Valve Reveals First Month of Steam Linux Gains 295
An anonymous reader writes with news that Valve has updated its Hardware & Software Survey for December 2012, which reflects the first month of the platform being available for Linux. Even though the project is still in a beta test, players on Ubuntu already account for 0.8% of Steam usage. The 64-bit clients for Ubuntu 12.10 and 12.04.1 showed about double the share of the 32-bit versions. MacOS use also showed growth, rising to about 3.7%. Windows 7's usage share dropped by over 2%, but balanced by the growth of Windows 8, which is now at just under 7%. The total share for Windows is still about 95%.
Wine (Score:4, Interesting)
I wonder how many of the "Windows" users are actually just Linux users using Wine. Despite the Beta, I still do that for games (e.g. Civ 5) that don't have a Linux version.
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There are likely a fair number like me that don't have a machine with a decent graphics card because of the lack of games in general. My primary laptop just won't cut it for Steam. Now that Steam is out for Linux, my next one will.
Re:Wine (Score:4, Interesting)
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They tend to be a lot better value than the high end games, too. I don't really feel all that bad if I spent $10 on an indie title and it turns out to be a dud, but if I spent $60 on a top tier title and it ends up sucking, there'll be hell to pay. And for *most* of the indie games on Steam, $10 is on the high end of pricing. A lot of the indie games on Steam are well worth the price they're charging, and then some.
Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (Score:4, Interesting)
That's a very good point made by the parent, and it has plenty of precedent outside of the Valve/Steam games space. I appear in the statistics as a "Windows User" for Guild Wars 2 (and for many years previously for Guild Wars 1), yet there hasn't been a Windows box at home for years and years. This is sure to be happening for Steam "Windows" games as well.
Wine works perfectly for gaming these days. Beware the "Windows User" statistics!
Re:Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (Score:5, Interesting)
It's funny because Steam knows it's being run in Wine (it checks for Wine version, look in Help -> System Information). They don't know anything about your Linux system, though, and I don't know how they use that information.
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I'm planning on setting up a linux install once the steam port matures a bit more. I have a Mac and PC and use the latter mostly for gaming and BSD development. Being able to game without windows would be great. I recently went from a Mac Pro to a Mac mini because I gave up on Mac gaming after trying to get it to work for years. It's just much better and cheaper on a PC. Without having to buy a windows license in the future, I can save even more money on my PC. Windows is $100.. that could go to a fast
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> they already account for Linux Installs by checking for wine being installed and wine3d
I don't know about that. I did a Steam survey about a year ago. It prompted me with the "Information to send to Valve". There was nothing about linux in what I saw when I pushed the send button.
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It could be "not that many" and still outnumber the Mac users.
ComplainersThe world is passing you by... (Score:5, Insightful)
You can spend all your time fighting extraordinarily un-restraining DRM, or you can play games.
Stop looking a gift horse in the mouth. From the numbers, having Steam support linux games at all is pretty silly from the business perspective.
It's an act of good will that it exists at all.
So, keep complaining, if you think that's getting you anywhere. I'm going back to playing games
What margins are you expecting. (Score:2, Insightful)
From the numbers, having Steam support linux games at all is pretty silly from the business perspective.
Steam is supporting games *from* a business perspective. Its very existence is being threatened. In future steam may only exist OS X and Linux. Its mistake was not expecting this sooner, and not supporting Linux earlier. The reality is Windows is going to be overtaken by Android this year...it actually makes sense to produce games for Linux first, and cross platform is a must in today's new world.
I buy a large number of games, most are cross-platform; DRM free and pretty cheap. I don't use steam because of
While your calling me a racist... (Score:2)
"In future steam may only exist OS X and Linux."
Considering the amount of stupid things a person can read here I don't lightly say this, but this is one of the dumbest things I've read in quite a long time. Second only to some asshat spewing racist remarks in a different thread I read a couple days ago.
