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Linux Business Operating Systems Software Sun Microsystems

Wal-Mart Sells PCs Preloaded With Sun's Linux 617

Posted by timothy from the from-high-end-to-everyman dept.
badboy3062 writes "Wal-Mart this week started selling Microtel PCs preloaded with Sun's Java Desktop System. Prices start at under $300 for a system without a floppy drive or monitor. Jonathan Schwartz, Sun's executive vice president for software, says this move is just another step in its plan to gain new audiences for its technologies."
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Wal-Mart Sells PCs Preloaded With Sun's Linux More

Wal-Mart Sells PCs Preloaded With Sun's Linux

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  • Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:5, Funny)

    by The I Shing ( 700142 ) * on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:54PM (#8727527) Journal
    No... must... not... shop... at... evil... Wal*Mart... must... stay... away...

    It kind of pains me to see this. Why does a store that I hate have to go and do something that smacks of coolness? Why couldn't it be Target or KMart?

    And isn't Microtel a motel chain?

    • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:5, Funny)

      by boisepunk ( 764513 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:57PM (#8727558)
      KMart? is that some online shopping utility that comes with KDE?

    • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by irokitt ( 663593 ) <archimandrites-iaur.yahoo@com> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:59PM (#8727587)
      Selling a $300 US computer with Linux is not "something that smacks of coolness." Wal-Mart just doesn't want to pay for an OEM Windows license, since that would end up being a significant portion of the cost. This is like Fry's on-the-cheap Linux systems. They cost ~$250 US, and use woefully outdated parts to achieve that low price. Adding a Windows license would kick that price up considerably.

      And yes [microtelinn.com], yes it is.

      • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by boisepunk ( 764513 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:02PM (#8727628)
        Maybe having Linux being "good enough for government work" isn't exactly the image we want Linux to have. Just like I think having Linux on cheap, disposable, sub-par computers from places like Wal-mart may not be the best thing either.

        The real goal is to have people see Linux as a viable alternative, not a cheap Windows imitation or some eccentric thing the government uses.
        • Consider that users still buy E-Machines (a cheaply made Win32 system). The systems may not be cutting edge, but a market definitely exist for those who don't want to pay cutting edge prices.

          While I see the Java Desktop System as a good start, I am not sure the timing for consumer release is ideal. Certainly these systems will satisfy office application needs, web surfing, and multi-media, but for many consumers, the game titles on the system are important. If I can't get the next release of my favori

        • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:4, Insightful)

          by C10H14N2 ( 640033 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @03:26PM (#8728740)
          The Machine might be mediocre--much like many of the cheap desktops people are buying. However, a quick spin around the Wal*MART catalog shows that they are pushing the Sun Java Desktop brand along side Lindows and Lycoris. The Windows and No-OS machines they are selling use THE EXACT SAME HARDWARE, except that the Sun version costs $100 less than the Windows install. Sure, you can buy the WinXP box, but they're putting the same machines side-by side and effectively saying "Hey, you just use this for web browsing and email, why pay an extra $100 for the exactly the same machine that does exactly the same thing? Besides, Linux is cool and makes you look smart. You're smart, right?" Ka-ching.

          Don't be so quick to write this off. They are truly offering what everyone has been asking for: CHOICE. Hell, I HATE Wal*Mart, but I give 'em kudos for this.
      • Plus the fact they dont need to pay for the * Internet security suite that is almost obligatory these days.

        although what will happen when a regular joe finds they cant put AOL on their new budget PC? they'll buy a more expensive one that "works".

      • Must... Not... Defend... Walmart... (Score:4, Interesting)

        by cgenman ( 325138 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:19PM (#8727870) Homepage
        Walmart.com actually has had a lot of options in terms of pre-loaded OS's. They come / have come with Windows, Lindows, Lycoris, Mandrake, Sun Java Desktop, and FreeDOS. Or you can get them naked.

        True, all of these are cheaper than Windows (except for, of course, Windows), but if all Walmart was interested in was being Cheap, they would all be using Lindows (remember flat rate licensing?). The inclusion of Lycoris and Sun Java Desktop is an indication that they see value in having a variety of Linux desktops available.

