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Windows 8 Features With Linux Antecedents 642

Posted by timothy
from the all-stolen-from-vannevar-bush dept.
itwbennett writes "As details about new features in Windows 8 started to be discussed in the Building 8 blog and bandied about in Linux/Windows forums, Linux users were quick to chime in with a hearty 'Linux had that first' — even for things that were just a natural evolution, like native support for USB 3.0. So ask not 'did Linux have this first', but 'does Windows 8 do it better?'"
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Windows 8 Features With Linux Antecedents

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  • by eldavojohn (898314) * <eldavojohn&gmail,com> on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:40PM (#38998197) Journal

    The Microsoft twist: No Linux distro does ISO mounting as easily as Windows 8, as it requires some command line trickery (or, again, third-party tools).

    Here's your "command line trickery" (once you've gotten superuser):

    mkdir -p /mnt/iso
    mount -o loop image.iso /mnt/iso

    Did you see that trickery? Someone call the pope, I'm well on my way to sainthood after that "miracle." Hahah that's funny though, this guy should see some of the command line paragraphs I've typed out for stuff like ffmpeg back in the day. I think the author doesn't understand that there are many linux machines that are servers or headless and many distros that love to leave you the option of not having to run a window manager. As a result, it's almost always up to you if you want to run a heavy GUI to execute two whole commands.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by MrEricSir (398214)

      Right, because there's absolutely nothing arcane or overly complex about having to open a terminal window, read a bunch of man pages, and then issue two commands with various flags just to mount a disk image.

      • by Microlith (54737) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:53PM (#38998387)

        Not for anyone who has bothered to learn how to use their computer. But then, that's just one way to do it on modern Linux distributions, which now simplify the process by letting you right click and mount the volume.

        And has since the days I was using Daemon Tools on Windows.

        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by Anonymous Coward

          Not for anyone who has bothered to learn how to use their computer.

          Learning to use your computer should *NOT* require knowledge of shell command flags. The very attitude that it should, is why its so bloody hard to hire good product people. Not coders, not sysadmins, people who actually get users and what they want. (Also explains the huge salary gap seen in the IT world)

          • by RCL (891376) <(moc.liamg) (ta) (gvv.sr.lcr)> on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:22PM (#38998757) Homepage
            That is why KDE and Gnome make this stuff easier. But there SHOULD be a way to do everything with shell commands, for users who are willing to learn them. Without that, I just don't have the feeling that I'm in control of the machine.

            BTW, Windows actually has plenty of command line tools (made by Microsoft) which allow you to script much more than one might think without ever touching the GUI. Too bad a lot of the said tools aren't included by default and need to be searched for in various * Kit packages from Microsoft.
            • by StikyPad (445176) on Friday February 10, 2012 @05:06PM (#38999457) Homepage

              To be fair, mount and its ilk are more complicated than they need to be. The flags and path should be optional, and the default behavior should be to detect the FS type where possible and mount in /mnt/volumename as read-only, creating the folder if necessary. This is the behavior that the majority of people want the majority of the time, and "mount image.iso" should accomplish that automatically. Commands without default behavior are like doorknobs that don't return to center because hey, *someone* might not want the door to latch after they close it. Conform to desired/expected functionality with as little user input as possible by default and let actual power users handle the corner cases.

              • by rev0lt (1950662) on Friday February 10, 2012 @06:24PM (#39000547)
                Considering the commands were about mounting an ISO file, why the hell would I want 1) mount to automatically detect a filesystem inside a file; 2) mount it as read-only on a predefined location? I actually sometimes use files as raw devices for writing (for example, if I need to demonstrate how ZFS resiliency works, a couple of files and mount allows me to quicly show how it works instead of having to use physical devices)?
                Every mainstream linux distro with gnome/kde will automagically mount a recognized device on a predefined location without any user intervention, and creating folders as necessary. I'm no expert, but not only Linux's udev seems to work quite well (and recognize a lot more filesystems than Windows), but automounter has been available for ages in almost all modern/relevant unix operating systems.
                • by shutdown -p now (807394) on Friday February 10, 2012 @06:42PM (#39000765) Journal

                  Considering the commands were about mounting an ISO file, why the hell would I want 1) mount to automatically detect a filesystem inside a file; 2) mount it as read-only on a predefined location?

