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Nice Browsing From Undead & Unknown Software Projects 126

Posted by timothy from the looking-familiar dept.
metalhed77 writes: "A new version of the Nautilus file manager (1.0.4) has made its way out to the gnome ftps. here's the article on linuxtoday. It includes various improvements which are described on linux today, these primarily consisted of bug fixes and speed ups." Good to see that the effort that went into making Nautilus friendly wasn't wasted. But if you want to browse more than your hard drive, HeUnique points out another interesting project which is not distributed with the official KDE package. It's called: KDENOX ("KDE No X" -- you can use it with X or with framebuffer and QT Embedded: here's a screenshot). The gain? You get Konqueror without KDE, with SSL, cookies, proxy, bookmarks, fonts, and without KDE itself. The executable is small (4MB), doesn't take much RAM, and it works very nicely on low end machines ... (grab it from KDE CVS). Update: 07/08 01:17 AM by T : Here's a screenshot elsewhere; first person to mirror gets a lollipop.
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Pretty Browsing From Undead Software Projects More

Pretty Browsing From Undead Software Projects

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  • So.. did nautilus get better? (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Eazel blows millions, gives up Nautilus... is it better now that it's totally run by the free community? If it is, no Linux company should ever get money again.
  • For all they talk about it, you'd think it has features like buttons for "Give head" [...]

    Well, it has been said that Konqueror is the best pr0n browser. Get a load of these features:

    • Checkbox to disable Javascript window.open() method to nip those annoying popups in the bud. In CVS there is a toolbar button, even!
    • Fine-grained cookie control - Let your favorite sites store their settings while blocking privacy-invading tracking services
    • Toolbar button to stop animated .gifs (woohoo!)
    • new Web Archiver feature packages up any website into a .war file for offline viewing

    I guess it's sort of the next best thing to a "Give Head" button.

  • Good thing they mentioned konq (Score:5)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 07, 2001 @04:58PM (#100969)
    Hey look more news about gnome, we better spend most of the writeup talking about kde and konq
  • Hi,

    I made the screenshot, and yes, a bit of Irony won't hurt anyone ;)

  • Re:konqueror does rule (Score:3)

    by Micah ( 278 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @06:50PM (#100971) Homepage Journal
    Netscape is unstable, I think everyone will agree, it's difficult to run it for more than a half hour or so without a segfault or other error.

    Sorry, that's complete BS. Even if you're talking about NS 4.77. Ever since 4.6 or so, I've had pretty good luck with NS's stability. The only times it ever hung were when I was getting to Java apps, with maybe a couple exceptions.

    Now, some people might have had worse luck than I, but you state that "everyone would agree". No, that's just not the case.

    But Mozilla is much better, and I've pretty much quit using NS4.7. Do try 0.9.2 -- it rocks.

    ---
  • Good God, it's 2001. Buy something with a hard drive in it, for God's sake.

    - A.P.

    --

  • Find me a program that _requires_ 4M of code to do what its intended to do and I'm sure you'll find many people able to do it in a lot less code.

    7729636 Mar 26 18:50 /opt/netscape/netscape
    1067312 May 1 2000 /usr/bin/lynx

    And with a lot fewer features...

    - A.P.

    --

  • His point was that the article would be about Mozilla or something and it would provide news about the project. At the end the poster would mention something that is completely not news just for no real reason.

    It's not a matter of what's good, it's simply kind of an odd thing that has been happening.
  • Damn!
    I just upgraded to slack 8.0, so I thought.. "hmm. I'll try galeon! If it's lighter than Mozilla, and it incorporates the gecko engine.. well.."
    This is such a BRILLIANT browser! I *love* the zoom feature (I'm 46, and need it occasionally). The standards conformance (IMHO) and ability to *actually view* almost every page I encounter makes this thing a real godsend. It's been only two days, and I'm using it almost to the total exclusion of 'scape 4.77, which was a HUGE improvement over 4.73, which is what I was using before.
    Yes, it pauses, and lags occasionally, but overall, on my feeble 200(!)mhz system, it's fairly snappy!
    It's still buggy, though. Just try to enter a reply to a /. post like I'm doing right now, and you'll encounter several of them.
  • Probably an early adopter...some of us used to read slashdot before it had user ids....I waited a while to register. :)