        Now, it may very well be that they simply contract out through individual companies, so that if someone wants to sell a Lycoris desktop through Walmart.com it presents no risk to Walmart, but that doesn't mean Walmart is inherently exploitive.*

        *on this particular issue.

      • Right. I don't think what Linux really needs is to be associated with really ugly, underpowered, outdated systems (please no replies on how 1.6 GHz and 128 meg should be good enough or how you're running Linux on a postage stamp). This just make Windows look more like the luxury option.

        But how much luxury is it? When I bought my first IBM compatible in 1989, the guy offered to knock $50 off if we went with PC-DOS (or was it DR-DOS) instead of MS-DOS. My dad got pretty pissed at the assumption that he couldn't afford the market leader in software when he was shelling out $2000 for a top of the line 386DX40 (AMD!) with a genuine SoundBlaster 8 bit soundcard. And the difference there was much more subtle...you could run pretty much any MS-DOS app on the alternative OS. You can't do that with Windows and Linux. It's not the difference between power windows or the crank. It's the difference between driving on the interstate, or having to drive backroads all the time. That's one hell of a decision for $50.

        Do we really want Linux and Java to be known as the ghetto class solution? Is the benefit of "availability" in Wal-Mart worth the detriment of association with Wal-Mart, especially considering you can't buy a single Linux program at Wal-Mart?
    • Selling a $300 US computer with Linux is not "something that smacks of coolness."

      The 2nd def. in the dictionary of "smack" is "To have or exhibit indications of the presence of any character or quality."

      So by "smacks of coolness" I just mean that it's something that indicates coolness, but that doesn't mean that it is, indeed, cool.

      Like when Duncan says to the injured sergeant, "So well thy words become thee, as they wounds; they smack of honor, both." Just gives the appearance, you know?

    • Ich hab' eine Idee... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by sczimme ( 603413 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:07PM (#8727704)

      Selling *anything* at WallyWorld practically guarantees broad exposure in markets that a vendor might not otherwise reach. Imagine if - years ago - you could have walked into [that store] and picked up an Ultra 10. I use the U10 as an example because it is/was essentially a low-end, mass-marketed (sort of) item from the Sun line. Wal-mart would be unlikely to carry the Ultra 60 just like they are unlikely to carry gigantic plasma TVs: the clientele probably are not the ones to buy high-end merchandise (or at least not buy it there).

      PS Microtel makes very, very small communications devices. You're welcome. :-)

      • What you're missing (Score:5, Informative)

        by karmaflux ( 148909 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:14PM (#8727821)
        is the fact that you can't walk in to Wal-Mart and pick one of these up. They're only available online.

      • Sun as the biggest Linux vendor. (Score:5, Interesting)

        by ron_ivi ( 607351 ) <sdotno@NOSpAM.cheapcomplexdevices.com> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:16PM (#8727844)
        "Selling *anything* at WallyWorld practically guarantees broad exposure in markets "

        I think Sun is serious about becoming the biggest Linux vendor, as they suggested a year ago with their china deal [techworld.com] where McNealy said "This, I believe, makes us instantaneously the number one Linux desktop play in the planet."

        If they're going for volume, you can't beat Wal*Mart and China.

    • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Golias ( 176380 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:10PM (#8727766)
      Why does a store that I hate have to go and do something that smacks of coolness?

      Wal-Mart also sells a good-quality, extremely easy-to-hack DVD player with digital sound output and S-Video out... for $30.

      I don't get all this hatred of Wal-Mart. Sure, some of what they sell is cheap crap, but for the most part they seem to be pretty much the same as any discount retail chain. (And though it pains me to say so as a Minnesotan, their prices are usually better than Target's.)

      Is it the stigma of it being a chain that grew out of the rural midwest and South? Is it the result of people buying into the "OMG, they're killing the small-towns" nonsense? What's the problem? Seriously.

      • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by jargoone ( 166102 ) * on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:17PM (#8727849)
        The reason everyone hates them is because they strong-arm suppliers into providing them product at prices costs below what any other retailer can purchase the same product at. So they can sell it for less than the smaller guy's cost, and still profit. Small(er) guy can't win, has to go out of business.

