All schools In Denmark switching to Linux 424
Someone who can read Danish writes "According to this story
(in Danish) Denmark has taken the first steps to start using Linux and Staroffice in all schools (1.1 million students).
Sun has agreed to provide Staroffice for free, or on
a CD-ROM for 10 Danish crowns ($1.5)."
10 Danish Crowns?!! (Score:4, Funny)
Origin of "crown" as money (Score:2)
There aren't even that many kings in Denmark!
Aside from the joke...
The term "crown" referring to a monetary unit comes from the fact that some old coins had a bas-relief crown stamped into them. It's analogous to the term "Benjamin" referring to a 100 USD note, which carries a picture of Benjamin Franklin.
Quick translation (Score:2, Informative)
Free software for school use
Denmarks 1,1 million school pupils, students and teacher can now turn to back to microsoft. At least with respect to office programs.
A deal between the silicon valley company Sun Micrososystems Incorporated and UNI-C causes that all the school pupils, students and teachers can download the office program Startoffice for free and install it on their home computwer. Alternatively they can buy it on a CD-ROM for the price of frabrication: 10 kr per CD (This is about 1 $). The schools can buy staroffice i packages of 50 cd's
The deal that Sun made with UNI-C follows the directions laid out by minister of education Ulla Tørnæs. They were made public October 30th, and they describe how institutions of education must act when offered office programs for free
One of the demands are that such donations do not cost the state any money, another demand is that UNI-C (The IT-center of research and education of Denmark) must administrate and distribute the licences.
UNI-C will have its expenses covered through the 10 kr that the CD's cost. Sun will provide a server with the cost-free OS Linux for the pupils, students and teachers who wish to download StarOffice 6.0.
>>UNI-C exists to help the danish education world, so of course we are happy to be able to mediate such a special initiative from Sun, says Dorthe Olesen, administrative director of UNI-C.
The most used office system in the world Microsoft Office, does not have a version for Linux
Because of the dominance of Microsoft in office and operative systems, a growing number of state owned institutions work on creating alternatives - primarily a combination of starofice and Linux
If all 1,1 milion pupils, students and teachers use the offer, the total value is about 200 million kr (20 mil $) (says sun)
Linguistics (Score:2)
anyone here speak danish (Score:2, Funny)
Re:anyone here speak danish (Score:4, Funny)
DANISH is like an advanced version PSTRY but you get a much better tase of it you compile it on APPLE or some other similarly fruity platform. It is best learned in the morning with a healthy side of JAVA.
Re:anyone here speak danish (Score:2)
Re:anyone here speak danish (Score:2)
Universities in the US considering it as well (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Universities in the US considering it as well (Score:2)
[OT] Re:Universities in the US... (Score:4, Informative)
Penn State and Pitt are "semi-private" Commonwealth affiliated institutions. They get interesting tax status, charge in-state students less, and get some Commonwealth funding.
Then there are the more traditional state colleges: Lock Haven, IUP, Shippensburg(??), etc.
Re:Universities in the US considering it as well (Score:5, Interesting)
Anyone here care to guess how many different incompatible programs our students have on their computers? Not counting the various (and sometimes) incompatible variations on MS Office, you also have the abortion known as MS Works. Then there's Lotus, WordPerfect... Hell, even NOTEPAD! And don't get me started about the different versions used from country to country. We have students who attend here from all over the world.
We've been using Open/Staroffice now for well over a year and are not looking back anytime soon. There were some minor initial glitches, but this was due to our using the Openoffice.org betas. Star PP1 / Open 1.0.1 have been rock solid for us.
Chuck Hunnefield
Technology Coordinator
Linden Hall School for Girls
"They bought their tickets... They knew what they were getting into..."
MS Works not an abortion (Score:2, Funny)
Like 'Taped live', 'Military Intelligence', 'Tax Return' or 'Government Organisation'
OXYMORON n.: A rhetorical figure in which an epigrammatic effect is created by the conjunction of incongruous or contradictory terms
More oxymorons here [oxymorons.com] and here [oxymoronlist.com] (and I'm sure you can search google for more.
