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Mandriva Businesses

Xbox Receives Linux Mandrake 9.0 273

Posted by timothy from the nice-nice-nice dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Today the Xbox Linux Project announced that Xbox Linux Mandrake 9 has been released. This is the first complete Linux distribution for the Microsoft Xbox gaming console. A 350 MB installation CD of Xbox Linux Mandrake 9 is available for download free of charge from the Xbox Linux website."
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Xbox Receives Linux Mandrake 9.0 More

Xbox Receives Linux Mandrake 9.0

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  • Woooweee! (Score:4, Funny)

    by ebbomega ( 410207 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @05:53AM (#4408747) Journal
    Now I can use WINE on my Xbox....

  • README / legal (Score:5, Funny)

    by jukal ( 523582 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @05:56AM (#4408757) Journal
    Heh, they handle the legal issues in a very "pro" way [sourceforge.net]:

    Xbox is either a trademark or a registered trademark of Microsoft Corporation. Mandrake might be some kind of trademark of MandrakeSoft. Linux definitely is a trademark of Linus Torvalds. GNU is cool, but I don't think it's a trademark.

  • Stupidity (Score:5, Insightful)

    by e8johan ( 605347 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @05:57AM (#4408760) Homepage Journal
    If M$ was so determined to build a console and prevent people from running *nix and other fun stuff on it, *why* did they choose a (nearly) standard PC hardware platform. Please provide a more custom solution next time to give the hackers a real challenge ;-)

    • There is method in the M$ madness (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ites ( 600337 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @07:11AM (#4408904) Journal
      "Why choose a (nearly) standard PC platform"?
      Microsoft are long-distance players.
      They are designing a Microsoft PC platform.
      Let's call it 'Fritz 1'.
      They would really like this to become the next standard.
      And by trying this out in the XBox arena they are proofing the concept.
      Whatever weaknesses get thrown up now will be closed in the next release.
      After three releases, the design will be unbreakable.
      After that, it's a minor matter to convince Dell and HP to base their PCs on this design.
      And Windows XP 2003 will not run on anything else.
      If the XBox does not scare you, perhaps you should consider a future where all PCs are designed by Redmond.
      It would be smarter for people to leave the XBox alone and not contribute to M$'s strategy by hacking it.

      • Re:There is method in the M$ madness (Score:4, Insightful)

        by mr3038 ( 121693 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @08:09AM (#4409000)
        If the XBox does not scare you, perhaps you should consider a future where all PCs are designed by Redmond.

        PCs will be PCs in the future too. It might be that you cannot run Windows on a PC anymore in the future. I really don't understand the difference between this new Microsoft XBox and normal x86 PC if they really decided to offer Windows for XBox only. XBox, even in its current form, has all the processor power the casual office worker needs and if companies can get their boxes for less than 250 euros then they should go for it. But some workers doing 3D stuff and simulations do need more processing power than that XBox can offer. So MS needs to offer multiple versions of this new XBox because companies are not going to pay for features they aren't using--at least I hope so. If this new XBox does have replaceable Xcpu, Xmemory, Xmotherboard and Xpci cards then how it's different from a reqular PC? It's not like we have a single identical bus between first x86 PC and todays PC either and we still consider those as the same architecture.

        The only thing to fear is that general use PCs could have really high price tag because all the normal people buy the XBox New Technology (pun intended) instead.

        • The ones who have the most to fear are gamers, not casual office workers.

          Microsoft's strategy is to corner the gaming-hardware market. If the X-box becomes the only console available, we will see the end of "Direct X" on the PC. Windows will be rigged to choke on anything but the most rudimentary game software. Anyone who wants to play a game will be forced to buy an X-box.

        • I think he is talking about the DRM, not the PC. If in the future you are required to buy an Xbox systems instead of a generic PC to run windows then you can sya bye-bye to the lowcost PC and hello to the EXPENSIVE Xbox.

      • And Windows XP 2003 will not run on anything else.