        Seriously, if you care, do a search and educate yourself. It's not hard to find -- the web is literally covered with anti-WalMart material.

        • Re:Why Wal*Mart? Gott in Himmel, why? (Score:4, Informative)

          by fatray ( 160258 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:52PM (#8728275)
          WalMart is not strong arming suppliers--the suppliers don't have to supply WalMart if they don't want to. What WalMart is doing is telling suppliers that they must have low prices and good service, if they are going to remain a supplier. When I say good service in this context it means that you supply the correct quantity, meeting spec, and on time.

          My plant supplies WalMart and they suddenly wanted us to supply in (much) more expensive packaging and told us it had to be at the same price as the old packaging. We went to the Wal Mart buyer with the facts of what the new packaging would cost and they were OK with a price increase representing the increased cost. My experience is that they are good business people and they expect their suppliers to be good. If you can't supply quality product on time and at a competitive cost, you won't be a WalMart supplier.

    • Dell Poweredge Server (Score:5, Informative)

      by vwjeff ( 709903 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:32PM (#8728000)
      What's the big deal here. If you go to Dell.com and click on Small Business you can get a Poweredge server for $279 with the following components:

      Intel P4 2.4 Ghz
      40 GB Hard Drive
      128 MB Memory
      Floppy Drive
      48x CD-ROM

      ($379-$100 mail in rebate) I hate mail in rebates!!!!

      This is basically a low-end desktop with no OS. Load your favorite distro and there you go!!

      I think it's great that a company is selling computers preloaded with Linux but this really isn't news.
    • If there is one company that can stand up to Microsoft and sell the OS that they want, it's WalMart.

      The other computer OEMs haven't done it. They're not big enough to say "screw you, MS, were not paying $100/license"

      WalMart is extremely interested in delivering the lowest price to their consumers, and removing the Microsoft OS is one way to do it.

  • Mixed feelings about this. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by grub ( 11606 ) <slashdot@grub.net> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:55PM (#8727539) Homepage Journal

    This sounds great at first glance but my gut feeling is that most of these units sold will be reformatted with Windows. That's the ugly truth methinks.

    • Re:Mixed feelings about this. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by AKnightCowboy ( 608632 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:58PM (#8727576)
      This sounds great at first glance but my gut feeling is that most of these units sold will be reformatted with Windows. That's the ugly truth methinks.

      Why would you buy a Walmart PC with Linux on it for $300 and then go out and buy Windows for $150+ when you could just go buy a Dell with Windows XP preloaded on it for under $400? Unless you're planning on a five-finger discount on the Windows license it'd be more to buy a Linux box and put a non-OEM copy of Windows on it.

    • Re:Mixed feelings about this. (Score:5, Funny)

      by taradfong ( 311185 ) * on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:59PM (#8727583) Homepage Journal
      Hmmm...everyone's dying to put Linux on their X-Boxen, and Windows on their Linux boxen. I guess no one is every happy with their native OS.

    • Re:Mixed feelings about this. (Score:5, Funny)

      by Ralph Yarro ( 704772 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:04PM (#8727673) Homepage
      This sounds great at first glance but my gut feeling is that most of these units sold will be reformatted with Windows.

      Yes, it's frightening the lengths people will go to to avoid paying their $699 licensing fee.

    • Re:Mixed feelings about this. (Score:4, Insightful)

      by FooBarWidget ( 556006 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:06PM (#8727692)
      Actually it doesn't matter whether that actually happens. The only thing that matters is that the numbers of sold Linux PCs go up! Companies will think "hey, Linux's market share is rising. maybe we should port our apps", regardless of whether people will actually reformat the hd and install a pirated version of Windows.