                  Because that's what 99% of people who are mounting an ISO file need.

                  I actually sometimes use files as raw devices for writing (for example, if I need to demonstrate how ZFS resiliency works, a couple of files and mount allows me to quicly show how it works instead of having to use physical devices)?

                  For that kind of thing, you'd use additional parameters. His point was that the default should be to automatically do whatever is most reasonable for most users. If you know better, by all means, use your knowledge to specify the exact switches in advance.

                  • by rev0lt (1950662)
                    The point is that not everyone uses mount the same way. Most modern linux distros with GUI usually allow the mounting of ISO files without recurring to the commandline, and they even create the appropriate temporary mountpoint folders as needed. Most users that are actually aware of mount funcionality probably don't need it to guess automagically the file format, but need it to be consistent and allow a certain degree of freedom.
                    My ZFS example is a good one - automatic filesystem detection could expose the
                • by StikyPad (445176) on Friday February 10, 2012 @06:54PM (#39000915) Homepage

                  I actually sometimes use files as raw devices for writing (for example, if I need to demonstrate how ZFS resiliency works, a couple of files and mount allows me to quicly show how it works instead of having to use physical devices)?

                  Thanks, I don't think I could find a better example of a corner case if I tried.

                  • by rev0lt (1950662)
                    And how conveniently you ignore most desktop Linux distros actually allow you to mount ISOs without recurring to the commandline or being a privileged user. But hey, don't let facts interfere with your rant against mount.
              • by makomk (752139)

                There's various standard programs like pmount that do that for removable media already, but ISO mounting is a bit more obscure and quite often you genuinely do want to specify a specific directory where it should be mounted.

          • by bmo (77928) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:27PM (#38998815)

            Right, because the command line is so unimportant that Microsoft came up with an entirely new command shell called PowerShell and OSX has full-on bash.

            You know, the two major OSes pointed at consumer idiots have powerful shells. Go figure.

            --
            BMO

            • by kelemvor4 (1980226) on Friday February 10, 2012 @05:05PM (#38999441)

              Right, because the command line is so unimportant that Microsoft came up with an entirely new command shell called PowerShell and OSX has full-on bash.

              You know, the two major OSes pointed at consumer idiots have powerful shells. Go figure.

              -- BMO

              Optional for power users who want them, not required for simple tasks like mounting an image where a mouse click will do.

              • by AliasMarlowe (1042386) on Friday February 10, 2012 @05:41PM (#38999995) Journal

                Optional for power users who want them, not required for simple tasks like mounting an image where a mouse click will do.

                And that's the way it's been on almost any Linux distribution, for quite a while. On Ubuntu 10.04, I just right click on an ISO file and select the mount option. Then it appears as a new drive on the desktop. It works about the same, whether you're using a Gnome desktop, or KDE, or LXDE, or xfce. Probably also on other desktop environments or window managers, but those are the ones I'm familiar with.

                Of course, with Linux, you can ALSO do it via the command line. This is very useful on a headless (no GUI) machine, which Windows curiously lacks support for.

              • by Rennt (582550) on Friday February 10, 2012 @09:30PM (#39002273)

                Even in Windows land, it is the GUI that is optional. The shell is always there - you can poke at it through a GUI like some terminally obese person with a dialling wand, or you can just use it directly.

                Server 2008 doesn't even install a GUI by default.