        That's probably what they're planning, but given their previous record it'll take until XBox 3 & WinXP 2006 for it to actually work properly. :)

      • ites wrote:

        > And Windows XP 2003 will not run on anything
        > else.
        > If the XBox does not scare you, perhaps you
        > should consider a future where all PCs are
        > designed by Redmond.

        Close, but you do not go far enough. The only XBox application Microsoft could get developers for was as a game console, but that was never the original intention. Originally XBox was to be the home terminal to .Net, and eventually, Microsoft's OS for the next Millennium (http://research.microsoft.com/research/sn/Millenn ium/mgoals.html especially "What would such a system be like?").

        Like online gaming, you would pay Microsoft a monthly fee. You would also pay for use of any extra features in your software, and of course, for access to secure files (music, etc.). The initial hardware cost would be far cheaper than a PC, but the monthy and usage payments would be mostly profit for Microsoft.

        Programs and your data would exist across the distributed net. You could run Office.Net, just about any application or game written for .Net and Millenium. Better watch your monthly bill, though, because it is going to be worse than your phone bill, and probably as big a surprise.

        > It would be smarter for people to leave the XBox
        > alone and not contribute to M$'s strategy by
        > hacking it.

        Most definitely. Microsoft could point to Linux users using it as a regular computer and say to its developers: "See, they are using it to run other programs." As long as the XBox is only a game console and a failed one at that, Microsoft's plans for it will fail as well.

        Shinoda: "The age of Millennium."
        Io: "What does that mean?"
        Shinoda: "A thousand year kingdom. It wants to create a home for itself. There is one flaw in its plan: Godzilla."
        "Godzilla 2000 Millennium" (Japanese version)

        G Countdown: 21 days (www.godzillaoncube.com)

    • Re:Stupidity (Score:4, Insightful)

      by tsa ( 15680 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @07:31AM (#4408928) Homepage
      That's not stupid, that's brilliant marketing. The fact that you can run Linux on it will now be a reason to buy an X-box, so MS now earns money with Linux, and it didn't cost them anything! Bill never ceases to amaze me.
      • Well, not realy. If I recall correctly they lose money on the hardware which should be made up for by the games.. and since an xbox running mandrake will not run xbox games they lose..

    • DRM Practice (Score:3, Insightful)

      by DrSkwid ( 118965 )
      Protecting the XBox is good practice for building an 'unbreakable' home PC.

      MS had to build a PC becasue they need to have a reference point. A software DRM solution would be problematic because of the wide range of hardware it was likely to end up running on. They have a need to get this reference system into the wild and see how people would attempt to break into it. Already they have reaped dividends by having their first attempt cracked.

      They can do this without any great risk to their reputation as secure system builders because, after all, it's *only* a games console.

  • New Sourceforge Project (Score:5, Funny)

    by youngerpants ( 255314 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:01AM (#4408767)
    The first one to get CP/M running on the XBox will gain true kudos.

    10 PRINT "Microsoft really wouldnt like this"
    20 GO TO 10
    RUN

    • Re:New Sourceforge Project (Score:4, Funny)

      by sg_oneill ( 159032 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:56AM (#4408881)
      by youngerpants on Tuesday October 08, @06:01PM (Score:1, Offtopic) (#4408767)
      (User #255314 Info) [ Neutral ]
      The first one to get CP/M running on the XBox will gain true kudos.

      10 PRINT "Microsoft really wouldnt like this"
      20 GO TO 10
      RUN

      Ah... Teen moderators... Don'chya lovem "What's CPM got to do with this?". (Hint read some IT history books kids.)

  • Why? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by miffo.swe ( 547642 ) <daniel@hedblom.gmail@com> on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:02AM (#4408770) Homepage Journal
    Even if its nice and fun that they have made it possible why would i want to run linux on X-box? All they really do is helping MS finetuning their DRM system before it gets to he PC. It will be a cold day in hell before i buy an Xbox.