    • Re:Mixed feelings about this. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Maestro4k ( 707634 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:17PM (#8727854) Journal
      • This sounds great at first glance but my gut feeling is that most of these units sold will be reformatted with Windows. That's the ugly truth methinks.
      Actually I think you may be wrong. I had the misfortune (ok to be fair at least it was a job and kept me fed) of working at Wal-mart for a year and a half. For much of that time I was in Electronics, and even after I was moved to checkouts the Electronics people were known to call me or bring customers up for me to answer their computer questions. Frankly the vast majority of these people (all your average joe non-techy person) could have cared less what OS they had as long as it WORKED. If the Sun Desktop works well and does the things Average Joe Consumer wants (which are web surfing, E-mail and possibly chat mainly) then the customers likely won't even notice it's not Windows on their computer.

      And to be honest (not trying to be mean) most of those Average Joe Consumers couldn't reformat a system and put Windows on it if their lives and the life of their first-born child depended on it. Whatever it comes with will be what it stays with.

      Now it will be interesting to see if they pack in restore CDs for them, HP in particular is really bad about forgetting them, even with only a 15 day time-period for in-store returns we took back so many HPs for exchange because of missing restore CDs it wasn't funny. I believe we had more computers stacked in claims than on the sales floor most of the time.

      One amusing tidbit I had\ve to mention, wonder how long it'll be before Wal-mart realizes it'll be really easy to take a stylized sun and put their smiley face in the middle.

  • Subscription? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:55PM (#8727540)
    Does Sun require an annual support subscription for these things, like their enterprise versions?

    Because if so, there's going to be a lot of unpatched Linux boxes out there in a year or so.

    • Re:Subscription? (Score:4, Informative)

      by Bishop, Martin ( 695163 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:01PM (#8727624)
      No, in fact, I got a Sun Java Desktop "livecd" thingie with an issue of Linux User & Developer that I bought the other day...haven't really tried it out, but I'm pretty sure it's free

      • Re:Subscription? (Score:3, Informative)

        by FattMattP ( 86246 )

        haven't really tried it out, but I'm pretty sure it's free

        So, in other words you don't know and your post isn't really informative after all. What the poster was asking is if patches are available free of charge without having to get a subscription. The answer is yes but only for one year [sun.com]. You have to register with your serial number before the updater that retrieves the patches will work. A year after registering you must purchase support to continue to receive patches. I was unable to find more d

  • No floppy?! (Score:4, Funny)

    by Capt'n Hector ( 650760 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:56PM (#8727547)
    Because you know that a floppy drive adds hundreds to the manufacturing cost.

    • Re:No floppy?! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by neiffer ( 698776 ) * on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:58PM (#8727571) Homepage
      I am a teacher and I wish more PC's would ship without floppy drives. When my students bring in disks from home (and I sometimes have 150 disks to deal with at a time), 1 in 3 has an error, and another 1 in 5 has a virus. I'd much prefer email or a USB flash drive!

      • Re:No floppy?! (Score:5, Insightful)

        by bmwm3nut ( 556681 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:02PM (#8727632)
        1 in 5 has a virus. I'd much prefer email or a USB flash drive!

        and we all know that viruses can't be tranferred by email or a USB drive. i do agree that floppies are out dated and error prone, but getting rid of floppies isn't going to stop kids bringing in viruses.

      • Re:No floppy?! (Score:3, Insightful)

        by polyp2000 ( 444682 )
        Anyway even if this Linux based Wal-Mart PC did have an internal floppy drive the likelihood of it providing a breeding ground for spreading viruses is rather slim to say the least.

    • Re:No floppy?! (Score:4, Informative)

      by silas_moeckel ( 234313 ) <silas AT dsminc-corp DOT com> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:59PM (#8727589) Homepage
      Actualy Floppy drives have gotten expensive around $10 a unit in modest quanities. Add the cost of installation and repair and it's 3.33-5% of the total cost of the system why bother?

    • Re:No floppy?! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Ralph Yarro ( 704772 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:01PM (#8727620) Homepage
      Because you know that a floppy drive adds hundreds to the manufacturing cost.

      How much does it have to add to hit your profits on a $300 item? Say they make a 10% profit, that's $30, say the floppy drive costs $3. Not including the drive would increase profits by 10%. If a 10% increase in profits doesn't sound appealing to you then I'm going to guess that nobody lets you make those sorts of decisions.

      • It's profit, and support. (Score:3, Interesting)

        by khasim ( 1285 )
        I believe you are correct about the profits portion of the equation. But you forgot to include the support costs of floppies.

