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Intel Graphics Linux

MeeGo Being Ported To Wayland 76

Posted by Unknown Lamer
from the netcraft-confirms-x11-is-dying dept.
An anonymous reader writes "From the MeeGo SF2011 conference this week it was disclosed that MeeGo may ship the Wayland Server with the tablet version of the MeeGo 1.3 operating system for release in October." A reasonably annotated version of the presentation slides. Unfortunately video of the talk is not yet available.
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MeeGo Being Ported To Wayland

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  • by killfixx (148785) * on Friday May 27, 2011 @05:15PM (#36267576) Journal
    Kristian Høgsberg has been at the forefront for a while now. Imagine pulling an Apple/MS/Linux coup. "Subvert the dominant paradigm." That was my favorite saying (20 years ago). I'm happy to see ANYONE doing it. X has been the "paradigm" for so long that no one WANTED to challenge it. Kudos Kristian.
  • it's good to see MeeGo ain't dead after mama Nokia cheated papa Intel with his friend Microsoft.

    • by mickwd (196449) on Friday May 27, 2011 @05:41PM (#36267844)

      Yes, it is good to see that.

      However, this kind of thing is precisely why Nokia dropped Meego. Nokia is in the business of selling phones, not on some never-ending quest for the ultimate Linux UI without ever getting something out of the door.

      The mobile phone marketplace is very fast-moving. At some point, you need to stick with what already works, and polish it, instead of dropping it for the latest shiny instead.

      The tragedy with Nokia is that they were 90% there with Maemo. While their competitors surged ahead, they dropped Maemo and virtually started afresh with something about 10% ready instead.

      • by pavon (30274)

        Amen. Maemo looked really promising 5 years ago when the N770 shipped. It looked even better 3 years ago when the N810 shipped. Then just about time when they were going to start using it on mainstream smartphones, they changed direction and spent the last 3 years reinventing the wheel. Such a waste.

      • by suy (1908306)

        If anything, Nokia is exactly the one to blame for doing that. They broke compatibility across Maemo releases (IIRC).

        In Maemo 5, when TrollTech and Qt was already in the company, they release the whole OS based on GTK+, but they say that the future is Qt (agreed), and release Qt 4.6 updates for the N900 with some specially crafted widgets for Maemo 5 integration. However, they are at the same time developing Qt Quick, which only appears in Qt 4.7, and yes, it's way better, but is yet another change for deve

      • by Microlith (54737)

        this kind of thing is precisely why Nokia dropped Meego

        On the contrary, Nokia never got to MeeGo. They were part way with their Maemo-derived, MeeGo compatible device when Elop announced a wholesale shift to being (effectively) a Microsoft OEM.

        At some point, you need to stick with what already works, and polish it, instead of dropping it for the latest shiny instead.

        And had Nokia not stymied the group working on Maemo, then they would have gotten there, as you acknowledge. But in the end they would likely h

      • by elPetak (2016752)

        Well... maybe because they were 90% there with Maemo is that they were borged.
        Think about it from the MS perspective... borging nokia was prolly their last chance to gain marketshare in the smartfone market and it would have been lost forever if Maemo/MeeGo were to be succesfull.

        • by BreezeC (2040184)
          Maybe nokia don't know how to do in the smartfone market. So nokia dropped meego.
          • by elPetak (2016752)

            Nokia ruled the smartphone market globally with symbian for ages. I have a 5 year old symbian phone (N95) and it does everything (gps, nice camera, java, flash, accelerated 3D graphics, wifi, multitasking, etc, etc, etc).
            It was only in the US where symbian didn't have much acceptance, but if you consider the global market share then nokia was the ruler of the smartphone market until 2010 Q4 when android surpassed Symbian as the most common operating system in smartphones.
            MeeGo was never a player in the smar

      • Maemo was just too old. It may have been 90% done, but it just wasn't a good competitor. The use of Flash being the number one mistake. The shift to Meego's UI was a great move. Clutter is very capable, and looked very pretty on Meego 1.0 for netbooks and would be a great performer for smaller, embedded systems where you have a GPU and UI is the primary use. You can debate the merits and deficiencies of the UI designs choices in Meego, but at the least the technology was solid and pretty. If anything
        • by Microlith (54737)

          Intel tried to keep Meego development on their hardware, which limited work towards others (Read: ARM)

          Except development proceeded apace on both architectures. But Intel (obviously) didn't provide support for non-Intel platforms, even though they had no means nor right to block it.

          Instead they brought in Qt and basically hit the big reset button on the whole project in order to get their brand up front.

          They had been planning a shift to Qt some time before, and to a great degree it was a smart move due in no

        • Maemo was just too old. It may have been 90% done, but it just wasn't a good competitor. The use of Flash being the number one mistake.