    • Re:Why? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by DJProtoss ( 589443 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:23AM (#4408814)
      Why? Because you can have a small, quiet, nicely put together server box for around £140 + modchip costs (which if you are handy with a solder, are quite small).

    • Re:Why? (Score:2, Insightful)

      by oever ( 233119 )
      I agree completely.

      These people would be much wiser if they'd port linux to all these different PDA devices. That's a hot market right now.
      • There are quite a few PDAs that run Linux. None of them have been superior (usability-wise) to devices running PalmOS or even WinCE.
    • Why not? Buy ten of them, then smash them to bits. Every one you buy takes money directly out of Bill-n-Steve's pockets and away from their DRM project. Just don't buy any games

      • Re:Why not? (Score:2, Insightful)

        by will_die ( 586523 )
        Except they have more money then me, and each sale goes on record as another person who has one.

      • Re:Why not? (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Quixote ( 154172 )
        Why not? Buy ten of them, then smash them to bits. Every one you buy takes money directly out of Bill-n-Steve's pockets and away from their DRM project. Just don't buy any games

        sigh... this comes up every time there's a discussion on the X-box. Your logic would make sense if there was an infinite supply of X-boxes. The fact is, the number of X-boxes being manufactured is limited (and finite, as are all things in this Universe except, possibly, human stupidity). If you buy an X-box, it moves off the shelf and the manufacturer gets $300 ($100 from MS, and $200 from you). If you don't buy it, it sits on the shelf and the manufacturer is out $300. An X-box sitting on the shelf for 1 year will end up costing the manufacturer an additional (say) $50 in interest and other costs, maybe much more.

        If you really want to hurt MS (and I am not saying that one should; I'm just answering this hypothetically), then the best way to do it is to (a) not buy X-box at all, (b) convince others to not buy either, and (c) (this might be illegal) buy an X-box and return it after opening it.

        • Each xbox going to someone for the sole purpose of running linux hurts MS because it removes one more xbox from the pool of contributing to their recurring revenue stream, selling games. Each xbox diverted from its true purpose is a good thing(tm).
          The probability of convincing enough people not to buy xbox to make a difference is very small.
          There is a very good probability that a significant number of xbox could be diverted from their recurring revenue with a solid linux port.
          • Each Xbox bought also goes to the pool of "Xbox sold" which MS uses to market to game developers to code for the Xbox which creates more Xbox games which MS uses to market to the consumer to buy an Xbox.

      • Someone help me out here;

        Better than buying them (costing me $) and smashing them, couldnt i goto ToysRus with a tiny gauss gun or somthing up my sleeve (magnet) and zap all the lovely HDs on the Xboxes? could you fry the harddrive on teh xbox to the point where it wouldnt run?

        if i did this it would
        A) cost ToyRUs to return/handle etc, reducing profits on Xbox, making ToysRUs un-favourable to MS consoles
        B) cost M$ money because they have to handle returns etc
        C) Give xbox a black eye to gamers who would see xbox as crappy (defective) hardware, dropping sales

        this has been my little fantasy for some time - can anyone tell me if it is at all possible?

    • Re:Why? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by JavaTHut ( 9877 )
      This has probably already been asked many times already, but, didn't Sony release a Playstation Linux kit? Why arn't we supporting their efforts and buying that instead of pouring so much effort into a mircro~1 solution?

      ~Ravi

    • Re:Why? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by blibbleblobble ( 526872 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @09:05AM (#4409185)
      All they really do is helping MS finetuning their DRM system before it gets to he PC.

      Very true. However, they are also demonstrating legitimate uses of mod-chips, legitimate uses of hacking proprietry hardware, and legitimate reasons for cracking hardware protection. Best of all, they are doing so in a manner which can easily be recognised by the general public (of which judges are a subset) - "Cracking hardware is good: look, you get to run this mainstream, competitive, and popular OS distribution.

      A couple years ago, you'd have taken a modchip to court and the judge would say, "well yes, this is just for playing illegal games isn't it", but now you can take the same modchip along and the judge will see "yeah, that can be used to load the office-suite my son uses". Big difference.

