After Protest, Lenovo Releases BIOS For Loading Linux on Yoga 900, IdeaPad 710S (liliputing.com) 74
Lenovo received a lot of heat in September when it said the Yoga 900 and Yoga 900S hybrids would only support Windows, and not Linux. The company has now changed its stance, though there is still a catch. An anonymous reader shares a Lilputing article: But now you can install Linux, because Lenovo has released new BIOS options for those laptops. There's a bit of a catch though. Lenovo's new BIOS has an AHCI option that lets you install Linux... but if you're using the new BIOS, then Windows is not officially supported. In fact, Lenovo says it's not officially supporting the new BIOS either... if you want to install it, you're pretty much on your own if you run into any problems. While Lenovo is presenting this as an either/or solution for choosing whether you want to run Windows or Linux. But some users have discovered that it is possible to set up dual-boot system using the new BIOS, allowing you to choose between Windows and Linux when your computer boots.
Re:Real Reason (Score:4, Informative)
So according to your brilliant analyses, a hardware vendor offering a piece of hardware that Linux did not support was a plot by Microsoft? I say 'did not support' because now Linux does support it, and there is no need to mess with the BIOS.
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Uh, no. This had absolutely nothing to do with secure boot. The laptops in question had an SSD controller from Intel. Linux could not see the controller when it was in RAID mode. The BIOS did not provide a way to turn off RAID mode, so Linux didn't see the disk. You could still boot Linux from USB, etc, which would not be possible under your wonderful conspiracy theory. Intel has now released patches for their drivers, and now Linux can see the disk. Amazing!
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Your statement is backwards. Not that linux did not support it but it did not support linux. When a vendor deliberately makes hardware incompatible with software it's not the software that is at fault. The simplest way to avoid this is of course to avoid such hardware vendors.
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What idiocy. The vendor did not 'deliberately make hardware incompatible'. They made hardware that worked for what they were selling, which was a laptop with Windows 10 installed. No, they didn't check if it would work with Linux, they were not selling Linux. They probably also did not check if it worked with any of the BSDs, or Solaris, or iOS, or Android, or AIX, or Z/OS.
Yues, the simplest way to avoid it is to not buy it. But that is not what happened, is it? No. Instead of admitting they bought t
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No, it's because systemd is shit.
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It was the Superfish [wikipedia.org] scandal. But the Lenovo shills gave you a -1 score because they are desperately trying to bury the truth.
the answer is simple.... (Score:1)
Big deal : no spyware for me, thanks. (Score:5, Insightful)
Lenovo has been caught putting spyware on its laptops.
Who in his right mind would buy any of their products ?
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on its NON BUSINESS laptops.
yes, that matters. that's a big detail you omitted (for some reason..)
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Last time I looked, they were the only ones making laptops without those goddawful shiny glossy screens (been using Thinkpads since IBM's T21).
First thing I do is format and install the OS of my choice anyway. Not that that excuses preloading crapware on their machines.
I do need a new laptop though -- would love some recommendations for Linux-friendly brands.
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If your OS of choice was any flavor of Windows since Vista, then you'd have the spyware installed at every boot. It's injected from BIOS/UEFI into Windows at every boot.
Re: Big deal : no spyware for me, thanks. (Score:1)
Asus zenbook has a non glossy screen, and though it doesn't really support linux, at least it runs quite well on it.
Intel already posted Linux source for this (Score:5, Informative)
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As it should. This was never an issue of a BIOS problem and very much a missing driver from Intel for something that their hardware should be capable of in any operating system.
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No, it's a BIOS problem. The hardware has a perfectly compatible AHCI interface. Lenovo just decided to disable it.
Sure there's a "fake raid" (i.e. no hardware, just a driver) that lenovo is pushing. What's even weirder is lenovo is pushing his on a laptop with a single drive (thus no R in RAID). On top of that it breaks compatibility with MS Windows as well, thus you have to install lenovo's version of windows.
Strange that so much effort is spent making sure users can't reinstall MS windows from micros
"consumer" vs "business" computers (Score:3)
I have been thinking about whether the distinction between "consumer" (eg IdeaPad) and "business" (eg ThinkPad) machines even makes sense. This is not even limited to Lenovo of course.
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Reminds me of an old ATA controller that had two models, that literally came off the same line, with all the same bits. One was standard ATA, the other had RAID support. There was a trick where you jumpered a connection and loaded the RAID firmware (free to download as an "update") and ta-da you have a RAID controller. Saving you about $250 in the process.
The difference between "consumer" and "Professional" systems is often window dressing. And it isn't that big of a secret.
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I mean the reason why the distinction exists in the first place though, for example PC retail price wars.
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It makes a lot of sense. A huge part of the cost of a modern laptop is case materials, as compared with the guts.
I need my business laptop (Macbook Pro) to stand up to being open and closed at a minimum of several times a day. It needs to be able to be shoved in a messenger bag that gets banged around in rental cars etc. It needs to do all this without the display hinges failing or the case fatiguing, it needs to say looking nice so clients don't think we use some old beater hardware for our work etc.
My
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I have been thinking about whether the distinction between "consumer" (eg IdeaPad) and "business" (eg ThinkPad) machines even makes sense. This is not even limited to Lenovo of course.
For Lenovo it makes sense. The consumer parts are the ones that are complete crap and loaded with cramware and spyware. The pro-lines are the good ones, and for actual professionals (only other companies pro-lines).
Re:"consumer" vs "business" computers (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure it does. The goals differ in several important ways.