You need to pay attention, I am sorry that Microsoft is not the dominant Gaming Platform any more, Microsoft has been shitting on gamers for some time, and the after years of it playing second fiddle to its console, Today it tries to bad Adult games on the PC platform. Microsoft is Also unashamedly chasing Apple profits by locking down its platform to its store & Microsoft signed binaries this is not a secret...its common knowledge, its the whole reason for steam being offered on Linux (in my opinion al
Office...that will get the gamers they love excel (Score:2)
Is their Office for Android in the works? Sounds to me like you're greatly overestimating the potential demise of Windows, just like Linux users have been doing for the decade I've been on /..
Did I say windows is going anywhere!?...Microsoft are going to continue to be the horrible abusive monopoly on Desktop they always have been, The evil fucks are locking windows into General purpose machines making them glorified electronics, but those are being outnumbered by these smart devices from the likes of Amazon; Google; Apple.
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You can spend all your time fighting extraordinarily un-restraining DRM, or you can play games.
Or I can play games and not use Steam. Not all games require Steam or even have DRM, you know.
Also, I don't think that "it's not as bad as other DRM" is a good argument.
It's 'ok' (Score:4, Informative)
The Steam client itself works just fine. The problem is Valve's distribution system. I had 4 games that were listed as supported. Of those, two of them would not install (as in you can click the install button and it would give a message that it was installed but there would be nothing downloaded). One of them installed but would not launch. The last is TF2, and I really don't care to play that.
I'm not faulting them, it's still beta after all. I'm just not excited about a new platform to play games that are mostly available outside of Steam already with the added bonus of more TF2.
Does WINE count as Windows? (Score:2)
?????
Case sensitive file systems (Score:2)
Why is it that they fix the case sensitive issue (I assume, since Linux is case sensitive by default) for Linux, but the Mac client still refuses to work on a case sensistive volume?
WHAT THE FUCK?
I could ramble on about how you actively have to do something stupid to not support case sensitive, but I'll leave that for another day.
Remember why they ported to Linux (Score:3)
Valve MUST make Linux a viable gamming plataform, or they are out of the game.
That said, they get the same result whatever market share Linux gets. The reason they must run on Linux is not because everybody will sudenly switch, it is because they can use it to threaten Microsoft in the case MS extends their PC monopoly into the game distribution market.
The Mac simply doesn't enable such kind of "deal".
Other Linux Support (Score:2)
Valve has native binaries for Gentoo, SUSE, Fedora, and Arch
You can read more here: https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Steam_under_Linux [valvesoftware.com]
On a personal note, while extremely happy that linux is finally gaining gaming ground, it sorrows me that they decided to put emphasis on Ubuntu, given its current questionable vision
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Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:5, Insightful)
You've gone to far. RealPlayer is literally the worst program in the entire world.
Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:5, Funny)
I take it you never used Lotus Notes then...
Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:5, Insightful)
You obviously haven't used Excel for Mac.
1) No multi-threading, which is a problem when the application pretty easily maxes out a core.
2) Bizarre keyboard shortcuts that don't match the standard ones used in most applications
3) Piss poor support for multiple displays, with a resizing bug that's been around for way too long
4) Excel documents don't show up in recent items in Finder
5) Excel addresses files using a path - not a reference to the file, meaning that it doesn't notice when open files are renamed or moved. It also gets confused if you have two mounted volumes (including the home folder) with the same name.
6) Very buggy AppleScript support. I know of no other application that so easily crashes while scripted to do fairly mundane things.
7) Uses its own internal clipboard, meaning that copying and pasting can be pretty bizarre. Copying something, and then closing a document alters the contents of the clipboard. It's also slow as hell. It's not unusual for me to sit there waiting 5 seconds to put a value from a cell in to the clipboard. I could understand this if it's pasting in to a cell that is referenced in heavy calculations, but for just copying a value?
iMovie 3.0 was pretty bad. I'd take Steam of that any day.
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> 3) Piss poor support for multiple displays, with a resizing bug that's been around for way too long
Why would this ever be a problem? This is something that should be transparent to applications.
What happened to this great multi-monitor support in Macs and Windows that's supposed to make Linux look so shameful?
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The person you're replying too is trolling.
I can't speak to #1 as I don't have any spreadsheets complex enough to max out the processor long enough for me to notice.
#2 is false.
#3 is false.
#4 is false, his system is fucked if thats the case as its not up to excel to support the feature, its built into the OS.