    • Re:Why? (your answer) (Score:5, Insightful)

      by gosand ( 234100 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @09:16AM (#4409219)
      Even if its nice and fun that they have made it possible why would i want to run linux on X-box? All they really do is helping MS finetuning their DRM system before it gets to he PC. It will be a cold day in hell before i buy an Xbox.

      I agree, I wouldn't buy one either. But think about this: before Linux (I'll assume GNU/Linux, since it is now a distro) was ported to the Xbox, there was no reason to have a mod chip other than to play pirated games. Now people are hacking it (in the truest sense of the word) and are finding other fun uses for THE HARDWARE THAT THEY BOUGHT. I emphasize that because Microsoft just shut down a company that sold mod chips. They have no right to do this. Once you buy hardware, you own it. Now they might be able to convince a judge that the only reason to have a mod chip is to play pirated games, therefore robbing Microsoft of their money. But with the porting of Linux, it proves that there are non-illegal reasons to want to buy a mod chip.

      Not that I think that it will stop Microsoft from bullying people, but it is a start. If you couldn't run the Linux kernel on the Xbox, there would be no other reason to buy a mod chip.

      Besides, I think it is cool that people have the skills to do this kind of thing. It is interesting, and proves the power of the "little guy".

      • Now they might be able to convince a judge that the only reason to have a mod chip is to play pirated games, therefore robbing Microsoft of their money. But with the porting of Linux, it proves that there are non-illegal reasons to want to buy a mod chip.

        Yeah, just like the judge decided that since DeCSS was necessary to play DVDs on Linux, it's OK to distribute it.

        Oh, wait...

  • Considering the lack of great games, the linux distro on the xbox will help cut the loses for those people that purchased it thinking there would be this great exodus from the PS2 to the xbox by the great game makers.

  • Interesting indeed (Score:2, Informative)

    by zeekiorage ( 545864 )

    ...it contains the graphical environments Gnome and KDE, as well as software packages such as OpenOffice.org, XMMS and Mozilla.

    and all this in only 350 mb!! I wonder if I can download and install it on my pc ;). BTW the press release is here [sourceforge.net]

  • Motivation? (Score:2, Informative)

    by Opiuman ( 172825 )
    Personally I think that the fine fine hackers of the Xbox Linux [sourceforge.net] project have done a great job. Part of their motivation is the $200,000 prize [com.com], another part of the motivation is that Micro$oft is losing a bundle [com.com] on each Xbox sold for which no games are bought -- but -- IMHO the bigger parts of the motivation is the pure hacking challenge and the quest for freedom in using hardware you own.

    • Idiot (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      They lose even more money every time an X-Box sits on a warehouse shelf instead of being sold.

      Buying an X-Box does not "stick it" to Microsoft.

  • Redhat and KDE (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Mr_Silver ( 213637 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:16AM (#4408799)
    From the README [sourceforge.net]:

    In addition, RedHat does not provide both Gnome and KDE in equally powerful installations.

    Is this an ill-informed, and IHMO wrong, swipe at Redhat's changes to KDE and Gnome to make them more unified or are they implying something else? If so, what?

    I've never had a problem installing both under Redhat and hence have no idea what on earth they are talking about.

    • Is this an ill-informed, and IHMO wrong, swipe at Redhat's changes to KDE and Gnome to make them more unified or are they implying something else?

      Forget for a moment the recent arguments over RH8, and consider the previous releases. Red Hat has always had less-than-stellar packaging of KDE, certainly by comparison to Mandrake or SuSE, just as SuSE's Gnome packaging has always been the poor relation to its KDE packages. It's simply a consequence of where those distros' particular development direction is focused. That doesn't mean to say Red Hat 7.x's packaging of KDE or SuSE's packaging of Gnome is crap, or that they don't work, just that significantly less time and energy has been spent on them fixing bugs and customizing them, because both distros consider the 'other' desktop to be less important to them.

