The Mono Mystery That Wasn't 268
jammag writes "It was shocking news, or so it seemed: Miguel de Icaza, the Mono creator, was switching his opinion about his life's work — he now seemed to agree with the free software partisans who oppose his Mono work and his Microsoft connections. The story flamed across the Internet and even got picked up on Slashdot. But Bruce Byfield reports that 'De Icaza has not changed his opinions.' De Icaza calls the rumors 'a storm in a teacup.' Tracing the misinformation trail, Byfield concludes that 'the FOSS community excels at communication. However, in this instance, that ability was used irresponsibly.'"
Inflamatory headling superceeds mundane content? (Score:5, Funny)
Inflammatory headline supersedes mundane content? Say it ain't so!
-Rick
sonofaspellingfail. (Score:2)
Wow, take time to spell check the comment, and completely forgot the header, excuse me while I seek atonement from my old English teachers... This is going to hurt.
-Rick
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Don't worry, "headling" still sounds smarter than the whole .NET vs. Mono debate.
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Re:Inflamatory headling superceeds mundane content (Score:5, Informative)
We have announced that our upcoming Mono release (2.8) will default to 4.0:
http://www.mono-project.com/Roadmap [mono-project.com]
For the first time in Mono's history our C# compiler and its supporting engine and core libraries were done before Microsoft released the product, we were usually one to two years behind. This time we are some five months ahead of time:
http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2009/Dec-09.html [tirania.org]
There are still a handful of loose ends here and there, but luckily, nothing major.
Who cares about core libraries? (Score:3, Insightful)
How about WPF, then? When are you going to develop it? I know: never. The scope of it is way too large for your team.
Same about complete WCF, WWF (and other WTFs).
So in reality, a Mono application will probably work on Windows, but almost none of Windows C# applications will work on Mono.
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WTF?!?
WPF is VERY alive. You're confusing it with WinForms (which is dead).
Aaaand Silverlight just uses a subset of WPF for drawing. So you're in essence saying that WPF is dead because its subset is alive :)
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Not having a WPF implementation created a one-way street - Mono applications will work on Windows, but not vice versa.
That doesn't help Linux.
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I don't think WPF is really that alive, although I agree calling it 'dead' is a bit dramatic.
Microsoft, as is there frequent pattern, has moved on from WPF in that it's stable but won't be invested in significantly anymore.
Example: If you take a look at the last major Microsoft conference (MIX10) then you'll see there we no new WPF features added, while a whole bunch of new Silverlight things announced. Even Microsoft realizes that the web is having an impact on their desktop UI strategy, i.e. Silverlight i
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"Example: If you take a look at the last major Microsoft conference (MIX10) then you'll see there we no new WPF features added"
WPF is definitely not going away. Look at VisualStudio 2010, or to be precise, look at its editor. Yes, it's WPF.
Not much new features are added to it because it's in the stabilization phase for now. So yes, it's just resting.
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Example: If you take a look at the last major Microsoft conference (MIX10) then you'll see there we no new WPF features added, while a whole bunch of new Silverlight things announced.
That's because the new things in .NET 4 (which includes WPF 4) were announced a long time ago on PDC. There's no point in hashing them over again on MIX in March, when the final version is going to come out in April, and there has been two public betas and RC already, the latter being feature-complete.
Here [microsoft.com] is the high-level changelog for WPF 4. As you can see, it contains totally minor and irrelevant features typical of a product being deprecated, such as "the WPF text rendering stack has been completely re
Re:Who cares about core libraries? (Score:5, Informative)
Visual Studio 2010, a core flagship MS product, is written in WPF [onedotnetway.com].
Re:Who cares about core libraries? (Score:4, Funny)
And it shows.
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Why not call it Mono 4.0 then?
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Re:Inflamatory headling superceeds mundane content (Score:4, Insightful)
Five months ahead?
How can you maintain and guarantee compatibility? Divination, or do you actually work hand in hand with Microsoft .NET developers?
And, has Microsoft added ASP.NET and its other IP to the EMCA 334 & 335 specifications, so that you can legally add them to MONO?
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Most new features have been announced on PDC'2008. Since then, there has been a public beta of VS2010 / .NET 4 in May 2009, a second one in October 2009, and RC in February 2010.
It's still impressive that they have implemented it all in slightly over a year, but there is no mystery here.