#5 may be true, I've not yet noticed, but I wouldn't call that a bug, I'd call it a feature. Nothing is more annoying that moving a document to the trash, replacing a backup at the old location, then o
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I'm guessing Excel handles it poorly because it does things its own way, which just happens to be a wrong way. It has the resize bug, it places pop-up windows on the main display when the invoking window is on the secondary display, and the progress window for opening files is squished in to the top left corner because it doesn't know how to centre its position. My guess is that it gets confused when trying to manually determine screen sizes, which it really shouldn't have to do anyway on its own. It's as l
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Why would this ever be a problem? This is something that should be transparent to applications.
What happened to this great multi-monitor support in Macs and Windows that's supposed to make Linux look so shameful?
Step 1: Install Windows XP on system with nVidia card and multiple outputs
Step 2: Install Office 97 Pro
Step 3: Put any Office application on the second display, and click on a pull-down menu.
Step 4: Laugh and laugh as the menu appears with the proper X and Y offset, but on the wrong display
Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:4, Informative)
The Mac version tends to lose windows quite often as well. The news, library, game windows, etc. will be active (including the odd duplicate) and not appear on screen. Sometimes it just takes an extra five minutes for the news to load to tell you the latest deal.
Hopefully that's not the case for the Linux users as well.
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The quality of the Steam client is the biggest issue I'd have with Valve. On the Mac I've found the following:
1) It's not uncommon for it to crash on quit.
2) Online/offline mode is flakey. On most launches it fails first time to go online, but on second try will. No other games or applications have issues here.
3) Initially the UI was buggy as hell. I think it's improved, or I just got used to a UI that appears to have been modelled on tacky MP3 player software from the 90s, or a game mods website. Another e
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That's funny because I have been playing that free demo that doesn't run.
I have been also been playing other games. I bought them because they were cheap and thus represented little risk even in the worst case.
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Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:5, Informative)
That was my impression. I've tried the Linux Steam beta and it is terrible. It's slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain. it doesn't integrate into the desktop either, so the app looks out of place.
Which is surprising since the Windows client runs pretty well using WINE.
I have both installed, and you are full of crap. Steam is slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain on both Windows and Linux. I suppose you could laud Valve for providing the same experience on both platforms, but that's really not much of an accolade considering how crap Steam on Windows is. Regardless, it takes just about as long for either Steam to connect, but it actually takes longer for Steam for Windows on Wine to display its interface after the nigh-interminable login process.
Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (Score:5, Insightful)
Are we running the same Steam? I've been using it for years, and never encountered anything just described. It's quick and gets out of the way as soon as I tell it I want to play a game. In fact, my only irritation is that it has to install the DirectX runtime or VC RED (whichever it is) for each new game, but I sort of understand why it's doing that, and it only happens once.
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Nah, I agree with GP... the Windows Steam client seems to have gotten much slower over the past year or so, at least with respect to browsing the store. Launching games you already have installed is pretty swift, though.
Speaking of which, what are the good Linux games in the Linux store? I played with the Steam Linux Beta a little bit last week, but their Linux section is kinda full of indie stuff, and using search seems to return results for all platforms. Couldn't even find L4D2 for Linux, and not real
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Well, Cubemen [steampowered.com] is a very nice tower defense game and should be fun for kids.
There is also a Linux version of Team Fortress 2 [steampowered.com], which you might be interested about.
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I have one more irritation, at the moment it uses 130MB of memory just sitting in the tray. Now I have 16GB of RAM, but seriously?
Re:DRM (Score:4, Informative)
Lot sof playable-on-Linux-DRM-free games at gog.com.
Re:DRM (Score:5, Informative)
Well not really. You can only filter Windows vs Mac. No Linux specific support at all.
AC
Re:DRM (Score:4, Informative)
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Steam IS DRM.
Re:DRM (Score:5, Informative)
Yes, Steam is DRM. However, Steam is DRM that gives something back in return.
Being able to download your games as you please, store your saves (on supported games) in the cloud, automatic updates, and the ability to easily download mods for games (when supported), makes Steam more palatable when it comes to DRM. Most DRM schemes just take away from the user without giving anything back in return, Steam is different.
