PC Superstore Admits Linux Hinge Repair Mistake 193
Erris writes "PC Superstore says their store manager was wrong to turn away a client with a broken hinge whose machine should have been repaired. 'El Reg put a call in to the DSGi-owned retail giant to get some clarification on PC World's Linux support policy. A spokesman told us that there had simply been a misunderstanding at the store and that, in fact, the normal procedure would be for the Tech Guys to provide a fix. [PC World] will provide a full repair once the firm has made contact with Tikka.'
It appears... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:It appears... (Score:5, Informative)
And now, my own opinion about PCWorld. They are technological idiots. I've lived in the states and now in the UK, and compared to these idiots those guys at BestBuy are hackers. I honestly don't believe you have to be more qualified to work at PCWorld than at, say, Burger King. You can manage a register, sweep floors? Good enough. They couldn't help even if they wanted to, which they don't. Extrapolating the behaviour of their workers to their management and I'm not surprised at all that it's PCWorld which pulls some crap like this.
Re:It appears... (Score:5, Informative)
This is why, despite needing a job I am not applying to PC world.
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Un-disputed that there are some real brain-dead numptys working behind the counter at PC World. On the other hand, I know at least one guy who wo
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For those too lazy to read the link, PCWorld is still refusing to fix the laptop. They aren't blaming it totally on Linux, now it is a mix of Linux and saying that the warranty doesn't cover the hinge because that is basic wear and tear.
Ugh, you know you cannot do this, but I would like to kick this guy in the balls, and if the police comes complaining, you'll say nothing's wrong, it's just "basic wear and tear". Hinges of laptops are notorious for breaking down. Well, tough luck for manufacturers, many of them seem to get it right nowadays. 3 years should be a minimum for a laptop. If we cannot enforce that, we'll be drifting in shitty products for the next 1000 years.
Re:Interesting... (Score:4, Funny)
Day 2: Got a job at PC World.
Day 3: I've been promoted to manager.
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I used to be a blastocyst, you insensitive clod!
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ZOMG AN EX 2 YEAR OLD PROGRAMMING C++!!!!!11!11
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If I had mod points at the moment, I would be giving out a few -1 offtopis here.
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And while these cases may be in the minority (which I see no reason to believe without some evidence or links), they are not so uncommon as to be ignorable.
Re:Ready to burn some karma. (Score:5, Funny)
I know, my other computer is your windows box.
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I wish that he would post the video that he took when he went back to talk to the manager a second time. The dickishness he describes sounds outrageous.
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"I see someone has been drinking from the fountain of stupid again."
Re:It appears... (Score:5, Informative)
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"After I booked the ticket, I noticed something strange: there were no travel details on how I would get from San Jose to San Francisco. I called Orbitz and they told me that I would have to provide my own transportation from San Jose to San Francisco. What?"
Orbitz didn't point out that it was anything like it ended up being. You see two airports and you assume you're flying between them. Or that there's transportation provided. The simple fact in Mr. Maddox's case is that the comp
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Not only was the schedule invalid, but it depended on the customer paying for transportation between stops without informing the customer of that fact.
It's quite the incompetent travel agent who books you flights, but neither books transportation between stops nor informs you that you need to do this. That's HIS JOB that's why you
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SHeesh, read the whole page, including the letter orbitz sent him:
In other words: It Was A Valid Schedule. At least according to the airlines Orbitz got the info from.
it depended on the customer paying for tr
Oh no. Re:It appears... (Score:2)
Someone, please, tell me that PC World is not that stupid. Tell me that web page belongs to someone other than the AC that submitted the original story and was latter identified only as "Tikka". It violates their own store policy [pcworld.co.uk]. Their PR people told The Register they would take care of it. Tell me the video was taken days ago. I'd really rather hear anything other than some self important moron is making life difficult for a Linux user, against store policy, common decency and half the internet's out
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Someone, please, tell me that PC World is not that stupid. Tell me that web page belongs to someone other than the AC that submitted the original story and was latter identified only as "Tikka". It violates their own store policy. Their PR people told The Register they would take care of it. Tell me the video was taken days ago. I'd really rather hear anything other than some self important moron is making life difficult for a Linux user, against store policy, common decency and half the internet's outrage. No? Poor Mr. Tank.
Nope. PC World are that bad. After years of experience with the various Dixons group stores, including working for one of the chains for a few years, I washed my hands of them.