There haven't been any updates to Ecma-335/335 so far. This doesn't preclude Mono from having an ASP.NET implementation, though - in fact, it's probably the single non-Ecma library that Mono has the best (most compatible etc
Re:Inflamatory headling superceeds mundane content (Score:5, Insightful)
You thought wrong.
First parties posting is one of the strengths of the dot.
Re:Inflamatory headling superceeds mundane content (Score:5, Funny)
The slash however is a slippery slope.
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No, they had the core libraries for .Net 4.0 in before Microsoft released .Net 4.0. Generally they are a year to two years behind.
Maybe with some practice your reading comprehension will improve. :)
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What's the difference between Mono and .NET? How does the liberated open source software community connect to these standards? Where does De Icaza fit in the puzzle?
For this and more, tune in next week for another exciting chapter of "As The Monopoly Turns"
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What's the difference between Mono and .NET? How does the liberated open source software community connect to these standards? Where does De Icaza fit in the puzzle?
Your geek card please... Thanks
Mono is a free implementation of the .NET infrastructure.
De Icaza is just the one that started Mono and integrated it into Gnome.
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.NET is Microsoft's implementation of it's CLR (Common Language Runtime). In general anything CLR tends to be referred to as .NET.
Mono is an open source implementation. It runs on Windows, MacOS, Linux, FreeBSD and I believe I've even seen it for HPUX. There are probably other platforms. In my experience, if your platform has a libgdi+ library available for it, mono will run most .NET apps written in Visual Studios 2003 and earlier. I'm not sure about later MS dev environments. I also don't know if libgdi+
Lets get more rumors started. (Score:4, Funny)
Didnt you hear? Stallman converted to scientology and Linus is accepting patches from NAMBLA!! Oh and the EFF finally released its spec for its homegrown DRM scheme.
Re:Lets get more rumors started. (Score:4, Funny)
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Wait, I thought this was the North American Man/Boy Love Association?
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Linus is accepting patches from NAMBLA!!
I think he's also accepting patches from NAMPLA, look how fat this penguin has become after all the abuse:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/af/Tux.png [wikimedia.org]
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
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Oh now that made me laugh. Hard.
Still good for Slashdot... (Score:5, Insightful)
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I can see the editor thinking "we already know this is fake news, but let's publish: we are missing a good Mono flamewar since forever!"
Nah .. I think at the moment it is more like "lets break up the run of slashvirtisments and Apple fawning stories so we can seem like a reasonable website". As after all the editors have proven time and time again that they don't know real news from fake shit.
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I can see the editor thinking "we already know this is fake news, but let's publish: we are missing a good Mono flamewar since forever!"
Should be modded Insightful, not Funny...
Not that big of a deal (Score:2, Insightful)
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Wow, grow up, guys. So he has Microsoft connections? So what? If open source affiliation is a valid reason to hate somebody, you might start rethinking your life priorities.
I don't think it's his "open source affiliations" anyone is worried about, so much as his affiliation with a dangerous monopolist that has been incredibly damaging to the industry and state of the art.
The Mono project gives Linux developers more choice, especially if they have been working with .NET tech for a long time.
Yeah, sort of the same way crack dealers give kids more choice of entertainment.
Would you forfeit years of .NET training and experience because you want to use a Linux platform?
If I wanted to develop for Linux, I'd absolutely learn new frameworks and tools to do it, but then most people already know multiple languages, tools, and methods of programming.
at, or I am missing a bigger picture, in such case maybe someone can elaborate in the implications of said "teacup storm"?
Look up the phrase, "embrace, extend, extinguish". It
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If they're injecting patent bombs into FOSS, then I care, regardless of their intentions.
Besides, it only goes to show the frailty of modern development education. People get hooked on to languages, and not on to versatility. If a platform doesn't support your favorite development tools, then you either avoid the platform or you adapt and use what there is. It's not like Linux doesn't have a ton of languages. I could understand it if your faced with a choice between assembler and K&R C on one side,
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Did the check clear? (Score:2)
In other words, that check from MS finally cleared. :)
.NET on my computers.
In actuality, I think that De Icaza actually believes in what he is doing and not a paid shill. However, I is still don't want anything to do with
Too bad. I was willing to think he'd grown up. (Score:3, Insightful)
That's a shame. I'd thought that after all this time he was finally wising up and accepting what everyone else on the planet was saying. I guess either he hasn't put his fanatical devotion to his employer aside (does anyone really believe that he didn't get the job he applied for at Microsoft?) or that his boss told him to back down. Either way, too bad. He's a talented guy and I wish he would work on something useful and less poisonous.
