Microsoft Joins the Linux Foundation (techcrunch.com) 202
Microsoft today said it is joining the Linux Foundation as a high-paying Platinum member. Linux Foundation executive director Jim Zemlin said, "This may come as a surprise to you, but they were not big fans," describing the two's previous relationship. From a report on TechCrunch: The new Microsoft under CEO Satya Nadella, however, is singing a very different tune. Today's Microsoft is one of the biggest open source contributors around. Over the course of just the last few years, it has essentially built Canonical's Ubuntu distribution into Windows 10, brought SQL Server to Linux, open-sourced core parts of its .NET platform and partnered with Red Hat, SUSE and others. As Zemlin noted, Microsoft has also contributed to a number of Linux Foundation-managed projects like Node.js, OpenDaylight, the Open Container Initiative, the R Consortium and the Open API Initiative.ArsTechnica has more details.
The mothership is here! (Score:2)
Drink the koolaid and ascend to the mothership!
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Nah, this is just the 'Embrace' phase of EEE that Microsoft is so well known for.
FUCK YOU 2016 (Score:5, Funny)
Note that rapture index - record high 189 - 10 Oct 2016
Satan says "damn Russian hackers hacked my Nest thermostat"
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Nah, this is just the 'Embrace' phase of EEE that Microsoft is so well known for.
The 'Embrace' phase is pretty much the only one they are known for, people said it about Java, they said it about HTML standards, they said it about Linux kernel contributions, they said it about Open Source and now of course they're saying it about the Linux foundation so by all accounts "EEE" means "will become hugely successful".
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People did not say that about html.
Really? That proprietary extensions to HTML weren't an example of what people believed EEE was?
WINE (Score:5, Interesting)
Could they maybe see their way to helping out the WINE project?
Until that happens, I'm not really going to congratulate them.
AC
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That would't make business sense. I think this move is a strategically great move of Microsoft. The operating system wars are always about available features and apps, so when they go into this, they want more of the programs that people use to be available on their operating system. I wouldn't be surprised if at some point the Windows Phone gets a Dalvik engine to run Android apps. When they have re-claimed some of the lost userbase they are probably going to focus on making the Windows Store an essential
Re:WINE (Score:4, Interesting)
That would't make business sense. I think this move is a strategically great move of Microsoft.
The price of operating systems is steadily approaching zero. macOS updates are free and the OS comes with the hardware. ChromeOS is free. Microsoft already provides the license for free for smaller devices [theverge.com]. PC sales are slowing [cnbc.com] and that's what moves OS licenses. People have fewer reasons to upgrade. What Microsoft realized is that hardware and services are the future, not operating system licenses. And to capitalize on that, they need their software to run everywhere. That means Visual Studio for Mac [visualstudio.com] and SQL Server for Linux [techcrunch.com].
So no, I really don't believe helping the WINE project is a bad move for Microsoft at this point. Anything that increases adoption of Microsoft software and services is what matters now.
Re:WINE (Score:4, Interesting)
Why would they do that? They now fully-support a standalone Ubuntu (Linux) installation under Windows as either an integrated part of Windows, or a fully-supported guest OS under their hypervisor, either running on current desktop or server installations or as a guest on their free Windows Server 2016 Hyper-V Server offering.
So until Microsoft assists a competitor to take market share from them you won't support them - is there ANY other company you can think of that gives up market share to help a competitor?
Re:WINE (Score:5, Funny)
is there ANY other company you can think of that gives up market share to help a competitor?
And I suppose you have some other explanation for Windows 8 and 10?
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is there ANY other company you can think of that gives up market share to help a competitor?
"They now fully-support a standalone Ubuntu (Linux) installation under Windows as either an integrated part of Windows, or a fully-supported guest OS under their hypervisor,"
So... Canonical, then?
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Why would they do that because they are trying to force Windows ANAL PROBE 10 on every one and they are coming off as lame arse perverts and nobody wants their consumer products any more, so empty fucking marketing. M$ is being the consumer market touch of death , just ewww. Perhaps they can sell more smart phones if they shape them like round long and not to wide and increased vibration levels. Nobody likes fucking perves http://onlineslangdictionary.c... [onlineslan...ionary.com] and that is exactly who M$ have become. So take the
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Re:WINE (Score:5, Interesting)
Do you even think Microsoft is even able to help? By example, the current situation with SMB is, when Microsoft needs to know something particularly subtle about SMB, they go ask the Samba guys. See, Microsoft never cares much about clean and transparent design, or keeping accurate historical records. Whatever they happen to cobble together by RC date is the definition of the "standard". If undocumented or partially documented APIs shifted a little, so what? You can see how this design culture might create issues with trying to run random Windows binaries from any point in that 20 year reign of chaos. To sort all that out requires real dedication to the art of fecal archaeology. Not something you're going to find a lot of in Microsoft's backbiting engineering culture, and if it does exist, it will be managed out soon.
