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Microsoft Linux

Microsoft Joins the Linux Foundation (techcrunch.com) 202

Microsoft today said it is joining the Linux Foundation as a high-paying Platinum member. Linux Foundation executive director Jim Zemlin said, "This may come as a surprise to you, but they were not big fans," describing the two's previous relationship. From a report on TechCrunch: The new Microsoft under CEO Satya Nadella, however, is singing a very different tune. Today's Microsoft is one of the biggest open source contributors around. Over the course of just the last few years, it has essentially built Canonical's Ubuntu distribution into Windows 10, brought SQL Server to Linux, open-sourced core parts of its .NET platform and partnered with Red Hat, SUSE and others. As Zemlin noted, Microsoft has also contributed to a number of Linux Foundation-managed projects like Node.js, OpenDaylight, the Open Container Initiative, the R Consortium and the Open API Initiative.ArsTechnica has more details.
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Microsoft Joins the Linux Foundation

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  • Drink the koolaid and ascend to the mothership!

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Nah, this is just the 'Embrace' phase of EEE that Microsoft is so well known for.

      • by Thud457 ( 234763 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:39PM (#53296879) Homepage Journal
        YASOTET - Yet Another Sign Of the End Times [raptureready.com]
        Note that rapture index - record high 189 - 10 Oct 2016

        Satan says "damn Russian hackers hacked my Nest thermostat"
      • Nah, this is just the 'Embrace' phase of EEE that Microsoft is so well known for.

        The 'Embrace' phase is pretty much the only one they are known for, people said it about Java, they said it about HTML standards, they said it about Linux kernel contributions, they said it about Open Source and now of course they're saying it about the Linux foundation so by all accounts "EEE" means "will become hugely successful".

  • WINE (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:03PM (#53296567)

    Could they maybe see their way to helping out the WINE project?

    Until that happens, I'm not really going to congratulate them.

    AC

    • by Anonymous Coward

      That would't make business sense. I think this move is a strategically great move of Microsoft. The operating system wars are always about available features and apps, so when they go into this, they want more of the programs that people use to be available on their operating system. I wouldn't be surprised if at some point the Windows Phone gets a Dalvik engine to run Android apps. When they have re-claimed some of the lost userbase they are probably going to focus on making the Windows Store an essential

      • Re:WINE (Score:4, Interesting)

        by jon3k ( 691256 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:21PM (#53301795)

        That would't make business sense. I think this move is a strategically great move of Microsoft.

        The price of operating systems is steadily approaching zero. macOS updates are free and the OS comes with the hardware. ChromeOS is free. Microsoft already provides the license for free for smaller devices [theverge.com]. PC sales are slowing [cnbc.com] and that's what moves OS licenses. People have fewer reasons to upgrade. What Microsoft realized is that hardware and services are the future, not operating system licenses. And to capitalize on that, they need their software to run everywhere. That means Visual Studio for Mac [visualstudio.com] and SQL Server for Linux [techcrunch.com].

        So no, I really don't believe helping the WINE project is a bad move for Microsoft at this point. Anything that increases adoption of Microsoft software and services is what matters now.

    • Re:WINE (Score:4, Interesting)

      by kenh ( 9056 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:21PM (#53296749) Homepage Journal

      Could they maybe see their way to helping out the WINE project?

      Why would they do that? They now fully-support a standalone Ubuntu (Linux) installation under Windows as either an integrated part of Windows, or a fully-supported guest OS under their hypervisor, either running on current desktop or server installations or as a guest on their free Windows Server 2016 Hyper-V Server offering.

      Until that happens, I'm not really going to congratulate them.

      So until Microsoft assists a competitor to take market share from them you won't support them - is there ANY other company you can think of that gives up market share to help a competitor?

      • Re:WINE (Score:5, Funny)

        by myrdos2 ( 989497 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @06:21PM (#53300491)

        is there ANY other company you can think of that gives up market share to help a competitor?

        And I suppose you have some other explanation for Windows 8 and 10?

      • by MSG ( 12810 )

        is there ANY other company you can think of that gives up market share to help a competitor?

        "They now fully-support a standalone Ubuntu (Linux) installation under Windows as either an integrated part of Windows, or a fully-supported guest OS under their hypervisor,"

        So... Canonical, then?