Re:Too bad. I was willing to think he'd grown up. (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd thought that after all this time he was finally wising up and accepting what everyone else you agree with was saying.
There, fixed that for ya.
I know, amazing! Some people might *actually* disagree with you, oh wise and omniscient one!
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I know, amazing! Some people might *actually* disagree with you, oh wise and omniscient one!
That's fine when the subject at hand doesn't matter. In this case, no one with a sense of history and a functional intellect disagrees. The only counterarguments are from people who are ignorant of the fact that Microsoft has threatened to use their software patents to destroy FOSS projects, or who have reason not to care.
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In this case, no one with a sense of history and a functional intellect disagrees.
You forgot "or gives a shit about FOSS as a 'movement'". I don't care about FOSS as a movement in any way. I could give less of a shit...but I don't know how. I think people who hang out at SlashDot get lost in some kind of reality distortion field and think all other professional developers are greasy neckbeards like them. Most people don't care about any of this, and would use Mono in a heartbeat if it suited their technical needs. You are a minority.
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So why would you care if Microsoft used their software patents to destroy a project you don't care about?
Because the project's advocates are trying to get it used all over the place, with an eventual certainty that it will end up affecting some project or another that I do care about.
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I'd thought that after all this time he was finally wising up and accepting what everyone else on the planet was saying.
I wasn't saying that. Don't put words in my mouth.
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The phenomenon can lead to an ugly place when
His life's work? (Score:3, Interesting)
Didn't this guy start Gnome (or maybe KDE)? that is actually "life's work" worthy, not something nobody cares about like mono.
A coincidence? (Score:2)
List of all open source iconoclasts --
Miguel de Icaza
Theo de Raadt
notice any similarities between the names?
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notice any similarities between the names?
They're un-American!! I always knew FOSS was unpatriotic/treasonous - finally we have the proof!
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I know this is Slashdot but... (Score:5, Insightful)
...I'm amazed at how obtuse (and in some cases, downright insulting) the majority of the comments on this story are. I think it's highly likely that if .NET didn't come from Microsoft, nobody would be getting quite so emotional about the whole thing.
For the record, I'm categorically not Microsoft's greatest fan, but you cannot deny that .NET/C# is a damn good platform. Having a portable version of said good platform is therefore a Good Thing. It doesn't matter if Microsoft decide to fuck Mono over; it's still a good platform and therefore still a Good Thing. If you disagree and you don't like it, then fine; don't use it and stop whining.
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I agree with you, but you have the arguments wrong. The problem people had was that Icaza was pushing Mono so hard for things that didn't need it (Tomboy) that he came off like a shill. And that he was convinced there were no patent issues and everybody should start using it, despite the fact that patent issues are/were a real problem.
So he came off as a guy who was working on an inferior implementation of a Microsoft product and was strongly pushing for its infiltration into the Linux desktop, and giving h
Re:I know this is Slashdot but... (Score:5, Insightful)
I think it's highly likely that if .NET didn't come from Microsoft, nobody would be getting quite so emotional about the whole thing.
As a matter of fact, that'snot true [gnu.org]. The '.net trap' is just another version of the Java trap, only made more dangerous by the fact that Microsoft is known to be hostile to open source.
If you disagree and you don't like it, then fine; don't use it and stop whining.
The problem is that mono is included in Gnome, and if it spreads it will get harder and harder to avoid. Some of us would prefer to keep that from happening, because we know what the potential consequences would be.
What about him and Novell? (Score:3, Insightful)
I think he and his gang along with that pathetic dying company should leave Gnome, Linux alone. No more trickery to insert Mono to Debian, flagship open source Linux which is (was) like a manifesto of open source philosophy until it got that stupid notes app.
Would they agree on that?
Even got picked up on Slashdot? (Score:2)
He HAS Admitted Defeat (Score:5, Interesting)
It's very clear. The part in bold I find most damning. This indicates that he knew all along that you couldn't create an open source implementation of even the CLR without permission from Microsoft. There is a lot in here, but people like Bruce Byfield obviously havent read it properly. He's tried top backtrack and cover up a bit by saying that it's all nothing, but it most certainly is something.
