India's $35 7-Inch Android Tablet To Hit In January 205
indogiree writes "Engadget reports that India has just awarded the manufacturing contract to HCL Technologies. The first shipment will supposedly only contain the 7-inch model and is set to arrive on January 10. It's unclear if the $35 price has stuck or whether India's been successful in plans to drive the price down to $10 eventually with the help of large orders and government subsidies. HCL Technologies plans to initially produce 100,000 units. Among the key features of this India-based tablet include 2GB of RAM, web-conferencing, PDF reader, unzip, WiFi, camera and USB connectivity."
Production cost (Score:5, Interesting)
I'd really like to know what the true production cost of this tablet is. If it's low enough that with a few subsidies from the government they can get it down to $35 or even $10, then it leads me to believe other tablets are severely overpriced for no reason.
If they are indeed overpriced, then why doesn't 1 competitor just come in with a ridiculously low price and suck up all the "cheap" market? This applies to phones as well, which are also very expensive (though we don't often notice due to hardware upgrades from the carriers).
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India also has a $6000 car but most westerners (and especially the USA) wouldn't want it.
Re:Production cost (Score:4, Informative)
The base model is $3000, its only if you want the model with AC,Airbags,etc that you pay $6000
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Is that the same model of car that recently set fire to itself when a salesman wanted to take prospective buyers on a test drive?
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Assuming there was any problem at all, it could have been a mistake compounded by mass psychology and media attention. It sounds like it might be another 60 Minutes-Audi type hysteria, the Audi case was where people can swear they pressed the brakes but it turns out they really pressed the gas pedal.
Re:Production cost (Score:5, Informative)
Wasn't a problem with the brakes. Was a problem with the floor mats.
Wasn't a problem with either. Was a problem with the driver [marketwatch.com]
As anyone in computer support knows, the most common error code is "ID-10T".
If you prefer, a "layer-8" problem.
Could be known in this case as "PICNIC" (here meaning Problem In Chair, Not In Car).
The automotive technician version: "loose nut between the steering wheel and the seat"
I could almost go on about this all day.
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The supposed problem wasn't rough roads. People were claiming problems in parking lots too. One major problem in a lot of the cases was that the computer crash log showed the gas pedal being pressed when people said they hit the brakes. A firmware update can't fix user error, but it could be a good placebo in the case of mass hysteria.
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A problem that went away when Audi redesigned the placement of the pedals. It was an ergonomics rather than a mechanical failure.
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In August 2010, the Wall St. Journal reported that experts at the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration had examined the "black boxes" of 58 vehicles involved in sudden-acceleration reports. The study found that in 35 of the cases, the brakes weren't applied at the time of the crash. In nine other cases in the same study, the brakes were used only at the last moment before impact.[210] [edit]
Yeah, pretty much -all- the cases were due to driver error. Remember those 911 tapes where the guy wouldn't put his car in neutral, etc?
The problem is when one person reports a "problem" everyone else thinks "oh wow, I probably have the same problem if I did/will crash my Prius!" even though the problem was non-existent.
Sometimes you need to "fix" a problem th
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"brakes". The word is "brakes"...
Re:Production cost (Score:5, Funny)
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its the same car, but dont know which model the one that caught fire was.
most prob. the more expensive one since ppl dont buy the cheaper one much
That would be the new Ferrari (Score:2)
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That was probably a £170k Ferrari (Score:2)
That was probably a £170K Ferrari 458 [telegraph.co.uk] - they seem to be bursting into flames quite regularly, general recall of the model is currently going on ;-)
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Wikipedia says the Tata Nano started around $2200. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tata_Nano [wikipedia.org]
I wouldn't want that car (or any car) in Delhi, but for rainy days when I don't feel like bicycling to work in New England, I think it would be grand. Plus the rain might help put out the spontaneous combustion hahaha.
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Yes, it was supposed to be the 1lakh(Rs 100,000) car, but the actual prices went up, and including the taxes,etc, the price goes up to approx 1.5 lakh($3000 taking a conversion rate of Rs 50=$1)
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Re:Production cost (Score:4, Informative)
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The ability for a US corp to make a healthy profit and spend the cash on next gen R and D or to ensure US legislation is well written.
India wants nation building, tablets are trying to hold cartel like pricing up.
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Making a profit explains part of it. I don't think your anti-US conspiracy theory works well enough to explain the $35 price. The thing is, even the cost of the pile of parts for any other tablet on the market is a lot higher than $35. Also, almost none of the parts for a lot of the consumer tablets are made in the US or by US owned companies.
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I'm pretty sure I saw a breakdown of the parts/cost for the iPad, and it worked out to about $200 for the most expensive model, but that was off-the-shelf parts, rather than bulk from a distributor, so knock that down to about $100, I'd guess. Still more than your $35.