            • by hairyfeet (841228)
              Fallacy number 364- A program developed for a completely different purpose counts no matter what! In reality though PS is a SERVER program designed for SERVERS and used by these things called ADMINS that are actually paid real money to learn these things! Now I have been building and selling computers since before there ever was a Windows and you know what i've never seen? I've never seen powershell installed on a desktop and I've certainly never seen any OEM include it. but I've seen a ton of Linux distros
          • by Microlith (54737) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:28PM (#38998835)

            Learning to use your computer should *NOT* require knowledge of shell command flags.

            It should if you want to be considered proficient. It shouldn't be required for basic day to day operations, as I noted. But go on, be an angry anonymous coward.

          • by Kenja (541830) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:44PM (#38999109)
            Learning to use a computer should *NOT* require knowledge of mice and keyboards. The computer should know what I want it to do and just do it. I shouldn't even have to plug it in (electricity is dangerous!).
          • by NoobixCube (1133473) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:45PM (#38999119) Journal

            Learning to use your computer certainly SHOULD require familiarising yourself with your chosen platforms command line. The very idea that it shouldn't is why it'sso bloody rare to find an "average" user who knows how to do more than hit Play in iTunes. Not that it even involves the command line, do you know how many customers I have who don't know how to install software in Windows? This is simple, Computer Literacy 101 stuff. I learned how to use computers back when they were actually hard to use (though people who learned before I did, would probobaly look at my cosy DOS prompt and wish they'd learned there), these days there's no excuse for not having some basic and essential skills, yet every time I dare say we coddle the users, and that the problem is user education, NOT the programming and design, I'm told I'm being elitist. If a grown man with no intellectual disabilities couldn't work out how to use a spoon, and got cereal everywhere, would you blame the bowl, the spoon, the cereal, or him? I'd blame him just a bit, for not seeking out some user education. I'm sure a copy of Spoons for Dummies can't cost that much.

          • by Bert64 (520050) <bert@@@slashdot...firenzee...com> on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:48PM (#38999179) Homepage

            As someone else already pointed out, you *can* use the gui to mount an iso if you want.

            If i was explaining to someone how to mount an iso, i would probably explain the command line way because its easier... Someone could simply cut+paste the command that were posted here, whereas explaining a gui is much harder in a textual or vocal setting.

            It's very important that both options be available, so that people can choose which method they want to use.

          • by Culture20 (968837) on Friday February 10, 2012 @05:06PM (#38999445)

            Learning to use your computer should *NOT* require knowledge of shell command flags.

            Yes it should. Whenever someone wants to do something ridiculously repetitive with say, OpenOffice - converting thousands of documents into pdfs, I show up with my "magical powers" and open a terminal window, and convert them all into pdfs. Because they don't bother to learn something simple (command line basics, or just %*&^ing Google), they would have either wasted hours of their time manually converting the docs, or wasted money hiring a person to manually convert the docs. As it is, I suppose they wasted a little money, because they had me do something they should have been able to do for themselves.

            • by Missing.Matter (1845576) on Friday February 10, 2012 @06:14PM (#39000413)
              Wait... someone paid you to do something you are good at that they are not good at.... and you're pissed off about this? Isn't this the way society functions? I pay someone to bake my bread because I don't know how to do it and they are better at me. Does the baker turn around and say "Wow, what a fucking moron that guy is. Doesn't he see how easy it is to bake his own damn bread?" Why do geeks seem to be the only people with this attitude?
              • by Culture20 (968837)

                Wait... someone paid you to do something you are good at that they are not good at.... and you're pissed off about this?

                I'm pissed that my job, which used to be less user-based, is slowly migrating into butt-wiping; something degrading and unnecessary. Would you be happy exploiting illiterate folk if you're the only one who knows how to read? Doesn't it make it worse when they refuse to try to read?

      • by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:58PM (#38998453)

        Or you could click on it in Gnome/Nautilus (and probably whatever file manager KDE uses), but don't let that get in your way of your rant.

      • by sjames (1099)

        It's certainly no more arcane than having to learn which squashed bug you have to click.

        On the other hand, I can just right click the iso in the GUI and open it with the archive manager as if it was a directory. It just depends of if you like GUI or command line.

