French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubuntu 368
Ynot_82 writes "The French national police force, the Gendarmerie Nationale, has spoken about their migration away from the Windows platform to Linux. Estimated to have already saved the force 50 Million Euros, the migration is due to be completed on all 90,000 workstations by 2015. Of the move, Lt. Col. Guimard had this comment: '"Moving from Microsoft XP to Vista would not have brought us many advantages and Microsoft said it would require training of users. Moving from XP to Ubuntu, however, proved very easy. The two biggest differences are the icons and the games. Games are not our priority."'"
Games are not our priority (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Games are not our priority (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Games are not our priority (Score:5, Informative)
... but solitaire and minesweeper are great training for stakeouts ;-)
Doesn't the default version of Ubuntu have both? Mine does along with Chess, Othello, Tetris, Sudoku, Mahjongg, Blackjack, and a few others.
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Yes, by default Ubuntu includes several more games than Windows. I'd consider them better games also.
Where is GORILLA.BAS? (Score:3, Informative)
The games that come with Vista are quite a bit better than gnome-games:
Chess Titans
Freecell
Hearts
Inkball
Mahjong Titans
Minesweeper
Purble Place
Solitaire
Spider Solitaire
Most of these have been updated quite a bit, both with respect to looks, sounds and playability.
Although I miss pinball, I miss gorilla.bas even more :-)
Re:Games are not our priority (Score:5, Informative)
Come on, how much better can minesweeper or solitaire be?
Well, the minesweeper's basically identical, but Aisleriot solitaire (the default Gnome solitaire game) comes with 80 different solitaire variants, which beats the 3 or so that come with windows by a good ways. I personally like Hopscotch.
Gnome also comes with something like 17 games by default, and you can install hundreds more if you want them without even opening a web browser. I will grant that the networked hearts/spades games in XP are something I would like to see an equivalent to in Ubuntu.
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Not to mention the fact that you can install a lot more from the repositories
Re:Games are not our priority (Score:5, Funny)
In fact, solitaire really is great training for using a mouse. Time and again I have seen novice computer users of all ages, who would otherwise struggle with the mouse, become quite proficient after only an hour or so playing solitaire.
Now if they could just be gotten to stop playing solitaire afterwards, they could move on to other lessons.
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Now if they could just be gotten to stop playing solitaire afterwards, they could move on to other lessons.
I could say the same for fortune. Show a linux noob how to start a terminal and type fortune, then how to press up-arrow to use the history, and you can lean back for an hour or so. Not great console training, but it's a start. :D
Re:Games are not our priority (Score:5, Interesting)
Fortune is good for teaching people how do web programming.
Make it show Fortune.
Make it format pretty.
Keep clicking reload, and keep making it prettier. :)
I actually put it back into my personal site. I got the BOFH excuses fortune file, so whenever someone needs an excuse, they can just click.
"Power Company having EMP problems with their reactor" :)
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Now if they could just be gotten to stop playing solitaire afterwards, they could move on to other lessons.
Write the game so that the longer you play, the more cards go randomly missing. Once they get down to about 45 cards the game will not be much fun anymore... Call it Terminal Solitaire.
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... and finding and downloading installable games are easier for Ubuntu IMHO. want a tetris clone, fire up Aptitude and .. oh there is one click on it and install presto.
Except that it requires the root password, and lusers aren't given root.
Run away or I shall taunt you a second time (Score:5, Funny)
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Microsoft: can we come to see you and have a chat?
*Microsoft* surrenders! (Score:5, Funny)
The IBM PC was a hamster wheel, and MS-DOS smelled of Elderberries...
And what is the air velocity of a chair thrown by a CEO?
Re:Run away or I shall taunt you a second time (Score:5, Funny)
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Fetchez la vache!
Go France! (Score:5, Insightful)
Now if only state and federal agencies in the US would do some of the same. Sadly, so long as corporations are allowed to lobby, the pork train will probably continue.
Re:Go France! (Score:5, Funny)
Hey, it's not "pork", it's an "economic stimulus".
Re:Go France! (Score:5, Insightful)
Honestly, not supporting a business that resides in your nation during the current state of the economy is a pretty bad thing for the government to do.
But which companies to support? Red Hat is based in the USA as are many other Linux-based companies. The thing is, when you keep buying things from a certain company just because its made in the USA, you help monopolies and deny justice. Why would the justice department pass a ruling on MS if everything they use is MS based and in the short term it would cost more money to switch?
The point is that the government should be helping to foster the development of it's own economy by investing into it.