P.S. Could someone please explain what 'Commonwealth affiliated' means in one of the replies above, for the benefit of us UK folk, to whom 'Commonwealth' means something probably quite different.
Re:Universities in the US considering it as well (Score:2)
The only problem I see with SO/OO XML is that it's completely unindented and there is no XSL to convert it to anything readable. Ive made few hacks by myself, but it would be nice if Sun will supply some XSL to convert to/from another XML formats.
Re:Universities in the US considering it as well (Score:2)
Rotten (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Rotten (Score:2)
Re:Rotten (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Rotten (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Rotten (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Rotten (Score:2, Informative)
Sun made the offer, where Schools, teachers and Students can get StarOffice for free
In 1.5 years I'm going to be a teacher in Denmark and I like StarOffice
I use OpenOffice.org right now
Thanks Ulla Tørnæs
Re:Rotten (Score:5, Funny)
A little ere the mightiest Apple fell,
No PC stood OSless, and the servers all
Did crash and gibber in the server rooms.
And even the like precurse of fierce events,
As harbingers preceding still the fates
2000 and XP together demonstrate
Unto our climature and countrymen.
[Handing script to Marcellus] Slashdot is desperate with imagination.
Gates: Something is rotten in the state of Denmark.
Ballmer: Heaven will direct it.
Gates: Nay, let's buy it out.
Ballmer: My lord, my lord!
Gates: Illo, ho, ho, my lord!
LINUS ENTERS
Linus: Hillo, ho, ho, boy! Come, bird, come.
Gates: How is't, my noble lord?
Ballmer: What news, my lord?
Linus: O, wonderful!
Ballmer: Good my lord, tell it.
Linus: No, you will embrace and extend it.
Ballmer: Not I, my lord, by heaven!
Gates: Nor I, my lord.
Linus: How say you then? Would Linux give men source code?
But you'll be secret?
Both: Ay, by heaven, my lord.
Linus: There's neer a student dwelling in all Denmark
But he runs StarOffice.
Ballmer: There needs no ghost, my lord, come from the grave
To tell us this.
Linus: Why, right! You are in the right!
And so, without more circumstance at all,
I hold it fit that we shake hands and part;
You, as your business and desires shall point you;
As every man has business and desire.
And for my own poor part, look you, I'll go code.
yeah, but how long are they gonna stay with it? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:yeah, but how long are they gonna stay with it? (Score:2, Insightful)
Yes, let's put RH w/KDE on 486's... Didn't work due to poor planning. I wonder of the over-exuberance of Penguinistas is to blame for that one.
If someone switches back, you'd hear about it. (Score:3, Insightful)
While individuals and small installations may go back to Windows, I suspect that for most large installations, the cost advantages and reliability of Linux are so compelling that they tend to stay with it.
Re:If someone switches back, you'd hear about it. (Score:2)
Microsoft may have a strong foothold in the US... (Score:3, Insightful)
Damn straight! (Score:2)
Re:Microsoft may have a strong foothold in the US. (Score:2)
Re:Microsoft may have a strong foothold in the US. (Score:2)
Re:Microsoft may have a strong foothold in the US. (Score:2)
Even the American kids jump in, out of genuine protest (over what? aren't we plundering the world for their benefit
Just so's you know, Americans are aware that other people, especially Europeans, often raise an eyebrow at us. Out of politeness due a senile ancestor, we rarely mention how impressed we are by this.
Re:Microsoft may have a strong foothold in the US. (Score:2)
there's a growing sentiment of that inside the US too. I, for one, would like to move to Canada sometime in the next decade...
Editors on crack... (Score:5, Informative)
The article speaks mostly about Sun's StarOffice and how students will be offered it, not that every school will switch to Linux...
I'll leave translation to someone who has stronger danish skills than me though.
Re:Editors on crack... (Score:3, Informative)
Denmarks 1,1 million school students and teachers can now turn their backs to Microsoft Corp. At least when it comes to officeprograms.