      • by rtb61 ( 674572 )

        Why would they do that because they are trying to force Windows ANAL PROBE 10 on every one and they are coming off as lame arse perverts and nobody wants their consumer products any more, so empty fucking marketing. M$ is being the consumer market touch of death , just ewww. Perhaps they can sell more smart phones if they shape them like round long and not to wide and increased vibration levels. Nobody likes fucking perves http://onlineslangdictionary.c... [onlineslan...ionary.com] and that is exactly who M$ have become. So take the

        • by rtb61 ( 674572 )
          PS The Linux Foundation should incorporate in their bylaws the requirement that members must respect the privacy of end users, otherwise that money is to tainted to be of use.
    • Re:WINE (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Tough Love ( 215404 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @03:36PM (#53298789)

      Do you even think Microsoft is even able to help? By example, the current situation with SMB is, when Microsoft needs to know something particularly subtle about SMB, they go ask the Samba guys. See, Microsoft never cares much about clean and transparent design, or keeping accurate historical records. Whatever they happen to cobble together by RC date is the definition of the "standard". If undocumented or partially documented APIs shifted a little, so what? You can see how this design culture might create issues with trying to run random Windows binaries from any point in that 20 year reign of chaos. To sort all that out requires real dedication to the art of fecal archaeology. Not something you're going to find a lot of in Microsoft's backbiting engineering culture, and if it does exist, it will be managed out soon.

    • by HiThere ( 15173 )

      I think you misunderstand the "Linux Foundation". Judging from their past actions that's not a group that supports Linux as much as a group that supports businesses that are somehow involved with Linux. It's not exactly a false name, but it's certainly a misleading one...and probably on purpose.

      • Re:WINE (Score:5, Informative)

        by TheRaven64 ( 641858 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @04:12PM (#53299121) Journal
        It's a group that controls access to people who are able to push code into the mainline kernel. If you don't pay your dues, then your patches probably won't be reviewed / upstreamed, and no one will take any care to avoid making KPI / KBI changes that completely break your work.
    • by dbIII ( 701233 )
      That would actually be of benefit since WINE on MS Windows would solve a few compatibility problems.
      I have an MS Windows 7 user who log onto a linux box via X-Windows (Xwin32) to run an old version ofAutoCAD via WINE. The old version will not start on anything newer than MS Windows XP. He doesn't like the newer interface, so that looks like a trivial reason, but there is plenty of legacy software out there that currently needs a virtual machine to run but could run with much more effectively just the righ
  • by Anonymous Coward

    Systemd dotnet, with an integrated personal digital assistant

  • This makes sense (Score:5, Insightful)

    by FictionPimp ( 712802 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:06PM (#53296599) Homepage

    I keep saying it, MS wants out of the OS business. They want to build 'cloud' and charge you by the minute. Developing server/desktop OS is not the business they want to be in.

    • by subanark ( 937286 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:17PM (#53296703)

      Kind of. They just don't think it will remain profitable in the long term. And they really don't want to end up like oracle, which just sits on its IP and racks in as much profit it can.

    • by speedplane ( 552872 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @02:25PM (#53297905) Homepage

      They want to build 'cloud' and charge you by the minute.

      I have several friends at Microsoft who say the motto of the company is cloud cloud cloud. I've also spoken to people in the finance industry (e.g., big banks) who are much more receptive to putting their products on Microsoft rather than Google or AWS. Microsoft has a good shot here to take the market. They'll need a solid handle on linux servers to do that.

      • I have several friends at Microsoft who say the motto of the company is cloud cloud cloud. I've also spoken to people in the finance industry (e.g., big banks) who are much more receptive to putting their products on Microsoft rather than Google or AWS.

        Only a big bank with locked in income streams could survive that. For any competitive player, it would be certain death. No shortage of examples to illustrate. There were at one time a few high volume financial transaction platforms running on Windows. After a string of embarrassing and costly failures, they're gone.

      • by PCM2 ( 4486 )

        Last I checked, Microsoft is also spending in excess of a billion dollars per quarter on capital expenditures. Think about that for a second: What kind of software company spends that much on capex? No kind, that's who. But a cloud company that's building out data centers to compete with AWS just might.

