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Linux Kernel Bugzilla Launched 187

Posted by CowboyNeal
from the bug-zapper-kernel-trapper dept.
paskie writes "Martin J. Bligh of IBM announced launch of a Bugzilla bug tracking database for 2.5 linux kernel series - it's at bugme.osdl.org. Finally there will be some possibility to easily keep track of known bugs without being subscribed to thousand of mailing lists or googling to death. According to the relevant lkml thread, kernel developers will still prefer discussions to happen on the mailing lists, though. The Bugzilla server and connection is donated by OSDL and IBM folks administer the database."
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Linux Kernel Bugzilla Launched

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  • by DetrimentalFiend (233753) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @08:57PM (#4673782)
    "Please let me or the supplied mailto URLs know of any problems you encounter, but please be patient with any inital teething problems
    and don't tell slashdot just yet ;-)"

    Another server bites the dust.
  • Why? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 14, 2002 @08:58PM (#4673788)
    If the developers are still going to prefer the mailing lists, why set up a bugzilla for it? Now there's just one more place to check for bugs. This would only be good if it were going to be used as the only place for reporting bugs. As it is, it'll probably just be an annoyance.
    • Re:Why? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:00PM (#4673810)
      Yeah... easily searchable, centralised sources of information suck.
    • Re:Why? (Score:2, Informative)

      I think they were referring to discussions regarding the bugs. Not the list itself.
    • Re:Why? (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Kourino (206616)
      Who said the developers are going to prefer the mailing lists? A lot of people have expressed interest about this on lkml. And a lot of people seem to have already signed up for accounts on the thing.

      Oh and by the way, the original message said not to submit to slashdot, paskie, you insensitive clod :P That was the only thing holding back my kerneltrap article ...
    • Dude, don't be so impatient. Perhaps this resource will convince some kernel developers to use it instead of whatever else they were using. But it takes time, and you have to start somewhere!
    • Re:Why? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by iabervon (1971)
      This will be useful for tracking bugs ("So did anybody ever fix that problem with that weird hardware? Did the patch for it ever get into the tree, or did it just go to the person who reported it?"), as opposed to reporting and discussing bugs. That's why it was set up now, when work is supposed to turn to stabilization.
  • First Bug! (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 14, 2002 @08:58PM (#4673790)

    Linux's implementation of TCP/IP successfully connects to goatse.cx:80

    Expected result : connection attempt should be rejected.
  • Still responsive? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by RollingThunder (88952) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:04PM (#4673833)
    I'm impressed. The Mozilla bugzilla normally falls over the moment /. looks it's way, which is why it denies a slashdot referral now (if I remember correctly).

    Either it's just the fact this one's basically empty at the moment, or he may have some advice for the mozilla folks on properly setting up bugzilla. :)
    • IBM Hosting (Score:5, Interesting)

      by bstadil (7110) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:39PM (#4674039) Homepage
      The other day Slashdot had a story about the Lightest of the Linux [slashdot.org]that were hosted and managed by IBM. There were not even a slight delay in getting the story at any time. Same here. IBM knows how to do these things.
    • Re:Still responsive? (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      The site www.osdl.org is running Apache/1.3.22 (Unix) (Red-Hat/Linux) mod_perl/1.24_01 mod_ssl/2.8.5 OpenSSL/0.9.6 DAV/1.0.2 PHP/4.0.6 on Linux.
    • Re:Still responsive? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by asa (33102)
      bugzilla.mozilla.org doesn't "fall over" but thousands of slashdot readers loading bugs slows things down for the people trying to do actual work.

      --Asa
    • Slashdot typically links to individual bugs, not to the main page.

      Loading the index page has 0 DB hits if you're not logged in (Well, once an hour it'll run stuff, but....)

      Also, its probably a more powerful machine.
  • Bugs (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:16PM (#4673911)
    Many coders are disinclined to use bugs, because they don't necessarily improve code speed.

    Whether or not bugs will accelerate any particular program has to be determined
    case-by-case. And for most software, the deciding factor should be whether bugs
    will simplify development and correctness (theoretically they can, but lots of
    developers don't understand bugs and use them wrong).