An agreement between Sun Microsystems and UNI-C implies that the students and teachers at all levels can download StarOffice 6.0 for free and install it at their homecomputers at no cost. Alternativily they can buy a cd-rom at the pure cost which is set to 10 danish crowns (1,5$ or so). The schools can buy StarOffice in bulk (50 cd's).
The agreement has been made with UNI-C according to the rules of guidance that the minister of teaching Ulla Tørnæs (liberal party) published the 30. october. These rules describe who schools and universities must act when offered free office-programs. Among the demands are, that such gifts are truely free to the state and that UNI-C, the danish IT-center for research and education must distribute the licenses.
UNI-C get their expenses covered by the 10 crowns that the distribution of the cd's earn them. Sun provides a server with StarOffice and Linux so that students and teachers can download these programs for free.
UNI-C is here to help the educationenviroment in Denmark, so we are of coure happy to be able to provide such an initiative from Sun, the CEO of UNI-C Dorte Olesen states.
The most common office-system in the world is Microsoft Office which does not exist in a version that can be run on a Linux OS.
Due to the dominance of Microsoft within office-programs as well as OS more and more public authorities are working to create alternatives, primarily the combination of Linux and StarOffice.
If all 1,1 million students and teachers were to take the offer of Sun, the total value would be approx. 200 million danish crowns (28 million $).
Sorry for bad language, spelling errors and misprints.
Re:Editors on crack... (Score:5, Interesting)
What I find amazing is that this story is more "news worthy" than Denmarks resent law (passed on 11/12-02) and enforced from 22/12-02, whick makes it illegal to import or resell music CDs, DVDs, books and comics from outside EU. Except for your own personal use. Which means that any buisness, education or public service (Radio and TV) have to ask permission each time they want to buy/import any of these items, if they survive long enough. Laserdisken (a Danish shop specilized in import of DVDs from America and Asia) have already begone to close two of its three shops.
Read here for more info (sorry Danish only):
Politiken [politiken.dk]
Digital forbruger [digitalforbruger.dk]
Cultural Imperialism (Score:2)
Shame on them.
Re:Editors on crack... (Score:3, Insightful)
If it is the will of the Danish people to stop being assimilated by outside cultures or sending revenue to outside their jurisdiction, then all they have to do is Just Say No and stop buying that stuff. But noooo, they need a law to make themselves do what they supposedly want themselves to do.
Not a specific criticism against the Danish people, really. As Frank Zappa would say, we're "Dumb All Over."
Re:Editors on crack... (Score:2)
Ah, but StarOffice has been free for years without it becoming the standard!
Ironically it's only the latest version 6 that Sun decided you have to pay for. Now Sun is giving it away for free to some selected institution, and people think it's the best thing since sliced bread.
1. Change StarOffice from free to $75
2. Give away $75 StarOffice for free
3. ???
4. Profit!
anyone here speak Danish? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:anyone here speak Danish? (Score:3, Insightful)
Star Office will be ubiquitious. It also works with linux, but linux will not be ubiquitious.
In other words, they are moving to Star Office freely, or for a minimal price on CD. Hardly the same as a non-Microsoft workplace, more like non-MSOffice workplace.
Still, not a bad start.
Now if they could just set up a Christiania in San Francisco...
Interesting tactic from Sun... (Score:2, Insightful)
Bait and switch will not work here... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Bait and switch will not work here... (Score:2)
There are some distinct advantages to the StarOffice/OpenOffice duo. The software itself can be identical, but what the consumer is actually buying is substantially different.
StarOffice is "paid-for" software. This means that support is available because the consumer has a problem. Ultimately, the consumer asks "What am I doing wrong here?" The support is geared toward helping the consumer use the software, not toward fixing anything in the software itself.
OpenOffice is "free" software. This means that support is available because the consumer has run into an "interesting" problem. Ultimately, the consumer says "There is a problem, and here is a possible fix". The support is geared toward finding and fixing any remaining problems in the software, with "Read The Fine Manual" a valid response to any problems of user misunderstanding.
