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Red Hat Software Businesses Announcements Software Linux

Fedora 9 (Sulphur) Released 218

Posted by timothy
from the well-this-one-isn't-debian-based dept.
BrianGKUAC writes "Fedora 9 has been released as of 10 AM Eastern Time this morning. Release notes can be found here. Some of the more interesting new features include a new package management system, which can be used as an alternative to pup and pirut, known as PackageKit. This release also includes GNOME 2.22 and/or KDE 4.0.3, and Firefox 3 beta 5. Overall, there are a lot of improvements worth looking at, and the Bittorrent seeds are already feeding the release fairly effectively."
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Fedora 9 (Sulphur) Released

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  • So (Score:4, Funny)

    by sveard (1076275) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @12:45PM (#23392344) Homepage
    What smell is that? :p
  • by eck06 (725760) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @12:45PM (#23392348)
    - Uses seeding with openssl
  • PackageKit (Score:5, Informative)

    by brejc8 (223089) * on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @12:46PM (#23392364) Homepage Journal
    PackageKit is actually a just a tool which sits on top of yum and does not replace it. It does replace pup and pirut though.

    See PackageKit site [packagekit.org] of the release notes [fedoraproject.org].
  • by Tester (591) <olivier...crete@@@ocrete...ca> on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @12:46PM (#23392366) Homepage
    PackageKit is only a front-end over yum (or any other backend), it does not replace it.
  • by bignetbuy (1105123) <r0ck&operamail,com> on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @12:55PM (#23392464) Journal
    download pegged at 892KBps. An hour to snatch the DVD ISO!

    SEED, you bums! SEED!
  • by Anonymous Coward
    This is sure to be a stinker of a release...

    Sorry couldn't resist...

    *waits for -1 mod points*
    • by ajs318 (655362)
      Sulphur itself, in its elemental state as flowers of sulphur, is actually odourless.

      However, most sulphur compounds are very smelly indeed. Thioethanol (used in stink bombs) is reckoned to be the smelliest substance in the world.

      Oh, and props to them for using the "old-fashioned" spelling!
      • The stinkiest stuff in the world is apparently some material called "what me?" developed by the US or the French in WWII to spray on captured German officers. The idea is that they would stink so bad that their troops would be demoralized. Of course, the French got it on themselves 1 time out of 3, so the substance was not widely used. Of course, I'm quoting from memory and too lazy to google, so I could be all mistaken. Verify before quoting this.
  • by BDaniels (13031) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @12:56PM (#23392468) Homepage
    I'm a sysadmin and use KDE all day long, with Konsole as my terminal. I tried the preview release of Fedora 9 and found
    that the new Konsole - has less features!

    The buttons for quickly closing/opening a tab are gone. Right-clicking on tabs is gone. The ability to send input to all tabs
    is completely gone, not even accessible through menus.

    These are features I use every day while working on servers. KDE4 adds a lot of eyecandy (and a Vista-style 'start menu' - ick),
    but why remove useful functionality?

    • by icydog (923695) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:09PM (#23392628) Homepage
      IIRC, KDE said that 4.1 will have feature parity with 3.5. 4.0 is still a work-in-progress. I do agree though, I use konsole all the time and it's rather unpleasant right now. 4.0 is also missing a bunch of other basic stuff, like dragging between the two panes (files and the folder tree) in Konqueror.
    • by SlashdotOgre (739181) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:14PM (#23392696) Journal
      "I'm a sysadmin and use KDE all day long, with Konsole as my terminal. I tried the preview release of Fedora 9 and found
      that the new Konsole - has less features!"

      They must be going for the Gnome look...

      All kidding aside, I'm very surprised they went with KDE4. I've been playing around with it on Gentoo for several months now, and I could understand making it an option, but to not provide KDE3 out of the box at all (http://docs.fedoraproject.org/release-notes/f9/en_US/sn-Desktop.html#sn-KDE [fedoraproject.org]) is shocking. I thought even the KDE folks were recommending waiting until 4.1. Oh well, Fedora always likes the latest and greatest.
      • by CastrTroy (595695) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:18PM (#23392756) Homepage
        I'm surprised they didn't offer both as an option. Mandriva 2008.1 has KDE3 by default, and an optional KDE4 install. You can install both, and select which one you want from the login screen. It's way too early to force KDE4 on everyone. A lot of features are still missing, and it's still pretty unstable. For the Record Mandriva 2009, plans to be KDE4 only. Hopefully KDE4 will be more mature by then.
      • fedora is always bleeding edge. it's a testing ground for redhat. if you don't like that, go for a more stable distro.
      • by Peter H.S. (38077)

        All kidding aside, I'm very surprised they went with KDE4. I've been playing around with it on Gentoo for several months now, and I could understand making it an option, but to not provide KDE3 out of the box at all (http://docs.fedoraproject.org/release-notes/f9/en_US/sn-Desktop.html#sn-KDE) is shocking. I thought even the KDE folks were recommending waiting until 4.1. Oh well, Fedora always likes the latest and greatest.