    --
  • another browser you might want to try that supports the linux framebuffer is arachne. http://www.arachne.cz [arachne.cz]. It is made for both dos and linux and supports HTML 3.2 as far as I can tell. (i.e. everything but javascript/shockwave/pop-under x10.com ads. I've used it before and it worked great on a 486 laptop I tossed it on.
  • KDE-1.1.2 comes with a nice HTML-3.2 browser that should be light enough. Actually gtkhtml contains the same code.
    --
  • You are a liar. I run Kde-2.2b1 on my PIII-350 with 196 MB ram just fine. No tweaks, standard SuSE-7.2 system, AtiRagePro graphics card.

    If you experience slowness it must be something in front of your screen that slows everything down.


    --
  • Well open your eyes wide and read the topic of the posting once more. You will finally understand that it was *intended* to refer to multiple browsers. Just a nice feature to keep you informed with what happens. Get it?
  • uhh.. hello, you're surfing the web with a help browser.

    Konqueror/khtml != kfm, please upgrade your KDE 1.x installation.

    By the way, nice website you've got, renders real slick. Thanks for being one of those 4 sites. :-)

  • don't ask me, but the projects seem somewhat similar. Galeon being a lightweight Mozilla and this one being a light konqueror...?

    Not lightweight, embedded. There are plenty of embedded Gecko solutions (check out OST, www.ostdev.net [ostdev.net]) but I do not think Galeon qualifies as such.

    Konqueror on the iPaq is very cute though.

  • I have never used Konq. I was told by a couple of friends that I should try it out. Perhaps Konq is going to do for the Linux crowd what IE did for Windows browsing.

    Netscape has been falling behind. Mozilla is great and all (it still crashes for me) but it seems like Konq is moving fast.

    I guess NS lost another browser war. :(
  • You know most of the time it so hard to know where something is crashing and what caused it that it's not worth ranting and raving about whose is best, most stable or whatever. The most important thing is that it works when you need it too. Like when your showing something to a client or demoing in front of a large audience.
    Murphys Law: If it can go wrong it will go wrong!
    If life was a box of chocolates, I'd be all finished in 5 seconds flat. ;-)
  • User Agent configurability exists in KDE 2.1 as well.

    Thank you for playing.
  • Thanks, nautilus hackers, for your continued hard work. 1.0.4 is substantially faster than 1.0.3!
  • How come it's KDENOX when on the screenshot it says "Galeon is a GNOME web browser based on gecko" ... "It requires Gnome and Mozilla"

    Am I missing something? I don't see KDE mentioned.

  • Wow, fast reply! Thanks, so that's what I missed.

    Why do KDE people show screenshots of Gnome web sites? Is that sarcasm or have they become friends?

  • 4Mb = Small? (Score:3)

    by Chris Pimlott ( 16212 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @09:16PM (#100990)
    Call me old fashioned, but I don't consider a 4 megabyte executable to be small... In fact, I don't have a single executable on this system that's 4Mb.
  • This has been around for awhile - the core Konqueror dev has been influenced a bit by it, adding kiosk and security lockdown features into the main code tree.

    On another note, Konqueror has been ported all over the place - it's a good starting testbed for the kdelibs and the assorted io slaves. It remains to be seen if Konqueror appearing on a platform indicates that a KDE port is being considered (possibly by someone unconnected with the Konqueror port), or if it's just a test probe into that platform (PDAs, various system's framebuffers, etc).

    --
    Evan

  • Looks like a step backwards...like when you had a VGA game in DOS that need to take up an entire screen and had to re-write the drivers for every game. But that's just my take.

    JoeLinux

  • Nautilus is looking very tasty. (Score:3)

    by Chuck Chunder ( 21021 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @04:39PM (#100993) Journal
    I've spent the weekend upgrading my PC to the latest and greatest stuff (Xfree, kernel, nvidia drivers) and thought I'd give Nautilus a go, having not tried it since it's initial release.