This makes for an interesting ecosystem. As corporate, I will happily keep spending good money on StarOffice as long as it is not *too* inferior to the free OpenOffice. In a sense, what I'm really buying is that I don't have to "Read The Fine Manual". If I have a problem, I *can* get help. What *will* change is how I use the software, not the software itself. If I'm smarter (and sneakier) than the average PHB, I'll buy StarOffice and *use* OpenOffice. Long term, they reinforce each other. That's what I'm really buying.
The
hold on a sec buddy (Score:2)
I don't think this is true exactly. Sun is the copyright holder, they can distribute the software on any terms that they wish. I think that's why they can link Open-office with closed-source libraries like the template code and other extras and sell it as StarOffice.
It's only fair though. Sun bought the star-office code for a lot of money and released it GPL. They didn't have to do that, but they did. They also put quite a few developers and other resources into managing the resulting open-office.
Just as with Mozilla and AOL, I'm sure a large part of the work going into open office today is still on Suns dime.
If Sun wanted to tighten the screws as you said, all they'd have to do is remove some of the developers that they have on OO and put them on StarOffice only code; although I don't think they have any reason to do that.
Translation (Score:5, Informative)
By Keld Louie Pedersen
Denmark's 1.1 million students and teachers can now turn their backs to Microsoft corporation. At least when it comes to office software.
A deal between the Silicon Valley company Sun Microsystems Incorporated and UNI-C means that the country's students and teachers can download the office program StarOffice 6.0 from Sun at no cost and freely install it on their home computer. Alternately, they can buy it on CD-ROM at cost, 10 kroners per CD. The schools can buy StarOFfice in packages of 50.
Sun has made the deal with UNI-C according to the guidelines announced by education minister Ulla Toernaes (Left Party) on October 30th, on how educational institutions should act when offered free office software. Amongst the requirements are that such software donations are without cost for the state, and that UNI-C Denmark's information technology center should be responsible for distributing licenses.
UNI-C's expenses are covered by the 10 kroner the distribution of CD-ROMs brings. Sun makes a server with the free Linux operating system available for those students and teachers who want to download StarOffice 6.0.
"UNI-C exists to help the Danish educational world, so we're naturally very pleased to be able to distribute this type of initiative from Sun", says Dorte Olesen, director of UNI-C.
The world's undisputedly most wide-spread office system is Microsoft Office, although this does not exist in a version that can be used on computers with Linux as the operating system.
Because of Microsoft's dominance in both office and operating systems, several government institutions are working on creating alternatives, primarily the combination of Linux and StarOffice.
If all 1.1 million students and teachers make use of the offer, the total value will, according to Sun Microsystems, be around 200 million kroners.
So it's not an interesting story at all-- (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:So it's not an interesting story at all-- (Score:2)
"Because of Microsoft's dominance in both office and operating systems, several government institutions are working on creating alternatives, primarily the combination of Linux and StarOffice."
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/2413
k12ltsp (Score:4, Informative)
Anyone interested in doing something along these lines, and avoiding M$'s protection racket ("y'know, for a few dollars a year per station, I could make sure that you don't get hassled by software license audits"), should check out k12ltsp.org [k12ltsp.org]. With corporate donation programs starting to pass along some decent hardware to schools, a kick-ass lab can be had for just the cost of the networking infrastructure.
Translation (Score:2, Redundant)
An agreement between silicon Valley based Sun Microsystems and UNI-C has resulted in a free available download of office suite 6.0 for all school pupils, teaches and students in general.
Alternatively they can buy the program at cost , 10kr per unit. Schools can buy them in quantities of 50.
