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openSUSE 10.3 Public Release 165

Posted by Zonk
from the chameleons-sneak-up-on-you dept.
Shizawana writes "The latest version of openSUSE was released this week. The site has a sneak peak of all the new features and additions, including highly anticipated changes to the YaST package management. The official announcement of the release offers a few highlights as well: 'The openSUSE team is proud to announce the release of openSUSE 10.3. Promoting the use of Linux everywhere, the openSUSE project provides free, easy access to the world's most usable Linux distribution, openSUSE. openSUSE is released regularly, is stable, secure, contains the latest free and open source software, and comes with several new technologies. openSUSE 10.3 will be supported with security and other serious updates for a period of 2 years. This version contains new beautiful green artwork, KDE 3.5.7 and parts of KDE 4, SUSE-polished GNOME 2.20, a GTK version of YaST, a new 1-click-install technology, MP3 support out-of-the-box, new and redesigned YaST modules, compiz and compiz fusion advances, virtualisation improvements, 2.3, Xfce 4.4.1, and much more! Read on for details of what is new and available in openSUSE 10.3, and for all the necessary download links.'"
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openSUSE 10.3 Public Release

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  • I remember trying out suse 10.1, and a fresh install was full of bugs. Various suse utilities seemed to break immediately after running update.

    Have they made much progress towards more stable releases (marketing blurb aside)? Is it worth checking out?
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Culture20 (968837)
      Parent is not a Troll. zmd.exe (the default updater) is a mono app, and is prone to hanging. I've had to kill zmd and restart novell-zmd several times to get updates to work whenever I notice that a cron-run update is still in the process list 8-10 hours later.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by maxwell demon (590494)
        Just throw off zmd from your system and use opensuseupdater instead of zen-updater.

        Before I did that, openSUSE managed to make a dual-core system almost unusable: One core was running zmd at nice 0, the other one was running beagled-helper at nice 0. Now I only get one core filled up from time to time, and therefore only need to kill or at least renice when I need full processor power. For normal operation one core is enough, and beagle can have the other one.
      • by (1108067) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:28PM (#20856491) Homepage Journal

        Just remove mono and zdm.exe, and use guru or the smart updater. Mono sucks, pegs the cpu, and IMNSHO (in my not so humble opinion) there is NO excuse for having a file that ends in .exe on a linux box.

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by mrsteveman1 (1010381)
        If you knew what you were talking about you would have known that opensuse 10.3 doesn't even have ZMD, not turned on, not included by default, not installed.

        Besides that .exe files are PE executables, wine uses them just fine, so does mono. Do you refain from using Wine out of some fear of PE executables? DO you even know what a PE executable is?
        • by Culture20 (968837)

          If you knew what you were talking about you would have known that opensuse 10.3 doesn't even have ZMD, not turned on, not included by default, not installed.

          GGP was talking about opensuse 10.1, not 10.3. Please read more fully before reacting.

          Besides that .exe files are PE executables, wine uses them just fine, so does mono. Do you refain from using Wine out of some fear of PE executables? DO you even know what a PE executable is?

          Actually, I don't know what a PE executable is, but it's irrelevant to the discussion since zmd.exe runs via mono by default (on opensuse 10.1, 10.2, SLED 10). That extra interpretation eats up my CPU(s). Only thing worse would have been if they wrote their daemon in lisp or perl.

          • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

            by und0 (928711)

            Only thing worse would have been if they wrote their daemon in Python or perl.

            There, fixed for you.
    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Maelwryth (982896)
      I installed it last's beautiful. Definitely worth checking out :).
    • Yes They Have (Score:3, Informative)

      by TheNinjaroach (878876)
      Yes they have fixed those very annoying bugs from 10.1 -- I have been using SUSE since 9.1 and you speak of my most hated release. It seemed Novell crammed a bunch of their Zen Management tools into the 10.1 release and they mostly came out broken. By 10.2, SUSE was back to its standard, highly-polished state.

      Sometimes you gotta go backwards before you can go forward. I am usually on top of new SUSE releases, but I'm so pleased with 10.2 I will stay put until a KDE4 version of SUSE is released.
    • Yes. (Score:5, Informative)

      by flydpnkrtn (114575) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:35PM (#20856581)
      Try it you might like it :)

      No but seriously the update manager was based on zen-updater in 10.1 and 10.2. That functionality has been removed in openSUSE because a.) you don't need ZENworks stuff updating from your house and b.) it's bloated and kind of broken
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by grommit (97148)
      Yeah, 10.1 was easily the worst release of OpenSUSE. 10.2 fixed a lot of problems but IMO it wasn't as good as 9.3. I've tried out 10.3 RC1 and it is *much* better than 10.2. They've done a lot of work on this release and it definitely shows. I had been trying out other distributions recently to see if I want to switch away from OpenSUSE but if 10.3 stays as good as my initial look at it, I'll be sticking with OpenSUSE for a while.
  • Thoughts (Score:4, Informative)

    by TopSpin (753) * on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:06PM (#20856127) Journal
    SUSE is being pretty aggressive in terms of key packages like gcc, glibc and the kernel. 10.3 provides GCC 4.2.1, glibc 2.6.1 and the release of the kernel.

