057767) Homepage Journal
    This is probably the finest example of how to not win over support from people outside of the Linux and Open-Source community.

    I was kind of surprised to hear of the reaction that the teacher had to a student handing out Linux disks, as I don't know anyone who would take personal offense to trying out that software. Almost reads like a joke, but then again there is Rule 36...

    However, I was even more surprised by the response that was given to her claims. Did he honestly think he could be persuasive by being condescending, insulting and, well, just downright mean?? His points are valid, though I think one of them is pure opinion. (I don't think Linux was designed to "free people from Microsoft." I think that it was designed as an alternative to closed-source operating systems in general, which being "freed" from Microsoft Windows is a side effect.) Yet, if that teacher was being a bit harsh, Starks did nothing to quench that fire.

    With all of that said, I think that Linux is gaining positive momentum in education and public offices. Naturally, it will be a slow transition, considering most IT departments are not too comfortable with the idea of switching all of their computer network to a Linux-based one (and with good reason). It's getting there, though.
    • by jimicus (737525) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:45AM (#26058003) Homepage

      Please remember that when they're trying to teach, teachers are basically control freaks.

      I'm not saying this to be derogatory, you understand, but when you're trying to get a bunch of kids who don't necessarily want to sit still and pay attention to listen to you, what other option is there?

      That explains the teachers' reaction to the student handing out Linux disks. It'd probably be much the same whatever the student was handing out.

      Regarding their reaction to the existence of Linux - well, there's no shortage of narrow-minded people in teaching, as in any walk of life.

  • What a tool... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Registered Coward v2 (447531) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:24AM (#26057877)

    Ok, the teacher is misinformed and here email is a bit terse. Still, it was a chance to educate someone and make a friend; instead he chose to pen a rude reply and escalate the battle to the school's administration.

    I simply do not understand this attitude - FOSS advocates are trying to gain wider adoption of their software and ideas and yet seem to go out of their way to antagonize anyone who doesn't share their viewpoint.

    This could come down to a basic question - what right does a teacher or school have to control student activities in the classroom. My guess is that, if push comes to shove, a court would give them broad latitude in such matters. The teacher has no idea what is on the disks; and the school would naturally be concerned about any lawsuits that might arise over that, so they have a legitimate interest in restricting such activities. All it takes is one CD-Rom with something objectionable to a parent or illegal to paint FOSS and it's supporters as somehow evil and a danger to kids. Not that that is right, but winning and losing these kinds of battles rarely hinges on what is right.

    FOSS advocates should ask themselves why MS and Apple are successful in getting their products into schools and adopt their approach - working with teachers, teaching them how to use their products to further classroom activities; in short becoming a partner with them. I know a lot of teachers, and most of them just want to help their students learn, avoid hassles from parents and administrators, struggle with the myriad of laws and other things that impact their ability to teach and really care about the kids they teach. Sure, there are some who are useless but most are just trying to do a good job in a challenging environment.

    You do not have to agree with or like the teacher's stance, but to further FOSS goals you need to understand it and determine the best way to overcome it. making an enemy is not, IMHO, the best way to further those goals.

    I've found teachers open to FOSS if approached the right way. For example, explaining how OpenOffice/NeoOffice can be used for schoolwork by students so parents don't have to shell out cash for MS Office. Give them a disk, with written instructions on how to set it up to save in an MS format and you've made it easy for them to use and helped build credibility for FOSS

    The problem is zealots see everything as a threat or challenge; and believe compromise and cooperation is selling out; and that any differing viewpoint or argument against their approach is either flamebait or a troll (as evidenced by /. moderations).

  • by MrKaos (858439) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:28AM (#26057897) Journal
    She just made Linux the coolest thing at that school. I can see the kids handing out those disks in as clandestine manner as possible.

    I hope she told the other teachers to do the same thing.

  • by petes_PoV (912422) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:29AM (#26057907)
    This is a case of the education system failing. Most teachers, especially in any subject that involves the slightest amount of science or technology, are so badly trained and resourced[1] that they're typically a page or two in front of the kids when it comes to dispensing knowledge. Fortunately, most of them stick to the syllabus - otherwise they'd go off, spouting their opinions as "fact" and screwing up countless lives. However, they have such a limited knowledge of science or tech. from the real world, that anything they haven't come across before will seem wrong. Since most of them will have heard of piracy, porn and viruses it is natural for them to assume, in the absence of any hard practical knowledge they have themselves, that everything they don't explicitly teach is wrong, or bad.

    Rather than being saracstic in his reply, this guy should've offered to educate the teachers into what other options are out there. Instead he's just turned them off and made them more hostile to alternatives.

    Since succeeding in the education system requires children to give the answer the examiners expect - rather than the one that is correct, by closing this teacher's mind to other possibilities the Linux guy has made sure that the teacher will not admit coursework or answers that involve non-MS products. A good opportunity to expand some horizons has been wasted.

    [1] yes, yes, I know: yours was inspirational and a credit to the profession. Congratulations, you're in the top 0.5%.

  • by abigsmurf (919188) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:42AM (#26057983)
    Great, so he posted an incredibly arrogant, opinionated response to that letter and has done nothing to change the teachers viewpoint other than maybe think Linux users are all pricks.

    The teacher was deeply wrong with her viewpoint but the best way to respond is to politely correct her and guide her to somewhere where she can read up more on it. That's likely to result in a much more lasting result.

    Instead he goes on about Evil Microsoft conspiricy theories a stupid "Linux is better than windows in every single way" type rant. It's fine thinking one OS is better than the other but you're deluding yourself if you don't think there are things one OS does better than than the other (cue 'lol windows crashes better' replies).

    You won't change people by belittling them and going on what frankly, would seem like crazed ravings to someone unfamiliar with OSS zealots.

  • Ken Starks (Score:5, Interesting)

    by julian67 (1022593) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:43AM (#26057987)
    Ken Starks is a tedious and shameless self-promotion artist. He won't ever reveal the real names of the teacher or the student because they don't exist. He's a serial troll. The choice of Helios as a moniker is partially apt because he is at the very least *ego*centric, though certainly not effulgent. Free software would benefit greatly if "Helios" and Roy Schestowitz beat each other into dumb oblivion or if /. and lxer and similar just stopped taking any notice of these arseholes. They're embarrassing.
    • Re:Flabbergasted.. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Chrisq (894406) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:04AM (#26057719)
      I would have been flabbergasted, except for the fact that its a teacher saying that. There are very few teachers who seem to know where their knowledge area stops, or who don't express opinion as fact.
    • by Technician (215283) on Wednesday December 10 2008, @07:41AM (#26057967)

      I find what works best is to supply examples of fine open source software that runs on Windows and Linux. Once they grasp the concept of free open source software and the missing hurdles to it's use, the next step is to note the OS itself is free software. As an example, this page I wrote concerning an engineering challenge for launching t shirts at a NBA game. The engineering task was to find the optimum length for the launch tube. Note the use of open source software in the solution. When the teacher compared the open source solution to the Microsoft Sound Recorder or other packaged solution, then the seed for the concept is planted. Have the teacher read the license. um End User License Agreement. On a side note, the final and winner announcement will be this Friday. Our team has an excellent chance of winning. The teacher knows that I use The Gimp to size photos for the wiki, etc on a Linux machine. Windows is not needed.

      https://inteltrailblazerschallenge.wikispaces.com/Barrel+length+trim+method [wikispaces.com]

      When Open Source is the best solution, it gets noticed. It is no longer just hobbiest software.