        Bottom line, it doesn't matter if you prefer GUI or CLI, Linux has had it covered for years.

      • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

        by s.petry (762400)

        KDE has build in point click for those to retarded to know the benefits of using the command line. I believe Gnome has an add on as well, but I hate Gnome so don't care if it does.

        Look, even Microsoft started realizing (15 years to late) the benefits and power of the command line vs. depending on a GUI for everything that's done. Hence they released "Power Shell".

        It is always refreshing to see an idiot fan boy that thinks it's hard to do things without a GUI though, so thanks for the laugh!

      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        by Hatta (162192)

        We all speak English. That's pretty fucking arcane and complex. "mount -o loop image.iso /mountpoint" isn't any more arcane and complex than "loopback mount this image here".

        And it's more convenient than using the GUI. Since you're managing files, you probably have a terminal open already. So it's really just a matter of typing the mount command. You don't even have to take your hands off the keyboard.

        • by Missing.Matter (1845576) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:33PM (#38998919)

          loopback mount this image here

          For most people, every word you said except "this" and "here" is gibberish.

          You don't even have to take your hands off the keyboard.

          For most people, the productivity bottleneck isn't the time spent moving hands to and from the keyboard; it's having to memorize 1000 commands to use the damn thing. rm, ls, cd, cp, grep, etc. and all their associated flags are not easy for most people. The one I get tripped up on the most is renaming a folder. I want to rename, so is it rn? No it's mv... but I'm not moving it so that's confusing. How about copying a directory? cp is for one file, I guess I need a flag for more, which was it again? and do I type the source first or the destination first? And what about naming conflicts? I guess if I want to deal with those I need to know some more flags...

          This is going to go through your head every time if you're anything but an expert. And guess what, not everyone wants to be an expert. People use computers as tools and GUIs help them do that more effectively. I don't need to know the inner workings of a drill, I just know I press the button and the bit turns. Likewise, I don't need to know all the features of cp or mv by memorizing the man page. I just click and drag or right click rename and I'm done.

          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            by Hatta (162192)

            For most people, the productivity bottleneck isn't the time spent moving hands to and from the keyboard; it's having to memorize 1000 commands to use the damn thing.

            You could say the same thing about the English language. If complexity was a barrier, we'd all be pointing and grunting. But it turns out that the human brain has evolved for language, because language is empowering. Learing shell syntax is similarly empowering.

      • by Medievalist (16032) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:06PM (#38998549)

        Wow, that sounds hard! You have to do all that? Windows 8 must really suck!!!

        In modern linux distributions, if there's an ISO on the media, it appears the same as any other container object, except the icon's a shiny CD looking disc instead of a manila folder. You click on it like any other container object, say for example a folder or an archive file, and it opens.

        Why do you use windows if it makes you do all that crap?

      • Things you mount aren't located in /mount, no it is /mnt. Ahh well that is so easy, I can't believe it didn't know that right off the top of my head!

        That's what makes the *NIX command line even worse as a tool (not saying the Windows command line is better, but you needn't use it) is that commands are all kinds of random abbreviations. You can't make the argument with a straight face that it is "intuitive" or people can "use commands that seem natural." You don't list directories, you ls them, you don't put

        • by Jorl17 (1716772)
          While I understand your point of view, most of these things can be changed. Many of my user programs go in a ~/bin folder. I can have aliases for ls (in fact I do; I am ware that it still means that ls is the actual command). I rarely ever mount stuff at /mnt, just because it is a plain old directory, with no particular implications.
          Again, I kind of agree with you, but that isn't different to Windows. Your personal stuff is in the registry, in the My Documents folder (which has been changing name recently,
      • by inhuman_4 (1294516) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:16PM (#38998669)

        Right, because there's absolutely nothing arcane or overly complex about having to open a terminal window, read a bunch of man pages, and then issue two commands with various flags just to mount a disk image.