    My one serious complaint with YaST is the time wasted waiting for the package manager to download metadata every time you enter it. I've taken to just leaving it running on a separate desktop. Please, YaST folks, apply some caching; it should take at most only a few seconds to bring up package manager if it has been run in the last few hours. If I should need to ensure absolutely current metadata provide a simple means to force a full update, otherwise get the thing open as quickly as possible. Yes, it's probably possible to work-around, tweak or otherwise get this behavior now... I want it out of the box.

    • My Fedora machine is running, what's so modern about

      YaST is a piece of junk. If you use rpm to install a package, you have hopelessly screwed up YaST and it will never behave correctly again. It's why I gave up on SuSE. Maybe there's a way to fix it, but there are plenty of distributions that behave correctly and don't require putzing around.

      • Re:Thoughts (Score:5, Informative)

        by WhiteWolf666 (145211) <{sherwin} {at} {}> on Thursday October 04, 2007 @05:05PM (#20858213) Homepage Journal
        That hasn't been my experience, and I install quite a few packages via rpm command line.

        YaST was borked for 10.1 and 10.2. It made sense to try and use an alternative package manager.

        As 10.2 matured, YaST started to work properly, but was slow.

        In 10.3, YaST is quite speedy, very capable, and runs very solidly. Plus, the one-click-install thing works really well.
        • Well, my employer's customers use SuSE 9 and SuSE 10, so that's what I have to use. None of this openSuSE stuff. Hey, we still support VMS. What can I say?
    • Re:Thoughts (Score:5, Informative)

      by mj01nir (153067) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:26PM (#20856463)
      From the 10.3 announcement:

      The package management team have been working hard on improving the new openSUSE package management, and there is a lot to show for it now. It is reliable, more mature, and an awful lot faster. There is no more parsing during startup, greater compatibility with tools like yum and smart, and increased speed for the most common use-case: installing a package.

      Sounds promising.
      • by plazman30 (531348)
        You know with Zenworks, I couldn't update through our work's authenticated proxy. But I could using Yast. Now that 10.3 is out, they ripped out Zenworks and somehow managed to break Yast updates through an authenticated proxy.
    • They finally added metadata caching in 10.2 - but you're right it was way overdue.
      • by Culture20 (968837)
        Not out of the box. With Opensuse 10.2, I still have to wait for timeouts when I want to install something from one repo while others might be unavailable, or remove a repo that's been shut down.
    • by grommit (97148)
      I wouldn't say that it's fast now but it is definitely faster than any previous version of YaST's package manager. Ubuntu's package manager is extremely fast and it would be difficult to match that speed but thankfully I don't install/uninstall/reinstall packages very often so 10.3's package manager speed is fine for me. I would like it if the OpenSUSE team would work on having the package manager do multiple package processes at the same time such as downloading the next package while the previously down
    • I'm using it, and yes, its fixed. It's cached, and at each package manager startup it checks the cache versus the online version, and even if it needs update the cache update is an order of magnitude faster than a normal startup of the package manager used to be.

      It's quite useable now; time from clicking "software manager" to a usable interface is similar to using SMART.

      Speed seems to be one of the primary focuses of this release; from the package manager to the boot sequence.
    • by griego (1108909)
      Go into "Installation Source" in YaST and turn off Refresh for the slower repositories. Then refresh them manually once a month or something.
  • a new 1-click-install technology

    I smell a patent lawsuit with Amazon ... :-)
  • by saterdaies (842986) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:06PM (#20856135)
    knowing that Micro$oft won't sue me since I'm using an MS approved Linux from Novell! :)
    • by kjj (32549) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:11PM (#20856217)
      Actually you can still be sued if you just download a copy because you are not a Novell customer. The coverage does not extend to anyone outside of those paying Novell for a support, not even developers who contribute to the Novell code base.
      • Re: (Score:2, Flamebait)

        by marcello_dl (667940)
        I'd add that unfortunately openSuse is a distro that is more likely to contain lawsuit material from MS. With all the respect for the achievements of openSuse team, i'm not touching it.
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by hasbeard (982620)
      Actually, I don't think OpenSuse is covered by this agreement.
      • The comment was actually meant as a joke, but it's good to see people taking it seriously :) Just wanted to get a little dig in at Novell.
        • by BokLM (550487) *
          I guess the people who answer understood it was a joke. But a comment that say something wrong, even if it is a joke, still says something wrong.
  • ok (Score:3, Interesting)

    by User 956 (568564) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:06PM (#20856139) Homepage
    Promoting the use of Linux everywhere, the openSUSE project provides free, easy access to the world's most usable Linux distribution, openSUSE.