    In short, I'm impressed. It seems thoroughly usable and I think it'll have a permanent place on my desktop now. Now to have a go at compiling it with Mozilla support....
  • Except the frame buffer is a standard driver with a defined and known interface. And QT Embedded is a standard library with a defined and known interface. No-one is re-inventing the wheel. The drivers back in the DOS day's sucked. It really didn't change until first VESA, then Windows came a long and gave nice standard drivers. Linux isn't going back, just giving more options.
  • Apple stole originally? Yes, that would be another story (wrong, too):

    http://www.mackido.com/Interface/ui_history.html

    My problems with Windows include the look of Windows. (But hey, I'm biased that way...)
  • I will give you that IE doesn't crash much, but I won't give you that it's stable-- since I cannot count the times that 5 or 5.5 have completely misdrawn pages. I think my favorite is when I've gotten moderator points on Slashdot and I go to scroll down, instead of the form elements moving with the text the text scrolls and the form elements are sticky.

    FWIW, getting mod points on /. is the only time IE has spazzed out on me...and that seems to only happen under Win98. I've gotten mod points a couple of times since switching to Win2K, and the problem you describe has never happened.

    The only current-version browser I've run across that consistently has rendering problems is Nutscrape 4.x. Its CSS implementation is effed up pretty badly; sites that render just fine in IE, Opera, Mozilla, Konqueror, etc. sometimes come up as a total jumble in Nutscrape. Even Lynx does a better job with some of these sites. (Want an example? Try http://www.thejewelers.com/store01.html [thejewelers.com], a page on a site I redesigned a while back. It validates properly for HTML 4.01 Strict and CSS 2. It renders fine in every browser I've thrown at it...except Nutscrape. For their broke-ass browser, there's http://www.thejewelers.com/nsstore01.html [thejewelers.com]. It renders OK on Nutscrape and other graphical browsers (looks nasty under Lynx), but pays no heed to standards or principles of good design.)

  • uhh.. hello, you're surfing the web with a help browser. Maybe if you didn't go to just the 4 sites in the world that are designed to look good in Konqueror you would know this (or try to view a web diff with it).
  • I have zero day kde pup, go to google, type in random phrase, watch Konquer break.
  • Yup, 4 Mb is 100% of the RAM my Atari Mega STE has. And 4 Mb is the maximum amount of RAM I can plug into it.

    -- Pure FTP server [pureftpd.org] - Upgrade your FTP server to something simple and secure.
  • This will definitely help those out there with little ram to run some of the cooler KDE apps. Great job.
  • Anyone care to explain why a Konq screenshot would be of the Galeon home page?

    - - - - -
  • Looks like a step backwards...
    Not at all. Where this type of work really shines is in the embedded market. Hence, 'QT Embedded'. If you can get your applications working without the overhead of things like window mangers, windowing systems/servers, and abstraction layers, you gain speed and a much smaller footprint. For little PDAs and toasters, I don't really want to run an XFree86(*), Enlightenment(*), and Xlib(*) in addition to the applications I wanted to run in the first place.