        While yes it can be arcane to go through man pages to find out how to using things, I doubt many people do that anymore. If I need to know the command I go to google and type "Linux ${thing I want to do}" and get exactly what I need 90% of the time.

        However what I find stupid is having to run a gui to do the stupidest little thing. For example:

        Yesterday I had to print out quizzes for my students, I had 4 .doc versions of the quiz and needed 15 of each. On a gui I would have to this 4 times: 1) LibreOffice 2) Press Ctrl+P 3) Type in the number of copies. Opening LibreOffice/MS Office can be brutally slow on older machines.

        Or 1)Open terminal. 2) for i in quiz*.doc;do lp -n 15 $i;done. Now not many people would know how to do that and need to have the GUI to guide them. But for those of us who do know, not having the option of using a command line (especially for remote connections!) is dreadful. Why do I have to have so many GUIs, wizards, pop-ups, tips of the day, and other nonsense between me and the code that will send my stuff to the printer?

        And that is really the crux of the problem for me. It's not that the command line is better or the GUI is better. They each have their pros and cons. The problem is MS has crap command-line support, so when something is better done via command-line the option isn't there.

        MS is just adding insult to injury with their command line trickery comment. They claim the Win8 is better because you can mount ISOs from the GUI while on Linux you have to use the command line. Okay that is fair, but what about all of the windows versions currently available? You know, the ones where you just can't do it at all, command line or not?

        • by rjstanford (69735)

          Or 1)Open terminal. 2) for i in quiz*.doc;do lp -n 15 $i;done. Now not many people would know how to do that and need to have the GUI to guide them. But for those of us who do know, not having the option of using a command line (especially for remote connections!) is dreadful. Why do I have to have so many GUIs, wizards, pop-ups, tips of the day, and other nonsense between me and the code that will send my stuff to the printer?

          That's assuming, of course, that the lp command knows how to print a .doc format file. Its interesting to me though - that never used to be the case (its been a while since I've done command-line *nix printing though). How do you register a file format with the print daemon?

      • by Jorl17 (1716772)
        Like many have pointed out, if you get used to it and know it, it's intuitive. As an analogy, I have a friend who grew up with Linux, so whenever he reached Windows he had the same criticism, because he had to memorize all the clicks here and there, besides interpreting the arcane translations and dubious time estimates, etc, etc, etc.
        Furthermore, even though they are "3rd party", many simple applications do that with ease and without having to be tied up to a crappy monopolist OS.
    • by Osgeld (1900440)

      hm I just right click and tell it mount

    • by tscheez (71929)

      What? I can mount an ISO in F14 and GNOME with a right click. How is that not easy?

    • by gparent (1242548)

      Compare this to Right-Click -> Mount. Which is also available on some distros of Linux depending on DE and such.

      No, two lines of fucking arcane bullshit isn't ease of use. It's nerdy crap.

    • by Gaygirlie (1657131) <gaygirlie.hotmail@com> on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:01PM (#38998479) Homepage

      mkdir -p /mnt/iso
      mount -o loop image.iso /mnt/iso

      You kind of proved the author's point right there.

    • That's really a horrible example, though.

      If Win 8 can handle ISO images half as simply as WinCDEmu (Open source, too), then it's kicking Linux's ass in that regard. Double-Click on ISO, mounted. Right Click->Eject, unmounted.

      Tilting at this particular windmill might not have been the best illustration.

      [0]which I won't be updating to, so fanboy accusations to /dev/null

  • by HalAtWork (926717) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:41PM (#38998227)
    That goes for anything, but a more mature implementation will be more robust and so will the applications that support that implementation.
  • by eldavojohn (898314) * <eldavojohn&gmail,com> on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:42PM (#38998241) Journal

    As details about new features in Windows 8 started to be discussed in the Building 8 blog and bandied about in Linux/Windows forums, Linux users were quick to chime in with a hearty 'Linux had that first' — even for things that were just a natural evolution, like native support for USB 3.0.