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I am so sorry I was right (EU Law notwithstanding)... these are the hassles with hinge issues.
And, all you EU folks who jumped on me last time - when I said this would happen, don't jump on me again with how the law will help them now.
I'm not disputing whether the law is on his side or not... we covered that extensively last time around. But honestly, perhaps there is a better method than getting back on your high-horse about what's legal; because obviously that doesnt matter - INSTEAD (THOSE OF YOU IN
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Correlaries perhaps...
Those in the EU debating this and that back and forth could hopefully instead spend some time finding legal correlaries (that actually apply) to help this person - for instance, in the US, they invalidated clauses in vehicle warranties that required you HAD to take it back to the manufacturer for such regular maintenace as oil changes...
Are there similar correlaries in EU law? Someone over there has to know, so this person has something else to arm them with... something that fits
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900 diggs! It's front page! (Score:2)
How many people read digg?
Corporate account (Score:2)
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You may have a point, though (I don't have Firefox to confirm your complaints about rendering badly). It doesn't seem to be rendering right in Internet Explorer 6 either. To not work right in IE6 or Firefox seems almost criminal.
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Make sure to tag this (Score:1, Funny)
Really Cool! (Score:1, Offtopic)
A second post from an AC mentions the fabulous twitter and you have managed to create a tag that will point to more good stories in the future. Keep advertising my friend twitter [slashdot.org].
Everyone else should check out the Vista Failure Log [slashdot.org] these AC's hate so much. It and most of what twitter posts is more intersting than a story about some clueless and rude manager at a big box store.
If you want to read some really intersting news, visit Stallman's Blog [stallman.org], which is updated every other day.
we're sooo sorry! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Not a big deal (Score:5, Insightful)
3 words : word of mouth
Us Linux users are the ones that friends/relatives/etc. turn to when they need computer advise. If they piss us off, guess who we aren't recommended to those friends/relatives/etc.
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Only a misunderstanding if you get caught. (Score:5, Insightful)
Also, how many other people have already been turned away for hardware warranty repairs based on what software was on their machine?
Re:Only a misunderstanding if you get caught. (Score:4, Insightful)
This isn't about Linux. It never was. Linux just happened to serve as an excuse for denial of service. This regularly happens to non-techie customers who don't install alternate OSs. To consumers of all sorts of electronic products. They STILL get denied service. They get convinced by customer "service" that the product is not eligible for free or low-cost repair.
The thing is, American customer service is much like American insurance -- it's nothing but a financial black hole in the eyes of the bean counters. It's about saving a little money now. Every payment, every reimbursement, every repair denied is a few bucks saved. Who cares if the customer is unsatisfied? The corporations certainly don't
It's all about the numbers. Denying service to customers saves a little bit each time. If the rate of lost sales because of individual angry customers is less than the money saved from denial of service, it's a win. It's only in their interest -- or rather, the interest of their bottom line -- to service the customer if the angry customer breeds anger among many more customers, say via the Internet, and causes many lost sales that far exceed the costs of the simple customer care they should have provided in the first place.
This is capitalist shortsightedness at its worst. Bad word of mouth hurts more in the long run. Satisfaction leads to good word of mouth which leads to more sales. As a personal example, I always make a note to people about how phenomenal Nintendo customer service is. I tell them about a problem, they fix it immediately. I know for a fact that my advice has caused a few more sales of Wiis rather than (usually) PS2s. See, since Nintendo didn't penny-pinch with the cost of repairs for my system, they indirectly made more money through my satisfaction. This is foresight that I wish American companies had. I think we'd all be happier for it.
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That depends a whole lot on where you shop. The kind of service you want is expensive; you can't get it at value stores because there isn't enough margin to support the cost. There are a lot of companies out there who know how important customer service is, and who provide it in order to keep customers like you.
It turns out
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Don't shop at PC World (Score:4, Informative)
Sadly, PC World has also put a lot of the good little computer stores out of business which is why they can behave so badly.
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PC World employees are, by and large, not the sharpest tools in the box, and their managers are typically worse. They flat out LIE to cusomters about the products they're pushing, and use FUD to cajole people into buying things. Their components sales are horrifically overpriced. Last time I bought a network cable there it was £12 (~$25) for a 3m Cat5. I've heard someone tel
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Wait -- your keyboard didn't work, and you had to prove it with an operating system?
Have these fucktards never heard of a BIOS??
