
"Enemies of Linux" Trying to Undermine OS? 545
Pinawella writes "It's reported on VNUnet that 'Enemies of Linux' are trying to undermine the OS with a campaign of disinformation. It's based on an interview with an exec from the Open Source Development Labs, but who are these enemies?"
First post (Score:3, Insightful)
Jesus fucking christ people, it isn't that hard
Re:First post (Score:3, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:First post (Score:2, Funny)
Or even "friends with benefits," seeing how those companies are in bed with Linux to some extent or another. That chubby penguin gets around. ;)
Re:First post (Score:3, Interesting)
Yes Sun do open source stuff but you just have to look at the way they're pitching themselves nowadays against Linux - head on. The whole Solaris 10 for free thing is to persuade people to stick with Sun even if in reality a "free" Solaris is anything but when you slap on support costs.
Re:First post (Score:3, Interesting)
Its also a teensy b
Re:First post (Score:5, Insightful)
And you think that translates into an "enterprise ready" game plan!?!??!!?!?
The article talks about Linux being an enterprise class OS. It's not an OS. Not all Linux distributions are enterprise ready. If you install Oracle on Debian, are you going to get support from Oracle or Debian? If you install WebSphere on Mandrake, will you get support? Even if you install Fedora and grab all the SRPMS for RHEL to setup a Samba server, is Microsoft going to help you if you're having problems connecting your windows desktops to it?
An operating system for a server doesn't do anything except provide a base to install what it is that will run the server tasks in enterprise deployments. If you can't get the software stack supported on the operating system, it's a mute point. People choose linux because they want to cut down their deployment and support costs and spend more money on the part that actually does the work. Even if you set up all that stuff your self and get it to work, the time and effort in getting it done and keeping it up to date has to factor in.
CentOS, is NOT a free RHEL. It is built from the SRPMS but you won't get support for it from people that support RHEL and it is not something that Red Hat is providing. The people that make CentOS (which is very good) take advantage of the GPL and build their own distro based on RHEL. Red Hat doesn't seem too happy about this.
I wasn't talking about OpenSolaris. OpenSolaris is different from Solaris. Apparently there's a pilot program for OpenSolaris with developers and about 50 or so ISV's. You can't even compare OpenSolaris to Linux. OpenSolaris is an operating system. Linux is a kernel. Just curious, what are these restrictions on OpenSolaris anyway? That it's not GPL'ed? That doesn't prohibit you from including GPL'ed tools with it, you just can't mix OpenSolaris and GPL code together. You can't take GPL code and put it into BSD'd code without making the BSD code GPL either. But you're right, it still hasn't arrived yet. Right now, it's still yet to be delivered, but Solaris 10 is out there.
Solaris 10 is free as in beer. You don't have to pay to deploy it, you just have to pay for support if you choose to but nothing is stopping you from downloading it and installing it on a bunch of systems. If you buy something like Oracle that is certified for Solaris 10, you can get support from Oracle even if you're not paying for support from Sun. If you buy support from Sun and install software on it, you can get support from Sun. Try to get support from Oracle for CentOS, SAP, Websphere, Peoplesoft, etc.
Linux IS free. Linux is not an operating system. Most people don't want kernels, they want operating systems. Without talking about specific linux distros, this article is just osdl marketing fluff. Don't get me wrong. It's not that I don't think RHEL or SuSE Enterprise Linux are enterprise ready, or that even the newest linux kernel is. But when you talk about linux os's in general, like this article, the argument doesn't work. A kernel alone is pretty much useles. This is talking about how good the kernel is, implying the operating systems that are built on it will have all the same qualities which isn't true.
Just a Kernel? (Score:3, Insightful)
The linux kernel is just a kernel (much like the solaris kernel is just a kernel), but when most people talk about 'Linux' they're usually talking about far more than just an operating system -- what RMS would rather be referred to GNU/Linux -- This includes the kernel, the OS tools, and the various apps that come with most distros. Whether it's the wide 3rd party support you get for RedHat RPMs, the boot-from-a-CD convenience of knoppix or the buil
Re:Just a Kernel? (Score:3, Insightful)
"Mic
Re:First post (Score:5, Funny)
Who are the enemies
Just to the right of where the article says ,"So-called "enemies of Linux" are conducting a systematic campaign of disinformation which aims to undermine the enterprise credibility of the open source operating system", I see an add for MS's Get the Facts campaign. Hmmmm.