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Just because it offers something doesn't mean the DRM part is offering it. DRM offers the content industry something. It is the delusion that they're going to make more money. In reality it detracts from people who dislike DRM and from those who end up not pirating it (because fewer people who pirate means less publicity which means fewer sales). There are a lot of shitty movies that have sold well. It has to do with publicty and piracy fuels that.
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You are the most retarded AC I've seen on /. in the past few weeks. Congrats! So much wrong in so little text.
Also I loved the word "paytard", it tells us exactly the type of person you are.
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Mr. Stallman, I thought you had an account here...
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Re:DRM (Score:5, Insightful)
Steam IS DRM.
Steam is a distribution system that uses DRM. They could choose to stop using it and still be a distribution system.
Troll? (Score:3, Informative)
Moderators, please explain which part of "Steam is a distribution system that uses DRM. They could choose to stop using it and still be a distribution system" is a troll. Steam is a distribution system. Steam uses DRM. The DRM is not an integral part of Steam; some titles on Steam don't actually use it.
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Re:Troll? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Troll? (Score:5, Funny)
Yes, we all pine for the days when posters could disagree reasonably about how hot the grits should be that Natalie Portman should be slathered in.
Re:DRM (Score:5, Informative)
No. Steam is a distribution system. Steamworks is a DRM, community and cloud integration API which is provided through Steam, but which is entirely optional. There's a fair number of games available on Steam that already do not use Steamworks DRM, or any sort of DRM.
Re:DRM (Score:5, Insightful)
The thing with steam DRM though is that you don't really even notice it is there. Contrast to that of CD's of yore where if you forgot to put the right disc in the drive, your game won't start even though it doesn't actually need it. Or when you had those challenge response code books. Or worse, the ones where you had to read the damn manual with a red filter.
Also offline mode is an option with steam too, unlike say diablo 3.
One thing about older DRM was that the pirated version offered better value than the legit version because you didn't have to bother with that crap. Steam on the other hand the legit version offers many benefits that you don't get with a pirated version, like cloud save data and no need to hunt down the game discs if you re-format your PC.
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The thing with steam DRM though is that you don't really even notice it is there.
I notice that Steam DRM is there. Each Steam game I have takes a good fifteen-twenty seconds before it even shows its first splash screen. My non-Steam games show their first splash screen almost instantly.
(Even with Steam in offline mode, they still took longer to start. I got fed up with offline mode though because I'd always be turning it offline to play a game, then back online to look at the steam store, then offline again, then online again, ...)
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Will Valves servers be around in 30 years? Perhaps? Is it guaranteed? Nope.
True, but it's not like that will be very different with all other modern games. Games these days, even when single player, are filled with online integration and frequently need patches after the release to work properly. None of that will work in 30 years or even 5 years. My disc copy of Bioshock for example is unusable because the patch servers are down, without the patch servers however the game can't be installed, the installation will abort and the game will uninstall itself. That's not even DRM, that
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While Steam is not all nice, they do promise to release the games to their customers if ever they should go under.
Valve does not own the rights to the majority of games on their service. They cannot promise to release anything other than Valve published titles. There are a lot of third party games that use Steamworks DRM.
How happy would Rockstar be if Valve released a cracked version of Max Payne 3 just because they were going out of business?
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I'm against DRM when it's a problem, but I've never had a problem with Steam.
If the only reason I'd ever even notice your DRM is trying to do something illegal, I really don't have a reason to take issue with it.
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I'm generally fine with the DRM encountered with Steam. Only issue has been the Steam client frequently crashing on quit, which in the past meant it won't allow offline mode when I relaunch it. That's been a pain when I'm travelling and would fancy a quick bout of zombie hunting before my battery dies, and have no Internet access.
Overall the balance between usability and DRM has been pretty good.
Re:DRM (Score:4, Insightful)
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Re:DRM (Score:4, Interesting)
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There's an open question about all the games licensed from Steam before that, though.