          I don't understand. Why would having Flash support in the browser be the biggest reason for why the OS itself wasn't good?

      • by BreezeC (2040184)
        Meego not dead. Maybe nokia is a loser.
      • by MrHanky (141717)

        Wrong. Nokia's solution to the ultimate Linux (and Symbian) UI is/was Qt, which is pretty much agnostic as to which rendering system it runs on, and which already does run on Wayland (so this future switch isn't exactly a surprise to them).

      • by Mikkeles (698461)

        'At some point, you need to stick with what already works, and polish it,...'

        Ah, yes; the Polished Turd process of software development; also known as Agile.

    • by exomondo (1725132)

      it's good to see MeeGo ain't dead after mama Nokia cheated papa Intel with his friend Microsoft.

      You can't kill it, it's open source, it will die on its own if it isn't any good.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    But good to see MeeGo embracing country music anyway.

    (Mod me +1 funny or -1 offtopic, but don't bother trying to educate me -- I already know Wayland is a graphics server, like an X server "but better".)

    • I already know Wayland is a graphics server, like an X server "but without important features used by people who do actual work with Linux".)

      FTFY.

  • I'm sure this is all very exciting if you know what MeeGo is.

    I've gone to the site, read the homepage and got a hint. Then I read the About page and got corporate name-checks and drivel about leveraging stuff.

    Is it an OS? Or what?

    • by suy (1908306)

      You can think of MeeGo as "just" a Linux distribution. However, it's optimized and focused in bringing the usual Linux stack to all sorts of devices (TVs, cars, phones, tablets...).

      It's a true open source project, or at least, it aims to be (is just beginning), and provides some sort of tools, and middleware. It's also a specification that you have to comply if you want to be MeeGo certified, so you can grant that software runs on all MeeGo devices.

      • by 6Yankee (597075)
        Thanks, now I don't feel quite as dumb as I did :)
        • by Lennie (16154)

          Let me guess you've never tried to search on Google and clicked on the 3rd or 4th link ? Because that probably points to this page:

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MeeGo [wikipedia.org]

          I suggest you try it next time, it aint all bad.

          • by 6Yankee (597075)

            If I go to your official site, and still have to go to Wikipedia to find out what the hell it is you're making, then your official site is a miserable failure.

            I don't need Internet 101, thank you very much, especially after having had it from the other respondents whose posts you presumably skipped in your rush to deliver it, but I hope the warm glow of smug superiority brightened your day. :)

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by PopeRatzo (965947) *

      Is it an OS? Or what?

      MeeGo is one of those little scooters that fat people drive around in the Wal-Mart because they're too obese to walk 30 feet to pick up their 5 gallon jar of pickles, adult diapers and box of shotgun shells.

    • It is a collaboration between Intel and several cell phone OEM's, with Nokia a major player, to develop an open-source Linux operating system for phones. In a sense, it is the spiritual successor to Nokia's Maemo operating system, found on the N770, N800, N810, and N900 devices. MeeGo is much more "Linuxy" than Android is, providing a complete RPM-based Linux stack with Qt as the primary API.
      • by 6Yankee (597075)

        Thank you! :)

        Now why couldn't *they* say that...

        • Because they assume that if you're interested you already know what Meego is? Especially if you regularly read slashdot.. Should they also explain what KDE, Xorg etc is everytime news about them comes along?

      • by Microlith (54737)

        That's at best a pale explanation.

        MeeGo is a fully open source Linux OS under the Linux Foundation umbrella that seeks to be a reference baseline OS for all sorts of consumer electronics. Phones, Tablets, Netbooks (less these days), TVs, set top boxes, and in-car computers.

      • by hitmark (640295)

        Nokia have been cutting back on support since the Winphone agreement with MS. Hell, they have even outsourced Qt now.

        The funny/sad thing about Meego, is that these days it is more Moblin (a Intel project) then Maemo. Hell, i am not even sure if the 1.2 release have transitioned to Qt as the main interface toolkit on the netbook and IVI variants (the variants that Intel focused on).

        I base the claim on it being RPM based, as Maemo have been DEB based since day one. Moblin also was DEB on first release, then c

    • You should know by now that official websites are useless to find what they are actually about. For that there's Wikipedia.

      MeeGo is a Linux-based open source mobile operating system project. Primarily targeted at mobile devices and information appliances in the consumer electronics market, MeeGo is designed to act as an operating system for hardware platforms such as netbooks, entry-level desktops, nettops, tablet computers, mobile computing and communications devices, in-vehicle infotainment devices, SmartTV / ConnectedTV, IPTV-boxes, smart phones, and other embedded systems. MeeGo is today hosted by the Linux Foundation.