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I think you misunderstand the "Linux Foundation". Judging from their past actions that's not a group that supports Linux as much as a group that supports businesses that are somehow involved with Linux. It's not exactly a false name, but it's certainly a misleading one...and probably on purpose.
Re:WINE (Score:5, Informative)
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I have an MS Windows 7 user who log onto a linux box via X-Windows (Xwin32) to run an old version ofAutoCAD via WINE. The old version will not start on anything newer than MS Windows XP. He doesn't like the newer interface, so that looks like a trivial reason, but there is plenty of legacy software out there that currently needs a virtual machine to run but could run with much more effectively just the righ
One phrase (Score:1)
Systemd dotnet, with an integrated personal digital assistant
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Clippy
Cortana
This makes sense (Score:5, Insightful)
I keep saying it, MS wants out of the OS business. They want to build 'cloud' and charge you by the minute. Developing server/desktop OS is not the business they want to be in.
Re:This makes sense (Score:4, Insightful)
Kind of. They just don't think it will remain profitable in the long term. And they really don't want to end up like oracle, which just sits on its IP and racks in as much profit it can.
Re:This makes sense (Score:5, Insightful)
They want to build 'cloud' and charge you by the minute.
I have several friends at Microsoft who say the motto of the company is cloud cloud cloud. I've also spoken to people in the finance industry (e.g., big banks) who are much more receptive to putting their products on Microsoft rather than Google or AWS. Microsoft has a good shot here to take the market. They'll need a solid handle on linux servers to do that.
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I have several friends at Microsoft who say the motto of the company is cloud cloud cloud. I've also spoken to people in the finance industry (e.g., big banks) who are much more receptive to putting their products on Microsoft rather than Google or AWS.
Only a big bank with locked in income streams could survive that. For any competitive player, it would be certain death. No shortage of examples to illustrate. There were at one time a few high volume financial transaction platforms running on Windows. After a string of embarrassing and costly failures, they're gone.
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What part of "Microsoft has permanently burned their reputation with big banks to a crip" is tough for you to parse?
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What part of "Microsoft has permanently burned their reputation with big banks to a crip" is tough for you to parse?
These big banks still rely heavily on Microsoft for office productivity (Windows, Office, Exchange Server). They have relationships that go back decades. Sure, maybe the traditional MS server stack did not pan out, but I don't think they've totally "burned their reputation." AWS and Google are starting from scratch with these companies, MS already has their foot in the door.
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Sure, maybe the traditional MS server stack did not pan out, but I don't think they've totally "burned their reputation."
Toasted it. Fried it. Up in smoke. That parrot is dead... burned to a crisp, whatever you think.
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Last I checked, Microsoft is also spending in excess of a billion dollars per quarter on capital expenditures. Think about that for a second: What kind of software company spends that much on capex? No kind, that's who. But a cloud company that's building out data centers to compete with AWS just might.
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Caution, but optimism (Score:5, Interesting)
Theres good reason to be cautious, Microsoft doesnt exactly have a spotless record of playing nice with FOSS, but recent behavior , that is microsoft realising it can still make silly money selling Azure and various microsoft software packages to the linux world means that so far its been a pretty good citizen.
Now, I wonder if they'll eventually give us Office for linux. That'd make a LOT of suits happy.
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Every now and then when MS Windows does something utterly stupid I wonder what would happen if MS had built on that instead of a cut down CP/M clone and a gutted pale shadow of VMS.
Re:Caution, but optimism (Score:4, Insightful)
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True.
See RedHat and systemD for an example.
RedHat funds so much work connected to it that it is far too much work for anyone trying to do something that competes with it.
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Not really. Unless they figure out a way to own https://github.com/torvalds/linux [github.com], or to convert most people and companies to using Microsoft's fork of Linux (the existence of which is still just speculation on your part), then it will remain as it is.
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I'm sensing a pattern here (Score:1)
Anyone reminded of IBM?