Sun has made and agreement with UNI-C following the guidelines, that Secretary of Education Ulla Tørnæs (Liberal Party) published on October 30'th, for how educational institutions heeds to act when offered free office suites. One of the requirement is that like offerings impose no cost on the government and the UNI-C IT-Center for research and Education handles the distribution. UNI-C covers its cost thru the 10kr charge for the physical CD-Rom. Sun provides a server with the free Linux OS installed for the students and the teachers that wishes to download StarOffice 6.0.. UNI-C mission in life is to help the Danish educational area, so we are delighted to act as a go between for such an offering from Sun, states Dorte Olesen, Managing Director. for UNI-C.
The worlds undisputed leader in office systems is Microsoft's Office, that does exist in a version that runs on the Linux OS.
Due to Microsoft's dominant position of the Office productivity domain as well as the underlying OS is causing more and more public institutions to seek out alternatives. Primary the combination Linux and StarOffice.
If all 1.1 million students , teachers uses the offering the combined value of the gift from Sun Microsystems will be around 200 million kroner.
Uni-C: Danish IT Centre for Education and Research (Score:2)
More info about Uni-C (in English):
http://www.uni-c.dk/generelt/english/index.html [uni-c.dk]
Pass the CD... (Score:2)
Wow...1.1 million kids are going to have to share one CD-Rom? Anybody have a couple hundred CD-R drives ready?
This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:5, Funny)
Denmark, whose main exports include those silly little wooden shoes and tulips, was unavailable for comment.
In other news, Microsoft led a resounding stock rally.
Re:This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:2, Troll)
Solution?
Get their own friendly government installed iraq.
It keeps me awake at night thanking our lord that sweden havent got anything the USA could need.
Not really... (Score:2)
Oil is expensive, but not nearly as expensive as the cost of invasion. Or war. Saving several million, or even several hundred million, doesn't stand up to the billions of greenbacks that a war with Iraq would require.
A stupid move on Bush's part? Yes. Done for shady reasons with crappy motivations? Yes. Are oil prices part of that motivation? Not really.
The US doesn't get that much of its oil from Iraq. It's not like there aren't other members of OPEC willing to sell to us. Or Texas, for that matter.
Re:This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:3, Informative)
Re:This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:4, Informative)
Denmark, whose main exports include those silly little wooden shoes and tulips, was unavailable for comment.
Re:This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:2)
We? No, our main exports include synthetic and organic drugs and the occasional spazzed out french tourist. The clogs and tulips are from the past, my dear.
Re:This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:2)
Except that clogs are still seen and tulips account for 40 percent of the whole of Duch agriculture earnings at over 150 million dollars worth per year. Sounds pretty here-and-now to me.
TWW
No, Holland has a much more insidious export (Score:2)
Stunning Al Quaida - Lego - Denmark link (Score:5, Funny)
Apparently, the attack was planned using a 43,000 lego brick scale model of the two towers. The Administration suspects direct involvement by Lego Corporation's scaled modelling experts and has now declared Lego products a Weapon of Mass (Modelling) Destruction. The Administration is now compiling a list of all people who have made substantial Lego purchases in the last few week and will be immediately calling them in for questioning and possible detention over the next few days.
Re:This just in. Denmark part of Axis of Evil (Score:2)
We're Lego, Maersk and bacon
translation from elcheapo online translator (Score:2, Funny)
Why not use Linux in schools? (Score:3, Insightful)
penetrating the soft underbelly ... (Score:2)
Yeah, Apple has been trying to do this for years with their education program. Then again, they're not offering obscenely cheap software that is easy to install on donated Pentium III's.
Re:penetrating the soft underbelly ... (Score:2, Insightful)
OpenOffice.org - the development platform for StarOffice is only at 1.0.1. It is stable (at least for us), but there are still a few issues to resolve. Not the least of which is a usable version for the Mac. This is probably part of the reason they are waiting as many schools do use Apple (although these are decreasing).
Our school jumped on the bandwagon while OpenOffice.org was still in beta. We completely converted to Open/StarOffice last year. I think that part of this push (when it happens), should also center around competition. It should go something like this:
"How many of your tax dollars go to your local schools? How much of that goes to Microsoft? You might be surprised..."
Offer StarOffice for cost of media, give OpenOffice.org to the students / parents on request and you've got a winner.