  • by sg_oneill ( 159032 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:10PM (#53296631)

    Theres good reason to be cautious, Microsoft doesnt exactly have a spotless record of playing nice with FOSS, but recent behavior , that is microsoft realising it can still make silly money selling Azure and various microsoft software packages to the linux world means that so far its been a pretty good citizen.

    Now, I wonder if they'll eventually give us Office for linux. That'd make a LOT of suits happy.

    • I think they want to own Linux outright, and this is one more step in that plan. I also think they want to be the ONLY OS in the free world, and this is one step in that plan. Once the eliminate Linux as a competitor, they'll target Apple.
      • by dbIII ( 701233 )
        The massive missed opportunity was that Xenix, owned by Microsoft was actually a very decent unix implementation on cheap PCs and had far more of a chance to take the world by storm than something put together in spare time by a Scandinavian student. The thing with chances is that if you don't take them nothing happens.
        Every now and then when MS Windows does something utterly stupid I wonder what would happen if MS had built on that instead of a cut down CP/M clone and a gutted pale shadow of VMS.
  • by Anonymous Coward

    Anyone reminded of IBM?

  • 1. This is the embrace phase. begin screaming into your keyboards now.
    2. Newly deceased members of Hell will find new ice-skates and ski shoes waiting for them.
  • Step 1 (Score:5, Insightful)

    by fahrbot-bot ( 874524 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:14PM (#53296677)

    Embrace [wikipedia.org]

  • Microsoft never opened sourced the parts of .NET that would help most end users like WPF. Much of Microsofts open sourcing is of things that are already open source in the Linux ecosystem, and would not result in damage Microsofts products. Linux is dominate on servers, so Microsoft open sources server code, but does not open source desktop code where Microsoft is still dominate. The Ubuntu Windows thing is designed to hurt Linux by giving people a reason to not run Linux, instead allowing them to avoid Lin

    • by kenh ( 9056 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:32PM (#53296827) Homepage Journal

      If Ubuntu were really competent they would have done the reverse which is to have Windows apps run on Linux which would have been an advantage for Ubuntu.

      You understand Ubuntu GIVES AWAY their operating system, and by Microsoft including Ubuntu inside Windows desktop environments, it allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu without having to wipe their disk, re-partition it, install a hypervisor (parallels, VM Ware, VirtualBox, etc.) - an obvious good thing for the Ubuntu ecosystem. It also, in the eyes of millions of users validates Linux as a usable operating system.

      Running Windows applications under Linux has been done, it's called WINE, and it's kludgy and not very intuitive for casual computer users.

      The Linux foundation charter should be amended to ban companies like MS who sell competing OSs.

      So let's see, aside from Microsoft, that would also prevent Oracle (they sell Solaris, a Linux competitor), IBM (they sell AIX, a competitor to Linux), and many other large corporations from donating to the Linux Foundation - how exactly does preventing large donors from donating "help" the Linux Foundation?

      • "by Microsoft including Ubuntu inside Windows desktop environments, it allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu without having to wipe their disk, re-partition it, install a hypervisor (parallels, VM Ware, VirtualBox, etc.)"

        Doesn't Windows 10 include HyperV? It should have been easier to ship HyperV enabled by default on capable hardware, and it would have been trivial to include a VM template.

        "
        - an obvious good thing for the Ubuntu ecosystem. It also, in the eyes of millions of users validat

      • and by Microsoft including Ubuntu inside Windows desktop environments,

        It allows Microsoft to control the Ubuntu "experience" and blame Ubuntu for any user dissatisfaction when it is really a Windows container problem. "Look, see, you can run Ubuntu and doesn't Windows actually run much better and faster?"

        it allows hundreds of millions of users try Ubuntu without having to wipe their disk, re-partition it, install a hypervisor

        Hundreds of millions of users can already run Ubuntu without having to do any of that. I have two USB sticks with Xubuntu on them that boot just fine on my Windows computers, and that's a 16.4 version, I think. Making that stick was absolutely trivial -- I used a bootable Xub

        • by PCM2 ( 4486 )

          It doesn't. But preventing large donors who have a vested interest in the failure of Linux as FOSS does.

          So let's look at the other platinum donors.

          - Oracle has a vested interest in the failure of Linux since it owns Solaris. It has also arguably been actively trying to damage Red Hat by forking its distro.
          - Intel has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it has a very close economic partnership with Microsoft.
          - HPE has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells hardware that runs Windows and HP/UX.
          - IBM has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells mainframes and s

          • - Oracle has a vested interest in the failure of Linux since it owns Solaris.