Re:First post (Score:5, Funny)
Re:First post (Score:2, Funny)
Re:First post (Score:2, Insightful)
Red Hat.
Between forking their own distro and using a package manager that doesn't work and play well with others, they've gone a long way to undermine the OS.
Oh, and enemy 4.
Richard Stallman
Besides running around telling everybody who will or will not listen that we all need to call it "Guh-Noo Linux" from now on and forever, the author and cheerleader-in-chief of the GPL is such a cantankerous cuss that it's hard not to reflexively be against anything which he's for.
Then there's en
Re:First post (Score:2, Insightful)
Linux is free, and freely available.
The above-mentioned companies and those like them want to charge you money.
Sun is especially sore, but at least they see their demise in the rearview mirror.
IBM, because Linux commoditizes their hardware.
Microsoft, because they can't patent a whole bunch of stuff, and that linux-based desktop distros are going to kick their earnings into the ground and they know it.
Apple becaus
Re:First post (Score:3, Informative)
I don't agree with this.
Any "solution" which places sensitive corporate data on hardware which is not under complete control, physical and logical, of the corporation, is just asking for IP theft (read: Industrial Espionage), and in my opinion, the CIO/IT Management should be dissmissed on the grounds of malfeasance.
Re:First post (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:First post (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:First post (Score:3, Insightful)
The enemy of my friend (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The enemy of my friend (Score:5, Funny)
The freak of my friend is my foe's fan...
Re:The enemy of my friend (Score:3, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:um sure. (Score:5, Insightful)
"Criticized" is one thing; "slandered" is another. Linux is far from perfect, and all but the most rabid zealots acknowledge this; there are many valid criticisms to be made, and in some cases the validity of these criticisms is sufficient to point users direction of Windows or one of the proprietary flavors of Unix.
BUT
Re: (Score:2)
Re:um sure. (Score:2, Troll)
Naturally. Criticism is protected speech; slander is not.
Do you believe that the information being distributed about Linux by its competitors rises to the level of slander? If so, when do you think there will be a lawsuit filed regarding it?
Re:um sure. (Score:4, Insightful)
In any case, I wasn't trying to make a legalistic distinction. I don't know, and don't especially care, if the FUD Microsoft et al. are throwing at Linux rises to the legal definition of slander or not. (I also don't believe that corporations or organizations should be able to sue for slander at all, but that's a whole 'nother argument.) But it is definitely slanderous, rather than critical, in tone and content: that is, it's "words falsely spoken that damage the reputation of another" rather than real analysis of the relative merits and flaws of Linux as compared to other OSs.
Re:um sure. (Score:2)
Axis of evil (Score:4, Funny)
Is it Mr. White of 42 Evergreen Terrace?
Perhaps the little old lady who lives across the road?
Or, almost inconceivably, the vicar's wife, Mrs. Candor?
Or, just perhaps, is this a thinly veiled attack against Microsoft?
Could it just be more FUD?
Just because they want to kill you (Score:5, Funny)
Just very very very hostile.
enemies (Score:4, Funny)
Make up with your lover,
who's greedy to be back
in your good graces.
Daughter,
because you've taken anger to extremes,
you won't amount
to a hill of beans.
-Hla Stavhana
Let us not make a hill of beans for our enemies!
And the point is... (Score:5, Funny)
Well that's a new tactic...
Who are these enemies? (Score:5, Funny)
Why the BSD people of course. Everyone knows the BSD triangle of NetBSD, FreeBSD and OpenBSD are out to get Linux. BSD stands for BKill SDamn DPenguin. What other free OS is there that could feel threatened?
Re:Who are these enemies? (Score:2)
Re:Who are these enemies? (Score:3, Funny)
Nonsense. Only Linux users spell that badly.
Re:Who are these enemies? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Who are these enemies? (Score:5, Funny)
Damn, you beat me to it, I was going to go for an "Axis of BSDvil"
The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:5, Insightful)
Why can't we just unite like all the good apps on windows, mac os, qnx, amiga.. and everything else with a real solid dev team?
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2)
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2)
It's a shame that things have gotten so crummy lately... it didn't used to be this way. When I started using
Linux, everything was consistant; highlight, middle-click. It ALL worked that way, and it was good. Some
people clamoured for a keystroke-based copy, and they made sound arguments, but it was really a matter of
preference, and we had something that worked and was consis
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2)
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2)
This always seemed like a pretty stupid way of doing things to me. OK, autocopying is fair enough for some apps where text tends to scroll, making manual copying annoying (IRC clients, etc), but in the main I prefer the Windows way of doing it.