Also, interesting to note, stores like Staples sell at pretty much what the manufacturer sells to them at. That's why they push extended service plans and accessories, they're not making any profit off the laptop you're buying.
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OK, maybe it's real, but maybe not necessarily in the way the Indian government claims, unless they bought/stole the design. It also looks like the Indian government is also subsidizing 25% of the manufacturing cost:
http://androidos.in/2010/09/the-truth-about-35-android-tablet-from-indian-government/ [androidos.in]
Someone else pointed out that it's a resistive touch screen, which is a technology that's at least a couple decades old. I wouldn't be surprised if they used the cheapest TN display they could find.
Re:Production cost (Score:5, Insightful)
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Indeed. If the device is actually delivered, there will be a number of questions that will really get answered. Is the display tolerable to use? What is the real battery life? How well do the touch functions actually work? Does it survive the first drop (and I suspect that as a small tablet, it will get dropped regularly)?
Re:"Tolerable" (Score:2)
Tolerable for who? It's all about expectations.
The Western press will no doubt compare it side-by-side with the iPad and go on at great length about all its shortcomings, how isn't as shiny, how the touch-screen isn't as good, how the speaker is a bit naff, etc., but that's not who it's aimed at.
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I'll compare it to the iPad right now: even marked up to $50 without the subsidy and marked up to $75 to make a profit and another $25 for international shipping and duties, I can buy six of them instead of one iPad. Six. At least three or four of them, even if the numbers are a little off. Since the iPad is intentionally limited in capabilities compared to laptops of the same price, I'd say this thing can afford to be a little behind the iPad in processor speed and touch screen accuracy.
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Boy, are you crazy.
Any idea how long it's been since a "US corp" (whatever that is) has spent cash on R & D? And you believe that corporations worry about whether legislation is "well-written"?
All I can say is that India better hope like hell that Apple doesn't have nukes yet.
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All I can say is that India better hope like hell that Apple doesn't have nukes yet.
Epic comment, you should have been modded both insightful and funny for that one :)
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All I can say is that India better hope like hell that Apple doesn't have nukes yet.
Think about it. The mark of the beast. Something placed upon the hand or the head. Impossible to do business without it. Wrought by one who is worshiped as a demigod, but is in fact the antichrist.
If Apple has nukes, it won't just be the end of India.
What we're witnessing here could be the beginning of the end. The iPocalypse itself.
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You jest, but I just finished reading Doctorow's political novel, Makers and he makes a good case for why walled gardens = epic EVIL.
What makes it hurt even more is that a logo that once stood for freedom and invention now stands for limitations and prevention.
Re:Production cost (Score:5, Insightful)
Because, as Apple shows, people are not necessarily going for the cheapest thing.
Also you're shooting yourself with low profit margins - look at Motorola and Nokia nowadays - they were selling decent phones a while ago and decided to go for the low hanging fruit of cheap phones. That didn't leave enough focus/resources on the smartphones.
The result is the're both still in big trouble, with Motorola resuscitated by Google's Android as compared to cash rich Apple, who clearly have a strategy that brings in more money and focuses on innovation much more...
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Also you're shooting yourself with low profit margins - look at Motorola and Nokia nowadays - they were selling decent phones a while ago and decided to go for the low hanging fruit of cheap phones. That didn't leave enough focus/resources on the smartphones.
And thats why Nokia has large market penitration in "the rest of the world", the US is the only one where they skipped out on because of wanting to many rights for the end users when it came to carrier deals. All of Apples 'inovation' is based on other peoples work (Nokia and others for the actual ability to work as a phone), they are really just skilled collage makers pasting together technologies that other people have made into their own product.
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The result is the're both still in big trouble, with Motorola resuscitated by Google's Android as compared to cash rich Apple, who clearly have a strategy that brings in more money and focuses on innovation much more...
As for Apple - innovation, somewhat, marketing definitely, but there is far too often a design or quality problem of some kind or another.
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You are comparing an mp3 player to a phone.
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Who, me? ;)
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Congratz, you're snap bang at the core of Apple's market: people who can't tell a phone from an MP3 player.
It comes with peach-colored sleeves, too !
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"You can use a program to use a device in a manner it wasn't specifically built for, and doesn't include the same components that raise the cost, so the fact that it's cheaper is TOTALLY relevant, you meanie!"
Seriously, either compare phones to phones, or mp3 players to mp3 players. Theoretical devices do not count, faking functionality does not count.
