Comparing the Freedoms Offered By Maemo and Android 244
An anonymous reader writes "Maemo 5 and Android have received a lot of publicity lately, despite the former not even shipping yet. Both have become famous partly for using the Linux kernel, but now that we have a choice, how do we pick one? Is the issue as mundane as choosing your favorite desktop distribution, or is there a more significant difference? This article compares the two from an end user and developer perspective, emphasizing root access and ease of sharing code."
Re:Not a chioce right now (Score:5, Informative)
the N900 gets released 16th November
http://www.product-reviews.net/2009/10/22/nokia-n900-uk-release-date-pushed-back-to-november/ [product-reviews.net]
Re:How do I choose? (Score:3, Informative)
all the features you mentioned are available with windows mobile.
Re:Not a chioce right now (Score:2, Informative)
openmoko (Score:1, Informative)
if you really want open then go for openmoko. it can even make phone calls these days. i just got one :-)
Re:Not a chioce right now (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Not really an article (Score:4, Informative)
The problem is that we do not yet know what Nokia will make you agree to in order to install the gain root privileges application
Using Maemo 4 running on a Nokia N810 (the predecessor to the N900) as an example, the exact disclaimer is:
My experience with the N810 indicates that the Maemo system is extremely open. It's not merely slightly easier to get root access, it is significantly easier compared with jail-breaking an iPhone or hacking root onto an Android device. It is literally installing a third-party package (either gainroot or openssh) via the usual GUI package manager and takes a couple of minutes. Your data is not wiped, nor will your root-access be revoked upon the next firmware upgrade (which doesn't wipe your data either on the N900).
Re:Freedom of choice is made for you, my friend (Score:4, Informative)
Don't forget Palm's WebOS!!! (Score:4, Informative)
- unfettered access to the linux subsystem (ie, need adblocking? You can replace /etc/hosts with an ad/malware blocking version! You can patch many aspects of the phone this way, go check out the patches on precentral)
- if you are a web developer (html, css, javascript), you already know how to write code for this phone. It's that easy. The SDK is freely available, and RUNS FINE ON LINUX. No need to keep a windows box around just to write some phone apps.
- like all the other apps, controlling the US is also done via javascript. Many features can be unlocked just by uncommenting some code.
- and for just plain old users... the interface is very clean, consistent, and beautiful. It stays out of your way. Some of the included apps aren't as powerful as they maybe should be, but that is what the openness of the phone and the homebrew community is for.
Re:The writer is clueless about end users (Score:4, Informative)
Re:How do I choose? (Score:2, Informative)
In S60v3 Nokia phones, when you choose to send the SMS, you are presented with the standard SMS writing interface, with a basic template already filled in saying 'Sorry, I will call later'. Simply press send. If you so choose, you can edit it to whatever you want and then press send. Its been around for a long time and I am kind of surprised other phones still have not copied this.
Re:Not really an article (Score:5, Informative)
It only provides a warning that you may damage your device and does not mention breaking a warranty, EULA, TOS, etc...
It's also worth noting that the warning links directly to the instructions for reflashing the device (with the obvious caveat that any data that isn't backed up will be lost). So even if you shoot yourself in the foot as root, they're more than happy to point your toward the stack of bandages in the corner.
Re:Don't forget Palm's WebOS!!! (Score:2, Informative)
Maemo has all of this, with the added advantage that you don't have to write applications in an arcane scripting language unless you really want to.
Re:Why does T-Mobile suck? There's a map for that. (Score:3, Informative)
Ringtones are not public performances. Here, have an article from an obviously biased but generally honest source: http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/10/court-rules-phones-ringing-public-dont-infringe-co [eff.org]
Re:No lawsuits? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:the "freedoms" (Score:3, Informative)
the "freedoms" are an illusion. so long as either device you buy is tied to a draconian carrier its just another big ass phone screwing up the line of my pants and sucking down 5 hours worth of charge time in 3 days. the phones may be free, but their features, options and abilities will quickly be restricted at the carrier level.
A phone with freedoms is a phone that doesnt require service contracts or "new every 2" plans for hardware. Its also a phone that lets you question and subvert greedy carrier tactics and, god forbid, gauge and monitor a carriers network performance independently from their own claims of most reliable and most coverage. buy either one, but remember the freedom stops after the transceiver driver comes up.
So, since you can buy an N900 without a carrier contract [mobilephonesdirect.co.uk], it's your dream phone, right?
On the other hand, the contract I'm getting with my N900 gives me unlimited data transfer, unlimited SMS and a big chunk of free talk time. So I'm not particularly worried about "sucking down 5 hours worth of charge time in 3 days." Believe me that if my carrier tries to restrict the capabilities of the phone, it'll be returned to them before you can say "Jack Rabbit" -- and they'll have to take it back.
But I guess you should ignore me; my lack of a tinfoil hat probably means that I'm imagining all that due to the brainwashing mind control beams irradiating my brain. Enjoy your paranoia!