    Perhaps they're not jeering Windows for "copying" Linux so much as they are happy to show that the flexibility and community involvement in open source is starting to surpass those closed source equivalents? Isn't that what Windows used to gain so much marketshare? Supporting everything before everyone else?

  • by pwolf (1016201) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:42PM (#38998243)
    Does it really matter?
    • by marcosdumay (620877) <marcosdumay@gmSTRAWail.com minus berry> on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:55PM (#38998411) Homepage Journal

      And what will Linux do that Windows 8 doesn't when Win8 finally gets on the market?

      Or maybe:

      When will people start to care about paying for low quality products when hight quality ones are free?

      • by Microlith (54737) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:57PM (#38998451)

        When the producer of the low quality product has coerced the hardware vendors into making it exceedingly hard, if not impossible, to install the high quality one.

      • by michrech (468134)

        When will people start to care about paying for low quality products when hight quality ones are free?

        'People', like me, will start to care when the software we run (for me it's games) run *natively* under the freely available operating systems.

        THAT is one of the biggest issues preventing 'people' from migrating to Linux.

        • by kbielefe (606566)

          Ah, the brilliant circular argument: I use windows because all my apps are windows apps. Good thing I learned English, because all the books I read are in English.

          • by rev0lt (1950662)
            Shure. Show me a photo editor that runs on Linux on a color-managed environment. Or where I can specify printer profiles for different papers supported by my expensive printer. Or a professional-grade video-editing suite that actually works (Smoke used to run on RedHat, but it seems there are no recent versions for Linux). Or a word processor that won't barf when you are editing a 10,000 page document. Or a graphical file manager with thumbnail visualization that actually works. Or a decent CAD suite (2D an
  • Meh. (Score:5, Informative)

    by zooblethorpe (686757) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:42PM (#38998245)

    I don't really see anything here worth the attention -- this really just looks like an attempt to generate traffic.

    Move along, nothing to see here.

    ...No, really. It's quite dull and profoundly uncontroversial.

  • by Monkey Angst (577685) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:45PM (#38998279) Homepage

    ISO Mounting

    It boggled my mind that even Windows 7 didn't have that. At my job, I'm the Mac tech and there are a couple of PC techs. When they're overbusy, I take some of their workload... had to do an install of Office on someone's machine, so I found a folder of ISOs on a network share, downloaded it, and...? Hmm. "I may be an idiot," I said to my colleagues, "but I can't figure out how to mount this ISO file." "Burn it," they said. "Why, how do you open it on a Mac?" "Uh... you double-click it."

    Talk about your long times coming.

    • by sohmc (595388)

      I like to say that I literally 'LOL'ed at this. I've said the same thing a number of times about things that are so easy either on a Mac or on Linux that is impossible to do natively on Windows.

      Will Windows 8 have virtual desktops? Seriously...this needs to native to Windows.

      • by emurphy42 (631808)
        Not that you're necessarily wrong, but VirtuaWin works well and has for a while. Add the KvasdoPager plug-in to get a preview widget within the taskbar.
      • Re:ISO Mounting (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Korin43 (881732) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:23PM (#38998777) Homepage

        The one that really gets me is updating.

        On Windows:
            * Run Windows Update
            * Run a program that detects out-of-date software like FileHippo's update checker (or open all of your programs and see which ones annoy you)
            * Download each program's update individually
            * Run each of those (clicking through the damn wizard every time)
            * Reboot your machine
            * Watch as a "new update available" popup appears an hour later when you open a program

        On Linux, pick one of the following:
            * Click the update icon (Ubuntu, maybe other distros)
            * Run 'yum upgrade', 'aptitude update && aptitude upgrade' or 'pacman -Syu'

        "OMG Linux is so hard. You expect me to open a terminal and type two words??! It's much easier to spend an hour clicking 'Yes"!"

        • by thegarbz (1787294)

          I don't understand the update fetish. Why should it be up to the system or the user to update a program? If a program has such a short development cycle, or periodic bug fixes then it should update itself. And really most of the programs out there do and do so transparently to the user.