Not Linux, star office (Score:4, Informative)
It does not mention anything about schools switching to Linux.
Well, Linux is more indirectly mentioned. (Score:2)
And in the next paragraph it says that several public institutions are working to move from MS products (Windows/Office), primarily to Linux/StarOffice.
What it all leads up to is that this application is ready to move to Linux. Of course that doesn't mean that other software might hold them back on Windows.
Kjella
I see many posts about LTSP (Score:2)
LTSP requires a ton of configuration and requires boot rom's and nfs to mount root drives. This is to many pieces and parts to fail. I run hundred's of clients in this fashion and it requires darn near 0 effort to maintain by the sysadmin.
I wish... (Score:2)
Even people graduating from CS hardly konw Linux even exists. And those who do, usually drop out of college during first 2 years. That's what I did...
Clarification of a few things... (Score:5, Informative)
I'm from Denmark, I can read the article, so I figured I'd clear up a few things:
An entity, which is called UNI-C, has reached an agreement with Sun Microsystems about distribution of their StarOffice package. Schools, teachers and students will be able to get the software for free if they download it (from a linux server, running on the danish school network known as Sektornet) or for a fee of ~ $1.50 on a CD.
UNI-C is a semigovermental entity, that does networking for the public school system and the universities, hosts the DIX (Danish Internet eXchange) and things like that. Danish law says, that for a public school to accept free software, the software must be of no expense to the state, and its ditribution must be handled by UNI-C.
So, in conclusion, no, every school in Denmark is not switching to Linux. They may switch to StarOffice, on some platform.
But hey, it's a step in the right direction...
Oh, and merry x-mas everyone.
Bo
Lets get our facts straight. (Score:4, Informative)
UNI-C [uni-c.dk] is not "University of Copenhagen". It is a state-run pseudo-company which offers IT/networking facilities for the educational sector. Amongst other things they host the Danish Internet eXchange (DIX [www.dix.dk]") where ISPs can peer on neutral ground, and they offer a free life-time email-address to all danish teachers.
There's not a word about Linux in this anywhere.
Sun has offered StarOffice at a hefty educational discount. UNI-C helps them implement the scheme in a manner which saves Sun a lot of logistics.
There has been increasing focus on Open Source in Denmark recently, ignited by a independent report [teknologiraadet.dk] which concluded that if the political goals about using the Internet to improve the public sector are to be fulfilled, one can do so $500M cheaper over the next 10 years using Open Source than M$ software.
M$ is not happy about this, but their FUD doesn't seem to stick anymore.
A single Danish city-council, Hanstholm [hanstholm.dk], has taken a bold step and switched to StarOffice, and they're getting a lot of positive attention. (If you want to hear more about this, attend Nordu2003 [nordu.org])
Yes, I think this is all signs of a healty development :-)
All schools In Denmark switching to Star Office (Score:2, Interesting)
Sun and MS--brothers of same ilk (Score:2)
And how, exactly, is this dumping any different than the tactics Microsoft uses?
Re:Sun and MS--brothers of same ilk (Score:2)
IANAL, by the way.
Re:Sun and MS--brothers of same ilk (Score:2)
Every producer has a monopoly over their products, be it Office, Solaris, Paradox, or Access. Just like in Highlander, there can be only one (who gets the right to maintain the product, licensing aside.)
Re:Sun and MS--brothers of same ilk (Score:2)
Methinks you misunderstand what a monopoly is, at least legally. Making a unique product that no one else has or can sell is NOT a monopoly. It is legitimate competition. But any entity controlling a specific market segment to the point where that segment cannot reasonably be called competitive IS a monopoly.
Microsoft has been found, despite using every delay tactic and technicality money could buy, to have a monopoly in the desktop OS market. You may disagree with this conclusion, but it is a legal FACT.
Monopolies are not illegal-- but EXTENDING them, as the previous poster pointed out, by using the monopoly to freeze competition in market segments which are not yet monopolized, IS illegal.
