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Linux as Military Standard? 84

Posted by sengan from the raises-moral-questions dept.
Phil Gross writes "InfoWorld's Robert X. Cringely is reporting that the US Air Force is considering adding Linux to the list of potential standard military operating systems. It seems the U.S. Air Force has recognized the significance of the momentum behind Linux, according to one reader. Apparently it is asking developers and users if they would be interested in a Defense Information Infrastructure-Common Open Environment (DII COE) segment for Linux. If there is enough interest, Linux would become an "official" operating system for military computers.' I'd love to get more details on this. "
In related news, Wired is reporting the Navy is reconsidering its use of NT: " the Navy said that while Windows NT was specified in the Statement of Work as the operating system for the workstations in question, other components of a coming upgrade will primarily utilize Unix-based systems. The source said. "I don't think that Unix or NT were ever really evaluated -- it was just somebody thinking this was good, with no knowledge"". Thanks to brentbent
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Linux as Military Standard? More

Linux as Military Standard?

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  • now killing people is less expensive! :P

    ---
  • She was more than just the patron of Charles Babbage, she wrote both the first computer program and the first programming-HOWTO. While Chuck was mucking about with designing the Analytical Engine, she wrote a monogram on how to use such a machine to do things. The example program was to calculte Bernoulli numbers, and made use of loops and conditionals. Some credit her with "inventing" such structures, but the Jacuard (sp?) looms also used them.

    PS: She wasn't the daughter of Percy Shelley (the poet) or Mary Wollstonecraft. She was the daughter of Lord Byron (the poet), and Annabella Milbanke.
  • From a military point of view, Linux is a much better choice than the proprietary offerings. One of the most important features that they would be looking for is the source code, for security, stability, and the ability to customise the code for their applications. I don't think that the military should trust any of their mission-critical systems to proprietary software, for the same reason they wouldn't buy Jeeps or Humvees with the hood welded shut.

    If any of you think that Open Source software should not be used in the killing of people, think about the fact that it's not Linux or OSS actually doing the killing. Guns don't kill people. People do. Not that killing people is any good, either.
  • yet anyway... I've done some work on computers in the army, even though it's not my MOS... :) But I've gotten tired of windows 3.1 stuff, which some military places still use alot of, in my experience with their computers... Some of their apps are gonna need special considerations too, due to security concerns.. still, I'll support it, as I'll support anything that helps our government stopwasting money. :)

    David, who's always hopeful about things like this working out...
  • Computer consultant on the side, but all I'm gotta deploy during Annual Traning this year is vechicles... transportation mos's only get to do computer work when things have gotta be fixed for missions, it seems... but good luck in your deployment, the computer kind anyway, hopefully not the company kind...

    David
  • Coz that air you're using, it was at some point, cycled through the engines of a military jet.

    And probably contains particles that were farted from the ass of some Marine somewhere.

    So, I'd stop breathing, if I were you ...
  • Posted by Myrdraal:

    As the topic says, you need to read further down. The interesting story is the next-to-last paragraph or thereabouts.
    -Myrdraal

  • Linux owes its existence to the Internet.

    The Internet owes its existence to the old ARPAnet.

    The ARPAnet owed its existence to the US Military.

    Linux is already the outcome of a millitary project, for better or for worse it's already "tainted" thusly.
  • Regardless of your opinion of the US Military, boycotting something like an OS just because the military uses it too is plain stupid. There are lots of other things the military uses too, like electricity, oil, automobiles, airplanes, cafeteria food preparation equipment, beds, shoes, radios, etc. Do you have plans to boycott all of those things too?

    Some things are so universally ubiquitous that everyone uses them, even those who disagree with each other completely. Would you stop using a brand of disk drive if you found that Microsoft uses that brand too? Of course not. This is no different.

  • Since when is dividing by 0 a buffer overrun? You get a floating point exception (SIGFPE).

    NT? Feh.
  • see article

  • So the "laws of nature" mandate using jet-propelled, computer-controlled nuclear missiles against entire cities of people you've never met, eh?

    I'd say you are pretty much correct here. Animals use whatever means they have in order to defeat an enemy. Humans weren't given neat stingers where our butts are. We don't have venom glands. We don't have really big teeth or claws. We aren't exceptionally big, strong, or fast. We don't blend in very well in most cases. We don't have much protection from the elements. What we do have is the intelligence to allow us to overcome all the things that seem to be deficiencies when we first look at them. We wanted protection and food, so we made clubs and spears and such. Then we went out and killed animals that we would otherwise have been no match for.

    You see, when two countries have opposite views on something and neither side is willing to compromise thier stance, there is little choice but to force the other side to comply. That way you either get what you want and weaken the other side to the point where they can't object, or you are weakened and lose the ability to take what you want.

    Animals fight all the time. As another poster said, chimps have been seen to fight with other groups of chimps. It happens with alot of the big mammals. You think rams butting heads to see who will be the dominant male is not violent? I believe lions and other pack animals also have violent conflicts to resolve leadership problems.

    We've just elevated things to a much higher level. One could wonder if our intelligence combined with our violent instincts could be our downfall. If the enemy keeps inventing stronger weapons, you must also invent stronger weapons or risk being made subservient to or destroyed by that enemy. Unfortunately, I don't think humans have hit their full destructive potential yet.

    That's pretty scary, but it still conforms with the laws of nature I think. We are using whatever means we can to defeat or deter enemies. Luckily, as in the animal world, the threat of violence is often enough to deter an enemy. If they believe you have the power to kill or at least seriously hurt them, they may decide that it's not worth fighting.