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It can be argued that server sided DRM has nothing to do
Re:DRM (Score:5, Interesting)
Also, DRM is essential to delay piracy for the first month of game release. Games only really sell in the first few weeks after launch, if you didn't know - after that, people move on to something else and the "long tail" of sales begins (see just about any game's charts: [1] [vgchartz.com], [2] [vgchartz.com], [3] [vgchartz.com]). So the games need to make up for that large upfront investment in first 4 to 6 weeks, if they don't break even, they are dead. Alan Wake, L.A. Noire, Max Payne 3 - all those arguably known and high profile titles are commercial failures. Most current triple A games flop or barely make even, but unless explicitly asked, publishers rarely admit it. However, if you work in gamedev you probably saw the closures of Grin, Pandemic, 38 Studios, and in general, it starts to happen too frequently [neogaf.com].
So no, it's not just about "having control". There would be no need in control if existing model provided a sustainable way to earn money. Truth is, nowadays interactive entertainment market is a gamble.
Re:DRM (Score:4, Interesting)
You, and nobody else up to this day, succeeded in correlating piracy with loss of income, maybe because there is no correlation at all.
Furthermore I couldn't care less about AAA games at all. AAA games come from big companies, usually follow trends and add very little innovation to the market. It can be argued that we would be much better without those companies and their games.
And all markets are gambles. You always take the risks when you enter a market. If you can't take the risk don't do it.
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This is not limited to games, creating just about every intellectual property (software, movies, music, etc) requires more investment with time.
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I predict domination of "pay4win" free2play games, ad-supported games and MMO-like "thin client" games in the near future - precisely because there's no mutual trust between game d
Re:DRM (Score:4, Insightful)
It's about control. You give up control over your own games and your own computer and hand it to a third party.
That's however not much different then using apt-get on Ubuntu. If Ubuntu decides to remove some software from their repositories, you are still fucked. It might all be DRM-free and Open Source, but you still need a lot of knowledge and work to get it back into working order, which isn't really a whole lot different from DRM, which oftentimes is rather easy to get rid of as well.
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It's about control. You give up control over your own games and your own computer and hand it to a third party.
That's however not much different then using apt-get on Ubuntu. If Ubuntu decides to remove some software from their repositories, you are still fucked. It might all be DRM-free and Open Source, but you still need a lot of knowledge and work to get it back into working order, which isn't really a whole lot different from DRM, which oftentimes is rather easy to get rid of as well.
Needing knowledge and work is not the same as DRM, which is illegal to remove in many very important jurisdictions. And the very point of Ubuntu is to reduce the work done by the user. The very point of DRM is to place restrictions in the path of the user.
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My point is that it's largely a legal issue, not a practical one. Working around DRM is often easy, while completely DRM-free stuff can give you a lot of trouble. The only difference is the legality.
Re:DRM (Score:5, Informative)
You know, I often find myself forgetting that Steam is essentially DRM. This struck me most lately last night as I started thinking about the new SimCity that's coming out this year and how it's suppose to be "always online" for DRM purposes. I started to think, "Well, hell, I have SC4 on Steam I could just fire that u....waaaaaait".
I don't know if I can really pinpoint why I don't consider Steam to be the kick to the dick that almost all other DRM is. Is it the constant sales and love that get chucked my way? The ability to move game folders/files anywhere and everywhere and have it work as long the signed in account owns the game (my old apartment would frequently dump our Steam games on our NAS to save everyone else who bought it the trouble of downloading it, all legit)? The relatively good server uptime (compared to other game companies)? The ability to add non-Steam games to my library? I don't know, but I just feel like I'm using a service instead of being locked up.
Is it pure? Hell, no. Is it good? I'd certainly say so. If the balance of the two don't balance to your favor I'd certainly see why you'd avoid it. I don't, personally, and my big wish is that the Linux/Mac Steam clients get some sort of built in VM in order to easily play the huge back catalog of Windows only games. This could either increase Linux/Mac growth by easing the pain of transition or it could stymie development by giving developers a lazy out. Either way...VIDYO GAMES!
Re:DRM (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't know if I can really pinpoint why I don't consider Steam to be the kick to the dick that almost all other DRM is.
Two reasons.
1) It continues to just work.
2) You get at least the game-play value out of it that you spent.