    • by vux984 (928602)

      Hmm. "I may be an idiot," I said to my colleagues, "but I can't figure out how to mount this ISO file."

      This post seems fake to me. Even your average "mac tech" should have enough passing familiarity with windows to be able to figure this out.

      "Burn it," they said.

      This part is especially fake sounding. Where did you find a windows tech who didn't know how to deal with an iso file?

      Half the PCs out there come with some sort of 3rd party CD burning software that can deal with opening and extracting ISOs just fi

  • Just look at the author's bio. Free advertising/advocacy has been going on in the computer magazines for as long as I can remember.

  • by G3ckoG33k (647276) on Friday February 10, 2012 @03:48PM (#38998321)

    "things that were just a natural evolution"

    Try to tell that to the patent jerks at Apple, and Microsoft...

    Maybe someone like SCO will sue Microsoft for using the the USB protocol, even if Microsoft and Apple may have paid for using USB, and SCO doesn't even own the patents. This business is so litigious.

  • It's noticeably better at generating profit for Microsoft.

  • ZFS is a fantastic filesystem, most people who have used it are aware of it--but it has little widespread adoption outside of the Solaris and BSD communities due to licensing.

    BTRFS has yet to become the defacto file system in any linux distro today that I'm aware of, but it's well under way. That said, BTRFS will be a complete replacement for ext4, while ReFS is being phased in with a cautious approach (no system drives on ReFS).

    The filesystem thing is definitely a natural evolution, it's like saying featur
  • Immitation/Flattery (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Oswald McWeany (2428506) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:04PM (#38998513)

    I would have thought Linux users would be happy if MS borrowed their ideas- it makes the "mainstream" operating system more like the one they have chosen to use for themselves.

    Surely MS copying Linux can only be a good thing? No?

    I've heard MS is going to even start using a penguin as their logo too. ;)

  • by Qbertino (265505) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:48PM (#38999181)

    ... and vice versa.

    Quite a few features on the Mac OS X UI are directly lifted from Enlightenment and similar projects. Enlightenment was the first UI emphasizing beauty and, for instance, had first spikes into OpenGL support about 10 years ago. They also were the the first to introduce the 'brushed metal' look throughout an entire UI. That all was back in the day when Mac OS 9 still looked like a souped up Windows 3.1 in a few places.

    The new system settings tray introduced in Windows XP is a direct copy of the KDE settings layout of the time - which at the time also was a first. As where the Frog Design UI element designs.

    All this is quite natural though, and can be taken for granted.

    To be honest, I wouldn't take a professional UI designer serious, if he *weren't* intimately familiar with the various alternatives outside of mainstream OSes and UIs.

    My 2 cents.

    • by H0p313ss (811249) on Friday February 10, 2012 @06:08PM (#39000353)

      Quite a few features on the Mac OS X UI are directly lifted from Enlightenment and similar projects.

      Actually, I think you'll find that Enlightenment "lifted" features from NeXTSTEP, which significantly predates E. OSX is really just the latest and greatest flavor of NeXTSTEP.

    • OS X has had hardware accelerated Quartz, "Quartz Extreme" since 10.2 Jaguar, available August 2002, so close enough to 10 years.

      And yeah, as another replier notes, NEXTSTEP had hardware accelerated blitting in the 1980s. The window manager on a NeXT Cube is not noticeably less snappy moving windows around than a Mac of today.

  • by caywen (942955) on Friday February 10, 2012 @04:57PM (#38999287)

    It's not like Microsoft said, "hey, we invented an easy way to mount ISO's. Take THAT Linux! wait, you already have that? Oh well, our way is superior!"

    It's more like Microsoft said, "Hey, we made ISO's easy to mount."

    The rest of the crap comes from those who make a living trying to instigate fights between users in both camps.

Machines certainly can solve problems, store information, correlate, and play games -- but not with pleasure. -- Leo Rosten

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