    That's an interesting statement. Is there a distribution that aims to hinder the use of Linux everywhere?
  • Sneak peak (Score:4, Funny)

    by $RANDOMLUSER (804576) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:07PM (#20856149)
    How do you sneak a mountain?
    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by maxwell demon (590494)

      How do you sneak a mountain?
      You walk on it with sneakers?
    • How do you sneak a mountain?
      Easy. You swap its name with some other mountain. Then tell people you snuck both mountains into each other's place. No one will have observed you sneaking either mountain, so your sneaking skills will be proved superior.
  • Sneak peak? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by rrohbeck (944847) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:07PM (#20856151)
    Is that a peak that sneaks up on you? Like a volcano or something?
    • Wanna bet the spell checker caught "sneek" before the article was posted?

      (my karma's finally excellent...just kidding Zonk!)
  • 21% (Score:2, Informative)

    21% downloaded already. Thought I am considering switching from the x86_64 version to the 32-bit version this time. My only really solid reason for this is the lack of a 64-bit Java browser plugin, and I don't even use it that much (but the kids like Runescape, so qhat can I do).
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by ericrost (1049312)
      Ubuntu gutsy has a 64 bit flash and java.. I was surprised it wasn't advertised in the new features (as they didn't have adobe flash for 64 bit in feisty). Come on in, the water's fine.
      • I've been toying with the idea of going to Kubuntu for a while but I haven't had the inclination at the right time :)

        It isn't that 64-bit Java doesn't work, it's that there's no plugin for a 64-bit browser. This is even a problem on Windows XP x64 (the red-headed step-child of XP). I could, supposedly, install a 32-bit version of Firefox and use the 32-bit Java plugin but I didn't get that working.

        I did discover that 64-bit Konqueror somehow figured out how to run Java applets (though there's no sound
  • The little Giver app looks nice. If I had a new network to set up, I would consider this distro for all the clients, 20 barebone machines with OpenSuse installed and maybe Google Apps for a suite - simplicity!

  • by apokryphos (869208) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:15PM (#20856289) Homepage
    The Sneak Peek linked to is only the final one in the series, there was many more:
  • by GroundBounce (20126) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @03:29PM (#20856499)
    Does this violate any Amazon patents?
  • Damn, what's with the blue plastic window borders?
    I won't say anything else on the account of flaming or trolling, but damn. Fisher-price?
    Please note that my home is MS Windows-free. (3 OS X, and 1 Linux)
  • SUSE has always been good at providing Torrents of the CD and DVD ISOs, but I was wondering if there's a torrent of the installation repository available? I prefer to dump the install repository on one server somewhere, then net-install all my other machines, but I've always had to mirror with wget -r, and I'd rather torrent the lot...

    ... as in, a torrent for the entire tree of RPMs and stuff, not for an ISO file?
    • by wwrmn (42399)
      It's simple:

      1) Torrent DVD
      2) mount -oloop DVD.iso /mnt/cdrom
      3) cp -ar /mnt/cdrom/* /path_you_want

      Viola! You have a net installation depot.

      Unless I'm missing something...

      • by NoseyNick (19946)
        I meant the "repo/oss" and "repo/non-oss" trees used by net installs.
        No, they're not the same as the DVDs, though I'll concede there's a fair bit of overlap.
  • How can they provide MP3 support out-of-the-box? Does it mean that they can't distribute their distro in the US?
    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by wile_e_wonka (934864)
      It doesn't provide MP3 support out of the box--that was misleading. The first time you try to play an MP3, Amarok says, "You currently can't play this file. Would you like to downloa MP3 support? Yes / No" or something along those lines. So really it's one step away from MP3 support out of the box. The difference looks like a legal fiction to me, but it is technically not shipped with an MP3 codec.
      • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

        by eimikion (973712)
        Not true. There is a gst-fluendo-mp3-2.7.rpm package on the goldmaster DVD. MP3 playback works out of the box. Eat this, american law system.
    • Actually, I was quite surprised when I installed Debian Etch in a VM the other day, and found gst-plugins-ugly installed by default -- including, of course, MP3 support. I know that Debian has a non-US repository, but I cannot remember choosing to download an explicit non-US DVD.

      I've no idea how it works legally, though.

  • by eimikion (973712) on Thursday October 04, 2007 @04:20PM (#20857427)

    I've just installed a new OpenSUSE. All these little bugs from previous releases are gone. Yast software installer finally works with a good speed. Desktop responsiveness is amazing - KDE 3.7 works faster than GUI of Windows 2000. The default green artwork is very nice and gives a distinct feeling to this distro. Hardware detection is very good. My graphic card - nvidia 7600 and audio card - Creative Audigy 2 were working out of the box. Even installation of ADSL modem was a breeze - it is a cheap Sagem modem, used by the all telcos controlled by France Telecom, and most linux distros has problems with it.