      Even before the release of RH8, I can see why Mandrake would be chosen for a more desktop-agnostic solution - simply because it is, with strong development investment in both.

      Having said that, I do think it's a dig at RH8's Bluecurve more than anything else - but that's fine by me, because personally I agree with those sentiments, and I'm glad to see that I'm far from the only one who thinks that. Let's save those particular arguments for a more appropriate thread though, shall we? :)

  • News (Score:4, Funny)

    by S.I.O. ( 180787 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:17AM (#4408801)
    CNN:
    According to some industry insiders Microsoft, creator of the massively popular Linux computing platform is about to release some games (!) for the device. Linus Torvalds had consulted his lawyers and raised concern that such software products may violate his intellectual property.

  • Linux on xbox is nonsense (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:22AM (#4408810)
    What is about linux on xbox : a cheap PC ?
    It is nonsense. Of course it is cool to tweak Microsoft Hardware. but what the hell ?

    I you want a game console, ok. but don't buy a xbox to put linux on it. It makes no sense.

    I'd rather spend 100$ more and get a real PC. A silent mini-pc for instance see for instance http://www6.tomshardware.com/howto/02q1/020111/
    w ith a TV output and a remote you can make the perfect game console + multimedia player (DVD, mp3, divx etc) + office station + whatever you want..

    You can even choose a via C3 or eden fanless cpu for more comfort.

    A real cool LinuX/Windows/whatever PC with 256MB RAM, 40GB HD etc ..., not a 64MB RAM 8GB HD (ugly) xbox without warranty (cause chiped).

    My 2 cent (of ) tip

    • Even better than that, Tiger-Direct had some sweet deals on VIA C3 systems. You could build a low power, near-silent server for little more than $100. Don't like C3s? Fine, pop a cheapo Duron or Celeron in there. I just want cool and quiet.

      The lack of proper GPU support on the X-Box makes it useless for much more than a cheap hack. It's cool, but what point is there to it? Sure, you get a nice GPU, but its useless for anything else, and the rest of the parts (like the hard drive) are vastly inferior to the fast and cheap IDE drives that you can get nowadays.
    • *cough*. This was rated at +5?

      Then don't buy an Xbox and don't put Linux on it.

      Now, was that so hard?

      These people felt like tricking out their Xboxen with Mandrake. Did you ever buy a t-shirt that was slightly less than functional, but looked cool? What about sneakers?

      Sometimes, dude, people do things because they feel like it. And if the rest of us think it's kinda cool, then all the better. Thus the slashdot post: some /. readers might dig this stuff. But going off telling them that they're worthless, etc, that's just basically mean.

      Does it make the world a better place? Nope.
      Does it advance the realm of the computer science industry? Probably not.
      Nonsense? Maybe, but then again, so was Linux when it came out.

      Lighten up. ;)
    • It is nonsense. Of course it is cool to tweak Microsoft Hardware. but what the hell?

      Its called hacking...

      It allows you to get more uses of something you may already own. A perfect example is the Sega Dreamcast. Sega stopped making the device in mid 2001. There is a thriving hacking community [dcemulation.com] making the console more useful everyday, including running Linux [fivemouse.com] on a VGA monitor, at least 5 other playable console emu's, homebrew games and tons of ports. Why limit yourself to what the is offically available? I have time, I have the device so I'm going to mess with it. IMHO it would not make sense to buy an Xbox just to run Linux on it but I do not believe that is the point.
    • funny how people get +5 mods for linux on the much slower and expensive PS2, but god forbid it run on the xbox.

      I'm sorry, but my xbox is MANY more times powerfull then 99.9% of the linux boxes out there. I don't know if YOU know this, but i don't know a single person who dedicates there "latest and greatest" box to run Linux, most people have there trusty "celery" machines running linux off in the corner or an old P3-450 running gnome/kde.

      The xbox has fast cpu, plenty of disk space, a sweet video card, a great sound card, DVD and plays games to boot.

      NO extra peripherals other then a mod-chip are required to do this. You don't have to buy the expensive "linux Xbox kit" like you do with the PS2. No greedy corporation is making or loosing money.