This is why MS's giving away and embedding IE in its OS was illegal.
It is also why Sun giving away its office suite is not.
Re:Sun and MS--brothers of same ilk (Score:2)
Not according to the DOJ letter dated prior to Windows 95's release. It was after Windows 98 came out that the DOJ pitched a fit.
And, just so you know, I DO know what a Monopoly is, I simply use the standard definition of Monopoly that the average Slashdotter uses when yapping about MS' evil tactics.
Re:Sun and MS--brothers of same ilk (Score:2)
As for this letter, do you think that Judge Jackson didn't know about it? All the evidence was considered, and the Judge, notwithstanding his rather foolish comments to journalists, found Microsoft to be illegally attempting to extend their monopoly. There's really no point debating this issue.
How many? (Score:2)
Wow. I didn't realize Denmark was so small. Here in the US, cities like Chicago, LA, and New York probably have that many students in their school districts. I wonder if any of them would consider switching to Linux? It would save them a ton of money if they had good Linux administrators.
traditionally many schools use Macs (Score:2)
Re:But which Linux distribution? (Score:2)
Re:But Why? (Score:2)
Re:But Why? (Score:3, Insightful)
Perhaps they'll be addicted to system stability and being able to move documents between programs... It might be hard to go back after that.
Re:But Why? (Score:2)
No one should be taking a class in 'Word', they should be taking a class in how to put ideas together to make a coherent whole.
What they *use* to do that is immaterial.
Re:But Why? (Score:2)
But why NOT?! (Score:2, Interesting)
Case in point: One of the arguments made against using Open/StarOffice here was this very thing - that everyone would have to learn something new. A few of the teachers were concerned about our conversion to Open/StarOffice; this was my basic response:
1) Yep. That's what we do - we learn new things here at school. You expect the students to learn new things. Well, once in a while, the teachers must adjust also.
2) This is hardly the first time (and probably won't be the last time) that we have changed office-type software. As I had only been at the school one year prior to this, I did some checking.
Before using Office 97, they were using 95. Before that, some were using Word for DOS, some Works. Before that, Wordperfect. Before that, XYwrite and Visicalc. Etc. Change is inevitable.
The big difference here is that there's a lot more in common between Open/StarOffice and MS Office than MS Office and say, the Wordperfect suite. Sometimes, I think that people that slam on the usability and 'retraining' costs, haven't bothered TRYING it themselves! It's not that hard folks, really.
3) Standardizing on Open/StarOffice lets us give a FREE copy of Openoffice.org to every student, every teacher, every parent (should they want it). Truly a win/win situation here! No more BS with students showing up with a paper they typed at home and not being able to open it at school.
4) Which teacher would like to give up his/her position to enable us to afford licensing for Office XP (yes, I was serious!)
For us. the REAL question was - can the replacement software do EVERYTHING the last one could - at least for what we use it for? For the teachers and students the answer was a definate 'yes'.
I won't even get into the biggest advantage of all. Being able to use a cross-platform office suite means having the ability to GO cross-platform at some future date. Whether we do or not will depend on Microsoft.
Re:But why NOT?! (Score:3, Insightful)
That's the real payout. And everybody using the same version of the same software is *not* a viable solution. Home, Office, School. Different versions of different software. They all need to be able to read and write. The duo of StarOffice/OpenOffice will tend to ensure that "improvements" and "enhancements" do not introduce gratuitous incompatibilities.
Re:But Why? (Score:2)
Besides, getting the kids on a system that is more nuts-and-bolts and open is better for their CS education anyway. C'mon, they can roll their own kernel.
Re:But Why? (Score:2)
In an office there is a staff of geeks to keep the PCs running. All the vast majority of office drones need to kow is how to type (a useful skill if you can do it properly), and select text and click on a button to make it bold, pink or whatever, then click on the print or send button. That's all most people who use Windows and Office really use it for; and if you're doing it on Windows, Linux or Mac it doesn't take more than a few hours to "switch" to whatever.