But why support a company convicted of running an abusive monopoly? Sure, if it was cheaper to do it the MS way it might make some sense, but compared to Linux, MS is very expensive for little to no quality benefit. By buying MS products governments are helping MS build an even larger monopoly along with effectively tying the hands of judges in monopoly cases.
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They were found guilty of anti-trust violations with penalties enforced for their transgressions. The sad thing is that the whole thing is a joke. Bundling IE isn't really a crime. Bundling WMP isn't a crime. However, the Halloween Documents [catb.org] suggest there were serious illegal, anti-competitive practices at play that no one ever really hit them for.
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The EU case is the big one. The government found they broke the law, and fined them for doing so.
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Why is it so difficult to understand that breaking the law does not equal committing a crime? Would you be OK with the police putting you away for a year because they caught you going 5mph over the speed limit? After all, you did break a law by doing so.
A criminal conviction can result in prison time, execution and/or a fine. A civil judgment will never land you in jail, it will never get you killed (although it can bankrupt you) and it does not imply criminal behavior in any way. It only means you were fou
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If all else is equal, the more expensive option puts a drag on the economy, the cheaper option frees up money for other productive uses.
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If someone needs to explain to you why this is such a dumbass idea, try the cotton or the corn lobby. They will explain how that kind of thinking made americans choose the least efficient bio-fuel. Go sugarcane, go (that was a no-brainer by the way.. sugarcane = sugar = energy for your children AND you car)!
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Not sure why you were modded down... you can practically go into any market with a blindfold and pick up a random food item. Take off the blindfold and read the ingredients list. You'll likely find HFCS as one of the major items on the list.
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I saw an ad on TV recently, touting the wonders of HFCS. It's all natural and good for you. There was a very fine print line at the bottom of the last couple seconds of it that said something about Corn Growers of America, or something of that sort. :)
I don't watch TV, and watch even fewer commercials, so if I happened to see it, that was either really dumb luck, or they're spending a lot of money on pushing the wonders of their product.
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They have commercials every 5 seconds it seems.
Re:Go France! (Score:5, Insightful)
In this case, for instance, the contention is that a government agency can save millions of dollars by using Linux. Millions of dollars saved is millions you don't have to collect in taxes, or millions that you can do other things with(depending on whether you think the organization in question should focus on present level of service, controlling costs, or present level of cost, improving service).
If a government can actually save money by using linux, then their using Windows amounts to overtaxing their citizens for the benefit of a private corporation. That is bad.
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If a government can actually save money by using linux, then their using Windows amounts to overtaxing their citizens for the benefit of a private corporation. That is bad.
Sounds about par for the course these days though...
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Re:Go France! (Score:5, Interesting)
Defense has additional and different concerns than other areas of government. They need to make sure that even if a war broke out with a country that you and I buy components from, the military can still source the components to build what they need. If that means keeping a less efficient industry in business in the States, consider it an expensive insurance policy.
It makes perfect sense, but it's also a bit funny when you consider that DOD itself is just an enormous insurance policy. Or at least, it should be...
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Except they won't be saving the money, it's going to go to some other crazy project.
What, like educating children, feeding the poor, healing the sick and looking after the elderly and infirm?
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In some cases, I would agree. However this is an issue of a police force saving money, not just spending money differently. They could easily use local support agencies for their Linux and it would still help drive the economy.
I'd rather they save money and redistribute it as needed rather than going for the more expensive option for the sake of it.
The other problem with the car thing, is what cars are actually made in Canada? Each of the big 3 only make about 6 different vehicles in Canada, and none of
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It's not "Canada", it's only Ontario's lottery commission that is getting flak for buying German cars. Hell, they're so clueless at times I'm sure they thought Chrysler & Daimler were still merged.
Who was doing the most bitching? President of the CAW, of course.
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Honestly, not supporting a business that resides in your nation during the current state of the economy is a pretty bad thing for the government to do.
Why is MS at risk of going under? I'd much rather government stimulus come in the form of hiring unemployed IT people to help them transition and unemployed coders to add features they need/want and hiring smaller companies to provide support. Giving large amounts of money to MS is (amusingly) approaching the broken window fallacy.
The point is that the government should be helping to foster the development of it's own economy by investing into it.
Yes it should, but I'd much rather they hand all that cash to truly innovative companies that will provide longterm benefits to the economy and the government. Fostering innovatio
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In Canada, the government run Lottery corporation just bought 20 Mercedes for prizes
That's nothing, in the UK the National Lottery just bought a fleet of Cadillac STSes. If you win, they don't make you take one.