Not surprised... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Not surprised... (Score:5, Insightful)
i'm amazed that a pc world customer had heard of linux, nevermind installed it.
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Hateful people.
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To my mom a geek is: Someone that can fix my computer when it breaks.
To me it means: Someone that has an understanding of what computer parts are needed to assemble one from scratch and has a THOROUGH understanding of computers.
TO PC world it might mean:
1. They want to be able to fix computers. Not today, and not tomorrow, but someday, maybe.
2. They know how to turn it on and off and know when it doesn't boot up it's broken and needs fixed.
3. The
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Too right! It has to say something about how ready linux is for the ordinary person when someone who buys from PC World can install and run it.
Unless it was Linspire, of course.
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Also, don't be surprised that there are geeks out there who recognize a bargain pc/laptop at a big chain when they see one. Best Buy doesn't have a line around their stores on Black Friday for nothing.
Re:Not surprised... (Score:4, Interesting)
And then you get random blue collar workers running it because it can revive old hardware, it helps them get more from their tiny discretionary income, and it helps them do their job when they have management that will never give them approval to buy software.
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I've bought two PCs from PC World over the course of the last 5 years or so. I don't use Linux now, but for a couple of years it was my primary OS. In my time I've upgraded my kernel and gcc from source, manually upgrade from libc5 to glibc, hand-hacked modeline entries in my XF86Config file when my monitor wasn't detected properly, etc.
So, having established some geek credibility, why'd I buy from PC World? Simple - they had a sa
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Never forget that it's easier to announce that you're changing a policy than to actually do so.
Good (Score:4, Insightful)
Also, this is evidence that Linux systems are gaining ground -- issues like this are "growing pains."
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This is wrong. In the US, at least, it is illegal to deny warranty coverage for any hardware modification which is not directly linked to the malfunction. For example, if you replace your hard drive and it subsequently blows your ATA controller then they don't have to fix that, but it is illegal for them to refuse to fix your screen if it is also defective.
Replacing the software will void the warranty on any compone
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One of the reasons that I didn't buy a Gateway when they had a local store was their warranty coverage policy. Fortunately, I checked before I bought.
Although, thinking about it, you may be technically correct. I believe that their statement was to the effect that in order to get warranty coverage I had to either restore the machine to it's original condition or allow them to do so. Including wiping *ALL* files on the hard disk and ref
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2.) Thanks for this clarification, I did not know that was the case. I always thought that is the way things SHOULD be, but it is somewhat rare in this country that the way things "should be" coincides with they way things "are."
Leave it to an AC... (Score:2)
In the US, a warrantor can say the whole warranty is nullified if you hang fuzzy dice off the corner of your screen. The only thing they need to do is state so in plain terms. Read the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act [house.gov], if you want to know.
Most of the "they can't do X" crap, like the AC's comment, stems from a misinterpretation of one specific part of the act"
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The Microsoft mindset does not determine law (Score:4, Informative)
I specifically state 'UK' here because that's the only country I know this for sure of. It's pretty reasonable to assume this sort of protection is available elsewhere as well. What you suggest would amount to an override of local law which is impossible. You can't even get rid of such a law in small print in the contract as it will be found invalid in court - not that everyone + dog in business doesn't try..
I had Dolphin Kitchens try to pull a fast one on me that way, all the way to a 'regional manager' telling me that I signed and it was thus valid. I spoke to Trading Standards and approximately 15 minutes after they had a little chat with the company I got a phone call claiming a 'trainee manager' error. The moment I hear that excuse the company's off my list. If they can't even be upfront and tell me they screwed up I can't invest any trust in them.
The incident response of "it was a mistake" is total and utter BS. I'm pretty sure that the customer will have asked for a manager to discuss this, and said manager will have told him the same which suggest it's company policy (not store, COMPANY policy) rather than "a mistake".
I think the only mistake they feel they will have made is not even the public relations hit because it's mainly on geek sites and sufficiently 'geeky' customers avoid that shop anyway unless it's something simple. No, the mistake they feel they have made is attracting Trading Standards and Consumer Direct's attention to the store - no store likes to be picked over by a Government department proving they're needed, especially if the validity of the complaint is well above doubt.
So, if you want to do anything I would suggest telling you NON-geek friends. See if your local newspaper wants to carry the story..
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The shop effectively broke the law by refusing to repair the laptop (but why did the guy not contact the manufacturer directly instead?).