  • Silly... (Score:1)

    by jonr ( 1130 )
    ...looks to me as the Navy uses "the hip os of the" day strategy.
    "Gee, this Linux stuff seems to be getting a lot of press lately, let's use that for our carriers"
    I have no idea of what the navy is using their OSes for, but why don't they just use QNX and get over it?
    (not to be taken too seriously, really!) :)

    Jon
  • Now, would it be RMS or ESR riding the nuke all the way down? ;)

    --
    rickf@transpect.SPAM-B-GONE.net (remove the SPAM-B-GONE bit)
  • So the "laws of nature" mandate using jet-propelled, computer-controlled nuclear missiles against entire cities of people you've never met, eh? I don't know of any other animals that do that. Most all the animals I can think of kill other species for food or, on rare occassions, kill individuals of their own kind.

    In fact, I don't know of any other animals that engage in war at all, except for ants. Let's face it, it's an aberration.

  • Yep, it was named after Lady Lovelace, the famous patron of computing pioneer Charles Babbage and an early AI prophet in her own right. She was the daughter of Percy Shelly (the poet) and Mary Wollstonecraft (the author of Frankenstein), so you knew she had to turn out cool. ;)

  • I'd much rather have my taxes helping the OSS community than going to Microsoft. I would also like it that the agency in charge of defending my country is using stable, efficient OSes on their computers.

    Would it be bad if the Mafia used Linux? Is it bad if a porn site uses Linux? I don't know if Linus, Alan, or any of the other people involved really care. With respect to Linux, all I care about is that the people involved are working towards the goal of making the best OS possible.

  • More ships to tow, and the infantry will still rule. =)

    BTW, guess what operating system www.mil.fi [www.mil.fi] web server uses.

  • then, at the funding sources for MIT in the 1970's-early 1980's. That is, all sources of funding for the total budget, including grants and overhead levy/allocation. The institution where FSF and GNU got their start. Something RMS doesn't seem to talk about very much.

    sPh
  • Since "munitions" are subject to strict export controls the USAF flavor of Linux would have to be distributed in the United States only.

    Or am I wrong?
  • Hrm, hey look everyone, this OS stopped our new superboat dead in the water...let's tow it back to base and act like nothing ever happened! (several months later) Hrm, ya know, maybe we should rethink that whole OS thing...

    Can we say *DUH!*
  • If anyone is allowed to ship "munitions" overseas, it would be the military.

  • This certainly puts the whole "World Domination" plan in a new light....

  • Terrififc. World War 3.0.2b.
  • The USAF uses telephones too. Also, I don't think ADA is a munition.
  • There are some rockets (Manufactured in Norway) which is called Penguin rockets. Imagine fire those at the enemy :)
    - Who can beat the operating system of the penguin when it fires real Penguin rockets?
  • As far as I know, no military money went into the development of Linux. On the other hand, DARPA helped fund BSD--specifically, the development of its network code. Oh, and better stop using TCP/IP, too, since its design and development was paid for by the military. Forget about the Internet, of course, since it was funded for years by the military. Stop using anything with IC's, since they were developed for missile guidance. In fact, stop using computers altogether, since much of early computer research was paid for by the military. Take up fabric arts, or soybean farming, or open a shoeshine stand. Meanwhile, back in the real world, we'll go on using military technology for non-military purposes, with a smile on our faces, since no one can own us.
  • A DII-COE for Linux would be DoD-wide, not service-specific. This would be a giant's *leap* forward.

    -- Cerebus
  • I wish there was a more secure OS that was popular.
    There is no such thing as security, it's all an illusion. You can't stop bad people from getting at your data, you can only make it enough of a pain in the ass to do it that they don't think it's worth the bother, and then you've got to worry about it still being available to the people who need it. Everything involved is a trade-off. You want to 100% fool-proof keep people from accessing your computer? Turn it off. If that's not good enough, (Hey, someone might break in to your house!) wrap it in a mile or so of copper wire, plug it in for a few minutes, and once the fire dept. has put out your house, toss the slag down to the bottom of the ocean. And then, if you're really lucky, there won't be anyone twisted enough to try and dredge it up...
    Seriously though, it's better and more 'secure' to have an OS that gets fixed right away when one of the million problems that exist is located, instead of a few months from now, maybe, if the makers want to recognize the problem as worth their time.
  • Over here in good old Blighty our Combined Cadet Force (a lot of children dressed up in uniform and made to do drill, just like the real RAF/Army/Navy) already use Linux to run our web server (I can't remember the URL). Even though we also use it to track the rounds (bullets to you and me) and weapons (mainly Lee-Enfield .22 riles) on the range, you can hardly call it a 'killer app'.
  • I would think that this would fall in the same category as strong encryption. (Can only be exported to Canada)

    Actually I'm quite surprised that they are willing to release their software to the general public at all. If the US military wants to use Linux and release any software they create for it I say go for it. The more developers the better.

  • Rock (Score:1)

    by Voytek ( 15888 )
    Nt is one of the DII/COE OS's, as are several flavors of 'NIX. HP/UX...

    Full DII/COE Info at:

    http://spider.osfl.disa.mil/cm/general.html
  • I left the AF recently, and IMHO ;) the DII/COE is about the biggest load of crap ever to suck tax-payer dollars...

    Full info is at :
    http://spider.osfl.disa.mil/cm/general.html
  • Isn't part of the definition of Open Source Software (as listed on www.opensource.org) that it can not exclude anyone from using it?
  • His Pteradatyl would have had to have evolved into a Penguin...
  • They have been covering the yorktown crash from just about the start. Very intersting reading.

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