        You got it the wrong way around, why should a distro like Fedora release make a release with KDE 3.5.x when KDE 4.0.3 is available. If one needs a stable KDE and OS, stay with Fedora 8. It will be supported for quite some time yet.

        Some may think that Fedora moves too fast, but a lot of people really, really wants to work with the latest and most shiniest toys, even if they are somewhat less stable.

        --
        Regards

      • They must be going for the Gnome look...

        The day is still young, but that gets my vote for Quote of the Day.
    • by 93 Escort Wagon (326346) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:15PM (#23392718)

      I'm a sysadmin and use KDE all day long...
      Oh, come on, we're supposed to believe THAT? If you were a REAL sysadmin, you'd use twm at most! And you wouldn't ADMIT to having X11 installed at all! You'd talk about how console mode lets you do everything faster, and how bloated X11 is compared to X10...

      • by MmmmAqua (613624)
        Damn, where is the "+1, Great Sig" mod option when you need it? A flower for your sweetie would also have been acceptable.
    • by Peter H.S. (38077) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:31PM (#23392890) Homepage

      These are features I use every day while working on servers. KDE4 adds a lot of eyecandy (and a Vista-style 'start menu' - ick),
      but why remove useful functionality?
      Lots of KDE 3.5 features hasn't made it into 4.0 KDE yet. KDE 4.0 is bleeding edge just like Fedora 9 is.

      --
      Regards
    • by AtomicX (616545) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @02:15PM (#23393570)
      Hello - as the maintainer of Konsole I'll explain what is going on. I'll address specific points first:

      > The buttons for quickly closing/opening a tab are gone.

      Konsole in KDE 4.0 is orientated more around keyboard shortcuts - which I think makes sense in a terminal. (Ctrl+Shift+N creates a new tab, Ctrl+Shift+W closes the current one, although I would recommend using the normal Ctrl+D combination to exit the shell)

      Enough people complained (via bugs.kde.org) that I added the 'New Tab' button back in as an option in KDE 4.1. Plus there are Firefox-esqueue close buttons on tabs and support for re-arranging tabs by drag and drop or moving tabs between windows.

      > The ability to send input to all tabs is completely gone

      It didn't work at the time of the 4.0 release so it got cut. It has been reimplemented in KDE 4.1 with more flexibility in response to various RFE bug reports:

      http://commit-digest.org/issues/2008-04-13/files/konsole-copy-input-to.png [commit-digest.org]

      It is not the case the Konsole in KDE 4.0 has 'less features' in total. The menus may look far emptier but there is actually not very much missing. In fact it has quite a few additions, mostly fulfilling a large backlog of feature requests in bugs.kde.org, which I think are very useful:

      * The terminal setup UI was replaced with one which is simpler but also more flexible
      * Split-view mode
      * Incremental search
      * Key binding editor
      * Improved performance, especially scrolling in large windows

      In any case, if you have a complaint then please report it at http://bugs.kde.org/ [kde.org] - I am much more likely to read about it there than on Slashdot. Plus it also allows users to vote on the issues most important to them which is helpful from my perspective trying to allocate the limited spare time I have.

      Finally, as someone who followed KDE development discussion quite closely over the last two years, it is inaccurate to say that KDE is attempting to "copy" Windows Vista or is in some large measure "inspired" by it. The menu for example was originally developed by OpenSuSE for KDE 3 - a long time before Vista was released, based on openSuSE's own research. Evidence of this can be found in some notably different design decisions compared with Vista's menu. For example, both the Gnome SLED menu and KDE's "Kickoff" have a search facility but it is located at the top of the menu rather than the button because users couldn't find it when it was placed at the bottom.

      I think the view that KDE is trying to "clone" Windows, if not trolling, boils down to the use of black on the bar at the bottom of the screen. I am not involved with that part of KDE but I understand that the look of it is quite likely to change somewhat for KDE 4.1.