    My company has some realtime networked game for which bugs were an impediment.
    Both the rate/duration of screen refreshs and network transmissions were low
    enough so they didn't usually interfere with each other in the same bug. But
    using bug-safe versions of standard library functions was degrading every other
    part of the program with constant locking/unlocking.

    So no bugs was faster. (Maybe cleverer people could've made special bug-unsafe
    alternative functions to use in contexts where we know inter-bug race conditions
    won't occur. But munging around with 2 standard libraries in one program is
    riskier than we'd like to deal with)
  • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:17PM (#4673921)
    Now maybe it could use a name. How about
    Tux-zilla?
  • by joenobody (72202) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:20PM (#4673936)
    Bug 30 [osdl.org] Owner: mbligh@aracnet.com (Martin J. Bligh)

    Please enter
    Exact Kernel version: 2.5.7
    Distribution: red hat
    Hardware Environment: pc
    Software Environment: linux
    Problem Description: RMS is too smelly - What do I do?

    Steps to reproduce: No god no!!!
  • by illsorted (12593) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:25PM (#4673962)
    I think the 2.5 kernel is about ready for launch.

    Just need to clear up this last bug [osdl.org].
    • My favorite "political" bug is in the Abiword's bugzilla: Please remove Jane Swift from Tinderbox [abisource.com]. Quote:
      Please remove Massachusetts governor Jane Swift from Tinderbox! It's just silly, especially the comment! Who's next? GWB? Natali Portman? goatse.cx guy? I suggest disabling those pictures at all - they are too easy to abuse and nobody seems to clean them up.
  • And in tomorrow's news, the new Bugzilla that people hoped would allow them to track bugs in the Linux kernel disappears off the net after being slashdotted to death. ;)

    Well, all kidding aside, let's hope it will be a great tool to help in development of Linux.
  • by Joseph Lam (61951) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:53PM (#4674107)
    This seems to me that IBM wants to get closer to the kernel bug-tracking which is very important for them to adopt and support Linux on their products, especially on the high-end side. They've got to know the kernel inside out in order to introduce Linux and provide top quality service to prestigious customers.
  • by cpaluc (559921) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @09:58PM (#4674125)
    I searched 'firewire' and it said:

    "Zarro Boogs found."
  • GCC Bugzilla? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by __Reason__ (181288) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @10:15PM (#4674192)
    Its great that the kernel is getting a bugzilla.

    However, attention must be drawn to the plight of the poor, unfortunate GCC hackers, who are still having to put up with an inferior [gnu.org] bug tracking system, despite a flurry [gnu.org] of activity [gnu.org] earlier in the year, it seems that little progress has been made on implementation. Lets all hope that GCC hackers don't have to continue to suffer the pain of crappy bug tracking for too much longer.
    • they are not using it yeat for a very good reason.....up untill recently, MOzilla was not GPLed..and so far, it is still owrking toward that goal.

      we all know how RMS is with his GPL...free or not, he wants his code to be...Free!!!
  • by puto (533470) <theflatline@yahoo.com> on Thursday November 14, 2002 @10:23PM (#4674221) Homepage
    This is too funny. IBM doing something good for the community and for themselves at the same time? Nothing wrong with at. Altruism and capitlism can go hand and hand. And I am not one to look a gift server in the mouth.

    First we have people talking about IBM doing this to control kernel developlemt. This is nuts. IBM understands that Linux is big in the cards for them and they also understand the Free As in Beer Developmental community needs to really have a central repository for this sorta thing.

    So IBM cuts loose the space and the DB for it. Throws in an admin or two. Why? Cause they got big money on Linux, they want to move the big corps over to it. So they need the assurance that bugfixes, patches, what have you, is on a reliable server somewhere that will always be around.

    Yeah it does benefit them and benefit us. More power to em. OR what we are gonna round robin the server costs every month? We are gonna set up a Paypal Account and each chip in our own unlimited funds in this street paved of gold IT industry we have now?

    IBM is a business and it sees that helping the community can help itself. QUID PRO QUO my friends.

    IBM was a monopoly, but they also make damn good equipment. Always have. You can go on about a failed run of hard drives, or some bad workstations. But hey happends to all of them...