Cost: A "Consumer" laptop has to be as cheap as possible. Under $500 preferably. A business laptop can cost a lot more ($1500-2000) as long as you focus on what business users care about - small, lightweight, etc. Also, use higher quality materials that can withstand mobile use.
Accessories: Business laptops are generally purchased en masse, or at least purchased alongside similar models. Thus, if you have a line that share accessories like docking stations, adapters, batteries, power cables, etc, this simplifies IT departments inventory, etc. Consumer laptops don't generally require docking stations so you can get rid of those and the only things require standard ports.
Features: Business laptops need management features - remote management, inventorying, etc. Consumer laptops generally don't, though a LoJack option might be desirable,but optional.
Operating System: Business laptops generally run a stable Windows - Windows 7 is typical. Consumer laptops generally run the latest since that's what all the splashy advertising shows, so they'd ship with Windows 10. (Windows 7 is typically a Windows 10 downgrade license). In addition, business laptops may be used by people in a company who don't necessarily run Windows, so alternate OS support is desirable, like Linux.
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Mind you my knowledge is from some years ago but there was a very important reason for the difference. Consistency. When a company produced a busines line they committed to using the same parts in every machine. The consumer line can be a mixup of components since they're standalone machines. But having a thousand of the same
Makes it sound like a bad thing? (Score:5, Insightful)
but if you're using the new BIOS, then Windows is not officially supported.
They make it sound like it's a bad thing. But if one wanted to support Linux, why would one be interested in Windows? Laptops nowadays are inexpensive enough that if one had to, one could buy a separate laptop for Windows. In fact, given the way some Windows 10 updates have disrupted dual boot capabilities, I'd say that the only safe way of doing things would be to have completely separate laptops for Windows and Linux/BSD. Screw this whole business of dual booting, and dedicate complete systems for either platform
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I think the point is that they didn't officially test it with Windows, which is a bad thing.
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Fuck that. Separate disks / arrays with power on passwords.
On boot only supply the password to the drive you want to power up, be it Windows or Linux.
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Many 15" and larger laptops have space for multiple 2.5" drives. Often you give up the optical bay to do it.
You also have the option of doing embedded SD/USB storage as well. Running your secondary OS off of a good micro SD card or one of them tiny USB drives permanently attached to the mobo is an option.
Hmmmmm (Score:3, Funny)
"Lenovo's new BIOS has an AHCI option that lets you install Linux... but if you're using the new BIOS, then Windows is not officially supported."
Lenovo: "ARE WE NOT MERCIFUL?"
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They are providing a workaround for an INTEL PROBLEM.
Linux the OS that has the best hardware support in the world. .... except when Intel decides it won't show the OS your HDD in one of the modes the chipset can operate under.
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Irrelevant. It was a lack of an Intel driver for an Intel chipset which performs a common function selectable in the BIOS that prevented this.
Stop excusing Intel for not providing a complete set of drivers and hampering functionality under Linux just because you could otherwise run your computer using a subset of the available hardware features. We complain about lack of performance of graphics drivers between Windows and Linux, we complain about not having 100% open source in that scenario. Why give a free
Re:Too much work (Score:5, Informative)
Yeah I suspect in the near future you will get a virus or maybe some ransomware or just a crud filled slow system and you will be thinking about tjos while your stress level with skyrockets.
At home I have made the switch to a linux only lifestyle... one machine still has a dual boot. I rarely ever boot back into to windows and I don't have to mess with malware bytes, mcaffee, etc. And when it is time for a new OS upgrade I can do this in couple of hours with yum or apt-get to install all my tools.
For new shiny toy. For enterprise, the opposite (Score:3)
> hardware that doesn't work properly on Linux
I use four different models of RAID cards, from two different manufacturers. I'm fairly sure neither is supported by Windows 10, and all will be supoorted by Linux for another ten years. That's true of a lot of hardware I use, but I use heavy-duty hardware, not some toy from Best Buy.
If your interest is in the latest new toy from Best Buy, Windows has a slight advantage. For serious, big boy hardware that you plan to use for many years, Linux has a HUGE ad
Magnusson-Moss? (Score:1)
It sounds like they're tying warranty for a third party thing (Windows) to their stuff.
Keep buying... (Score:2, Troll)
This is the sort of thing that happens when a company that had malware and rootkits on it's BIOS reported multiple times don't get enough of a financial backlash to get a hint.
http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/n... [makeuseof.com]
Protip guys: DON'T BUY STUFF FROM LENOVO.
Just don't buy. It's simple. Lenovo is not an option, period.
They couldn't care less about clients protests, as long as they keep selling their crap filled laptops.
If you buy stuff from them, you'll get what you deserve.
There have been enough warnings already. T
no choice for you! (Score:2)
some users have discovered that it is possible to set up dual-boot system>/I>
Giving paying customers a choice? That's a bug and will be fixed in the next release of the BIOS.
If you actually want a choice you might consider grabbing the BIOS now while you can before you need it.
Sheesh (Score:2)
Assholes!
What manner of company would tie themselves to the company that has killed the computer market?.
Stupid people buy Lenovo/Apple/Dell/Sony/Toshiba (Score:1)
This isn't the only issue with Lenovo. These companies are utilizing digital restrictions to prevent users from doing things like replacing there wifi card with ones that are properly supported under GNU/Linux. If people stopped buying from these companies we'd actually have some better options in the GNU/Linux world for laptops. Until then we'll suffer at the hands of shitty corporations and be second class citizens. All because the majority are too stupid to recognize the damage its doing to our ability t
curso NR 10 (Score:1)