    (*) substitute with your preferred method. ;)
  • I was mostly joking. Writing without extra 'u's is one or two % more efficient than writing with them. Besides, nobody likes the British anyway ;)
  • If anybody hasn't noticed, KDE isn't exactly the most slim computing environment around. (To be equitable, neither is GNOME!) For those of us with low end hardware (300MHz PII, 256MB RAM...) KDE-2 is absolutely unusable (even on a super-tweeked Gentoo RC5 system running XFS!) For such people, lightweight web-browsers like this and Galeon are absolutely essential. The way things are going with KDE and GNOME, freedom is being increasingly restricted. To have a usable web experience, you seem to need to run one of these two (bloated and slow) environments. Thankfully, these project provide a way out. I'd prefer it if it were based on GTK+ (since there aren't many Qt apps outside of KDE) but hey, you take what you can get, no?
  • Quite true. Other's may scoff and tell you to buy a hard drive, but I look at my BeOS directory, and failing to see any executables over 2.5MB, sigh and agree with you that the whole OS world is heading into the toilet.
  • seems like Konq is moving fast.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    And unlike Mozilla, it actuall MOVES fast. (At least when you get past the 3-4 second startup time!) The thing that bothers me is that the developers don't really bother to code for speed. I'm upgrading to a 1.4 GHz Athlon soon, but I shouldn't have to, not to just run my desktop or webrowser at a decent speed. I can understand a 3D renderer chewing up your CPU. For something like KDE or Konq, its just plain unjustifiable. I really think developers should be forced to code on slow machines, just so the end result uses a sane amount of computing power.
  • Don't they rather call it humor?
  • w3m would qualify, I believe.
  • You _do_ realise that the complaint is not that the executable won't fit on the drive, but that 4M of code is _too much_ code for almost any purpose needing coding.

    Find me a program that _requires_ 4M of code to do what its intended to do and I'm sure you'll find many people able to do it in a lot less code.
  • w3m (lynx replacement with better layout) is only 279684 bytes. Netscape shouldn't be 4M either -- but its statically linked against all its libraries. /usr/bin/nslookup: 263k /usr/sbin/named: 509k (vs) /usr/bin/dnsqr: 27k /usr/bin/tinydns: 24k /usr/bin/dnscache: 49k

  • w3m (lynx replacement with better layout) is only 279684 bytes.

    Netscape shouldn't be 4M either -- but its statically linked against all its libraries.

    /usr/bin/nslookup: 263k
    /usr/sbin/named: 509k

    (vs)

    /usr/bin/dnsqr: 27k
    /usr/bin/tinydns: 24k
    /usr/bin/dnscache: 49k

    My point was simply that 4M is a _lot_ of code space (especially of 32 bit CISC code).

  • Oh goodness -- get a grip. The person asked a valid question, if a little trollish, and you didn't answer it.

    Yes, the Slashdot authors seem biased toward KDE. That's their opinion, and as editors on a site that claims to pronounce "News", they ought to be open with any such predispositions.
  • The funny thing is, I typed "w3m" but meant to say wget ...

    oh well.

    PS, why the 20 second delay for those of us who type at >100wpm ???
  • I'm glad your semantics are so exacting.

    That said, having wit or making sarcastic remarks does not make one a troll, nor does it negate one's arguments, statements or other remarks. The shallowness of the human reading them may allow that reader to ignore the truth value of the statements made in, around or near such "trolling" comments, but it is still present to be assessed.
  • Heh. Since you asked for it, I guess a little bit of plugging is alright: check out gentoo [obsession.se] (quick screenshot link [obsession.se]). Some people like it.
  • it's an article about "software projects" not just nautilus ... your question is about as silly as "why is nautilus mentioned first in an article about konqi?"

  • Xterm is the best filemanager. :)

    If, however, you were wanting something graphical, the most promising one IMOP is in GWorkspace [gnustep.it] - although it definately still needs some work. KDE and Gnome both have been horribly disappointing to me, although obviously some people like them. Personally, if I wanted MS Windows on my computer I'd just pull out my CD and reinstall it *shrug*.


    "That old saw about the early bird just goes to show that the worm should have stayed in bed."
  • Don't they rather call it humor?

    If by "they" you mean americans, then yes. If you mean everybody else, then "humour" is the correct spelling.

    -----
    "Goose... Geese... Moose... MOOSE!?!?!"
  • Besides, nobody likes the British anyway ;)

    But everybody loves us Canadians. Couldn't you do it for us? ;-)

    -----
    "Goose... Geese... Moose... MOOSE!?!?!"
  • A Konqi that runs without KDE?
    One that even runs on QTembedded?

    Since QT is also implemented for
    Windows, and now this version is
    free for noncommercial use - can
    we hope to see a port to Windows?