Probably because in the UK the relevant consumer rights only apply to the contract between you and the retailer you bought the product from. The origninal manufacturers may offer an additional warranty but as you have no contract with them you have no remedy against them if they refuse to honour it. (You'd have to sue the retailer and claim that the manufacturer's warranty was an essential part of the reason for the purchase.)
IME (in the UK) in consumer disputes any action that is not focused on working
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You are quite co
Yeah - I like the Consumer Credit Act :-) (Score:2)
Having said that, the few times I had to us
Riiiiight (Score:3, Informative)
And I'm sure that there was some policy that they can quote to back up that "misunderstanding" and it was a totally isolated event.
Pretty cut and dry denial of warranty of hardware based on software. If the manager denies service it's not a misunderstanding it's policy. Unless they can show the documents that the manager specifically didn't follow, it's a case of consumer backlash changing a companies operating practices.
I'll believe the "misunderstanding" cop out for the responsibility when they can show policy documents that state that the OS doesn't matter in cases of obvious hardware defect. If they've got that on file, if it was a misunderstanding and every higher level employee involved in that case goes back through basic training for service repair qualification, I'll believe it.
As usual... (Score:5, Insightful)
A junior employee or contractor made an error that is against our policy.
Translated:
A local store manager is foolishly given broad discretion to run the local store and making ass-pulled risk estimates such as "this guy can't possibly escalate his complaint from porch-seat grumbling to global public-relations catastrophe."
Welcome to the 21st Century. (Score:2)
PC World got Slashdotted!!! (Score:2, Funny)
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But it does work. The DMV screwed me, I went to trial the other day and they couldn't come up with any evidence (they were in the wrong). That's 3 points that didn't get on my license.
I'm doing something similar with the IRS. To get the best deal I can out of them involves hiring accountants and lawyers and costs thousands, but it will save me three times what it costs.
Yuck editors, trolls ahoy (Score:1, Informative)
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I really could do without watching some AC flirting with the guy he likes.
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Erris: stop responding to people like this. All they want is to be noticed. It doesn't matter if you're right or wrong: if they think you're paying attention to them, t
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A well-fed troll is a happy troll. I have to admit I almost feel guilty advocating the open-source software philosophy because of the divisive, alienating attitude in "their" posts. I know it's just a hideous caricature of how advocacy is typically done in the real world, but still...bleah.
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This is not about linux. (Score:1)
Laziness at work.
Wrong Name... (Score:1)
(english rhyming slang for you yanks)
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what English word did Austin Powers bring to America?
give you a hint, rhymes with tank but starts with a W.
I'm sure this has been said already (Score:3, Funny)
How to fix all of this (Score:5, Funny)
Take a crowbar and a fish. Pry the broken hinge open so as to free the penguin, then toss the fish to give the penguin an incentive to get out of the laptop. You may need to clean out the accumulated penguin filth.
Then take the laptop to a replacement window specialist to put windows back in the laptop. Once that is done, take the laptop to have the hinge serviced. Tada! all is well.
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Summary (Score:2, Funny)
Our bad.
Sincerely,
The Management
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No idea why you're writing to me, the issue is with PC World [pcworld.co.uk].
Sincerely,
hardware not software (Score:1)
There was one time a Radio Shack district manager gave me the "Oh, we don't support Apples" song and dance when the item I came in to purchase was a DB9-to-DB25 serial cable off the shelf for my external modem.
And then there was the time I actually had to say to a salesperson, "Okay, let's forget I mentioned what kind of mach
I wonder... (Score:1)
At this point... (Score:2)
not just PC World, perhaps? (Score:2)
You might then also notice on the 'Job Opportunities' menu references to Currys and Dixons. They are other high street tech stores in the UK.
I can't help but wonder if Curry's and Dixons' customer support is equally poor.
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A former colleague of mine had terrible trouble with a TV he purchased from Currys. It took about 3 or 4 months to sort out, with him having to take a day off every few weeks to sit at home waiting for them to deliver replacement/pick up broken TV.
Worked out OK in the end - they sent him one worth 3 times what he originally paid. I think he must have got through to the one person in the customer service department who really did care. Even then, they were probably on their last day at work so there
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As an example of "Currys Digital" pricing, a cable connecting headphones output of an iPod to a ca
it was a theme (Score:2)
Re:it was a theme (Score:5, Funny)
mod parent up (Score:2)
One more place NOT to buy from (Score:2)
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