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But, what are the Canadian owned and built brands of cars? I know GM builds some there (or at least did), but is there a truly domestic car there, not owned by an American company?
Ok, I went and asked a Canadian, rather than waiting for a response. He couldn't think of any, and couldn't find any through G00gle.
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2: The police are in the business of keeping us safe and secure. Given the choice of a *nix based system and Windows where would you want your criminal (or otherwise) record stored?
3: Is "THE ECONOMY!" the new "TERRORISM!"?
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Duh (Score:5, Funny)
Free is cheaper. Who knew?
Re:Duh (Score:5, Interesting)
Except for most of the suits I've dealt with at my last two companies. We keep talking about the need to save money and cut costs, so we lay people off. When I show them articles how IBM saved over 100 million dollars last year migrating more Windows systems to Linux, they balk at the notion. We literally use everything from Office 97 to 2007 here, and we can't share documents internally. We had a big crisis when departments couldn't work together on a budget, because no one could open each other's files.
I suggested OpenOffice to several execs, and not a single one would consider moving away from Office. It is just unthinkable. They keep insisting they want everyone on the same version of Office (and we have Mac users with Mac Office) but they won't buy new Office 2007 licenses for everyone. They want a solution that is free, but they are terrified of free software.
Instead, they'll cave and buy more Office 2007 licenses, and fire more people to make up the difference.
Re:Duh (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Duh (Score:5, Interesting)
They aren't run by idiots. They're run by selfish bastards. There's a big difference.
An idiot will make you fill out form 22/B in order to get a new stapler because he doesn't know of any other solution. A selfish bastard will make you fill out form 22/B in order to get a new stapler because he wants to save money on staplers and knows that most people won't take the time unless they really really need one.
This may seem like the effects are similar, but they aren't: the idiot, when he hears of a more efficient way, will at least consider changing it or at worst be very confused. The selfish bastard, when he hears of a more efficient way, will fire the guy who made the suggestion for undermining his authority. It's a difference between Dogbert and the PHB.
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It's not necessarily idiots (but I'm sure it applies somewhat.) Boards are made up of people from other companies. In fact, the company I work for took on a board member from Symantec a few years back. The same year, everyone got "upgraded" to Symantec Anti-Virus. It's a buddy-buddy world in Corporate America.
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It's more like, they stay with what they know is safe, regardless of the costs (in man hours, dollars, or pieces of their souls).
Myself, I'd look at it as, what is the cost difference? You'll have to deploy OpenOffice to every desktop. That will take manhours. But, if you have to deploy/upgrade and maintain the MSOffice installs, that will also take manhours. I'd say it's a wash on the manhours, but really it isn't. OO installs quicker. The licensing is ... well, free. Ev
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It is only power users who really know Excel that will struggle to relearn those tasks in Calc.
Whups (Ding!) Right on many counts, wrong on the implication there.
In the business world, at least among the top 10 banks, Excel is a defacto standard -- not just for moving spreadsheets, but for moving software between companies. An absolutely huge amount of business is transacted via business rules living entirely in spreadsheet VBA. I know, I developed some of it (contemptable, perhaps, but a guy has to eat). Throw the spreadsheet across the hall to the next company and they can run it irrespective
Read the original report - you'll feel much better (Score:3, Funny)
According to Guimard the move to open source has also helped to reduce maintenance costs.
Keeping GNU/Linux desktops up to date is much easier, he says.
"Previously, one of us would be travelling all year just to install a new version of some anti virus application on the desktops in the Gendarmerie's outposts on the islands in French Polynesia.
A similar operation now is finished within two weeks and does not require travelling.
Aaah... government work.
Not only do they find an exceptionally complicated way to solve a simple problem - they don't know when to keep their mouth shut when it goes in their favor.
Traveling around French Polynesian islands [wikipedia.org] updating anti-virus software for living?
Why yes. It is MUCH better to sit in some windowless room instead.
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*wimper*
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People lack the balls to make such a big change.
Remember 'Noone got fired for choosing Microsoft' is a famous line the higher up IT guys like to wave around. Fact of the matter is that noone ever got fired for choosing open source either. It's poor implementation of any solution that gets people fired.
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How did you mention it? Did you write a proposal that examined the financial ramifications of switching from MS Office to OpenOffice, including not only licensing costs but also retraining expenses? Did you outline the benefits of switching including how quality would be improved? Did you explain possible alternatives including the possibility of doing nothing? This is how executi
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French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubuntu? (Score:5, Funny)
"French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubuntu."