And what's the the Linux assumption that your mouse will have a third button? There're still plenty o
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:3, Interesting)
Fine. No problem. You don't want to relearn how to do a basic GUI operation that you've been doing the same way for years.
Neither do I. That's what this is about.
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:5, Insightful)
Linux is Free software, and most of the stuff running on it is usually also Free software. That has costs, and one of those costs is that people will write whatever they feel like writing. You won't be able to force people to conform. You can have things like Freedesktop.org [freedesktop.org] to lay out some suggested standards, but no one is compelled to follow them. The only way to enforce consistency is to dictate that there is only one way to do things, and the only realistic way to do that is to have a single group in sole control of all the core libraries, which means they need to locked down to prevent forking parallel development, etc. If that's what you want, great. It's out there and available right now: Apple is offering it with MacOS X, Microsoft is offering it with Windows. If you want Free software with open source, you have to be willing to take the bad with the good.
Jedidiah.
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2, Informative)
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:5, Interesting)
Yeah. Most users would have a hard time with Linux if they have to find out about the differences between GNOME, GTK, KDE/Qt, Motif, (insert random toolkit here) applications, all with their own rules of usability, standards, and copy/paste. Heck, there are different methods for copy-paste that are inconsistent (some X apps use the middle button, others use a Windows/Macintosh sytle method).
Why hasn't somebody already came up with the "Unified Clipboard," which supports all of the common X toolkits (or better yet, why do the GNOME/KDE/whomever developers have to design their own clipboards rather than use what X provides?)? Is it really that difficult? Even though I'm a supporter of different choices (I feel it is great that there is a choice between GNOME, KDE, and many other environments), I also feel that there should be compatibility between these different toolkits.
Remember, most users don't (and shouldn't have to) care about the differences between KDE, GNOME, GTK, and the rest. They want to take advantage of a variety of applications, many times from a variety of toolkits. They want to copy some text from their web browser and paste it into a word processor without fuss, and they want copy-paste to work everywhere in the exact same way.
GNOME and KDE's mission is to reach out to the desktop users, right? Some competition with each other is a good thing, but the two different toolkits should have some compatibility with each other, especially in the realm of cut/paste.
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:3, Insightful)
But you see copy and paste doesn't work under Windows or MacOS X if you hold it to the same standards. On MacOS X if you use an X app then copy and paste doesn't perfectly integrate with the rest of your MacOS X apps. Same for Windows - try using Ctrl-C Ctrl-V on Win
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2)
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:2)
Press and hold the left mouse button.
While still holding drag your cursor over the text you want to copy.
Click your cursor at the location in the app you want to paste to.
Works on almost every app except some non native linux apps.
I have like 400 users who do manage to copy/paste in linux so i figure youre an odd user. That said, why the Bush Junior should Gnu/Linux take the blame for some apps that dont handle copy and paste? Its the damn developers of said applications you should be hau
Re:The biggest enemy is ourself. (Score:3, Informative)
Just select the text, and middle-click where you want it. I have yet to find a single combination of programs where this doesn't work.
Enimies of Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
It's a f-ing operating system for god(s) sake people. It doesn't have enimies, it has competitors.
Re:Enimies of Linux (Score:5, Insightful)
As a Mac guy, I've seen this before. Typical exchange:
"I'm sick of all the viruses and crashes I get on my Windows box!"
"Well, you could try a Mac
"OMG LOL M4XZ I5 T3H 5VX0RZ!"
"Um, well, it's a pretty good machine, actually, and it doesn't have any viruses
"I'M SO SICK OF ALL YOU MAC FANATICS!"
(etc.)
So if Linux people are starting to get a little defensive, that's pretty much why, I think.
Re:Enimies of Linux (Score:2)
I'd say around 1996. Either you've been in outerspace for the past 10 years, just heard of linux recently, or this is your first time logging into slashdot.
Re:Enimies of Linux (Score:3, Insightful)
Somewhere in the 0.99 days as I recall.
Well, maybe it's taking a page out of the Scientologists playbook then. Kidding aside, I thought it was a really wierdly-worded sentiment as well.