        There are a limited number of moving parts in those computers. A floppy drive is a moving part and the only one (other than the CD) that the user is expected to jam things into.

        Not including it does boost profits.
        -and-
        Not including it means one less thing that is likely to break and result in a phone call and/or replacement.

        When you're looking at profits that small per unit, you do

  • WalMart Link and Accessories They Recommend (Score:5, Funny)

    by Johnny_Law ( 701208 ) * on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:56PM (#8727552)
    Here is a direct link [walmart.com] to the computer on Walmart.com and their description of the OS.
    Sun has delivered the first viable Microsoft Windows alternative. The Java desktop system is a more affordable, secure desktop, designed to thrive in a Windows-centric world and run thousands of Java technology-based applications.
    And here is the link [walmart.com] to the accessory they recommend for this item (guess who).

    I don't know whether this is informative or humorous. I chuckled and shook my head at the same time.

  • Accessories We Recommend for This Item (Score:4, Funny)

    by karmaflux ( 148909 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:56PM (#8727554)
    Microsoft Trackball Optical [walmart.com]

    HAHAHAHAHAH

  • What's so 'Java' about it? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by taradfong ( 311185 ) * on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:56PM (#8727555) Homepage Journal
    From what I understand, It's a Linux system, running a modified Gnome with some extra nicely well done integration with Java's runtime. I think more accurately it should be called the 'C' desktop.

    I wonder if it's bundled with 'digital ready' speakers.

    • Re:What's so 'Java' about it? (Score:5, Funny)

      by KillerHamster ( 645942 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:01PM (#8727615) Homepage
      And is it "Internet Ready?"
    • From the Sun rep:

      We also have some 500 pilots of our Java Desktop System and the Java Enterprise System now running across the world...

      They're certainly eager to encourage confusion of the Java Desktop with Java, aren't they? The article has a number of statements like that.

      (The Java Enterprise System _does_ have something to do with Java, doesn't it? I went to their site but couldn't get one shred of meaningful information from it. Also, if I were them, I'd be less enthuisiastic about bragging about the

    • Well, apart from the obvious marketing ploy by Sun, it does come with the latest J2SE installed by default and even has some GUI apps that are Java-based rather than C/Gnome based. How many other distros and os can claim that, apart from OSX. I've purused the demo CD and I think it's a pretty sweet system.

      Hey and just for fun, poke through and see if you can find the apps that are Swing based...

  • link to systems (Score:5, Informative)

    by Triumph The Insult C ( 586706 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:57PM (#8727564) Homepage Journal
    here you go [walmart.com]

    as low as $288

  • More details here (Score:3, Informative)

    by kiwimate ( 458274 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @01:58PM (#8727575) Journal
    clicky [yahoo.com]

  • What Walmart has to say about this computer.... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by kidgenius ( 704962 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:01PM (#8727619)
    From Walmart's [walmart.com] website:

    "Sun has delivered the first viable Microsoft Windows alternative. The Java desktop system is a more affordable, secure desktop, designed to thrive in a Windows-centric world and run thousands of Java technology-based applications."

    It goes on and on, including mentioning that it comes with StarOffice, it can exchange files with MS Office, it isn't prone to viruses, etc. They really are doing a good job at selling this to the average person and letting them know that there is a pretty viable option to Windows (other than mac of course)

  • Walmart (Score:5, Funny)

    by mostlyalmighty ( 591787 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:01PM (#8727622)
    But does it run Windows?

  • Oh nooo (Score:5, Funny)

    by Knight Thrasher ( 766792 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:03PM (#8727651) Journal
    *groans* Now customers are going to call me... "How do I set up my server?" - "Sir, where did you get that server? HP? IBM?" - "Wal-mart!"

  • PC support (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:03PM (#8727660)
    I can see it now
    "Hello AOL internet support, how can I help you?"