Re:Javascript as a mobile device's ABI? (Score:3, Informative)
You know, it's just one trade-off and it might not be much worse than linking C++ dynamically... Or Jitting Java byte code.
I have owned an Agenda VR3 and a Zaurus. I can tell you that there are many ways to wast CPU cycles and that in any case it takes effort to avoid them. The Agenda guys spent a lot of time trying to optimize the binaries and resolve issues caused by C++. They might have had an easier time coding in Python and avoiding C++. Or not. It's a complex issue, so it's hard to say even now after the dust has settled.
I don't think there is any silver bullet nor that Javascript, Dalvik or C++ are bad per se. What matters is the effort that the makers put into integrating the software and the hardware, testing, optimizing etc.
The Pre uses the V8 Javascript engine and it might be more efficient to jit a few tens of lines of Javascript than to link a C++ binary with all kinds of libraries (say stdc++, qt, X11 etc.).
Also, I remember that programming in GFA Basic and running the programs on my 8MHz Atari was quite fast actually. So why would it be such a mistake on Palm's part to use Javascript on a machine that is about 500 times faster (the fastest instruction took 4 clock cycles on the 68k)?
I think the Pre is really interesting as almost everything in it is Open Source (V8, Webkit, Linux etc.), based on standards (HTML, Javascript). Also people seem to be able to compare it with the iPhone without laughing so it must be a rather good integration of hardware and software too...
Anyway just my 2 cents and an occasion to fondly remember the gadgets of my youth ;-)
Re:The writer is clueless about end users (Score:3, Informative)
As a developer, I also care about the fact that the new MAEMO APIs are scheduled for deprecation before its release. Having a stable, well documented API matters. A lot.
Please elaborate on this?
I don't know if things got clearer since this article was written. Anyways, this is what I was referring to:
"""
Furthermore, the difficulty of the toolkit switch between Fremantle and Harmattan is compounded by the fact that Fremantle will break compatibility with the Maemo 4.x-series, thus forcing two consecutive rewrites onto developers."""
http://lwn.net/Articles/341391/ [lwn.net]
Re:Not a chioce right now (Score:3, Informative)
Sadly, I think it's November for everywhere.
http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=355093&postcount=423 [maemo.org]
Re:How do I choose? (Score:3, Informative)
I choose the one that will install on the hardware I own. or the one that has the most pro user functions and anti carrier functions...
I.E. mp3 ringtones that are not locked out. Backgrounds can be any file I choose to upload to it, same as themes. Give me a way to design and upload a look change without makign the carrier rich.
All features enabled and systems in place that keep the carrier from disabling features in the phone or forcing an update to my phone that is crippled.
Allows me to use a voip client at a wifi hotspot to circumvent airtime charges.
The Palm Pre is what you're looking for (though I don't think there's a voip app yet... just that Palm doesn't have the ability to lock one out when it comes around).
In all seriousness, I love the philosophy behind my Pre. It doesn't come with an install CD. There's no such thing as "Pre software". It works with internet services and data protocols you already have. Mail, chat, calendar, and contacts sync through Google. All uploads to the phone (ringtones, wallpapers) and downloads from it (photos) are done on a flat file-system on a USB mass storage device (standard USB micro cable, BTW, the same one that powers it). Music goes through iTunes, not some branded "Sprint Pre Jukebox" (yes, they should've used the less proprietary MTP, but you can upload as flat files if you like). Apps can be (and are) created by third parties and installed without Sprint/Palm's approval. Including a bluetooth tethering app.
Using common preexisting standards. Not creating its own protocols to lock you into their services. All features available and unlocked. Slashdotters should approve of this.
Re:The writer is clueless about end users (Score:3, Informative)
The way you wrote it makes it sound like the N900 will provide an API that's already scheduled for deprecation. But what the article actually says is that the N900 will use Maemo 5, which won't be backwards with the Maemo 4 used in earlier products.
I think the "new" word is the confusing part, if you said "the current MAEMO APIs will become deprecated" then it'd have made more sense.
Re:Moblin, iPhone, WebOS and more.. (Score:1, Informative)
http://maemo.org/ [maemo.org]
http://maemo.gitorious.org/ [gitorious.org]
http://bugs.maemo.org/ [maemo.org]
Re:Maemo wins hands down (Score:2, Informative)
I agree that a full blown desktop/server JVM would be OTT. The CDC (connected device configuration) profile is designed for devices which are smarter than the bog-standard Java-ME phone, but not up to running a full SE stack. Have a look at the overview here [sun.com]. A cut and paste of the 'target devices' section:
The CDC configuration was designed to bring the many advantages of the Java platform to a broad range of network-connected consumer and embedded devices, including smart communicators, high-end PDAs, and set-top boxes.
Devices that support CDC typically include a 32-bit microprocessor/controller and make about 2 MB of RAM and 2.5 MB of ROM available to the Java application environment.
What's more, the open source implementation released by Sun has an excellent ARM targeted JIT compiler. All in all, apart from the out of date GUI implementation (QT3 based) it would be an ideal Java platform for something like the N900.