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Microsoft Ubuntu Windows Linux

Microsoft Works To Port Ubuntu To Windows ARM (neowin.net) 107

Billly Gates shares a report: It was this time last year that Microsoft announced that it was bringing Ubuntu to the Windows Store (now the Microsoft Store), along with other Linux distributions. If you check out the app in the Store now though, you'll find that it only works on x64 devices, meaning that you can't run it on any of the new Windows 10 on ARM PCs. That's all about to change though. In a session at Microsoft's Build 2018 developer conference today called Windows 10 on ARM for Developers, the company showed off Ubuntu running on an ARM PC, with the app coming from the Microsoft Store. It will finally support ARM64 PCs, although x86 devices are still out of luck.
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Microsoft Works To Port Ubuntu To Windows ARM

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  • It's *not* Linux! (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward

    It's not "running Linux" by definition, because Linux is only a kernel and it is completely absent. Instead, MS is providing an emulation of the Linux syscall interface enabling unaltered Linux applications to run.

    (That said, this will probably prove to be the simplest way of running "Linux" on an ARM laptop, thanks to the joys of ARM SoC vendors not providing sane drivers..)

    • ... providing an emulation of the Linux syscall interface enabling unaltered Linux applications to run.

      Something FreeBSD has been doing for the better part of 20 years. It's not rocket surgery.

    • It looks like Linux, smells like Linux, tastes like Linux... better not step in it!

      • by DickBreath ( 207180 ) on Friday May 11, 2018 @03:53PM (#56597730) Homepage
        It only looks, smells and tastes like Linux until you find that your app doesn't run on Linux in production because you did your development on "Linux" on Windows.

        Microsoft has an incentive to make this happen in the future so that people in crisis mode will throw up their hands and just switch to Microsoft-Linux, and then maybe get rid of Linux altogether.

        Microsoft tried to do the same with Java. Introduce sweet addictive delicious Microsoft-only APIs into Java, hoping lazy developers wouldn't notice that these APIs are only on Microsoft's Java. This was in directly violation of the black-letter language of the written contract. Sun sued. Won $1.2 Billion. Microsoft abandoned Java and created .NET because the Java story was just too compelling. Here we are today where Java popularity (on various sites like TIOBE) exceeds .NET popularity.

        Too bad nobody will ensure the "purity" of Linux. And who says Embrace, Extend, Extinguish is dead?
        • Not likely, as the whole point of this work is to enable Windows developers to use some of their favorite native Linux-based tools. It would completely ruin the point if they introduced some artificial incompatibility. Remember, Microsoft is also hosting native Linux in Azure, right alongside their own Windows Server OS. This means they have, in fact, every reason to ensure these systems remain as compatible as possible with native Linux.

          Microsoft is not motivated by ideology, but by money. Linux used t

        • by Tenebrousedge ( 1226584 ) <tenebrousedgeNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Friday May 11, 2018 @05:17PM (#56598228)

          Nobody will ensure the "purity" of Linux, because that's what the GPL does. I'm not sure what specific FUD you're trying to imply with the EEE remarks, but the evidence for chicanery is pretty weak, and you're sort of pointing out that they aren't that effective at it.

          And not to defend Microsoft, but .NET is better than Java in most respects, and Java's popularity has been propped up by Android. I'm not sure where .NET is headed, but Kotlin is likely to start cutting into Java on mobile in a big way.

        • Re: (Score:1, Offtopic)

          by macinnisrr ( 1103805 )
          Embrace, extend, extinguish will never go away. It's everyone's mantra from Microsoft, to Apple, and even Google who have been so "pro open source". Check out my essay on how to combat this: https://volocian.com/adopt-adapt-abandon/ [volocian.com]
    • And no one but aspies actually care.

  • by vm ( 127028 ) on Friday May 11, 2018 @02:56PM (#56597338)

    ...and why would you buy an x86 desktop or laptop to run Linux under Windows Subsystem for Linux? If you're talking about low power embedded hardware then that's got to be a VERY niche use case.

    • I have a Windows tablet that has an x64 chip but for whatever reason they put an x86 UEFI BIOS. It won't load an x64 OS despite having the hardware to do so.
      • Why the fuck didn't you return it as defective?

      • I have an ASUS EEEbook X205ta that has the same.
        I'm running 64-bit XUbuntu on it.
        I only needed a 32-bit UEFI loader for grub on it to make it work.
        Unfortunately, the Linux kernel still has trouble with the power saving modes of the Baytrail chipset, but some workarounds have been made.
        Here [archlinux.org] and here [ubuntuforums.org] are links with helpful information.

  • by OrangeTide ( 124937 ) on Friday May 11, 2018 @02:59PM (#56597358) Homepage Journal

    Embrace, extend, and extinguish [wikipedia.org] -- United States v. Microsoft Corp., 2001

    Microsoft's long history makes them untrustworthy. I think we should be very skeptical of relying on any technology out of Redmond, and view it as a potential trap.

    It seems obvious that MS would like every Linux computer to have a copy of Windows installed. And for people to run their favorite Linux application along side Office 365 or whatever. I can't really blame them, it's a reasonable business strategy. But once MS has power over a market they aren't likely to act in their customer's best interests. Ultimately us consumers need to be cautious of what bargains we strike.

    • Embrace, extend, and extinguish [wikipedia.org] -- United States v. Microsoft Corp., 2001

      EEE only works if you dominate a market. Linux dominates on servers and portable devices (Android is Linux). Microsoft has no chance of executing an EEE strategy against Linux. To the contrary, WSL is Microsoft's way of conceding defeat in those markets, and accepting that it has to accommodate Linux on the desktop to avoid slipping even more.