    • Simple: It's the non Apple-trademark infringing version of iPee.

      Seriously though: (once again) FTWA [wikipedia.org]

      MeeGo is a Linux-based open source mobile operating system project. Primarily targeted at mobile devices and information appliances in the consumer electronics market, MeeGo is designed to act as an operating system for hardware platforms such as netbooks, entry-level desktops, nettops, tablet computers, mobile computing and communications devices, in-vehicle infotainment devices, SmartTV / ConnectedTV, IPT

      • by 6Yankee (597075)

        TL;DR: You're on the Internet. Use it.

        I guess you missed the part where I used the Internet to go find the official MeeGo site. TL;DR indeed.

  • I'm the proud owner of a N900, but I'm very frustrated in how MeeGo has stagnated, especially regarding Microsoft's attempt to nail it into its coffin. Maemo/MeeGo is by far the best mobile OS around that provides true power to the user and may actually, over time, have the same kind of exposure that Android did influential in growing "App" developer networks. Sadly, with few if any devices shipping its going to remain a playtoy.

    I'd like to see MeeGo become basically installable on any device that Android

    • by ianare (1132971)

      Not looking to good on that front, I'm afraid. The focus is now more on tablets and netbooks ever since Nokia left the party. But it could do OK in the tablet space, if there are good apps for it that come out.

      • by UpnAtom (551727)

        Tablets are as useless as they ever were.

        Want to type something? Sorry one handed virtual keyboard only. Since you have to carry the device, hope it's something short you're writing.

        Want to make a call? Sorry we cut that feature.

        Want to watch a film? Here's a wedge for only $30 so you can see the screen properly.

        iPads only sold because Apple fanboys will buy anything made by Apple.

        Smaller devices are the new PC ie a 'platform' that can make a company $tens of billions.

        It's interesting how great Nokia we

        • by Ultra64 (318705)

          Ah, so since tablets don't fit your exact requirements they are not useful for anyone.

          Better call all the tablet manufacturers and their customers and let them know that they only think the devices are working for them.

        • Tablets are as useless as they ever were.

          I'd like to point out that a few billion people worldwide disagree with you.

        • by exomondo (1725132)

          It's interesting how great Nokia were only became well-known after they became Microsoft's bitch.

          How great they were, you know, over 4 years ago back when their highend phones were good because we didn't expect as much of them as we do today. They arguably had the best hardware but since the 'smartphone revolution' they have been relegated to the low-mid end, low margin market. The N900 is great but it isn't going to win the mainstream consumer market.

    • by Microlith (54737)

      I'd like to see MeeGo become basically installable on any device that Android can reside and more.

      This is not something MeeGo or its developers can fix, at least not on the mobile device (ARM-based) space. Google has worked very hard to make sure the user space is incompatible with more common Linux distributions and software, and vendors are loathe to merge their drivers and device support upstream (because that would require more work.)

      However, it would be great if it could also load onto Nexus S, Nexus O

      • (it's running on Qualcomm chips and Tegra 2)

        Probably out of luck if you buy a phone using those chips. Those incorporating PowerVR GPUs may, eventually, run better with Wayland - as used in Intel's Atom platform.

        • by Microlith (54737)

          The problem with the way hardware is handled in the ARM space is that the SGX drivers that work on one platform may not work on another, even if the SGX core is the same. On top of that, you'd need them built explicitly for Xorg 1.9 and compiled against glibc (so basically, the vendor would be shipping both Android and MeeGo, or using the same hardware as one shipping MeeGo.)

          It's all about vendor-dependence.

      • by Rennt (582550)

        Google has worked very hard to make sure the user space is incompatible with more common Linux distributions and software

        Have they? I'd love to see some evidence of that.

        You'd also have to harass Google to compile any binary only bits (namely the graphics drivers) for glibc and to work with Xorg 1.9.

        What? Why would you even want binary drivers? In any case, Google is no more responsible for supplying 3D drivers then the eponymous Linus himself. Either harass the hardware vendor or write your own damn driver.

  • Presumeably this:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayland_(display_server_protocol)

    A method for applications to access a lower level of the OS than X, according to my naive understanding.  Sounds a lot like directX?
    • Please note that the correct URL is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayland_%28display_server_protocol%29 That way, it will work with anything parsing correctly formed URLs (like QuietUrl).

      Of course it doesn't help that Slashdot must be prevented to recognize that as URL, because otherwise it "helpfully" converts the %28 and %29 back to parentheses, forming an invalid URL and thus breaking everything expecting a valid one (also it doesn't help that Firefox [and probably other browsers] does the same in the UR

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