      • by chill (34294)
        Thank you for the clarifying post and your work on Konsole.
      • Improved performance, especially scrolling in large windows

        Not sure what value of large you're using, but FWIW, my own opinion is that any terminal application that has a problem scrolling is a non-starter for anything non-trivial.
      • One thing that was always snappy in GNOME was the scrolling in GNOME terminal. The main improvement when working with AA fonts (and most people are these days) iirc came from using OpenGL. As KDE4 has loads of OpenGL candy, is konsole going to take advantage of OpenGL to speed up its rendering?
    • by Khaed (544779)
      I tried the preview release of Fedora 9 and found that the new Konsole - has less features!

      They must have picked up some Gnome developers!

      -- Khaed, who is still looking for the preferences in Gnome Screensaver.
  • Beta XORG as well (Score:5, Informative)

    by fyrie (604735) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:09PM (#23392622)
    I can live with the beta Firefox, but the fact that they are using a beta XORG has put a kink in my plans to upgrade to F9 because NVidia doesn't have drivers ready. I'm anxiously awaiting this situation to be resolved. In the meantime I'll stick with F8 which is very stable at the moment.
    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Check here: http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=9959d4806fa0925ec3b511c7d038fcb8&t=111460

      and download the 173.08 with experimental support for xorg-server 1.4.99.901
    • Re:Beta XORG as well (Score:5, Informative)

      by tuffy (10202) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:38PM (#23393008) Homepage Journal
      Beta NVidia drivers are available [freshrpms.net] for the beta x.org server. There's also the Nouveau drivers, which might be good enough for 2D performance.
  • by BrookHarty (9119) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:17PM (#23392746) Homepage Journal
    This was the feature I was waiting for, was hoping to hear more about it when Fedora 9 was released.

    The article (or snippit) says Fedora 9 has kernel based mode setting..

    http://www.osnews.com/story/19661/A_Preview_of_Kernel-Based_Mode-Setting [osnews.com]

    Anyone test it yet?
  • Fedora 9 is also one of the first linux distributions (along with Ubuntu) to include OpenJDK. Fedora also includes Netbeans.

    They moved from IcedTea, which was based on the upcoming java7 to the stable java6 release. Looks like some of the stuff in IncedTea made it into OpenJDK 6.
  • by kriston (7886) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @01:35PM (#23392956) Homepage Journal
    Fedora 9 will not install on certain Samsung hard disks.

    If your hard disk has a "/" character in its model name as reported through the ATA interface then Anaconda will fail. The Python error message reads like "ends with '/' and is not just '/'" and the kernel halts.

    I have a very standard desktop Dell Optiplex that has one of these hard disks, model number "SAMSUNG HD080HJ/P".

    The "/" character kills the installation.

    So disappointing yet so simple to have fixed before release.

  • "Some of the more interesting new features include a new package management system, which can be used as an alternative to yum, known as PackageKit."

    ...and Linux kernel was replaced by Gnome.

  • Firefox 3 BETA ? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Superken7 (893292)
    Why is it so common nowadays for linux distributions to include *BETA* software (as complex as a browser can be) in their releases?
    Sure, there can be some heavily tested and simple programs left as beta, but firefox? The web browser is a heavily used and substantial tool these days..

    Firefox 3 Beta 5 takes my CPU usage to 100% easily, while firefox 2.x does not.

    is it so hard to stick with stable, tested software ? bleeding edge is not always better.

    Not to speak of KDE 4.0 :)
    • There's something stopping you from downloading FF2 and untarring it into your ~/bin, if that's what you prefer to use?
      • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Superken7 (893292)
        Of course not, and that is exactly why it should be the other way around ;-) providing the stable product, while you can still try out the BETA.
        • by xenocide2 (231786)
          Well, judging by the comments this is how Fedora rolls. The bug you state is easily the most duplicated one in Ubuntu 8.04. I was curious if Fedora fixed that before release. From your original post I may presume they did not?
    • by Peter H.S. (38077)

      Why is it so common nowadays for linux distributions to include *BETA* software (as complex as a browser can be) in their releases?
      Sure, there can be some heavily tested and simple programs left as beta, but firefox? The web browser is a heavily used and substantial tool these days..

      Nowadays? Linux distros have always (since RH 5.0 at least;-) ) included beta-quality software simply because their audience demanded it. Some distros are of course more bleeding edge/conservative than others.

      The newest Fedora release are for people who wants the latest software available. If one wants a more stable Fedora release, get the previous release like Fedora 8; it has KDE 3.5.x, FF 2, etc.