    And this busines that IBM needs to know the kernel inside and out. Ahhh, I do not think anyone needs to be talking out there ass about us teaching IBM anything about operating systems. Much less one ending in *NIX.

    IBM is one of the best things to happen to our community. They are making the inroads in the corporate road for us.

    JEEZ. Get off the high horse people.

    TheFlatline
    • IBM is a business and it sees that helping the community can help itself. QUID PRO QUO my friends.


      Bang on. OSS is in a very strong position here. IBM knows that a) the kernel developers can always go back to the old method and b) anything they do to fuck with the kernel developers, (say, closing the database and taking all the bug listing with them) would generate some MASSIVE bad PR.


      Bref, never look a gift horse in the mouth. At the same time, never trust a corporation further than they can make money off of you.


      "For you, that's paranoia. For me, it's reality!"

    • by dmiller (581) <djm AT mindrot DOT org> on Friday November 15, 2002 @01:05AM (#4674960) Homepage
      Get off the high horse people.

      Great way to finish a totally pompous rambling rant.
    • I completely agree! You couldn't have said it any better. Open source software, in this case the linux kernel, cannot be controlled by any one source. So even if IBM had less than pure motivation, they linux kernel would evolve around the problem and move on...simple as that. Though IBM does have great exerience in *NIX OSes...so I say let's except this help with open arms.
  • by Angelwrath (125723) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @10:26PM (#4674235)
    Could be a slightly silly question here - is there a Bugzilla or similar bug tracking site for Apple's OSX?
    • It's not bugzilla, but it's here [apple.com]. Requires at least a free ADC membership.
      • by scarld (626315)
        Or maybe try OpenDarwin's [opendarwin.org] bugzilla installation.
      • That's not quite the same thing. It doesn't let you search their current bugs for one thing, only report new ones and see the status of your own bugs. That strikes me as being very dumb, as it'll massively increase the number of dupes Apples developers have to contend with. It also prevents external discussion of bugs, users swapping workarounds etc.

        Honestly, a decent bugzilla is something I'm always grateful for, it makes working with developers and yes, getting your work done so much easier. I hope they don't let it get like the GNOME bugzilla however, full of bugs from years ago that were never even triaged (they are clearing it up now though).

  • by Mustang Matt (133426) on Thursday November 14, 2002 @10:30PM (#4674255)
    Geez guys! Run it through the w3c validator [w3.org]!

    We're suppossed to be promoting the standards right?
  • From an earlier /. interview:

    Talk to the IBM Linux Hackers [slashdot.org]

    IBM Kernel Hackers Respond [slashdot.org]
  • by MichaelCrawford (610140) on Friday November 15, 2002 @01:29AM (#4675035) Homepage Journal
    A few months before 2.4 was released, I proposed to develop a custom bug database for the Linux Kernel. [indiana.edu] The website I started for it is The Linux Quality Database [sunsite.dk].

    Unfortunately, the dot-com crash ensued just as I was getting started, and things have been a little too hectic since then for me to do much about it.

    A number of people suggested I use bugzilla, and I thought a lot about it, but didn't want to use it, at least not in its current form, because it lacks a feature that I feel is critical for a bug database that is to be used to track operating system development: storage of preset machine configurations.

    Perhaps the people with the new kernel bugzilla can put this in.

    What I envisisioned was a way for the user to specify the hardware configuration of their machines by drawing on a database of all known hardware. (Just making that database would be a big job in itself). The user could give a name to each configuration.

    Then when reporting a bug, the user would be presented with a popup menu or scrolling list of their configuration presets. There would be a way to make variations for a particular bug report, to indicate that a board had been added or removed from the stored preset.

    Then the user would upload their kernel .config file.

    This would allow the kernel developers to search for combinations of hardware that is or isn't installed along with kernel config options that are selected or not set.

    This would help a lot to identify situations where FooBar Corp's ethernet board doesn't work when you've got a WhizzyVideo card installed.

    I would also encourage people to report the configurations for successful kernel tests. That would help to build confidence as well as to identify untested areas so more attention could be paid to them.

    Unfortunately, I'm just a guy working alone and although some have offerred to help, I have been working too hard just to survive to even coordinate the development of such a database.