I've picked up a lot of sub-$5 games on steam. You know how much I will care if at some point I can no longer play them? About as much as a care that I let $5 worth of cheese spoil in my refrigerator this week. I wish it didn't happen, but it doesnt pain me.
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And at the very least, with the games on your system you can always crack them. This is an advantage over streamed games like onlive/gaikai and consoles.
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Bottom line is, no DRM is acceptable. Accepting DRM is signing a blank check and giving control over your property to someone else.
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You know how much I will care if at some point I can no longer play them? About as much as a care that I let $5 worth of cheese spoil in my refrigerator this week. I wish it didn't happen, but it doesnt pain me.
Wow, I'm sure companies love that attitude. No accountability necessary! Basically, if all of their customers have this "I only care if it bothers me" attitude, they don't have to worry about much at all.
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Steam DRM doesn't restrict my hardware choices, so it's better than iTunes music (pre-DRM-free) or video, where I have to use an Apple device or Windows to play the file.
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I don't know if I can really pinpoint why I don't consider Steam to be the kick to the dick that almost all other DRM is.
Easy, because Steam drastically improves your experience. PC gaming has always been a mess, requiring discs in the drive even so the game is already installed, hour long install and extraction routines, typing in long CD-keys, long hunts and installs for the latest patches and all that mess. With Steam it's click & play. It's essentially the apt-get of gaming. And even when Steam fails for some reason, the support forum is only a click away and often already has the workaround you need.
Of course Steam s
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DRM is the world we live in. Complaining about steam is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. We're never going to get a service like steam without DRM. The publishers would never agree to it. Steam has everything I want, with the exception of the DRM bit. I'll take it. It's the least annoying DRM system to date, so if I'm going to have to deal with one, I'd rather it be steam.
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Steam is less annoying DRM.
The problem with most DRM on PC games is that it breaks and prevents yo u from doing things that seem obvious. This includes simple things like playing the game without the CD or an Internet connection.
There's actually a tradeoff going on with Steam. It's not just some misguided suit deciding to add extra fail to a product that doesn't really benefit from it.
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Given that the client was packaged rapidly for other Linux distributions, I don't think they have that problem. I suspect, rather, that non-Ubuntu installs fall into the "Other" category (a full 0.71%.)
Re:It Could Be More (Score:5, Insightful)
Perhaps their engineers are not that skilled?
They started with getting it to work on one distribution (on of the more popular ones), they will get it to work on others.
The articles describing how the worked with graphics card manufacturers to improve performance on linux suggests that their engineers are quite skilled, but only human, so they cannot do everything at once.
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You should actually look into the claims you make before you make them, least you look like a fool.
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Well you could have both the windows version (under wine or natively) and the native linux version installed, and use the native version whenever possible with wine as a fallback. The more linux users there are, the more incentive there will be to produce linux versions of games.
There are plenty of people who would prefer to play games on linux if they could, but they play games on windows out of necessity and thus show up as a windows user in the stats.
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Has anyone made an ebuild for Gentoo yet?
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No
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RMS doesnt' fucking bath or shave and tends to eat his own toe jam. Following RMS's example is one of the more retarded things you do in your life.
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Many of the games available via Steam are proprietary software. Proprietary software, as Richard Stallman (peace be upon him) has reminded us time and time again, is immoral and thus wrong for society. Who knows what games could by spying on you and subverting your freedom?
Yes, I cannot ultimately know what the software does. I just trust Steam and its partners and the game publishers to not bite me in the ass. That's enough for me.
Look pretty good to me. (Score:2)
more of the users (at least the gamers) are using microsoft works than openoffice! :D
very few like the 1200 horizontal resolution, 1080 is much prefered.
powerpoint is more popular than word
only 19% have internet explorer installed??
gimp is more popular than paint.net
The Office Stuff is confusing, but in reality I suspect this is more about how the questions were asked but Office 60% OpenOffice 15% Works 15% ...with the rest on Docs/Live with a little overlap seems about right.
For Internet Explorer Safari 9% Chrome 12% IE 20%...with a massive Firefox win at 64% again interesting as although Firefox/Chrome was expected to do well in this demographic The heavy bias to Firefox maybe a little surprising, but not unexplainable.
You can picture how this survey was done, but yo