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How about this device?
http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/26/augens-150-android-tablet-hits-kmart-circular-coming-to-store/ [engadget.com]
http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/10/08/08/1727223/Kmart-Briefly-Offers-149-Android-Tablet [slashdot.org]
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KMart is still advertising these as having full access to Android market:
http://www.kmart.com/shc/s/p_10151_10104_020W023705190001P?keyword=tablet&prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1 [kmart.com]
And other reviews say 2-3 hours video playback:
http://www.kmart.com/shc/s/p_10151_10104_020W023705190001P?keyword=tablet&prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1#reviewsWrap [kmart.com]
I'm not saying you're wrong. Some javascript can be wasteful of CPU and power (although not less than bad Flash!). But if they took away Android
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K Mart is lower on the chain than Wal-Mart. You're surprised that they've not updated the status of a product? I'm surprised the site actually has basic functionality.
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Maybe the iPod touch should be called an app-pod instead of an iPod analogous to how some people call the latest smartphones app-phones. It's literally in a class of its own, why people don't try to jump into that market segment is beyond me.
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Colour me unimpressed.
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How about: Increased usage range.
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If they are indeed overpriced, then why doesn't 1 competitor just come in with a ridiculously low price and suck up all the "cheap" market?
The same reason they are marked up to begin with: Profits. If you mark something down $200 from your original price, you could end up making less money than your competitors even if you DO get their potential customers.
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If you watch the video of the guy [engadget.com] you'll notice he doesn't say it costs $35 to produce but rather he has a contract to buy a million of them at $35. He goes on to empathically say that this wouldn't be a retail price but this is the price at which it would be delivered to educational institutions. That makes me think it's more heavily subsidized (by all parties involved) than they are letting on. It could make financial sense for the company to get these tablets in the hands of students even at a loss, like
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"empathically" != "emphatically"
Re:Production cost (Score:4, Interesting)
India probably has the highest growth in terms of mobile devices purchased. The cheapest Nokia mobile set here costs USD 25 and we have Indian mobile companies now (Lava, MicroMax, Karbonn) who are aiming to provide mobiles for USD 10 in 2011. I have seen beggars with mobile phones. That's how low the entry-barrier is, in India. These mobiles do their job well.
India also has a very good mobile coverage. The areas which are not covered by private providers are covered by the state-owned BSNL. 3G services are going to get rolled out sometime towards the end of 2010.
The government wishes to push technology to masses. This is a good step in that direction.
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Uhm, the production cost of what is essentially a "smartphone without a phone" is in no way related to the production cost of an actual tablet computer using note/netbook-caliber components, add in the Gov't subsidies and the reality that this is a $100 chinese product that is apparently being bought on the cheap due to a lack of interest in the market (read "they are being dumped").
Thanks jigsawhacker for the link: http://androidos.in/2010/09/the-truth-about-35-android-tablet-from-indian-government/ [androidos.in]
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If they are indeed overpriced, then why doesn't 1 competitor just come in with a ridiculously low price and suck up all the "cheap" market?
I have seen the 7" apad [www.apad.tv] (iped, epad etc.) going for as low as $60USD on Chinese websites. You can Buy It Now on U.S. Ebay for $100. Also Android phones (Sciphone G15 [mysciphone.com]) for $100.
But these devices are not so popular in the U.S. and Europe. I would guess that they don't perform as well as a HTC device. Also, a phone is a fashion statement. Having the $100 Chinese Android phone is not going to impress as much as having a $600 "American/European brand (but built in China)" Android phone.
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I think most people would consider the manufacture of babies to be an industry where child labour is uncommon.
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You'd be surprised [wikipedia.org]
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I think you will find that the term offers an interpretation under which it is not only common, but exclusive!
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Is ANYTHING today manufactured someplace where child labor is UNCOMMON?
Anything where consistent quality matters. Microprocessors are made in the US, Western Europe, Israel or Taiwan. Cars and their components are still predominantly made in Europe, Japan, Korea or the US. Passenger planes - US, Europe, Brazil. Etc etc.
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I believe the prices set by these chinese (post-)shanzai shops show what's practically possible...
What would you say to a 7" touchscreen android with wifi & 2GB RAM for under $100 [dealextreme.com] delivered to your door.
I don't see any reason that price can't be halved for a large enough order & then you're only looking at a $15/unit subsidy.
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I believe the prices set by these chinese (post-)shanzai shops show what's practically possible...
What would you say to a 7" touchscreen android with wifi & 2GB RAM for under $100 [dealextreme.com] delivered to your door.
I don't see any reason that price can't be halved for a large enough order & then you're only looking at a $15/unit subsidy.
No, it's got 2GB of NAND flash, only 128MB of RAM. Whoever modded you insightful apparently didn't bother clicking that link.
The $35 tablet described in TFS supposedly comes with 2GB of RAM.
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Especially with the "2 GB" RAM part,
Well, I used the term RAM the same way the submitter did. Incorrectly.
But I think we'll see $35 Android 7" tablets by the end of the year. (probably not from the Indian govt however)
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its just the price after the government subsidizes it for their own students
And that, I think you are right, is the focal point that is being sorely missed.