      • by iggymanz ( 596061 ) on Friday May 11, 2018 @03:21PM (#56597506)

        Microsoft dominates the desktop and laptop market

        • by Alok ( 37687 )
          For laptops, its certainly not as much as it used to - for many companies, the laptops issued are Macs or else there is a choice between Mac or Windows. Most desktops are Windows, but some could be Linux also (curiously, I rarely see Mac desktops in offices though MBPs are everywhere).

          The fact there are credible alternatives makes it very hard for EEE to work. Personally I think MS is trying hard to turn over a new leaf post-Ballmer, though there have been some severe missteps like the XBox One DRM saga whe
        • Microsoft dominates the desktop and laptop market

          A market with no Linux marketshare so what's your point?

          • actually it's 3.5 percent, Mac 8.7 percent

            • So like I said, no marketshare.

              • tens millions of machines, you're wrong

                • tens millions of machines, you're wrong

                  10s of millions of machines is effectively zero marketshare in desktop computing.

                  Perspective: You're in desperate need of some. When you get some we can work on your understanding of business strategy.

                  • er no, that was over ten percent in total. that is not insignificant, either as percentage or whole

                    • er no, that was over ten percent in total.

                      Wow. So either you suck at Math or have no idea what the PC market actually looks like.

                      10% Linux Desktop market share.... Oooooh you're just trying a standup routine on me. meh. 2/5 needs work, the joke isn't very funny.

                    • no linux desktop market share was 3%, try to pay attention. the 10% was non-windows, linux+mac.

                    • no linux desktop market share was 3%, try to pay attention. the 10% was non-windows, linux+mac.

                      Your grasp of staying on point and not flipping on numbers is amazing. Have you considered a career in politics? God knows business is nothing for you.

      • by tepples ( 727027 )

        Linux dominates on servers and portable devices (Android is Linux).

        Are laptop computers "portable devices" by your definition? If not, how meaningfully not? Answering that question might help you understand what Microsoft is targeting with Windows on ARM.

    • I'd be concerned by Google. They're the "don't be evil" guys and I'm typing this on a Google branded device but food for thought.

      Almost every consumer Linux device includes Google Play, first on Android and now Chrome OS.

        Chrome OS now running desktop Linux apps in a container. So your choices for a 'Linux' laptop are bare metal, a surface pro WSL or a pixel book.

      • I'd be concerned by Google.

        I think that's a false dilemma as Google doing bad thing and Microsoft doing bad things are not mutually exclusive. Furthermore, I'd recommend being skeptical of the motives of any business. Things can be great as long the business and customers have complementary desires and act in mutual benefit. Things go awry when there is a power imbalance in a relationship, especially if it is possible to act for a short term gain or for an increase in power.

    • by DogDude ( 805747 )
      Microsoft's long history makes them untrustworthy. I think we should be very skeptical of relying on any technology out of Redmond, and view it as a potential trap.

      A "trap"? In what sense? Are you describing a movie, perhaps?
    • Embrace, extend, and extinguish

      Yes it would look like that if you know nothing about EEE, how it works, or the market forces that drove MS to do it in the first place.

      I've said it many times before but I'll give you the summary version here:

      a) To do EEE you need to have market dominance. All MS can do with their current Linux market share is embrace, nothing more.
      b) You want to do EEE to drive out competitors. But why would MS do that? The don't compete with Linux in any market Linux users care about.
      c) To do EEE you need a leadership te

  • MS Works? (Score:3, Funny)

    by idontusenumbers ( 1367883 ) on Friday May 11, 2018 @03:06PM (#56597404)

    Who's using Microsoft Works to port an operating system? It could barely do simple word processing! Maybe one of the bajillion wizards or templates is for porting.

  • Just use linux (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    I realize some of you have not yet switched to linux. I believe that the time is now, the microsoft and apple operating systems are simply unfit for most actual use cases due to spying, corporate shenannigans and general untrustworthyness.

    Linux will not spy on you, has a low overhead, an extremely high uptime, better security, and tends to keep their applications small and useful.

    The benefits stretch far into the horizon beyond the points I have brought up. It really is time to just get rid of the spyware

    • I agree with your sentiment 100%. Very well spoken. Just wanted to point out that OSX isn't based on the Linux kernel (with an 'e', not an 'a'), it's based on FreeBSD.

  • by dhaen ( 892570 )
    And creepy... There must be a carcinogen in the code.
  • What's M$ business model to spent shareholders money on this?

    • by theCoder ( 23772 )

      Microsoft makes money from people running Windows. In license fees for Windows, and in license fees for Windows applications (which are built by developers running Windows). If people are running Ubuntu, they aren't running Windows, and not making money for Microsoft.

      Further, there's "secure" boot to consider. Right now, it is optional. But if users can run Linux applications under Windows, then why do they need to run Linux kernel natively? And if they don't need to run the Linux kernel, then there's

  • So... if they're posting this in the Windows store... and the Microsoft Surface 1, which has been a dead-end device for years, has access to the Microsoft store... *checks Tegra 3 architecture* ...goddamnit.
  • by molarmass192 ( 608071 ) on Friday May 11, 2018 @08:58PM (#56599092) Homepage Journal
    I might actually consider a Windows shell that runs on Ubuntu, but an Ubuntu shell running on Windows, yeah, no thanks. The broken bits are still non-optional.

Machines that have broken down will work perfectly when the repairman arrives.

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