      That a distro like Fedora includes Firefox 3 Beta is also mean extra beta testers so perhaps a bug or two get

      • by Khaed (544779)
        Yeah, isn't Debian about the only distro that makes a release using only thoroughly "stable" code?
    • by Black Art (3335)

      Why is it so common nowadays for linux distributions to include *BETA* software (as complex as a browser can be) in their releases?
      Sure, there can be some heavily tested and simple programs left as beta, but firefox? The web browser is a heavily used and substantial tool these days..

      What part of Redhat do you not understand?

      Redhat has always shipped beta code in their distros. You don't remember the time they shipped a beta version of GCC and pissed off much of the Gnu people because of it?

      Redhat 3 beta 5 has worked fairly well for me. I am not seeing the CPU spikes you are seeing either. Are you sure it is not one of the flash replacements causing the problem and not Mozilla?

  • Sulphur story (Score:4, Informative)

    by BytePusher (209961) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @02:34PM (#23393818) Homepage
    I thought the name Sulphur was kind of... lame, so I decided to see what the name was about. The truth is, it was the least bad of all the names voted upon.
     
    The logic behind it is thus:
    Some more suggestions

      "sulphur"
      "mayonaisse"

    (like werewolves they react badly with silver)

    https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2007-December/msg01194.html [redhat.com]
    http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/Names [fedoraproject.org]
    The other options were:
    vote_count , name
                    62 , Sulphur
                    54 , Bathysphere
                    43 , Chupacabra
                    39 , Mayonnaise
                    32 , Dragicorn
                    29 , Woodwose
                    23 , Tourette
                    13 , Asperger
                    13 , Barmanou
                    10 , Chingachgook
                      6 , Kingsport Town
                      5 , Marfan

    https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-announce-list/2008-January/msg00012.html
    • by knarfling (735361)
      I, for one, am really, really glad they didn't choose a couple of those names.

      "Hey Asperger!! When was the last time you took a look at Chingachgook?"

      "I can't have Chingachgook at my place. The walls are thin, and my Mom might hear."
  • Release schedules (Score:4, Interesting)

    by jensend (71114) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @02:43PM (#23393928)
    One thing which the Ubuntu and Fedora releases show is that having regularly scheduled releases does not always work out for the best. Both have shipped with a primary browser still in beta (FF3 is a big leap ahead, but it still has some issues to be shaken out), and Ubuntu will be doing long-term support for an outdated GCC version which misses out on a lot of improvements while Fedora uses a brand new .0 compiler. Seems like both projects might have had better releases a month or so later.
    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by esocid (946821)
      It still encourages a good rolling release of new packages rather than letting things stagnate. Not saying newer is always better, but things will be fixed within a few weeks and regular package releases to solve any bugs, as well as support for newer technology. This is coming from someone partial to fedora, since I've used it since core 4, and I've never really had an issue with anything, with the exception of getting my wireless card on my laptop to work, but everyone knows what a bitch that is to solve.
    • by Black Art (3335) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @04:47PM (#23395644)

      One thing which the Ubuntu and Fedora releases show is that having regularly scheduled releases does not always work out for the best. Both have shipped with a primary browser still in beta (FF3 is a big leap ahead, but it still has some issues to be shaken out), and Ubuntu will be doing long-term support for an outdated GCC version which misses out on a lot of improvements while Fedora uses a brand new .0 compiler. Seems like both projects might have had better releases a month or so later.
      No matter what you do, some major component is not ready. If it is not KDE, it is Gnome or xorg or Apache or Firefox or whatever.

      There are a bunch of components in this release that were ready in time. Perl 5.10.0 is one that will make a difference. (Especially if your code uses regular expressions heavily.) There is also a new code base for TeTex. A new version of OCAML. Many things have been upgraded here, not just the unstable bits.

      Every release has this problem, not just Fedora 9.
    • Well, the alternative is to make everyone march to some sort of schedule, which not even Microsoft can do.

      The idea of Fedora is to push things along. If you are writing software or need the new features, yay!

      If you are more happy with stability, CentOS is what you are looking for. Same stuff, but older and more stable.
  • by esocid (946821)
    installed fedora 8 a few weeks ago. guess i'll have to recompile my kernel if it's a new one, not sure since I haven't checked if it is 2.6.24 or not. i guess it's a good thing i'll most likely forget to do it for another month and wait for some new packages to appear.
  • by rrohbeck (944847) on Tuesday May 13, 2008 @07:31PM (#23397538)
    Remember, YouTube no workee, wifey not happy.
    Or something like that.

When the weight of the paperwork equals the weight of the plane, the plane will fly. -- Donald Douglas

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