      Sounds like a Win-Win for most people.

      BTW, you can get xboxen off ebay for pennies to the dollar, as with any console. Try building a 129.00 PC with thus much power.
      • I don't buy it.

        Let me prepend this by saying that I use a PII/266, so I'm not too concerned about processor power, and I don't think that you have to have a 2Ghz Intel proc in your machine to make things good.

        The XBox was designed for console-style gaming. Period. It has a not-so-large hard drive, not particularly impressive outbound bandwidth, low-res video output, and an entirely pathetic amount of RAM (64MB, and that's counting video memory). I've got 256+32 megs of VRAM + main memory, and I'm not running the latest and greatest.

        Most of the money is going into the propriatary graphics hardware, which is unusable and pointless under Linux.

        The CPU is nothing special -- you can buy used, faster computers for less than an X-Box. Plus, you'll get a keyboard instead of those controllers, which aren't a ton of good in Linux.

        My understanding is that the sound hardware is nothing mind-blowing either -- anything I can do with it in Linux that I can't with an EMU10K1 on a desktop Linux box?

        There's the "cool factor" of running on a Linux X-Box, but as a practical desktop machine...I just don't see it.

        That's on top of the fact that you have to mod your system.

        I think you're being awfully rosy about the benefits.

        Also, I don't believe that 99.9% of the Linux boxes out there are slower than the X-Box. It may be a decent chunk, but not that much.

        The other thing that you're ignoring is that, assuming that you're correct that most people are running Linux on a secondary computer, people want to buy a whole new computer, little better than their existing machine, to run Linux. The whole point of using a secondary machine is that it's free -- the hardware is a sunk cost, so why not get some Linuxy good out of it?

        Finally, you stated that you don't know a single person who dedicates their "latest and greatest" box to running Linux. I run only Linux on my only computer, and my closest friend runs Linux on his workstation and OpenBSD on his server.

  • ekod - Eject Key Of Death (Score:2, Informative)

    by huge ( 52607 )
    The eject key will reboot the Xbox, so don't use it.
    surprise... ;)

  • oops (Score:2, Funny)

    by linucs ( 613973 )
    unfortunately the proprietary hardware and free software (free as in free speech) will clash like matter and antimatter so you could build a warp speed car powered by microsoft and linux dehe!
  • Can I run X on it?

    (It's an X-Box...:)) ...damn, that was lame.

  • Hi! (Score:5, Funny)

    by FrostedWheat ( 172733 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:42AM (#4408847)
    It looks like your trying to install Linux. Would you like some help?

  • Mandrake probably won't like this... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by sultanoslack ( 320583 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:42AM (#4408850)
    I'm guessing the XBox folks will get a cease and decist letter rather soon. I really doubt that the fine folks of Mandrake want to end up tangled up in legal issues with Microsoft and I'm rather cetain that they didn't authorize the use of their trademark on the XBox.

    This is as much XBox Mandrake as Lindows + AOL is an AOL PC.

    Disclaimer: I'm not actually saying that I don't think you should be able to run Linux on XBox, but rather that I'm sure MS isn't too fond of the idea, and there will probably be some legalese flying about soon.

    • Re:Mandrake probably won't like this... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by warmcat ( 3545 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:55AM (#4408880)
      The Press Release says:

      ''Mandrake Linux was chosen as the base for our distribution for various mostly technical reasons. We have no affiliation with MandrakeSoft, the creators of Mandrake Linux.''

      The README makes it clear that the Xbox Linux project has no affiliation with Mandrakesoft.

      ''No affiliation exists or is implied between the Xbox Linux Project and Microsoft Corp. or MandrakeSoft.''

      It IS a Mandrake distro with a tuned kernel and some scripts. Because of the GPL Mandrakesoft can expect (and I am sure DO expect) their distro to get redistributed.

      In a world of increasingly samey distros, Makedrake gets some extra publicity.