Ten years ago there was a huge variety of apps used -- for Word processing most used DOS and Wordperfect, or Word (DOS or Mac) or IBM Displaywrite or Wordstar, (we even had an antique CPM machine with Wordstar). Are people now so much more stupid than then that they'll go into shock if there isn't a start menu and a paperclip to tell them what to do? Give people credit for having brains -- it's not the specifics of each application schools should be teaching anyway. When today's kids go to work in five or ten years how much will MS stuff have changed?
Re:This is HUGE HUGE news!!! (Score:2)
Linux is given away for free, too, but that doesn't mean all schools in Denmark will use it, too.
StarOffice? (Score:2)
I suggest that everyone intrested in alternate office suites check out OpenOffice [openoffice.org] which is like StarOffice without the fat. I have used MS Office products for the last 8 years almost exclusively and I can honestly say that OpenOffice is ready for the needs 99%+ of MS Office users. I am already using features in OpenOffice like Cross-Referencing and automated indexing that I never figured out in Word (if they exist, which they probably do.)
I started my first real project with it 2 days ago (which is documentation for a program I wrote) and everything is moving quite smoothly.
Overall, it is both Free and highly recommended by me. If you want to ditch office please look at OpenOffice!
Re:StarOffice? (Score:2)
The only differences are license, fonts, cliparts, templates, dictionaries, thesasaurus and better hyphenation in SO-6. The speed of both should pretty much be identical on both systems.
Re:This is HUGE HUGE news!!! (Score:2)
Huh? Where is the connection between Redhat and StarOffice?
StarOffice is made by Sun and it is available for Windows too. My guess is that the vast majority of the StarOffice installations will be on Windows, since that is what most people use here (yes, I'm from Denmark).
This is still very cool though. It will make a lot of people familiar with StarOffice instead of MS Office.
Re:Is that the meaning of... (Score:2)
Don't take the errors personally, (we) Americans are pretty clueless what goes on abroad, and at home (have you heard of the Pennsylvania "Dutch"?). A surprising number can't name the President, or explain the Supreme Court's interpretation of the 11th amendment. On the other hand, let me ask *you* a few questions about American, Mr. Resident Alien..... Yes, you probably know more than I do, don't show off. And it's pretty darn inconsiderate that Dutch doesn't sound at all like "Holland" or "The Netherlands," but does sound a lot like "Deutsch."
I've at least visited the Netherlands and thought Copenhagen was great! (A joke! Really!)
When you live in a country that's big enough to confuse you, you're less likely to look abroad for additional confusion.
Oh great (Score:5, Funny)
Just what we need. More products from a company notorious for their.... erm... security leaks.
Re:Why not OpenOffice? (Score:2)
How about so one large entity (schools/gov't org) can count on full support from another org (Sun)? Such organizations are not the type of entity that will populate mailing lists or newsgroups seeking support, they want a single source that is certain to deal with any problem they have right now.
This isn't a dig at openoffice, it is simply a fact that the openoffice people are not setup for providing support the same way that Sun is. This fact is one of the reasons that the corporation that is RedHat is the biggest and most successful linux distro to date because they are a single corporate entity that will support their product faster and better than a newsgroup can (or mailing list). These common free means of support are fine for individuals but don't cut it for corporations or government entities.
Sun and Staroffice were the right choice in this, given the requirements. Besides, large entities supporting Staroffice are by default also supporting Openoffice as they are fully compatible with each other. The important thing, the KEY thing, is that something other than M$ Office is being adopted in a big way and this will continue. The growth of corporations and governments adopting Staroffice also supports openoffice. It is win-win.
Re:Why not OpenOffice? (Score:2)
Really? I have not used openoffice for very long yet, (only several hours of word processing) but it has been 100% solid so far.
Re:Why not OpenOffice? (Score:2)
What is really bad is MS-Word file format support. When I have OO Writer file of 100K and export it to MS Word doc format I get 20M. That export has certainly a bug somewhere.
Re: Danish eh... (Score:2)
Frustration? (Score:2)