    What is especially important to people in countries with stupid law (read USA) - OpenSUSE gives you mp3 playback out of box, due to legal fluendo gstreamer plugins. In addition, there are provided Flash 9, newest Java runtimes, RealPlayer and seamless Wi-Fi support.

    In the last year I've tried quite a few linux distros - Fedora, Ubuntu, Sabayon, Mint, Mandriva... nothing even come close to the OpenSUSE. Quality of Deutsch engineering.

    • You said you have tried quite a few linux distros, among them Ubuntu, and you claim nothing comes even close to OpenSUSE.

      What, then, are the big advantages of OpenSUSE over Ubuntu? I know both distros, and I do not see that clear superiority of OpenSUSE. I think both distros have their respective strengths and weaknesses.

      So why do you disagree and think that OpenSUSE is a clear winner?
  • I recently overlayed my laptop installation of SuSE with Ubuntu Feisty because of problems I had with YaST. YaST update performance was so slow and unreliable I gave up and started using the various SuSE yum repositories. That worked pretty well for me for a while, and I certainly appreciated the good multimedia support in SuSE. About the only thing I didn't like was lack of usable ACPI with my laptop.

    However a couple of weeks ago the bubble burst. A yum upgrade pulled in some new packages, a kernel and so
    • by NoseyNick (19946)

      As far as I am concerned the problems I had with YaST plus the obvious quality of apt-get etc. have made me an Ubuntu convert.

      The problems with YaST are allegedly fixed. Personally I'm in the exact opposite situation as you, whereby I tried switching from SUSE to Ubuntu on one of my laptops and I'm now bitterly regretting it and will almost certainly now switch it to SUSE 10.3. Ubuntu seemed to be vastly slower for "most things", whereas SUSE was only slow for YaST package-management (allegedly now fixed,

      • I did not need any additional Ubuntu repositories to get Java or Flash. These are available from the base Ubuntu repository. My WiFi function also uses a proprietary Intel firmware load and was supported using the basic installation. The only non-base repository I am using is to support multimedia.

        While as you say package management is not a daily activity, if it doesn't work properly you can become hosed like I was because it is such a fundamental piece of a modern Linux distribution. As far as YaST being
  • I don't realy care how they do it, f I can download it, or need to buy a box of the shelve, but I would like it if somehow SuSE came with DVD support. My Medion laptop I bought 1.5 years ago has a separate linux partition with a DVD player. It boots when you push a special "play DVD" button, without running Windows & friends. Even comes with the source for the kernel and other stuff that's on there, not the DVD players software though.
    But my conclusion is, that commercial closed source DVD playing softw
  • This is simply the most useable Linux distribution I have ever tried. I highly recommend new Linux users to check out this release :)
  • I've used Windows all my life and I'm wondering which desktop would be the one for me (Gnome or KDE). I realize there are differences, I'm just not sure what they are, and what can be easily overcome simply by installing the software into the other desktop.

    Also I'm wondering whether openSuse or Fedora is more newbie friendly (again not meant as flamebait!). Having looked at the two websites, openSuse certainly seems to have the better features, however the Fedora website is certainly inferior to the openSus
    • by NoseyNick (19946)

      I've used Windows all my life and I'm wondering which desktop would be the one for me (Gnome or KDE). I realize there are differences, I'm just not sure what they are, and what can be easily overcome simply by installing the software into the other desktop.

      There's license differences, which most people won't care about, there's graphical differences, but either one is so configurable it can be configured to look a lot like the other. Apps from one will run pretty seamlessly in the other if you have both s

      • Thanks, I'll have to give Suse a try. It seems like its much easier then the last distro I tried (and yes muds are still telnet based. I just included it to be exhaustive ;)).
        • by orcrist (16312)
          I just wanted to add one more tip to all that great advice from the GP:
          Forget the FAT32 partition. There is a pretty decent ext2 driver for Windows [] now, and SuSE installs everything as ext3 by default, which can be mounted as ext2.

          Just to be clear, ext3 is the journaled version of ext2, so you can access your Linux partitions using that, with the caveat that it will not be journaled when using it in windows (i.e. make sure to force a file-system check in Linux if Windows doesn't end cleanly). Another proble
  • I love SuSE, it's my favorite distro.. But I just find the linux community funny sometimes.. Case in point.. 'MP3 support out of the box.' Come on people that should have been an 'out of the box.' feature in 2000. This is 07' And people wonder why MS still sells their OS.
    • by NoseyNick (19946)
      This isn't a programming problem, it's a silly licensing / patent / legal problem...
      ... and only really in the US, in fact.

"The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was." -- Walt West