    I would sure like it.
  • (this'll probably get me modded down by the anti-microsoft zealots that refuse to accept that a microsoft product is superior to something else, I don't like Microsoft any more than you do, I'm simply informing the public that IE is not as unstable as people belive.)
    Ah, method #3 of karma-whoring - claiming that saying X will get you modded down, especially in reference to MS. Glad to see it worked.
    --

  • Can't watch mpgs and avis from the command line.

    Unless you have an avi viewer that supports AA-lib [sourceforge.net].

    --
  • My apologies, if this is true. I had just discovered the website.
  • Konqueror is one of those projects that is really making a difference for Linux. It is now much easier to refute complaints of outdated browsers and technology on Linux by the Windows sheep.

    I am really intrigued by the KDENOX option and I'm just dying to see the screenshot that was supposed to be linked to in this article. The geocities side is linkdead as usual, does someone have a mirror or any other screenshots?
  • check it out [mandragon.org] -- apparently it's based on Konqueror too.

  • all playing for the same side (Score:3)

    by Karma Sucks ( 127136 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @05:28PM (#101029)
    Just what do you have against Konqueror and Nautilus and Mozilla mentionned in the same article? It's all free software and it all works on Linux. The desktop wars are dead.
  • From the original post:
    "You get Konqueror
    without KDE, with SSL, cookies, proxy, bookmarks, fonts, and without KDE itself."
    Was it just me or are they really trying to emphasize that you can get Konqueror without KDE? : )

    -Angron

  • First off Mozilla wont work unless it can from the banks point of view look like Netscape or IE.
    I go for command line only for 2 main reasons.

    1. One can learn a lot more living on the command line. X tends to be a little sheltering.

    2. System bloat. My main system is a p100 with 32mg ram and a 1.2 gig harddrive. Running an emacs server, pine, slrn, BitchX, links, micq, and 9 instances of bash at any given moment tends to work the system a bit, and running X would slow it down to a crawl, especialy when 04:00 rolls around.

    Also by being full command line you can move to any other n*x system pull out a floopy and have $HOME sweet $HOME in under 50 seconds.

    On the bright side you get more codeing done because you don't spend all day in alt.binaries.*. Can't watch mpgs and avis from the command line.
  • You dont have a email addy listed so I am posting here. I wish my bank where as (cool|brain dead) as yours. fb on my current system dose not work worth a damn. I have set up framebuffering on many boxes without problem in the past and even after changing my graphics card (was a unsuported/ported #9). I still get errors and Tux is in reversed colors. I have had no luck even finding out what _might_ be wrong. So far I have just been living without it. seejpeg works so that takes care of 99% of my graphics needs.
  • Konq without X is cool but how about Netscape without X? You may ask yourself why. In order to access my bank online I have to use Netscape or IE. I am command line only at home and would love to have a framebufferd browser that is usable for this so I don't have to wait till I get to work and use one of their browsers. zen is a browser that will compile for gtk, qt or work from the framebuffer but its totaly useless for anything other than viewing a static page.

    I want to see more development on command line only browsers to take advantage of older hardware or for people like myself who are GUI-impaired. One of the nice bennies of more development would be one could do $ getbankballence.sh | netscape --prompt4password. Now wouldn't that be cool in cron.

    Some of the command line browsers out there, sorted by usefulness:

    links [freshmeat.net]

    w3m [freshmeat.net]

    w3/emacs [freshmeat.net]

    lynx [freshmeat.net]

    zen [freshmeat.net]

  • On the main page, they have instructions for using cvsup. If you would rather use cvs, here are the instructions.
    export CVSROOT=:pserver:anonymous@anoncvs.kde.org:/home/k de
    cvs login
    cvs co kdenox

    I only put this here cause I had to do some digging to find it. If anyone wants the current source tree, its mirrored here [rcn.com]

    SealBeater
  • Speaking of browsers, download the better.
  • IMO GNU Midnight Commander. mc, not gmc.
  • I forgot to say that gentoo is (again IMO) the best graphical file manager. And some people still use GMC. What a waste.
  • Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Konqeror/Embedded sound perfect for configuring all those 3rd-party apps on servers? You know, the ones that provide a "easy-to-use web interface" for configuration but won't work in lynx/links/w3m (because of frames, tables, graphics, etc)? I usually slog through the raw HTML rather than fire up X on a server, but a small graphical browser might not be any problem.

