Fedora 9 Preview Cleared for Launch

According to a post made yesterday to the Fedora announce mailing list, a Fedora 9 preview has been cleared for launch. "This is a Preview release, it is fairly close to what the final product will be like. This is the most critical release for the Fedora community to use and test and report bugs on. This is the last major public release before the final GOLD Fedora 9 release on May 13th (we hope). [...] Live images, KDE Live images, CDs and DVD options are available. http://torrent.fedoraproject.org has a section marked 'F9-Preview.'"

Feature List

[Nos.]

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/9/FeatureList [fedoraproject.org]

Re:Differences

[Phisbut]

Anyone have a link, or know off-hand, the major differences between this and the latest Ubuntu release? I realize there's the APT/RPM difference, but aside from that, what is notable?

KDE 4 [fedoraproject.org], among other things.

Re:Differences

[zedlander]

Fedora vs. Ubuntu [polishlinux.org]

Re:Differences

[pembo13]

Major difference? Well I can't enumerate them, but I can generalize things you'll see in Fedora compared to Ubuntu

• Continued work SELinux
• Continued work NetworkManager
• Continued work on PulseAudio
• Some other stuff that will make its way to Ubuntu once the bugs get worked out within Fedora (and upstream)
• Less specialization (ie. as a desktop) just a general operating system with utils and applications
• Work towards upstart (something Ubuntu already has I believe)
• Think I saw a few threads about ext4
• Think I saw a few threads about full disk encryption
• Jigdo support for sucking down images

Re:Differences

[fyrie]

First huge difference between the two is that Ubuntu has professional support if you want it. Another huge difference between the two is that Ubuntu typically only gets security updates and major bug fixes during a version lifespan whereas Fedora continually gets application updates over its version lifespan as new versions of individual apps are released.

So you could say that Fedora stays a little more bleeding edge throughout the version lifespan, and Ubuntu stays a bit more stable throughout the lifespan of a version.

Re:like it, but

[fyrie]

Most of that stuff is available in the livna repository. Standard procedure is to install the livna repo immediately and download the non free packages.

Re:Differences

[QuantumRiff]

after looking at the reply above to Fedora vs. Ubuntu [polishlinux.org] it appears that the package management has been drastically improved with Apt-Yum. I will have to play with Fedora again.

Re:Differences

[Phisbut]

I would find an RPM of something I wanted to install, it required me to first find and install another RPM, etc. Sometimes one of the dependant RPM's would not install, because I had a newer/older version for another program. Apt-get has worked flawlessly for me, and the HUGE pool of apps that just work has made it so I almost never have to search for .DEB files.

Comparing RPM to apt-get is apples to oranges. Either compare RPM to DEB, or yum to apt-get. I never had to bother with dependencies when using yum, just as you've never had to bother with dependencies using apt-get.

Re:SELinux is a pain in the ass.

[thule]

... thus the "continued work". Fedora has been trying to strike a balance and get rid of the separate 'strict' and 'targeted' by making better rules. It takes time, but I can tell you targeted works pretty good for me right now. It was easy for me to add an extended rule for an exception I needed. The 'continued work' is making good progress.

Re:calling 2005

[cbart387]

Now I have even lesser problems with a single huge repository and a couple of extra repos for proprietary codecs and drivers. It's been *really* smooth for me.

I agree. The only issue I've had was with a livna package overriding a package from an 'official' repository and causing yum to not complete an update. If you use the extra repositories I'd recommend the protectbase [centos.org] plugin. It provides a way to give precedence over certain repos so that you don't make yum mad.

Re:Did the yum-based upgrade make it into the tag?

[the COW OF DOOM (tm)]

There was never any talk about yum-based upgrades. Upgrading a live system is total insanity.

You're probably thinking of PreUpgrade, which is like a yum-based upgrade but without the insanity.

See the interview here for more info:
http://www.redhatmagazine.com/2008/04/15/interview-fedora-developers-seth-vidal-and-will-woods/ [redhatmagazine.com]

Re:like it, but

[the COW OF DOOM (tm)]

Yeah. It'd be great, if it wasn't illegal.

Here's the thing: it's not solely a matter of principle. Fedora has to play by a harder set of rules than Ubuntu. Fedora is backed by a public company, based in the US, so they answer to US law and Red Hat stockholders. And under US law, CYA just isn't enough, especially when there's multi-billion-dollar global megacorps who will take any opportunity they can find to sue you into oblivion.

Everyone would dearly love to be able to include mp3 codecs and ffmpeg and all that non-Free stuff. But they can't. So Red Hat and Fedora keep fighting the good fight - lobbying against software patents, pushing for open standards - and still people give them shit because they have to click two places instead of one to get MP3 support.

Way to focus on the big problems, people.

Re:Differences

[proxima]

Comparing RPM to apt-get is apples to oranges. Either compare RPM to DEB, or yum to apt-get. I never had to bother with dependencies when using yum, just as you've never had to bother with dependencies using apt-get.

I completely agree. Since my distros of choice over the last 5 years have been Fedora and Debian/Ubuntu, I've had a fair bit of experience with both yum and apt-get. Yum, at least as of the Fedora 8 install on my desktop, is simply not as good (IMO) as apt-get in Debian or Ubuntu for two reasons:

1.) yum is slow, horribly horribly slow. I think it may have gotten a little better in Fedora 8, and I've heard that they're putting serious work into it. Hopefully Fedora 9 will be better, but it never ceases to amaze me how long it takes to do a "yum search" to look for a package compared to "apt-cache search".