When I was a school child I had access to an Apple IIe, a Commodore PET, a TRS 80-III, and an IBM PCjr. Not exciting by today's standards, but the MSRP on these four machines would have totaled roughly $10,000 at the time. The cost to me : $0. These were machines at the different computer labs where I went to school, and they were subsidized by the go
2GB Ram? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:2GB Ram? (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:2GB Ram? (Score:4, Informative)
Flash most definitely is not "RAM". It can not be arbitrarily written.
Ram!= RWM (Score:2)
Re:2GB Ram? (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, no it's not. Flash can't be written to randomly; it needs a block erase cycle first (and generally a block is fairly large; we're not talking one or two bytes here). Technically you can zero bits without an erase, but not set them to 1 (erasing sets everything to 1).
This is why there's a distinction between EEPROM, FLASH, and RAM.
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Actually, no, it's exactly the functionally descriptive term I'm challenging.
The normal definition is a memory with flat access times - i.e. it doesn't matter what part of the memory you access, you can do it equally quickly. This doesn't apply for things like tapes or HDDs, which are respectively either sequential or semi-sequential (sequential per cylinder) access.
In the case of flash the time to perform a write is strongly dependent on the preexisting erase state of the block - if it's cleared already, i
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In that case of that restrictive of a definition, any NUMA machine would not have RAM as its main memory. Even if the chips themselves are RAM, the processors couldn't access them in an equal amount of time.
Re:2GB Ram? (Score:5, Informative)
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Suddenly that goes from unbelievably awesome to unbelievably shitty. 2GB RAM = holy shit! 2GB internal flash = !usable. I hope it has an external slot.
We're talking about a $10 tablet - how could you reasonably expect an external expansion slot?
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Hmmm.... how about buying large quantities? A "DDR2 1Gb 128Mx8 800MHz" chip costs less than 2 US$ on the spot market. So you can get 2GB for below 4 bucks as manudacturer (Source: http://www.dramexchange.com/ [dramexchange.com]).
CU, Martin
Re:2GB Ram? (Score:4, Informative)
1 Gb is 1 gigaBIT. 2 GB is 2 gigaBYTES. So, to make 2 GBs, you need 16 of those $2 chips, not two. So, ~$32 for 2 GB of RAM, just for the chips. 2 GB DIMMs/SoDIMMs are in $35-$40 range on the site you posted.
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Another person stupid enough to not comprehend the difference between stupidity and ignorance. Who are you trying to impress with that comment? Insecure fuck.
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I can not find 2GB RAM retail for less than $35. So the summary is truly amazing, or RAM is not a global market.
Logic? You fail it. The tablet is not made with retail products. Products are sold for what the market will bear. The retail market will bear higher prices than the wholesale, reseller market.
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The Truth about $35 Android Tablet from Indian Gov (Score:5, Informative)
Re:The Truth about $35 Android Tablet from Indian (Score:3, Informative)
and
http://ibnlive.in.com/blogs/jaimonjoseph/326/62006/is-indias--35-laptop-really-indian.html [in.com]
What will happen (Score:2)
If this actually happens and India really does subsidize and sell these Android tablets for $35 a pop to Indian citizens, I predict a lot of U.S. and western geeks will be purchasing them for $100 each on eBay.
well (Score:2)
Lemme guess (Score:2)
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Anything can be made not only "affordable", but even "free" with sufficient amount of subsidies.
It's not honest to advertise subsidized prices as the true expense. Someone is paying the subsidies, although it might not be the student or his school. Yet especially in India, they want to express nationalistic pride for this achievement, while comparing subsidized price with unsubsidized free-market prices. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that this device is fair amount more expensive in total cost
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You might want to tell Boeing and you local congresscritter.
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It seem to me, that they are taking success-concepts from the western world and integrate them into their culture.
Actually the source might not be 'western' but Chinese - see comment lower down "The Truth about $35 Android Tablet from Indian Gov" with story from androidos.in [androidos.in].
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Some day "shipping" will come to India, and we will be able to send a package from the country without being there personally. Just like people used to do with drugs, before India's Customs agencies got their import/export perfect under the control of law and order.
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There exists such a thing as 'Customs' in Indian airports. So, you ask how will India stop you? Simply by detaining you at the airport when the X-ray finds those dozens of tablets in your suitcase, and probably throwing you into the nearest cell till your lawyer bails you out and then, to top it all, imposing a life ban on your re-entering the country.
I have several Indian friends who've told me there are ways around anything "official" there (and provided numerous specific personal anecdotes to support that claim). It's just a matter of greasing the right palms.
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Those Indian friends of yours seem to be the typical armchair experts who enjoy giving opinions over a glass of beer. It really isn't that easy.
Why don't you try it? It's an open challenge. Once this product is released, I want to see you smuggle a dozen of these tablets to the USA - just a dozen. I will reimburse the costs of all 12 tablets if you manage to do it.