    Not to mention my tech computer, where I have to start X just to read slashdot...

  • Dumbass, you know it's a nice thing
    to help the freenet project by generating that proverbial slashdot effect on a new CHK entry.

    Do it.

  • You are so full of it! :)

    My idea of a stable browser is one that works as intended, as well as not crashing. (And frankly, I'd rather risk a crashed application on Linux than Windows any day). I will give you that IE doesn't crash much, but I won't give you that it's stable-- since I cannot count the times that 5 or 5.5 have completely misdrawn pages. I think my favorite is when I've gotten moderator points on Slashdot and I go to scroll down, instead of the form elements moving with the text the text scrolls and the form elements are sticky. Before long I have a window full of form elements. That's so unusable stability is irrelevant. I also find it frequently mislocates images or has the same or similar problem with scrolling as images. I use Netscape a lot on that same machine and while it never has a rendering issue, it does frequently lose track of itself and/or crash.
  • One of the nice bennies of more development would be one could do $ getbankballence.sh | netscape --prompt4password. Now wouldn't that be cool in cron.

    Hmm, not if you're gonna be prompting for a password it wouldn't...

  • Why, oh why, did this comment get modded up to a 5? Is it not a legit news item that there is a way to run an advanced gui web browser without X? Dare I say it's even bigger news than a point release of Nautilus?(albiet I LOVE Nautilus)

  • I see what you're saying. But that's what I really like about Slashdot. The editors just say what they think. Have you read the newspaper lately? The writing style they use is CRAP! To me, 'unbiased journalistic integrity' only gets you a really really stale writing style.

    -- juju

  • Maybe you could just change your user-agent to fool the bank's website into thinking you're running Netscape?

    -- juju
  • It's low-RAM prejudice is what it is!!! :)
  • The problem with IE is not that it's unstable. The problem is that it's closed-source (and possibly less secure because of that) and available only for few platforms (yes, I know about IE for UNIX).

    Instead of guessing what Mozilla 0.9.2 could be just try it and then post.

    I'm using it a lot. It crashed for me only once - after I tried really hard. I haven't tried IE - it doesn't run on my OS. (please don't accuse me of hypocrisy - installing an OS requires more efforts that installing Mozilla).

  • Why is this flamebait? Please explain me - I don't get it.

    Many people in many countries simply cannot pay many hundreds dollars for a computer (including the software). Either they get a computer with decent browser for $100 of they don't.

  • such as it is anyway, taken from the README in the KDENOX CVS tree, also if you look at the main konq website, there's a KDE/embedded link at the top of the menu on the left

    http://www.konqueror.org/embedded.html
  • oops that should be Konqueror/Embedded, not KDE/Embedded

    It should also be noted that this is designed for EMBEDDED systems, not simply a 486.
    We're talking about a low-resources system that either CAN'T run X, or it would be ABSURDLY slow.
  • How is removing X from the equation a step backwards? all you need is FB support and QT embedded, it's designed for embedded systems, not a standard-issue desktop PC
  • I think he's saying that he first thought it'd be good for his low-end systems and for setting up thin clients, but then realized that it's not neccisarily that useful, since you could run Netscape or Konq or Mozilla or whatever else just as easily on those systems, because they could be handling just the display part, while a heavy-duty server could take care of the RAM and processor intensive work.
  • There's a reason for that, Konqueror is one of the best browsers to pop up for Linux/Un*x in a long time, it just needs to work out some stability problems.
  • I'm talking about 4.*, they're all unstable, I can be scrolling down a webpage and it'll just die, or of course, not really die, in which case a killall -9 netscape is neccisary
    I don't even bother talking about 6.x, as it's too slow to get to anything that would cause a stability problem.