I accidentally an entire word (Score:3, Informative)
Sorry, that should read:
Yes, yes, preview first, etc etc.
Re:-1 Misses the point (Score:4, Insightful)
From Miguels blog
So in fact Miguel was lamenting time lost under a previous, less enlightened management. Not current problems with .NET.
I remember when Mono was first announced. Miguel at the time argued that the free software world had failed to produce any real competitor to Java or .NET style frameworks despite their absolute dominance of mainstream programming. He didn't think one would appear any time soon either. And guess what - he was right. There is no home grown Linux, Apache or Android equivalent to compete with Java or .NET. And whilst Java is now fully open source, it wasn't safe to assume that'd happen back all those years ago.
So in fact it seems Miguel was right all along - right about the need, right about the solution, right that Microsoft would not attempt to "destroy Linux" by leveraging patents. Instead they specifically promised in writing not to do that. Why? Probably because they don't care about Linux anymore. The world has moved on, what once seemed like a threat to their business no longer is.
Re:-1 Misses the point (Score:5, Informative)
"Miguel at the time argued that the free software world had failed to produce any real competitor to Java or .NET style frameworks despite their absolute dominance of mainstream programming."
Why would they need to? While initially some of the Java trademark and licensing mechanism were semi-unfriendly to open source, the situation was a LOT better than it has ever been with .NET, and is much better now.
Instead of trying to create a competitor, the OSS community worked with Java - A lot of Java's success can likely be attributed to the participation of the OSS community. (Heck, even Miguel's blog article effectively says this with his citations of various OSS "research" projects into JIT that became mainstream.)
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What does java do that python can't?
Re:-1 Misses the point (Score:5, Informative)
Run fast, support multiple languages, provide 99.9999% secure code environments, support more than one thread executing at a time, etc, etc.
But... Java and Python are two drastically different technologies. Python is great at what it does but it's a scripting language not a virtual platform like Java. .NET is more comparable to Java since .NET was basically cloned feature for feature from Java with some additional features added.
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Python is great at what it does but it's a scripting language not a virtual platform like Java.
Please explain. Python is compiled into bytecode, then executed on a VM. Java is compiled into bytecode, then executed on a VM. What substantial distinction would you draw between the two?
Re:-1 Misses the point (Score:5, Informative)
Java's virtual machine (specially Sun/OpenJDK) is much more advanced than Python's (CPython).
Python takes a bytecode and then executes the one or more native instructions it takes to fulfill the purpose of the bytecode instruction. And that's basically all it does.
Java takes the bytecode instruction and compiles into a native format and uses thats for future executions. In addition, it does many other types of optimizations to increase the execution speed. You can run Java in a purely interpreted mode like Python does, pass the -Xint argument on the command line to the java instance. You'll notice it's 10000x slower than the optimized execution paths.
Java's class library is primarily Java code, whereas Python wraps native libraries for much of this work. Both methods have their pros and cons, but it means Python can be prone to more issues regarding different system libraries, etc. Since Java provides it's own virtual platform with most of the code in Java, you don't have these issues as often.
Java also allows for true threading, whereas Python threads are limited by the global interpreter lock preventing you from getting real performance gains from asynchronous execution. You have to resort to multiple python processes to take advantage of multicore processors for example.
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There is no home grown Linux, Apache or Android equivalent to compete with Java or .NET.
I would dare to say that PHP competes just fine, just for example.
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You are joking, right? You can't possibly be serious.
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Instead they specifically promised in writing not to do that.
They most absolutely did not. They promised not to annihilate any 100% compatible implementations [slashdot.org].
Still missing the point... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Good News (Score:5, Insightful)
Good news everyone. Icaza is still a whore.
If you make your living exchanging your talents for money, so are you. So what is your point?
Stop being so inflammatory. If you have a logical argument to make, make it and we will decide whether the argument is valid based on its merit. Otherwise you just blend into the rest of the noise of modern 'rhetoric' (with apologies to true rhetoric).
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Good news everyone. Icaza is still a whore.
If you make your living exchanging your talents for money, so are you. So what is your point?
I suppose it's the difference between a Companion [wikipedia.org] and a whore.