            It also owns MySQL, as I recall, which runs great on Linux servers. Solaris is (was) a great OS, but hardly a major player in the desktop like Windows.

            - Intel has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it has a very close economic partnership with Microsoft.

            Intel doesn't give a crap which OS you run on their CPUs just as long as you aren't using an AMD or ARM CPU to do it.

            - HPE has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells hardware that runs Windows and HP/UX.

            Ditto HPE. HP/UX is a niche compared to Windows, and HP doesn't care if you're running Windows or Linux as long as you're doing it on HP hardware.

            - IBM has a vested interest in the failure of Linux because it sells mainframes and servers running AIX. ... and so on.

            Ditto IBM.

            Or maybe these companies are all platinum members of the Linux Foundation because they see Linux both as a massive market opportunity in its own right and also an enabler of new product development.

            Microsoft doesn't do hardware (as a primary function), they do operating system software

          • Oracle and IBM do a ton more business with Linux than they do with their own OSes which they've long since effectively given up on.

    • Good thing the Linux foundation has roughly zero to do with stewardship of Linux development, other than paying Linus's salary, which he doesn't really need.

    • by Kjella ( 173770 )

      The Ubuntu Windows thing is designed to hurt Linux by giving people a reason to not run Linux, instead allowing them to avoid Linux and run Linux apps on Windows, this will weaken the Linux user base and the Linux kernel.

      The kernel is supported by everything from Android to supercomputers and it really wouldn't matter if desktop share fell to 0%. Many if not most of the major open source apps like Firefox, LibreOffice, GIMP etc. already run on Windows, there are no Linux-only "killer apps" to sell out. Think of it as a LiveCD with less effort, just try it... you can try out how much of your needs it covers and I think Ubuntu can only gain by Windows users getting a taste. Those who feel it actually works 100% for them won't

  • by Anonymous Coward
    Devil here. Just wanted to confirm that, yes, it's cold enough to freeze the balls off a brass monkey.
  • Where's that guy who's sig predicted that Windows would one day be a Linux distro?

    • It's not my sig, but I've been saying for some time now that Microsoft will eventually debut a version of Linux (mostly to infect the market).

      Then we'll see MS Office on Linux (but it'll only able to run properly on "MS Linux") as well as other stuff integrated into it...the same way cancer 'integrates' into your body.

      It makes perfect sense: FOSS people do all the heavy lifting for decades to create a better, more secure OS than Windows, then Microsoft swoops in, co-opts it, and makes tons of money off of i

  • perspective (Score:5, Funny)

    by Danathar ( 267989 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:18PM (#53296725) Journal
    This year: - Trump became president elect - The cubs win the world series...playing the INDIANS no less! - Apple stops having growth - Microsoft joins the Linux foundation If we have too many more things happen my head will explode and melt away. What's next? The discovery of real Unicorns?
    • This year: - Trump became president elect - The cubs win the world series...playing the INDIANS no less! - Apple stops having growth - Microsoft joins the Linux foundation

      And don't forget that Google just joined Microsoft's .NET Foundation...

      Please Lord, if you're listening, TAKE ME NOW.

    • This year:

      - Trump became president elect
      - The cubs win the world series...playing the INDIANS no less!
      - Apple stops having growth
      - Microsoft joins the Linux foundation

      If we have too many more things happen my head will explode and melt away. What's next? The discovery of real Unicorns?

      ...my flying car?
      (personal jetpacks seem more likely: http://jetpackaviation.com/ [jetpackaviation.com])

    • by devent ( 1627873 )

      Here is your unicorn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

  • *NOW* the adoption of systemd makes sense!
  • by ErichTheRed ( 39327 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:37PM (#53296865)

    Microsoft is completely done selling operating systems and software the way they were previously. Everything they're doing is 100% dedicated to getting people over to Azure, spending money by the hour forever rather than getting a one-time license payment. The company I work for is building a huge new project in Azure and it's amazing how much money Microsoft makes just by keeping data centers running on their services from failing...the bills are thousands per month and we're a tiny customer.