    "I just bought this PC from wallmart and I can't check my mail"

  • JDS (Score:4, Interesting)

    by nelsonal ( 549144 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:05PM (#8727682) Journal
    The Java Desktop is a subscriber product did Wal~Mart get a discount due to expected volume or does the end user have to pay an annual maintenance fee for updates. IIRC it was $50-$100 per year depending on if you got it during the big sale (possibly still in progress). Having to pay that sort of maintenece costs would seem to push users toward Mandrake.
    I'm actually curious because I had the same idea, but didn't investigate it far enough to see if SUN was willing to cut OEM customers a break. It would be nice to advertise a SUN operating system that everyone is hearing so much about rather than the scary (to small customers) Linux.

    • Re:JDS (Score:3, Informative)

      by JohnnyCannuk ( 19863 )
      Nope.

      The Java Enterprise System is subscription based. The Java Desktop System is a pay once model - about $70 USD I believe. And since it's based on SUSE, you can then upgrade however you want (or know how to do). Or you can wait until the next version of the JDS come out. Or you can wait until Looking Glass come out and upgrade then.

      This is really no different that the Windows boxes the sell. What's better, Linux on the desktop will get MASSIVE penetration thanks to Walmart. It will be pre-loaded so Lin

  • Linux on the shelves (Score:5, Interesting)

    by semper_james ( 719169 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:06PM (#8727694) Journal
    So, does this mean that wal*mart is going to start stocking software for linux as well? Or just the cool windows games as usual?

  • Walmart equals a win for linux (Score:5, Interesting)

    by 192939495969798999 ( 58312 ) <info AT devinmoore DOT com> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:06PM (#8727696) Homepage Journal
    This is a genius price, and wal-mart's massive distribution capabilities could easily push the desktop market dramatically in the direction of linux. How large is wal-mart? Let me give an example. There's the story of the local piemaker who won a contract with wal-mart to sell his pies. Wal-mart ordered 10,000 TRUCKLOADS of pies! If they can do that kinda volume on the linux machines, Microsoft's in for a ride. Fortune 500: Microsoft = #46, Walmart = #1. Walmart wins!
    In other news, see my artist interview at fulcrum gallery [fulcrumgallery.com].

    • Walmart allways wins, So what? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Bill, Shooter of Bul ( 629286 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:21PM (#8727885) Journal
      By your logic, Because walmart always wins ( and believe me I agree 100%), ANY PRODUCT they sell will defeat their competing products. Ok, Walmart sells coke, therefore Walmart will crush pepsi. Walmart also sells Pepsi, therefore Walmart will crush Coke. So who wins? Sams Choice Cola.

      Walmart likes to help its vendors... at first. They worked exclusively with Tide to see if they could reducce their operating costs. Great, Tide now operated more efficently as a compnay. Then Walmart introduced Great Value Liquid Clothes detergent (compare with Tide!). Walmart might be working with Sun, but noting that they are essentially just selling a free OS, Its just a mater of time before Walmart introduces the even lower cost Great Value Linux . It will happen, believe you me.
    • Yes, Wal-mart is the Big Dog. A story: You may remember Rome, the Empire, who had to give away food to all of Rome, the city, in order to keep them happy. They ended up deforesting and gutting most of northern Africa to do so, turning it into a far larger desert than previous. I compare Wal-Mart to that process: cheap as shit goods, but it's for the masses of the newest and greatest empire, which goes a long way to explaining why it's #1 in the Fortune 500. Do not fuck with Wal-Mart. They are king. Now, in

  • Sound of music in this? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by person-0.9a ( 161545 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:09PM (#8727739)
    Wal-mart selling another distro of linux on "their" PC's. That's kinda nifty, but it does make one ask the question:
    Could this mean they'll get a clue and make their music store compatible with the computing systems they sell?

    (Perhaps maybe around the time when we see Mac OS X run natively on a Microtel PC).

  • Price went up? (Score:3, Informative)

    by dzeanah ( 51841 ) <derek@ze[ ]h.com ['ana' in gap]> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:11PM (#8727775) Homepage
    I just had a client order a PC from Walmart 3 weeks ago, and I thought the cost (with Lindows, not the Sun offering) was more like $215, though that was with 64M RAM. I thought it was $265 after shipping.

    Oh well. Still better than paying the Microsoft tax.