Jesus Christ! Windows was killing millions of people in France?!?!
Re: French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubunt (Score:5, Funny)
Jesus Christ! Windows was killing millions of people in France?!?!
Why do you think they call it the 'Blue Screen of Death'?
Re: French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubunt (Score:5, Funny)
And why do you think the French sigh of exasperation is "sacre bleu"?
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Actually, it's a reference the Virgin Mary, for whom the color blue is sacred.
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Re: French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubunt (Score:5, Funny)
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Re: French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubunt (Score:5, Funny)
Not just in France, the summary says Euros, so people all over Europe.
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Hah, now all this needs is Jean Reno and Robert de Niro chasing Bill Gates across Paris in a Peugeot 406...
Applications already migrated (Score:4, Insightful)
What the summary doesn't mention, but is worth noting, is that they were already using open source programs where possible---Firefox, Thunderbird, OOo. Now I think their migration is wonderful, but I suspect it might have been somewhat more difficult if users were asked to adjust to new programs, as well.
Re:Applications already migrated (Score:5, Informative)
They migrated their applications first, as part of a phased rollout, aimed at being a first step before the migration to Linux.
So the users did migrate applications, it just wasn't at the same time as changing operating system.
Re:Applications already migrated (Score:5, Insightful)
What the summary doesn't mention, but is worth noting, is that they were already using open source programs where possible---Firefox, Thunderbird, OOo. Now I think their migration is wonderful, but I suspect it might have been somewhat more difficult if users were asked to adjust to new programs, as well.
Of course it would have been more difficult. That just means they did it right, switching to Free applications first then to the Free OS. They probably saved money in the first step as well as the second, and lowered the burden by doing it phased rather than dumping it all on the users at once.
For information (Score:3, Informative)
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The Gendarmerie Nationale already used free software daily such as open office. The migration would have been more complicated is they were using MS Office.
Actually, they used MSOffice back in 2005. They did a staged transition to free software, first moving to OpenOffice and Firefox and Thunderbird. Now they're moving into the second stage and switching the underlying OS now that most of their applications are platform independent.
So now you have a project plan (Score:5, Interesting)
1: Switch your applications to Open Source.
2: Switch your operating systems.
And ironically, the best way to switch people away from Windows is to port free and open source applications to the platform.
Tis a good day for Linux (Score:2)
Great for Linux , awesome for Linux admins, even better for open source movement!
can't happen in Cambridge, MA. (Score:2)
Almost every time I pass the parked policy car in Cambridge, I saw the policeman playing some game (e.g., solitair) on his PC. I guess games *are* the priority here, hence don't see any migration to Ubuntu any time soon.
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Never mind that Solitaire is on the default Ubuntu install, along with a dozen other (read: more than Windows) pre-installed games.
No, that's not what they did (Score:5, Informative)
They saved millions by migrating 90,000 desktops to OpenOffice, they have migrated only 5,000 desktops to Ubuntu, they plan for 15,000 by the end of 2009, and 90,000 by 2015. (IIRC).
The title of the article, and the title of the slashdot posting is inaccurate - the savings are real, but the reason was not Ubuntu - it was OpenOffice.
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I think this is the key to moving away from Windows. Once users are happy with Open Office, Firefox, Gimp for Windows etc, then the next step to migrate totally to Linux becomes a much smaller one to take.
Re:No, that's not what they did (Score:5, Funny)
The title of the article, and the title of the slashdot posting is inaccurate...
What's your point?
This just in from the ticker. French police save m (Score:2, Funny)
French Police Save Millions Switching To Ubuntu
French Police are going door to door these past days informing citizens of the long-term health
effects of Windows. The so far largest campaign for public health in the history of France is
expected to continue for another week and is aiming for a coverage of over 90% of the nation's
households. Jean Trudeaux, an elderly villager in the Bretagne recalls opening the door to officers
early in the afternoon and being asked if he owned a computer. Acknowledging the pos
Biggest differences? (Score:2, Interesting)
The two biggest differences are the icons and the games.
Man alive. If that's what this person thinks are the "biggest differences" ... I don't know, that just sounds really strange. This wasn't a very technical person, I take it, saying this. Even from a pure user's perspective, there's more that is different than "icons." Like, the entire GUI is different. I know, basic functionality is mostly the same, and you still click things to get them to open, but there's still a lot more different. Good things, too, I'm not trying to say the switch was a bad idea
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But really, the paradigm of all modern GUIs is the same. There really isn't that much difference between XP or XFCE on a paradigm level. It's all clicky menus and icons.