I tend to choose my employers, and I certainly don't express opinions simply because I'm paid to. That doesn't mean I'll never express an opinion my employer tells me to, only that one of the following is true:
Now, I don't know which De Ica
Re:Good News (Score:5, Interesting)
As someone who actually knows Miguel de Icaza and someone who was there when Mono began, I can tell you with absolute certainty that he started Mono because he truly believes that it's a good platform. As do I and all of the other Mono developers (none of whom get a "fat paycheck" from Microsoft or anyone else). The Mono team is underfunded at Novell, so I and likely other developers have taken a pay CUT in order to work on what we believe in.
We are not paid to parrot any opinions from Microsoft or Novell. Our opinions are our own and we stand by them.
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It's a little more complicated. If you do something for a living that you would do anyway, if you were independently wealthy, you aren't a whore. If you do something that you would never do unless you got paid, you are a whore. Obviously, most actual whores would still have sex for free if they were wealthy, they just wouldn't have sex with you.
Now, I don't think Icaza is a regular whore. He would still be coding if he wasn't getting paid. I think he's an attention whore, which is slightly different. Regula
Re:Good News (Score:5, Insightful)
I never understood whats so immoral or degrading about being a whore. Certainly there are segments of the "sex worker" community that are unsavory and engage in despicable activity (sexual slavery, mental/physical abuse, unfair exploitation) however, there are also those who work freelance and or enjoy their jobs.
I don't mean to ruin whores for you, I mean, maybe you need to see it as degrading and immoral to get off, your kink is ok I guess. Though, I no more understand that kink than asphyxiation, so it does seem a bit strange to me.
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but I wasn't speaking of sex whores, but of work whores.
As for sex whores, despite your (and other poster's here) romantic notions about that line of work most in the world do it either out of desperation for money or are forced to do it.
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I don't work for the enjoyment of it. I've never had a job I wouldn't rather quit to go read novels all day. I believe most people, if they were being honest, would agree with the statement. That makes us both whores. The only people who work who are not whores are those who are independently wealthy or retired, and work merely for fun or to stave off boredom.
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at my employer I'm the "Enterprise Linux Engineer", so I get to design systems with free software, sometimes implement them including migrating clients from closed source, and sometimes head up software development projects. It's 80% fun for money, the other 20% is when clients are being a pain in the ass.
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By the way I never bought the "they sell their bodies and that's wrong" argument. I'm selling my body right now, to the corporation. For 9-10 hours a day I am selling myself as a temporary slave to their whims. So there's no real difference.
Tell that to the Icelanders [google.com]. I can't believe a law like that got passed in Northern Europe in the year 2010. It may seem like a minor detail from a small island, but I am appalled.
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That depends. Is it in my job description? No one is forcing you to accept a job you don't want.
The only thing that degrades hookers is people's attitudes towards them, and the exploitation that we allow to happen because we push prostitution underground.
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no, doing degrading and immoral work for money makes one a whore.
Interesting...
I assume we're still both talking about whores as in prostitutes - folks who sell sex for money.
So... What's so immoral or degrading about that?
Sure, some folks have moral objections to is. And some folks probably find it degrading. But does that mean that prostitution as a whole is automatically immoral and degrading?
Wouldn't that make something like bartending immoral as well, since some religions have moral objections to alcohol?
And wouldn't that make pretty much every job on the planet
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So then, Mono is some form of STD?
"Free" as in "Freedom"? (Score:2)
I thought free meant freedom to do whatever you want with the source code. Free...they keep using that word, but I do not think it means what they think it means.
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It's same as the tolerance movement - everyone should be tolerant of everyone else, and if you aren't tolerant we're going to beat the shit out of you until you are.
There is nothing free about the "free" software movement. They believe everyone should do it their way, and nobody should have the choice to do it any other. And god forbid you should ever change your mind and eventually decide to sell your services for money. Then you are Satan's unholy hellspawn.
The FSF is so full of bullshit it has put me
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Re:Long story short (Score:5, Insightful)
Miguel doesn't care, because that "99% of us" turns out to be less than 1% of the real "us."
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That would explain the neighbor's chiwawa.
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You said what you said Miguel, now suck it.
What is this some kind of sex for irony exchange program?
What I thought Miguel said (Score:3, Insightful)
was that Mono would have a lot of competition if it wasn't for the implicit patent threats coming from Microsoft. IOW, he was complaining that JVM technology had come a long way due to open policies from Sun and that .Net runtime engines had not enjoyed the same benefits. I think he is probably right there.