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Step 1 (Score:5, Insightful)
Embrace [wikipedia.org]
Re: Step 1 (Score:4, Insightful)
Years ago, this headline would be published on April 1st, and we would have had a good laugh. The times, they have a-changed.
Re: Step 1 (Score:4, Interesting)
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Embrace [wikipedia.org]
Do you honestly think Nadella or the current Microsoft management have the strategic vision, forethought or intelligence to pull off the embrace extend extinguish plan?
This isn't EEE, this is just MS not having a clue anymore.
LF charter should ban maker of competing OSs (Score:2, Insightful)
Microsoft never opened sourced the parts of .NET that would help most end users like WPF. Much of Microsofts open sourcing is of things that are already open source in the Linux ecosystem, and would not result in damage Microsofts products. Linux is dominate on servers, so Microsoft open sources server code, but does not open source desktop code where Microsoft is still dominate. The Ubuntu Windows thing is designed to hurt Linux by giving people a reason to not run Linux, instead allowing them to avoid Lin
Re:LF charter should ban maker of competing OSs (Score:5, Insightful)
You understand Ubuntu GIVES AWAY their operating system, and by Microsoft including Ubuntu inside Windows desktop environments, it allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu without having to wipe their disk, re-partition it, install a hypervisor (parallels, VM Ware, VirtualBox, etc.) - an obvious good thing for the Ubuntu ecosystem. It also, in the eyes of millions of users validates Linux as a usable operating system.
Running Windows applications under Linux has been done, it's called WINE, and it's kludgy and not very intuitive for casual computer users.
So let's see, aside from Microsoft, that would also prevent Oracle (they sell Solaris, a Linux competitor), IBM (they sell AIX, a competitor to Linux), and many other large corporations from donating to the Linux Foundation - how exactly does preventing large donors from donating "help" the Linux Foundation?
Re: LF charter should ban maker of competing OSs (Score:2)
"by Microsoft including Ubuntu inside Windows desktop environments, it allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu without having to wipe their disk, re-partition it, install a hypervisor (parallels, VM Ware, VirtualBox, etc.)"
Doesn't Windows 10 include HyperV? It should have been easier to ship HyperV enabled by default on capable hardware, and it would have been trivial to include a VM template.
"
- an obvious good thing for the Ubuntu ecosystem. It also, in the eyes of millions of users validat
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and by Microsoft including Ubuntu inside Windows desktop environments,
It allows Microsoft to control the Ubuntu "experience" and blame Ubuntu for any user dissatisfaction when it is really a Windows container problem. "Look, see, you can run Ubuntu and doesn't Windows actually run much better and faster?"
it allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu without having to wipe their disk, re-partition it, install a hypervisor
Hundreds of millions of users can already run Ubuntu without having to do any of that. I have two USB sticks with Xubuntu on them that boot just fine on my Windows computers, and that's a 16.4 version, I think. Making that stick was absolutely trivial -- I used a bootable Xub
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It doesn't. But preventing large donors who have a vested interest in the failure of Linux as FOSS does.
So let's look at the other platinum donors.
- Oracle has a vested interest in the failure of Linux since it owns Solaris. It has also arguably been actively trying to damage Red Hat by forking its distro.
- Intel has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it has a very close economic partnership with Microsoft.
- HPE has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells hardware that runs Windows and HP/UX.
- IBM has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells mainframes and s
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- Oracle has a vested interest in the failure of Linux since it owns Solaris.
It also owns MySQL, as I recall, which runs great on Linux servers. Solaris is (was) a great OS, but hardly a major player in the desktop like Windows.
- Intel has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it has a very close economic partnership with Microsoft.
Intel doesn't give a crap which OS you run on their CPUs just as long as you aren't using an AMD or ARM CPU to do it.
- HPE has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells hardware that runs Windows and HP/UX.
Ditto HPE. HP/UX is a niche compared to Windows, and HP doesn't care if you're running Windows or Linux as long as you're doing it on HP hardware.
- IBM has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells mainframes and servers running AIX. ... and so on.
Ditto IBM.
Or maybe these companies are all platinum members of the Linux Foundation because they see Linux both as a massive market opportunity in its own right and also an enabler of new product development.
Microsoft doesn't do hardware (as a primary function), they do operating system software
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Oracle and IBM do a ton more business with Linux than they do with their own OSes which they've long since effectively given up on.
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Yes of course. Everyone should have to run their OS off a USB stick.