      Where's the problem?
      • > Because of the GPL Mandrakesoft can expect (and I am sure DO expect) their distro to get redistributed.

        Trademark laws and software licenses are completely different ballgames. Of course they can take the Mandrake distrobution and ship it for XBox; it is in fact overwhelmingly under the GPL and similar licenses.

        This however DOES NOT give them the right to use the Mandrake trademark. They can base a distro on Mandrake and call it XBox Linux -- in fact Mandrake got started by forking Redhat, but if Mandrake had decided to call their distro Redhat That Sucks Less, be assured that they too would have gotten a letter from Redhat's leagl department. The GPL does not give you the right to use someone else's trademark.

        As you may recall, this same type of issue went down when Nusphere decided to market their fork of MySQL as "MySQL". MySQL AB sued them under trademark law. Again, of course they can fork, that is provided for by the GPL, but I'm trying to illustrate the line between software licensing issues and trademark law.

  • If only... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by TheVidiot ( 549995 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @06:56AM (#4408882) Homepage
    Is anyone working on bringing Xbox emulation to the PC? Wouldn't that make more sense?

  • I shouldn't ask but... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by thogard ( 43403 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @07:12AM (#4408906) Homepage
    What would happen if someone was to approach MS as a game developer and officaly port this so its got all the real stuff and so MS can sell it at K-mart or wherever. I know its wrong on so many levels but it would get around the mod chip issue and be legal (assuming the licenses allow it)
    • Well, you couldn't rebuild that official port without MS's secret X-Box key; to my mind, that makes it part of the source code, and thus distribution without it should be prohibited for GPLed software.

      So I think you'ld have to have a non-GPL bootloader for this to work.

      Otherwise it migh tbe ok.

  • This is an empty victory (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ites ( 600337 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @07:15AM (#4408907) Journal
    Running Linux on the XBox helps no-one except Microsoft.
    Microsoft are counting on this kind of project to test the XBox security.
    And when all the weaknesses have been fixed we will find ourselves with a new closed PC platform.
    Leave this thing alone, boycott it, let it rot.
    It is an empty victory to help M$ improve this product.

    • Re:This is an empty victory (Score:5, Funny)

      by flamingdog ( 16938 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @08:55AM (#4409150) Homepage
      really now, do you believe what you're saying? I mean look at Windows for example. Keep that in your mind and repeat to yourself what you're saying. "when all the weaknesses have been fixed" is not on the MS project calender anywhere, my boy.
      • Look at the number of ways people have found to crack into software.
        It is safe to predict that no software protection will ever work.
        But hardware protection is already very hard to break.
        And it is possible to make it unbreakable.
        And IMHO truly we are not far from that point.

  • mini-distro (Score:2, Informative)

    by TheJZA ( 580025 )
    I alwso want to t know if this is something more like the mini-distro that openbrick use. A mandrake mini-distro anad a FreeBSD mini distro.

    check http://www.openbrick.org
    http://www.openbrick.org /download/freebsd
    and http://www.openbrick.org/Members/jp/mini-mdk.tar.b z2/view

  • So, if I do get an xbox, I can have Bill Gates sponsor my hardware, and I will have a GNU-based development platform for making video-games? I realize they won't be speedy yet, nor run on non-chipped xboxes, but I will be able to use it for games development, right?
  • It's like watching a porcupine play with a balloon.

    Once M$ really gets going on squashing this, that's it.

  • real powerful (Score:3)

    by g4dget ( 579145 ) on Tuesday October 08, 2002 @08:25AM (#4409045)
    [Xbox] consists of very powerful IBM-PC-based hardware

    Yeah, 64M, a 733MHz PIII, some slightly outdated nVidia chip, and an 8G hard disk. Real "powerful". See that baby "fly". For the same price, you can get a real PC.

    • Re:real powerful (Score:2, Insightful)

      by JDBrechtel ( 48222 )
      A *real* PC for $200? It'd be close just getting *that* for $200.....much less whatever you consider a real pc.