    If they can make that much money just keeping the power and Internet flowing, why not outsource the development of operating systems to Linux? In that case joining the Linux Foundation makes sense. Windows Server 2016 is probably going to be the last "boxed" release of server software from them -- the push is to move workloads to Azure Service Fabric and rebuild everything as microservices anyway. All of their products are moving to the "Azure first" development model -- release everything to Azure first, then box it up as of a certain date and ship it to customers who want to pay for on-site licenses.

    In about 10 or 15 years, Microsoft will be where IBM is now -- they will have an assured stream of perpetual revenue coming from customers who aren't locked into a particular OS, but are locked into them as a service provider. (True, you can switch cloud providers, but did I mention they're making it insanely easy for Microsoft customers to migrate in from the on-premises world?)

    • by giampy ( 592646 )

      Also, in about 15 or 20 years, it might make sense for them to rely on the Linux kernel for the next windows version, rather than having to throw resources at developing and maintaining their own separate old windows kernel ... we'll see

    • Windows Server is still profitable. But there are plenty of Linux users out there, it's a huge market. It would be stupid for Microsoft to not cater to it on Azure. Furthermore, even the existing Windows customers need some Linux these days, and if you can't offer a package that can do both, they'll go to someone who can.

  • by frovingslosh ( 582462 ) on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @12:41PM (#53296897)

    Step 1: Join

    Step 2: Destroy from within

    Seriously, does no one in the Linux organization see any problem with this? Microsoft pays money (peanuts to them) and can now influence Linux? Microsoft is capable of every dirty trick in the book. They have a habit of betraying "business partners", even I.B.M. They are the people who, through a Windows "security update" modified the eeprom on my notebook's NIC so that it wouldn't work in Linux and put code in Windows so that they could reinitialize it properly. When you make a deal with the devil you're not bringing him closer to your point of view, you can only expect to sink to his level.

    • Step 1: Join
      Step 2: Eeer what were we doing again?

      No many people don't see a problem with the strategy, not because MS is inherently less evil than in the past but they are just that much more directionless and lacking of any vision.

  • OK, so that is why it is so cold here in the UAE now, only 24 Celsius - someone must have left the door to hell open.
  • "Microsoft today said it is joining the Linux Foundation as a high-paying Platinum member

    In other news, cancer said today that it's joining your body as a parasitic member to your lifespan.

  • ...will it help with the global warming?

  • They're not really being open source, I mean in spirit I don't believe so.

    What it is, is the crap they're pulling on windows is pissing off a lot of people. People are getting sick of it, and it's showing as anyone more technically inclined if they are able to for software reasons are drop microsoft like a bad habbit. Turning off updates, refusing to switch to windows 10 etc.

    So they need to attack the opposition and alternatives, so that you can't except their datamining traffic system that they use to sell

    • by Megol ( 3135005 )

      Tinfoil hat time? Tinfoil hat time!

      • by Tyr07 ( 2300912 )

        Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

        But everytime you go "But they've changed or are behaving differently now" I'm going to chase you going 'Sheeple time? Sheeple time!'

  • Of course they joined. Since systemd Linux is pratically part of the family. ...

    FLAMEWAR in 3 .. 2 .. 1 ..

  • The only important stuff on from the Linux Foundation is the LSB, and I see it mostly as a "Do everything the redhat way".
    What evil could they do inside there? The real evil should be inside the kernel development community, and nobody is screaming against MS submitted patches.
  • Did they shell out a full $37? Showoffs!
  • Trump did to the republicans and democrats.

  • Nice knowing ya.

  • When they contribute serious resources to the Samba and Wine projects in a sincere effort to create truely seemless interoperability, port visual studio and other MS development tools, and then use those capabilities to make the open and closed .net implementations and have true feature parity I'll take notice. Oh and get rid of their anti-competitive attempts to own the browser. Nobody should own the browser, period.
  • Remember the days of Bill Gates as a Borg on every Microsoft story here? Remember the days of MS being written as "M$"? Remember the days of every geek worth their salt on Slashdot loathed Microsoft? My my, times have changed. I for one, welcome it.

  • Typical Microsoft.... They will embrace Linux then extend it with their own proprietary cr@pola like they have done with everything else.

  • Microsoft's Silver Light is compulsory to run NetFlix on Linux. If there is any good will sought-after, Microsoft should end that situation.
  • This is otherwise known as "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer".

Honesty is for the most part less profitable than dishonesty. -- Plato

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