    However, I have found some time to write some articles on various aspects of Linux and web software quality [sunsite.dk] and post them at the site. Writing is what I like to do to relax when I'm not programming - I write articles like these whenever I can, despite despite what the anklebiters have to say about them [slashdot.org].

    The OSDL was kind enough to mirror my two kernel testing articles and even translate them into Japanese. You can mirror or translate them if you like, as they are under the GNU Free Documentation License. I would be particularly pleased if any of my articles were translated into more languages.

    The two kernel testing articles are:

    I should point out that I asked a couple of the larger commercial Linux vendors to contribute to the Linux Quality Database, which would have enabled me to feed myself while developing it, but I got turned down. I find that hard to understand, as it would have benefited them tremendously. I don't want to say who it was that turned me down, as I don't think negative publicity would be productive.

    But I found the OSDL's interest in my articles quite encouraging.

    A lot of people are griping about not being able to file bugs anonymously with bugzilla. I had always intended to allow anonymous bug reports, although I would encourage users to log in so we could follow up with them.

    Also some people are saying in other comments that bug reports that aren't emailed to the linux-kernel mailing lists won't be as good as the traditional ones. But I'd like to point out that linux-kernel is one of the highest traffic mailing lists around, and the discussions are extremely technical and often heated. Patches also fall on the floor all the time, as I found when someone posted a patch that fixed the problem I reported when I first subscribed.

    I felt then and still feel that linux-kernel is too intimidating for the average linux user, so most will choose not to partipate in kernel QA. A bug database with a nice web interface where the reporter doesn't have to participate in the mailing list traffic can only encourage more people to post bugs. And a bug database would make it possible to log successes without overwhelming the list.

    It would also be possible to publish an XML interface to the database, so people could log reports programmatically. That would help for identifying configuration information, for example you could run a program that would do what lspci does and upload it to your account at the bugbase.

  • Remember when Microsoft shipped W2K there was a story about 60k-something bugs that were not fixed before the release?

    Now I wonder how many unclosed bugs will be in Linux database when 2.6 is released? Will this be Microsoft's turn to laugh?

  • Correct URL? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by CwazyWabbit (610151)
    Any reason why the article points at Mozilla's in-use Bugzilla rather than the Bugzilla project page [bugzilla.org]?
  • Very nice (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Skal Tura (595728)
    More big corps support Linux, that better linux becomes if as long the corps doesn't try to control kernel development, only use the benefits of helping them.
    This is very strategic move from OSDL and IBM cause it helps a lot of linux kernel development thus getting patches faster and because kernel gets better & stabler IBM gets more systems sold with Linux.
    Besides Linux needs more corps supporting, because it's they key to Linux grow, i've found using linux a bit of hard because some corps doesn't support linux, biggest problems i've had with Linux is that my printer and scanner isn't supported and some applications what i need simply aren't there, for example Adobe Photoshop, GIMP is simply total crap when compared to Photoshop, even GIMP is very good basic image manipulation software and i prefer GIMP over Paint shop pro for example.
    Next biggest problem i had was the thing i was unable to play many games under Linux, only Quakes, Unreal tournament and few others when i'd liked to play Counter-Strike, Capitalism II etc...
    Emulating simply isn't the way to do it.
    I know it's old news that IBM supports linux but this bug tracker might help those corps which haven't done any native Linux ports before and thus some corps starts supporting Linux, and again when more software comes to Linux IBM gets more systems sold and more people start using Linux.
    I just wonder where are all those overclockers who use Linux, i found Linux way more better when i was OC'ng even i couldn't change FSB etc... by software, my old system booted fine at over 1700Mhz to Linux as under wind0ze it left me ~1670Mhz at a good day (1.33Ghz TBird air cooled)

    Oh yeah, i tried to stay on topic but i just had to say some other things also :-)
  • bug (Score:3, Funny)

    by Hard_Code (49548) on Friday November 15, 2002 @09:19AM (#4676221)
    Severity: Critical
    Subject: Bugzilla slow
    Comment: Guys, I just found out from Slashdot, but your site is really really slow. You should do something about that. To help you, I am registering a bug for each page I find to be slow.
  • How to fix Bugzilla [phrasewise.com]
    Are these concerns relevant now?

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