  • Got Root? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by loveisafist ( 766873 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:12PM (#8727787) Homepage
    So, let me take a guess and assume that the primary user is running with root level permissions? That may not be a good thing given 99% of the people who would buy a PC at Wal-Mart probably can't manage/secure their Windows based PC let alone a Linux box.

    • Re:Got Root? (Score:5, Informative)

      by Get Behind the Mule ( 61986 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:35PM (#8728029)
      So, let me take a guess and assume that the primary user is running with root level permissions?

      No, you guessed wrong. Well, I suppose you can't prevent a naive user from doing this, but JDS is based on SuSE, and SuSE requires you to define a non-root user at install time, telling you noisily that this is the account you should be using most of the time. So chances are good that most novice users will end up doing the right thing (it seems to work for SuSE, at any rate).

  • Heard good things (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:14PM (#8727824)
    I've heard really good things about Sun's Java Desktop Linux. If it's based on SuSE (9.0 is so !@#$ sweet it's not even funny), it's gotta be good. I've considered purchasing the $50 discount copy, but I still wonder what their server strategy is. I actually prefer linux on the server to solaris for a lot of reasons, as I don't do anything high level enough to require a sparc. I want an end to end solution, and Sun is making it difficult.

    Basically, I like the idea of using the same distribution for the server and my desktop. I can install SuSE on everything from my desktop to the Dell blade servers that I install, and it just works. This is very appealing, since I can become familiar with the environment by using it on my desktop in addition to the server.

    When I went to price out one of Sun's new AMD systems, I was somewhat disappointed. First of all, the website does not give the level of detail that Dell's does. I want to know everything about the system from ram speed, to hd speed, to bus speed, etc. Then, I want much more ability to configure scsi, ide, raid levels, etc. On top of that, it was pretty expensive. You can get a dual xeon dell with 2GB of ram, 15K rpm scsi for about $1,000 less than a bare bones sun with an amd chip. For what it's worth, IBM is much worse in this regard when pricing any of their systems online. I think they're even more expensive and the website sucks way more.

    Then, you have the option basically for solaris x86 (32 bit) or supplying your own SuSE 64 bit (community edition, whatever that means), or RedHat enterprise.

    My conclusion is that Sun is still not going after the low end. I don't know if they just can't get the economies of scale or what, but don't sell an entry level server and pretend that you're going to offer a "premium" entry level server when the website is worse, you have fewer config options, and the price is way more than can be justified.

    That said, I hope they read this stuff and adapt. How hard can it be to provide an entry level server when plenty of white box places do it even cheaper than Dell??? I can't even imagine what you get for the premium price tag.

    Still, I would love the idea if they gave me a Java Server system with Linux on the bottom of the stack with Java completely installed, configured, and supported, and the option for the Java Enterprise system on top of it. What's with their affinity for Solaris, especially on the low end servers? Even if it's better in some regards, it's not as familiar, performs worse, is difficult to get app support for, etc. Give me the real deal please, which for me is Linux.

    • Re:Heard good things (Score:3, Informative)

      by illumin8 ( 148082 )
      When I went to price out one of Sun's new AMD systems, I was somewhat disappointed. First of all, the website does not give the level of detail that Dell's does. I want to know everything about the system from ram speed, to hd speed, to bus speed, etc. Then, I want much more ability to configure scsi, ide, raid levels, etc. On top of that, it was pretty expensive. You can get a dual xeon dell with 2GB of ram, 15K rpm scsi for about $1,000 less than a bare bones sun with an amd chip. For what it's worth, IBM

  • Hmm (Score:5, Funny)

    by TheSpoom ( 715771 ) * <slashdot@@@uberm00...net> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:26PM (#8727939) Homepage Journal
    There are going to be a lot of systems out there with root passwords of "password" soon ;^)

  • Close, but... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by blogboy ( 638908 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:28PM (#8727969)
    The only people who would buy a non-MS PC are relatively technically competent ("enough to be dangerous"), and the majority of these folks should be smart enough to know what a bad deal this is--you can piece together a much better system for the same $$$. Hello, eBay? So the target audience is...?