  • Re:konqueror does rule (Score:4)

    by NNKK ( 218503 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @05:08PM (#101059) Homepage
    Personaly my complaint with linux browsers has always been, belive it or not, stability, not features.
    This will of course improve with time, but as far as I can tell, IE5.5 is more stable than most or all web browsers avalible for linux
    Netscape is unstable, I think everyone will agree, it's difficult to run it for more than a half hour or so without a segfault or other error.
    Mozilla hasn't achived 1.0 yet, and Konq, though officialy 2.1, simply hasn't matured yet as far ast stability goes, though it is more stable than Netscape.
    Opera I've generaly found to be very stable and very fast, though it's not under a GPL, GPL-compatible, or even Open Source compatible license (well, strictly speaking, neither is Netscape)

    I haven't tried mozilla 0.9.2 yet, I've been hearing good things about stability, but I haven't gotten around to grabbing it yet, prehaps I should, but I doubt I'll be suprised, it'll probably be a lot more stable than earlier versions, but I doubt they've made it as stable as IE5.5 yet.

    By now I can hear people yelling "Are you crazy?! IE crashes constantly!", well I'm here to tell you that contrary to popular opinion, it doesn't.
    I've had it exhibit instability maybe a dozen times since version 5, which has been out for some time. It's outright crashed, *shrug*, maybe 6 or 7 times. This is in win98 and win2k, can't speak for win95, haven't used it since 98 was in beta.
    IE simply is not the unstable peice of crap it was in 3.x and 4.x, it is a mature, stable product. Yes it's from Microsoft, and yes, it's responsible for a deluge of non-compliancy with standards, but it is STABLE.

    (this'll probably get me modded down by the anti-microsoft zealots that refuse to accept that a microsoft product is superior to something else, I don't like Microsoft any more than you do, I'm simply informing the public that IE is not as unstable as people belive.)
  • The only real stability problems come from Javascript. Try turning it off and you should probably never encounter a problem. Don't worry though, the Javacript code is continually being improved, and I've heard good things about it in the new KDE2.2 Beta1.
  • Linux / Open source has always been about taking the best of all worlds. While Apple users may still bicker about Microsoft stealing their UI (which Apple stole originally, but that's another story), the Linux/KDE/GNOME,etc folks don't give a rat's. They just take what's good. Who cares if something was on another system first? In a recent KDE mailing list comment, someone thought it would be cool if Konqueror had a sidebar like Mozilla and IE. So guess what? Now Konq has an optional sidebar. It all boils down to: "Why the hell not?"

    Btw, the problems people have with Microsoft are not related to the look of Windows. Rather, it's about their proprietary code, licensing issues, etc.

  • Why we need a lightweight browser (Score:3)

    by hysterion ( 231229 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @08:18PM (#101063) Homepage

    I say : As a maintenance tool for low end boxes.

    (Such as, say, the old PPC I use as a gateway to the net. 3 years old, 180 MHz, 32 meg RAM.)

    On such a machine, you need something to

    1. Browse local help pages;* **
    2. Search the web for code and rpms;
    3. Download these onto the machine.
    * Bonus if it can read
    man and info pages, (like gnome-help-browser [lanl.gov]).
    ** Double bonus if it supports find string on page (unlike g-h-b).

    Skipstone [muhri.net] is nice (uses gecko and fewer gnome libs than galeon), but I found it still memory hungry and a quite bit slower than g-h-b, or legacy Netscape for Mac on the same hardware.

    (The one I tried compiled against Mozilla 0.9. Although there may be good progress since, I wonder if gecko may just not be lean enough... Moz 0.9.2 is still a big memory hog on my other machine -- like 50 meg after a little browsing, where legacy Netscape would stay around 30.)

    Encompass [sourceforge.net] uses gtkhtml instead. Can anyone comment on it? Will it do (1), (2) and (3) above? I still need to figure out exactly what dependencies [freebsd.org] it needs to compile. Anyway, it seems promising -- see this review [linuxplanet.com] and some more recent news [gnome.org].

  • Actually, it is more of an issue running KOffice, or GIMP ;) than netscape. Actually, for internet kiosks, this would be very useful.