Re:Enimies of Linux (Score:2)
Just so you know in the future.
Natural enemies include... (Score:5, Funny)
http://www.antarcticconnection.com/antarctic/wildl ife/penguins/index.shtml [antarcticconnection.com]
Sheesh slashdot editors, at least do a simple google search first!
Re:Natural enemies include... (Score:2)
hmm (Score:4, Insightful)
It's no real surprize that people want to get rid of it. If not for Linux we'd have a choice of two OS (Windows or OSX) and not many people want to buy a mac just for the OS.. Get rid of Linux and Microsoft's market share once again becomes uncontested, keep it around and it'll slowly dwindle untill Linux and Windows are running evenly.
Re:hmm (Score:2)
Solaris
AIX
FreeBSD
OpenBSD
NetBSD
HPUX
T
I am sure there's more, but there's lot's of OTHER things then the desktop. The desktop is just hte most visible one out there.
Its not enimity (Score:2, Informative)
http://ask.slashdot.org/askslashdot/02/11/13/21272 27.shtml?tid=109&tid=4 [slashdot.org]
Re:Its not enimity (Score:4, Interesting)
I had a look at the parent post's link and noted that it was from 2002 and even still there were a number of positive comments regarding Linux.
They key point from my perspective is this: nobody is telling you that you have to run Linux. All that is being said is that it's there if you want to try it and use it, and in a great number of cases, it's available for free. Nope, the gaming and some commercial apps aren't all there, but for the vast majority of computer use it's just fine.
I run dual boots on pretty all my computers at home except my firewall/gateway, which runs linux exclusively. I game more on my windows boots, and I work more on my Linux boots. Windows lacks the combined capabilities of bash, perl and gnu tools (unless you want to run cygwin). I don't mind spending the time to learn how to use the gimp. Like many *nix tools, it's great once you've spent the time to learn how to use it. Remember, however, that nobodies telling you that you HAVE to use linux. It's just an option being provided by your friendly OSS community.
Actually one of my friends does have to use linux (Score:2)
Moral of the story: be kind to geeks, for they have root access.
Re:Its not enimity (Score:3, Insightful)
But installing an operating system is something that most people will never do in their lives. It's something that even the most hard-core computer hobbyist might do once every year or two. It's just not important.
What's important is the ability to accomplish tasks with a computer. Have your students take three computers out of
Re:Its not enimity (Score:2)
Give more anti-Linux FUD, it will only backfire. (Score:2, Informative)
Messages that criticize OSS, Linux, & the GPL are NOT effective. Messaging that discusses possible Linux patent violations, pings the OSS development process for lacking accountability, attempts to call out the 'viral' aspect of the GPL, and the like are only marginally effective in driving unfavorable opinions around OSS, Linux, and the GPL, and in some cases BACKFIRE.
http://www.opensource.org/halloween/halloween7. p hp
how to count (Score:5, Insightful)
This is a good point, but asking OSDL members this question is somewhat akin to doing a survey of how many people run IIS among ASP developers.
I've only ever purchased one server with linux preloaded (from Dell). Every other linux system I've ever owned has come blank, except one workstation that had a copy of Windows preloaded.
Officially, I have 1 linux system, but in reality, I have probably 15 active systems.
Unnamed Vendors? (Score:5, Funny)
Did anyone else picture Nelson Pratt coughing "MICROSOFT!" right after saying "unnamed vendor"?
who are these enemies? (Score:5, Interesting)
Do Penguins taste nice?
It may sound like a strange question but people do actually eat penguins. In Antarctica there are research stations where scientists live for months or even years so for them having a penguin for dinner is much like us having a Sunday roast. From their experiences we have been told that they taste like duck and that they also have a high oil content, due to all the fish that they eat. Guano miners also eat penguins whilst they are working near to Humboldt colonies; this however is bad news, as the Humboldt penguin is now a critically endangered species. Guano is old piles of penguin poo and it is mined for as it makes a good fertiliser, this practice is also detrimental to the wild Humboldt penguin population.
Clearly, these people are trying to undermine Linux by spreading the word that penguin meat is tasty and nutritious.
"OMG they're eating Tux. You Bastards!"
Re:who are these enemies? [OT] (Score:2)
Thanks to your post, I will now scratch off "Pet a penguin" and add "Eat a penguin."
They forget (Score:5, Insightful)
Nobody owns it (apart from !SCO), anybody can release their/a version of it, and more important, all the coders and developers don't really give a shit who uses it.