      • ... $199.86, and it already runs Linux. No modchip required.

        VIA C3 800 MHz processor

        133 MHz frontside bus

        128 MB SDRAM, expandable to 1 GB

        133 MHz memory speed

        10 GB Ultra-ATA 100 hard drive, 5400 rpm

        52x CD-ROM drive

        Integrated Trident Blade 3D/Pro Media AGP 4x graphics Up to 8 MB shared video memory

        Integrated AC '97 Audio with 3D enhanced sound

        Integrated 10/100 Ethernet connection

        Micro ATX tower case (14"D x 7"W x 14"H)

        Available drive bays: one 5.25-inch external, one 3.5-inch external, one 3.5-inch internal

        2 PCI slots

        1 ISA slot

        High-speed serial port

        Parallel port

        2 front and 2 rear USB ports

        Game port

        104-key keyboard

        2-button mouse with wheel

        Audio port (line-in, line-out, mic-in)

        Stereo speakers

        http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product _id=1957333&cat=41937&type=19&dept=394 4

        • Compared to XBox, that system is crap on all fronts except memory and expansion. The video card is crap, and the VIA C3-800 Mhz, while producing little heat, competes more with a PII-400 than anything approaching it's clock speed. The audio is probably worse than XBox....

          MS is not stupid, there is a reason the components as a whole are sold at a loss, it isn't possible to build a complete system with those components that cheap.

          All this said, I have no interest in owning an XBox, for games or hacking. They lack good, exclusive titles, and I would rather shell out a little extra for good expandable system that doesn't require 'modchipping' and doesn't inflate MS's market numbers in any form.
          • You forgot to tell me that it also doesn't have a DVD player.

            I'm not trying to say that a $199 Walmart Linux PC is an XBox, that's not my point. I was responding to the earlier author who maintained that

            "A *real* PC for $200? It'd be close just getting
            [64M, a 733MHz PIII, some slightly outdated nVidia chip, and an 8G hard disk] for $200.....much less whatever you consider a real pc."
            and, except for the (admittedly) crappy Trident shared-memory video card, I'll stand by that assessment. More memory, more hard drive space, higher CPU core frequency (and for that matter, higher FSB speed - 133 MHz) and Linux (Lindows OS) is already installed. Same price. Expandable.

            For the people who suggest that an XBox would make a kewl inexpensive "server", I simply maintain that you could buy and support Microsoft's product, pay extra to hack it with a mod chip and install a free OS over the one you paid for when you bought the XBox, or you could simply buy and support a Linux PC.

            "All this said," hacking an XBox is a pretty neat technical hack, but a lot of effort if all you're trying to do is to save a few bucks on hardware.

  • Yes! Yes! We know! (Score:2, Insightful)

    by et289807 ( 311853 )
    How many times do we have to hear that the Xbox runs linux? It ran the linux kernel - L-i-n-u-x. Of *course* is going to run EVERY gosh darn *linux* distribution! Are we going to list ALL the distributions, ONE by ONE? Do we even KNOW them ALL?

    • Re:Yes! Yes! We know! (Score:2, Insightful)

      by vekotin ( 535759 )
      quote:
      This is the __first__ complete Linux distribution for the Microsoft Xbox.

      Notice the emphasis? I think it's worthwhile information to know who managed to be the first.

      Besides - a distribution means simplicity. Simplicity means more people trying this. And from that on, the snowball hopefully starts rolling down. Thus, the big box with x and Linux will be something interesting to try for more than just level 9 and above ubergeeks.
  • The real reason why Microsoft is so dead set against the mod chips for the X-Box.

    To keep people like us from installing Linux on the damn things.
  • So Mandrake is on the XBox? Big deal.

    Just last night I picked up 50 magic coins and was able to hack into the Pentagon using Super Mario Sunshine.
  • Which character is going to popup when I need help writing a letter in OpenOffice -- Clippy or Tux? Maybe I should play that Clippy vs Tux Xbox game to see who's worthy of being my document writing assistant. ;)

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