    Sig: Warning The following may be illegal under the DMCA (rot-13 decoder):
    ABCDEFGH I JK LM
  • My first thought was, "This would be great for those old 80486's I have laying around." However, then I realized an important shorcoming... On low end machines you can get advanced functionality by running X because the X server really serves out your display to various clients (usually programs on the same computer) and this can be used to set up thin clients with almost no hard drive, RAM, etc.

    So it is not as useful as I first thought. However, it would be useful for setting up internet kiosks on low end machines. This could be useful where the machine's primary function is to access web pages and perform various console type applications. Particularly useful for libraries and schools, I would think...

    Sig: Warning The following may be illegal under the DMCA (rot-13 decoder):
    ABCDEFGH I JK LM

  • When you get a website you can write whatever opinion you want. If you're not happy with what slashdot's content is like simply stop visiting. It's not like you're forced to come here and read it. I don't remember ever seeing slashdot boast about their journalistic or unbiased standards. Excuse me while I shed a tear for you because you saw something you didnt like on slashdot.
  • I dont remember a prerequisite of slashdot readers to answer anyone's questions especially in when all you're doing is complaining. The author didnt ask a question he made a retorical statement in the form of a troll, statements like For all they talk about it, you'd think it has features like buttons for "Give head" and "Win Lottery." (Maybe those are in CVS?) basically negate any point the author was attempting to make by throwing in the oh-so-intelligent-sounding bathroom humor. Others have already commented on slashdot's often biased writings, I don't blame slash editors a bit for writing that why should anyone else get to? Even worse assuming that maybe his comment might sway or change the editorial style of slash editors in the future, hah! Making a huge deal about it is silly, all I'm doing is making a huge deal about someone else making a huge deal out of something which is certainly not huge deal material in my opinion.
  • Ok, I know this is a little petty, but is it just me, or does it seem like every time the Gnome or Mozilla projects do something cool, the /. editors posting the story just HAVE to mention Konqueror or KDE, especially in a context of "well, Mozilla is neat, but Konq can cure cancer, AIDS, and make your kid 25 IQ points smarter."

    For all they talk about it, you'd think it has features like buttons for "Give head" and "Win Lottery." (Maybe those are in CVS?)

  • Re:What I want in a browser. (Score:3)

    by Spy Hunter ( 317220 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @07:06PM (#101081) Journal
    In order to access my bank online I have to use Netscape or IE

    There's no reason for that to remain true. Just drop bugs.kde.org a line and they'll get right on it. They've got a great bug reporting system over there, and all improvements that get committed to the big KDE Konqueror are automatically available in KDENOX (Konqueror/Embedded is its real name, actually).

  • Mirror of galeon.png KSK@galeon.png (Score:3)

    by justrob ( 445616 ) on Saturday July 07, 2001 @06:55PM (#101084)
    I've put the screenshot in Freenet.

    Retrieve with:

    http://localhost:8081/KSK@galeon.png [localhost]
    or
    freenet_request KSK@galeon.png galeon.png

    Freenet: http://freenet.sf.net [sf.net]

    The CHK for this key, for the paranoid, is:

    CHK@iE7SmyIIP8rYKqT77jhdJjDcgB8OAwE,OHOBWuZQ703Mw9 YpjUxFpA

    "The Slashdot Effect is good for Freenet" - Gill Bates

  • so... (Score:2)

    by prepp ( 465299 )
    by my thoughts, that does really look like galeon, oh well.. It has some areas that it can be applicable in, picoBSD anyone?
  • You list several ``command line'' browsers, but none of them actually is a ``command line'' program.

    It's a common misconception that many people have; they refer to programs which run in a console as command line, but in fact this is very far from the truth. A command line program is one which is non-interactive. As such, lynx -dump could be referred to as a command line program, but I'm not aware that any of the others could be.

    To simplify, a command line browser - in fact, a command line anything - is one that can be invoked from a script without any manual intervention.

    It would be good to check my bank balance periodically, although it might be a bit depressing!

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