People that USE it though know the truth, and my Financial Manager likes it too, even though he doesn't really know what it is. He knows what £0:00 is, though.
Not suprising... (Score:2)
The question is whether or not this is the usual suspects (Microsoft) or some counter grassroots organization (Beos, BSD).
So long as it stays on the up and up, a little competition and criticism is a good thing. (IE The complaints of FireFox not responding quickly to recent security problems. That's a valid concern)
Well its the same (Score:2)
the biggest enemy of linux is OS X (Score:2)
I'm getting ready to download a PPC distro to put on a G3 Server I picked up on ebay for 20 bucks, so I'm not anti-linux, (though I have to admit it's mostly becuase OS 9 is such a loser)....I just dont know why one would make that choice, and I am open to hearing from linux folk as to why they would run Linux on Apple's mode
Re:the biggest enemy of linux is OS X (Score:2, Interesting)
Kinda like the difference between living in a dictatorship where everyone is well fed and gets all sorts of cool free stuff, or barely scraping by in a full democracy. Some people value the freed
Re:the biggest enemy of linux is OS X (Score:5, Interesting)
Both gratis and libre, and both of those are excellent reasons for me.
I'm curious about OSX, and I'd like to give it a go, but:
So Darwin is Open Source: big deal. The rest of MacOS X is the ultimate in closed software.
Do we really need the propaganda tone? (Score:2)
A press release, not a story. (Score:3, Interesting)
Heck, we're quoting Nelson Pratt -- the "marketing director of the pro-Linux organisation" -- at enormous length. Add a straw man to your press release -- poof! It's a news item!
This sort of thing, from Taco no less, doesn't help Linux's credibility much.
well what a great poll (Score:2)
The myth of "Linux competitors" (Score:5, Insightful)
But to call these "competitors" of Linux is to misunderstand the nature of the threat.
Linux is not a business, it is not a strategy, it is not a concept.
Linux represents the brutal and unflinching march of technology towards the zero price point. Linux - and all free & open-source software - exists because all the barriers to its existence have been gradually razed.
The first rule of competition is that all players must be playing the same game. How can anyone seriously still think that Linux and (e.g.) Microsoft are playing the same game?
The game is not over - there is no game, and there never was.
Re:The myth of "Linux competitors" (Score:2)
Re:Zero Price Point (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Zero Price Point (Score:4, Insightful)
I said that technology moves towards a zero price point, not that people's labour does.
The price of labour is affected by a different equation, namely the elimination of barriers that previously stopped other people competing for the same jobs.
Any student of economics will understand that competition is a positive force. Seeing one's salary undercut by competition is tough, but it may be the incentive you need to rethink your job, your productivity, and your role in society.
Google (Score:2)
Disclaimer: The ad is in Danish, and it may thus be only the Danish branch of MS buying these adwords. It's possible that similar ads won't show up if the same search is done from other countries.
P.S.: If the ads show up, feel free to click them. Wouldn't want Google to miss out on a bit of revenue, would you?
Uh... (Score:2)
I like to watch the videos of brainwashed CEO's talking about how they would never trust their business to "a bunch of freeware".
We are all a bit one-sided here... (Score:2)
Not saying it isn't true, but the wording is quite funny.
FOSS doesn't want to compete (Score:5, Insightful)
Now that IBM, RHN and Novell are in the ring, Microsoft, Oracle, CA and everyone else are starting to see Linux as a competitor. The problem is that most people in FOSS are not used to competition, they prefer enemies. Enemies are easier to vilify and ridicule. Competitors who are eating your lunch are not. This whole "we are holier than thou and you are so evil" thing is not going to work out there in the real world. Linux needs to compete, not be surrounded by fanboys who can pick their noses and chuckle when they write "Microshaft" and "Windoze".
Slashdot has been the main front in this whining battle for the past few years. It's gone mainstream now, of sorts, and people are starting to notice the ridiculous "OMFG WINDOZE IS TEH SUXX" headlines that adorn the front page day in and day out, complete with borg icon. And don't complain about Microsoft saying this or the other about Linux when most of you spend your waking hours claiming that Windows cannot be secured or otherwise used as a computing platform, using anecdotal data points to build feel-good statistics that only you believe.
Grow up and compete. The "some dude said something bad about Linux"-style whines like this article are starting to sound more and more like Suckdot [suck.com].