    • Re:Close, but... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by JohnnyCannuk ( 19863 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:43PM (#8728131)
      Wrong.

      People who shop at Walmart will buy and use whatever PC is cheap and gets them on the Internet-thingy and lets them do e-mail. They could care less about Microsoft, Open source, Sun or ESR.

      Remember, these are the people that think "Microsoft Windows" is their word processor...they don't know what an operating system is. The can, however, tell the difference between having to pay $350 (for Word) and $0 (for OpenOffice.org/StarOffice, included in the JDS) or having to pay $150 (for a Windows upgrade down the road) and $0 to $70 (for an upgrade of Linux/JDS when they want it).

      And when their kids grow up, which OS do you think they'll use and trust?

  • On your first WalMart PC service call (Score:5, Funny)

    by WormholeFiend ( 674934 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:29PM (#8727981)
    you might notice the following:

    The PC is up on blocks.
    The case has a shotgun rack
    The customer wears a wife-beater shirt with a penguin on the front.
    There are dipstick oil marks on the floppy drive.
    The hard drive is full of Johnny Cash MP3s.
    The case is modded with a transparent confederate flag window.
    The mousepad is red and black plaid.
    Traces of pig feces on the keyboard.
    The open source internet browser default page is www.y'all.com.
    The USB port cover panel is welded shut.
    The wallpaper on the desktop is of a scanned black velvet Elvis painting.
    The case has a side-mounted spitoon.
    The customer added an 8-track tape player in one of the drive bays.
    There are John Deer stickers on the case.
    -

  • Good for standard PC uses (Score:4, Insightful)

    by hattig ( 47930 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:32PM (#8728006) Journal
    I don't know what the Sun Java Desktop is like personally, but it is probably pretty good - Gnome and StarOffice and all that jazz.

    As such it should handle what most people use a PC for pretty well - internet, e-mail, chatting, letter to the bank manager.

    You don't need Windows XP for these tasks.

    Now the price is a bit high given the hardware - you could build the same for a lot less, but Walmart will be making a slice and Sun will be too I imagine.

    And these boxes will be faster than 2.8GHz Celeron boxes judging from reviews online.

  • I have bought a boat load of these things (Score:5, Informative)

    by codepunk ( 167897 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:33PM (#8728015)
    Man I have bought a bunch of these boxes. I normally buy the cheap 200 dollar not loaded model and throw fedora core on them and give them to our customers. In the two years now of running them I only had one that had the power supply give up the smoke. For non power users that just want to surf the web and do a occasional spread sheet the box is more than fast enough.

  • It's not that prominent (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Animats ( 122034 ) on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @02:48PM (#8728225) Homepage
    For about a month last year, WalMart featured the Linux PCs more prominently than Windows PCs. They aren't doing that now. They were heavily pressuring Microsoft for price cuts, and they may have obtained some.

    More interesting is that WalMart is preloading OpenOffice on their low-end Windows PCs. That's will accelerate OpenOffice deployment. Lots of kids are going to be doing their book reports on OpenOffice.

  • These Microtels are NOISY (Score:4, Informative)

    by bshroyer ( 21524 ) <bret AT bretshroyer DOT org> on Wednesday March 31, 2004 @03:02PM (#8728422)
    A solid piece of hardware - I now have three operating in various capacities around the house - but noisy like you wouldn't believe. I've become accustomed to some minimal amount of acoustic engineering going into boxes these days -- all of the name brand boxes have an average (low) amount of noise. Not so with the Microtel. The power supply has a whoosh to it, and the CPU fan a bit of a low whir. You may be able to remedy this with a replacement low-noise PS.

    Not bad for under $300, but, as always, you get what you pay for.

    Why don't we have boxes with external (fanless - noiseless) power supplies? Everything that goes on inside the box is low voltage DC, right?
    • Righto. I've bought two Microtels boxes over the last year. They're nicely put together in a steel case that gives you easy access to RAM, disk bays, etc. (unlike the plastic Rubik's Cube of an HP they sit next to). Peformance has been better than expected for the price -- with the exception of that danged noisy fan.

      Overall, a lot of bang for 300 bucks.

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