What I didn't hear him saying was that Mono was a bad project, risked patent infringement claims, etc. There seemed to be some concession on the patent issue but it seemed overblown.
At the same time
Re:And what have YOU done for Free and Open Source (Score:4, Insightful)
What's more, Mono is undeniably Free Software, and it follows the grand tradition of GNU software in that it re-implements someone else's proprietary software (while mixing in its own completely Free Software extensions).
I am by no means a fan of Mono, but I fail to see how it is any different than gcc or the many GNU utilities that are basically work-alikes of any number of proprietary software products. Cloning commercial software products is hardly a new theme in Free Software. What is it, precisely, that makes Mono a special case.
The difference, apparently, is that Microsoft is especially evil.
The problem with that, of course, is that Microsoft is not really that particularly evil. Especially compared to AT&T or IBM in their respective heydays. Sure, patents have changed the game somewhat since the early days of UNIX, but Free Software's defense against patents has always been the same. Pretend that they don't exist until threatened, and then write the functionality out of the effected software. Mono is not appreciably more vulnerable to attacks from Microsoft than the Linux kernel, or any other major piece of Free Software.
So really, why all of the hate?
Re:And what have YOU done for Free and Open Source (Score:4, Insightful)
I am by no means a fan of Mono, but I fail to see how it is any different than gcc
Ah well that makes sense. Here it is in a nutshell:
Gcc is, as far as anyone is aware, free of all patented technology, in particular patents owned by companies hostile to free software.
Mono is most definitely encumbered by patents owned by a company that is very hostile towards free software, and has been recently becoming more vocal about alleging patent violations in Linux and threatening legal action.
Mono is not appreciably more vulnerable to attacks from Microsoft than the Linux kernel, or any other major piece of Free Software.
Yes it most definitely is! Because the vulnerability is not hypothetical, it is not a made-up FUD tactic. It's plain as day and undeniable that these patents cover things in Mono, and it is not a simple matter of recoding if MS ever becomes aggressive. There are aspects of the framework that simply cannot be implemented to spec without running into these patents.
Microsoft has no interest in anything cross-platform excepting those that are owned by MS. They have promised not to enforce patents against Mono, but this is not a legally binding promise. The only reason they have to let Mono exist is to waste the time of Linux developers, and to encourage adoption of a framework that is ostensibly cross-platform but can be instantly made Windows-only any time they want.
Oh and I think you're wrong. MS is just as evil as IBM and AT&T. Main difference is that today MS only controls the software while IBM controlled both.
This is absolutely a time bomb and MS is just waiting for the right moment to set it off.
Re:And what have YOU done for Free and Open Source (Score:4, Insightful)
If the danger to Mono is so obvious, then please point out the patent numbers that Microsoft owns that would apply to Mono (and that don't, at the same time, apply to Free Software tools like OpenJDK, or gcc). Additionally, you should only use patents that don't apply to the ECMA specification.
What? You don't have access to such a list? Imagine that! My guess is that this is because (to my knowledge) no one has come up with such a list of patents. It is possible that you have access to such a list--in which case your accusations could *potentially* stop being FUD. Until then, however, you have no evidence that Mono is particularly vulnerable to attack from Microsoft.
Microsoft has already stated that it believes that Linux (for example) violates hundreds of its patents. In fact, it has even signed patent deals that supposedly cover Linux. Patent attacks on Linux are definitely not FUD. Should I stop using Linux as well?
If Mono is a trap, then it is quite likely to be the stupidest trap in the history of the world. At the very best Microsoft could force the Mono developers to be less compatible with .NET. Since Mono is not particularly compatible with .NET in the first place this is hardly a huge threat.
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And Mono is, as far as anyone is aware, free of all patented technology.
Or have you found a patent that covers .NET? I haven't. No one else I've asked has. Have you?
Are you fucking kidding me? Are you only just hearing about Mono today? Is everyone you know equally clueless, or did you just never think to try maybe checking the Mono website itself [mono-project.com] which informs you that it implements patented technology. It's always been known that Mono is not free of patented technology, Miguel has never claimed it wa
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So a half-assed internet search uncovered a patent that covers the architecture for networked applications in .NET. And that's not good enough for you? How did that go again? "As far as anyone knows, Mono has no patent issues... except the one I found in two minutes of googling. But I'm sure that's it."
Yeah whatever.
I'm not doing "diligence" because I'd never set my foot in that bear trap in the first place.