Frankly it's true. (Score:3, Interesting)
I worked for an Enterprise software CRM company and we dealt with customers paying tens of millions of dollars. If there was a bug, any bug, even if it wasn't our bug, we were on the daily conference calls. There was one bug that was clearly a Microsoft SQL Server optimization bug, but I had to work with Microsoft over Christmas just because our customer wanted someone from our side there... **just because**. There was no logical reason for me to be there since it was completely out of our domain, but we still had to be there. This is how enterprise customers behave and frankly, since they are paying millions of dollars, I don't blame them to expect this.
However, with Linux, even with Red Hat support, there is no such level of support. We ported our apps to Red Hat Advanced Server 3, and the level of support we got from them was good but not enterprise level.
We ran into an IBM Java Run-Time bug... clearly a bug in the Run-Time, but Red Hat's response was, "Well, IBM has a certain SLA with us when we create a bug for them, and they may or may not get to it." That was it. There was absolutely nothing we could do at that point. They didn't own the IBM Java Run-time, so they passed the buck on responsibility. Which in some respects is understandable, but is completely unacceptable for enterprise customers. Linux is a mix-and-match of a bunch of open-source software and **no one was ultimate accountability** which is something that enterprise customers are paying for and expect.
er... (Score:2)
Spammers?
I know: AOLers!
Obviously (Score:2)
If it weren't for those damned DirectX games, we'd be so much more productive!
What a stupid question (Score:3, Funny)
Ahhh the end of innocence (Score:4, Insightful)
Anything like the 'vast right-wing conspiracy'? (Score:2)
Just because someone says something you don't like or that you don't agree with doesn't make it wrong. One shouldn't be afraid to hear the other side.
Ad Sales (Score:2)
Linux does have enemies. Of course Microsoft is one, but they have also been very much helped by Linux and *BSD because these have weakened or destroyed competitors in the server market who were starting to venture towards the desktop. Digital, Sun, HP, IBM, SCO, etc. all lost to Linux. Some of these companies learned that it w
Since when was FUD new to IT? (Score:2, Insightful)
Enemies of Linux!? Don't make me laugh! (Score:3, Insightful)
A better slant would be that software companies who have compete in the same market space as those companies that use linux are using their usual dirty tricks and misinformation to undermine the competition while the competition simultaneously uses similar tricks and lies to undermine them. But it's hardly news is it?
Once again - Third stage of Acceptance (Score:3, Insightful)
As told by Ghandi:
Stage #2: they'll laugh at you (done)
Stage #3: they'll fight you (current stage)
Stage #4: you'll win (next stage)
Also known as Stages of Acceptance (learn more [chemistrycoach.com]). For me it's very clear what is happening.
Just wait... (Score:5, Funny)
Anti-microsoft FUD (Score:5, Insightful)
Pratt says... (Score:3, Interesting)
I agree, it means Linux is becoming a general-purpose tool: home users AND scientists/engineers/hackers (using hackers in the comp-sci sense, not the thug) are now starting to focus on the benefits of an open development model.
That means that no one is really fascinated by Microsoft anymore. Oh sure, Microsoft can still spend bucks on PR and FUD, but there is no amount of that that will make users forget this other more fascinating thing that Linux is.
In the end it's a numbers game: Microsoft may have hired spectacular staff, but they can't compete against collected might of THE WORLD, can they? India and China will lead the way, no doubt.
And besides, Linux (for the most part) exists simply because people enjoy making tools out of computers, it's not about trying to raise revenue for the coming quarter, but (funny enough) it seems to be doing just that!
If Microsoft wants to matter anymore, they'll roll with it, like they did on the Internet; late.
MS should open-source some code and actually let the Wine guys run with it; they're the only ones REALLY trying to preserve Windows, by writing a great application suite, to support the Windows user.
I know MS have been accused of fighting Wine users, but it really is to MS's own detriment; it alienates more users.
Re:/. and firefox (Score:2, Funny)
This is management speaking, please report to my office.
Re:Suprised... (Score:2)
However, there are more than enough incompetent and even evil people working within the FOSS movement already. Sturgeon's Law ("90% of everything is crap") applies here as it does anywhere. The fact that constructions such as Linux exist at all demonstrates the power of community efforts when it comes to detecting, measuring, and filtering the bullshit to leave the 10% that is worth downloading.
You might be able to d