2.) The package repositories for Ubuntu (which is derived from the huge repository from Debian) are larger and more complete, at least for the random software I tend to look for. Again, Fedora is gaining in this regard, the community-supported package setup is starting to rival Ubuntu's universe, making this a huge step up over the old RedHat 7/8/9 days compared to Debian at that time. When it comes to software outside of either repository, RPMs tend to be more common than debs, which is an advantage for Fedora.

So yum (and the standard underlying repositories) are behind in those respects compared to apt-get, but the difference is shrinking. In yum's defense, I think they implemented package signing as a default requirement before Debian did, but I could be wrong on that.

I've run Fedora on my desktop for a while, but Kubuntu on my laptop. I honestly don't know what I'll install on my desktop next. I usually skip every other release, and since I'm on FC 8, that means waiting until FC10. This might be good anyway; I'm a KDE user, and KDE 4.0 just doesn't look feature complete. Best to wait until KDE 4.1 polishes everything a bit more, perhaps. I'm debating whether to try out the latest Kubuntu on my laptop when it's released this month to try out KDE 4.0.

Re:Release Candidate?

[the COW OF DOOM (tm)]

Correct: RC builds are not announced or mirrored worldwide. They're candidate images for testers to work with. They are publically available, though - anyone who's interested in helping can be a tester.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA [fedoraproject.org] is a good place to start if you're interested in testing Fedora.

Otherwise, the next major public release is F9 final, scheduled for May 13.

Re:what about youtube ? is it working ?

[Anonymous Coward]

YouTube functionality works just fine once you add the adobe-linux repo and install flash-plugin-9.0.124.0. It does on occasion flip out, but thats been the case with the adobe linux port for quite some time.

What is broken in Fedora x86_64 variants is Java plugin support from Sun. The icedtea plugin works great in most circumstances for small stuff, however larger java applets wont run without the Sun JRE. That JRE works fine in i386 but breaks because Sun has not released a 64 bit port for it yet.

Re:Debian/Ubuntu User asks: What's the big deal?

[427_ci_505]

>Does Fedora have a neat zero-fuss hardware recognition and will it install and run out of the box just as >fritionless as Ubuntu or Knoppix?

Multiple monitor setups are problematic, but other stuff works well.

>Will multi-source audio work out of the box? (wether with esound demon or whatever ... gosh, just asking this >question brings back those memories ... )

If by this you mean multiple programs can output sound at the same time, then yes.

>What about generic wireless stuff and extra function keys and all that? Especially on those new sub 1000 Euro >laptops popping up everywhere? If I get a fairly cheap generic laptop with all of todays bells and wistles, will >I be able to scrap Windows Fister and slap Fedore over it and utilize all the extra features or will it take a >week of expert-tweaking (which I don't have time and nerve for anymore) to get those things running?

On F8, with a Broadcom wireless card, I needed to cut the firmware out of the windows driver. That was annoying. After that it works well. I wish I had an intel card.

>>What's with Flash?

On an i386 it works fine. Just make sure to install an extra package that allows the sound to work with Pulse Audio. With that said, at least one of the versions of Adobe's plugin isn't too stable...

>>Java?

Seems to be doing ok.

>>Zero fuss install/uninstall/upgrade/dependancy tracking and resolution?

Yum does seem slower than apt-get, but I haven't had any problems with it besides.

>>What's with DVDs? Will I have to install 6 players of which only two kinda-sorta-maybe work 75% of the time or >>will there be *ONE* (1) DVD player that actually plays DVDs without getting into a hissy fit over CSS (I'm >>willing to install a Fedora DeCSS package by hand from a 'non-offical' source for that or do any other >>documented non-hacky actions in order to prepare for that)

mplayer or vlc should handle it, after installing the necessary pkgs.

>>What's with Video? What's with 3D?

The open source radeon driver seems to be working well with my older hardware.

>>Fedore Fan Crew - here's your chance to get a Debian/Ubuntu guy to give Fedora a try next time around. I'd like >>to read your thought on the issues above. Thanks.

I'd try a livecd. Just be aware that most of the software won't be there, since there is only so much that can fit on a livecd. I use debian on my other computer. So far, I'm liking fedora better. But debian is still pretty good.

That's a similarily, not a difference.

[SEMW]

Anyone have a link, or know off-hand, the major differences between this and the latest Ubuntu release?

KDE 4, among other things.

Both Kubuntu 8.04 RC and Fedora 9 Preview are available with KDE4.

Re:selinux

[init100]

Please run SELinux in permissive mode instead of disabling or even uninstalling it. If you ever would like to activate it again, running in permissive mode ensures that the proper security labels are maintained, while disabling or uninstalling SELinux causes the system to perform a time-consuming relabeling of all filesystems if/when SELinux is re-enabled.

Besides, if an application is giving you troubles, why not file a bug report in the Red hat Bugzilla? Post the output of setroubleshoot (the GUI application that explains what went wrong and why) in the report, and the Fedora developers can probably determine how to best change the security policy.