Oh, knock it off. I didn't say that. The original statement was that it "allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu" (emphasis mine). A USB 3 memory stick has plenty of performance to allow users to try Ubuntu without needing a Windows platform under it, or letting Microsoft control the Ubuntu "experience".
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Good thing the Linux foundation has roughly zero to do with stewardship of Linux development, other than paying Linus's salary, which he doesn't really need.
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The Ubuntu Windows thing is designed to hurt Linux by giving people a reason to not run Linux, instead allowing them to avoid Linux and run Linux apps on Windows, this will weaken the Linux user base and the Linux kernel.
The kernel is supported by everything from Android to supercomputers and it really wouldn't matter if desktop share fell to 0%. Many if not most of the major open source apps like Firefox, LibreOffice, GIMP etc. already run on Windows, there are no Linux-only "killer apps" to sell out. Think of it as a LiveCD with less effort, just try it... you can try out how much of your needs it covers and I think Ubuntu can only gain by Windows users getting a taste. Those who feel it actually works 100% for them won't
Hot Damn! (Score:1)
good to know (Score:2)
Where's that guy who's sig predicted that Windows would one day be a Linux distro?
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It's not my sig, but I've been saying for some time now that Microsoft will eventually debut a version of Linux (mostly to infect the market).
Then we'll see MS Office on Linux (but it'll only able to run properly on "MS Linux") as well as other stuff integrated into it...the same way cancer 'integrates' into your body.
It makes perfect sense: FOSS people do all the heavy lifting for decades to create a better, more secure OS than Windows, then Microsoft swoops in, co-opts it, and makes tons of money off of i
perspective (Score:5, Funny)
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This year: - Trump became president elect - The cubs win the world series...playing the INDIANS no less! - Apple stops having growth - Microsoft joins the Linux foundation
And don't forget that Google just joined Microsoft's .NET Foundation...
Please Lord, if you're listening, TAKE ME NOW.
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This year:
- Trump became president elect
- The cubs win the world series...playing the INDIANS no less!
- Apple stops having growth
- Microsoft joins the Linux foundation
If we have too many more things happen my head will explode and melt away. What's next? The discovery of real Unicorns?
...my flying car?
(personal jetpacks seem more likely: http://jetpackaviation.com/ [jetpackaviation.com])
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Here is your unicorn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
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2016 really has been one of the best years on record, hasn't it?
Only if by "best" you mean "worst", then yes, it's been one of the 'best' years on record.
systemd (Score:2)
Makes perfect sense - it's their next phase (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft is completely done selling operating systems and software the way they were previously. Everything they're doing is 100% dedicated to getting people over to Azure, spending money by the hour forever rather than getting a one-time license payment. The company I work for is building a huge new project in Azure and it's amazing how much money Microsoft makes just by keeping data centers running on their services from failing...the bills are thousands per month and we're a tiny customer.
If they can make that much money just keeping the power and Internet flowing, why not outsource the development of operating systems to Linux? In that case joining the Linux Foundation makes sense. Windows Server 2016 is probably going to be the last "boxed" release of server software from them -- the push is to move workloads to Azure Service Fabric and rebuild everything as microservices anyway. All of their products are moving to the "Azure first" development model -- release everything to Azure first, then box it up as of a certain date and ship it to customers who want to pay for on-site licenses.
In about 10 or 15 years, Microsoft will be where IBM is now -- they will have an assured stream of perpetual revenue coming from customers who aren't locked into a particular OS, but are locked into them as a service provider. (True, you can switch cloud providers, but did I mention they're making it insanely easy for Microsoft customers to migrate in from the on-premises world?)
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Also, in about 15 or 20 years, it might make sense for them to rely on the Linux kernel for the next windows version, rather than having to throw resources at developing and maintaining their own separate old windows kernel ... we'll see
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Windows Server is still profitable. But there are plenty of Linux users out there, it's a huge market. It would be stupid for Microsoft to not cater to it on Azure. Furthermore, even the existing Windows customers need some Linux these days, and if you can't offer a package that can do both, they'll go to someone who can.
And that's how Linux died (Score:5, Insightful)
Step 1: Join
Step 2: Destroy from within
Seriously, does no one in the Linux organization see any problem with this? Microsoft pays money (peanuts to them) and can now influence Linux? Microsoft is capable of every dirty trick in the book. They have a habit of betraying "business partners", even I.B.M. They are the people who, through a Windows "security update" modified the eeprom on my notebook's NIC so that it wouldn't work in Linux and put code in Windows so that they could reinitialize it properly. When you make a deal with the devil you're not bringing him closer to your point of view, you can only expect to sink to his level.