My parents, who are about the most illiterate people I've ever met, went from Win98 to Gnome to Mac OSX over the years without a single complaint about usability of the GUI. Plenty of other issues, but never about the GUI.
So yes, I agree with the article. The biggest difference is in the icons and the games.
There are 2 separate national police force (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, there are two separate national police forces in France.
The Gendarmerie Nationale [wikipedia.org] is, (adapted from Wikipedia):
The Police Nationale [wikipedia.org] is, (adapted from Wikipedia):
Mandriva? (Score:4, Interesting)
Pretty easy? (Score:2)
...Seriously?
Unless the sole purpose of the computer is to access web based application, otherwise how could it be easy?
Or does it only refer to the user training part? Then I would believe easy is the correct word to describe (Form Windows, you have to train user to use windows LOB apps too)
Re:Pretty easy? (Score:5, Interesting)
How much training have you received in using the apps that you use 90% of the time?
Just curious.
I don't know anyone who has received formal training in how to use their email client, web browser, word processor, or presentation software. If they don't
know how to do something, they simply ask peer who does.
anti-monopoly rulings (Score:2)
Minor correction (Score:3, Informative)
Gendarmerie Nationale is a branch of the French army, and are not the police. One major difference is that they are allowed to shoot to kill, while the police is not allowed to shoot even after they get shot at and are injured.
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"while the police is not allowed to shoot even after they get shot at and are injured"
They can only shoot their side arm after being buried 6 feet under? Or do they have to go to the arcade like the rest of us?
50 million EU... about 500 policemen (Score:3, Informative)
Staggering.
Essentially 500 jobs worth of money shipped to bill gates every year.
And that is just france.
Re:did i read that wrong? (Score:5, Funny)
Yes.
I did have to pause a moment to think millions of what? Initially I thought people.
Re:Allies? (Score:5, Funny)
So can we now call Linux the Allies coming to save France? I didn't want to 'call' the other side of that.....
No! No, way! You absolutely, positively are NOT going to trick me into saying that Microsoft is the Axis of Evil! Do you have any idea how fast I'd be modded down by the Microsoft fanboys? Forget it! I'm not doing it!
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Is there a "law" that states Godwin's law will be applied to any and all conversations leading to references of Nazi's or Hitler? Kind of like a meta-law...
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So, you're suggesting a relationship in behavior between Microsoft's world domination, and that of Hitler and the Nazi party? :)
Would they really be a party? Most parties I've went to were fun events, involving booze, women, and loud music. Maybe they should be referred to as the Nazi bad guys club, or something like that. :)
Re:Mandriva snubbed? (Score:5, Informative)
First, a small precision: The Gendarmerie Nationale is not exactly the French national police (called Police Nationale in French), but an armed force (the fourth french armed force, after infantery Armée de Terre, navy = Marine Nationale, air force = Armée de l'Air). The small difference between Gendarmerie & Police is that Gendarmerie members are exactly soldiers (with strict military discipline).
In practice, Gendarmerie tend to work in rural or semi-rural areas, while Police tend to work in urban zones (actually, there exist some kind of competition between Gendarmerie and Police, which gives interesting french thriller films and books) And they have different legal abilities. For example, in some limited cases, a Gendarme can legally shoot his gun first, while in principle a Policier (policeman) can use his gun (policemen and gendarmes are armed with guns) only for self defense (but IANAL so I may be wrong).
Gendarmerie is centralized and military, so it was easy to order them to switch at once to Linux [no training needed; just an official order from a high-rank official]. And I hear their IT department was strong enough to customize (without subcontractors) some Ubuntu distribution to the exact needs of Gendarmerie (which includes access to some peculiar databases). This could be an explanation of why Gendarmerie did not need any support from Mandriva.
But Mandriva still has several French state contracts, including even research contracts on collaborative projects.
Disclaimer: I do work sometimes with Mandriva on collaborative research projects (such as GGCC [ggcc.info]).
Re:Sadly, "thanks" is all those programmers will g (Score:5, Informative)
no
they donated their code.
if they wanted to get paid for their code, they should have not donated their time.
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The French public sector (much bigger in proportion than the US one) did contribute significantly to opensource software (for example, the first linux thread library and Ocaml [inria.fr] has both been written by a French public sector researcher, Xavier Leroy, and you'll find thousands of other cases, like Frama-C [frama-c.cea.fr].).
Also, French government did issue several contracts (outside of Gendarmerie) to support opensource sof