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Step 1: Join
Step 2: Eeer what were we doing again?
No many people don't see a problem with the strategy, not because MS is inherently less evil than in the past but they are just that much more directionless and lacking of any vision.
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Hey, they were mean to me in the 80s, too. And in the 2000s they were especially mean to Linux, going as far as funding the SCO lawsuits.
Chilly (Score:2)
In other news (Score:2)
"Microsoft today said it is joining the Linux Foundation as a high-paying Platinum member
In other news, cancer said today that it's joining your body as a parasitic member to your lifespan.
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Grow up...
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Grow up...
No.
If hell freezes over (Score:2)
...will it help with the global warming?
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The amount of energy used to refrigerate hell will be enormous and will accelerate global warming.
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Tinfoil hat time? Tinfoil hat time!
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Naturally. They feel right at home with systemd. (Score:2)
Of course they joined. Since systemd Linux is pratically part of the family. ...
FLAMEWAR in 3 .. 2 .. 1 ..
Supposing they want to embrace... (Score:2)
What evil could they do inside there? The real evil should be inside the kernel development community, and nobody is screaming against MS submitted patches.
Platinum no less (Score:2)
MS is trying to do to linux what (Score:2)
Trump did to the republicans and democrats.
Goodbye Linux foundation (Score:2)
Nice knowing ya.
Still waiting... (Score:2)
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At least make the browser multi-platform, or failing that have it use webkit/blink.
It's like I'm taking crazy pills! (Score:2)
Remember the days of Bill Gates as a Borg on every Microsoft story here? Remember the days of MS being written as "M$"? Remember the days of every geek worth their salt on Slashdot loathed Microsoft? My my, times have changed. I for one, welcome it.
Embrace and Extend (Score:2)
Typical Microsoft.... They will embrace Linux then extend it with their own proprietary cr@pola like they have done with everything else.
How About Netflix ? (Score:2)
This is otherwise known as... (Score:2)
This is otherwise known as "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer".
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Yep, the year of the Linux desktop is near - the last year. Muahahahaha...
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Yep:
1) Add incompatible extensions.
2) Don't document the standard ways of doing things, just their way.
3) Noobs who don't know any better write a lot of code that only works on Microsoft Ubuntu.
4) Companies that think they're using a common standard end up as chained to Microsoft's Linux as they were to Microsoft's web browser IE6.
At step 1 they can also rely on their typical bugs to introduce incompatibilities. It's amazing how they've always been able to weaponize their incompetence.
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I predicted something like this 10+ years ago in a /. post.
Re:Welp (Score:4, Interesting)
I doubt they'll ever open source their core product like Office, but if open sourcing their tools or contributing to open source projects makes it easier for people to use Microsoft services, that's money for Microsoft that isn't going to someone else.
They'll never be as open source friendly as some would like, but at least they're a lot less hostile. Since they got rid of Ballmer who was the obstinate type that kept trying pound square pegs into circle holes, they've been a lot more willing to accept that not every single part of a solution needs to be something from Microsoft.
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The secure boot spec is revised as computer manufacturers want to be able to remove the option - as it reduces support costs.
You don't have to like it (I sure don't) but not understanding an issue before complaining is foolish...
Re:This does not look like a good thing. (Score:5, Insightful)
Call me paranoid, but I'd NEVER allow ANY MS software on any Linux machine *I* control. Just like using Windows 10, you can't audit who/what the OS is talking to, and what its sending to the "mothership".. In the case of MS porting Office to Linux, I would have the same concerns. For all we know, they'd put the "spyware" aspects of Windows 10 into Office for Linux so they could collect everything from Linux users also. To put it bluntly, I trust MS as far as I can throw them, which, being 66 years old, isn't *very* far.. I used/supported MS products for close to 20 years as a sysadmin, but decided I was done when I retired in 2010. Now its 100% Linux on my personal systems..
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Call me paranoid, but I'd NEVER allow ANY MS software on any Linux machine *I* control. Just like using Windows 10, you can't audit who/what the OS is talking to, and what its sending to the "mothership"
No, but I'd be much less concerned about an app... you can run it with any kind of restricted user or SELinux policy, firewall it, run all sorts of process and network monitoring and so on... sure you can't control the code but you can isolate the potential harm pretty well. You can't do much about Windows 10 though, it 0wns you.
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Sounds like a vast right-wing conspiracy to me.