Open Source Federal Income Tax Software 227
niiler writes "There is finally a usable US federal income tax program for Linux users who don't wish to file online. TaxGeek is a Mozilla-based US income tax program that includes Form 1040, Schedules A, B, C, C-EZ, D, E, K-1 (1065), SE (Short and Long), W2, Forms 8880, 8853, 8863, 8812, 5695, 4952,3903, 2106, 2106ez, 2441 with access to most other files as PDFs. It is intended to be extensible so that developers can easily add other forms that are needed without affecting the existing file formats and stored data. TaxGeek will also create PDFs of all the supported forms so that you can print them and send them in to the IRS. (PDF creation support requires the installation of Perl PDF::Reuse.) At this point, e-filing is not supported."
Nice Disclaimer (Score:4, Informative)
Re:A step in the right direction, I think. (Score:5, Informative)
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6. Why can't I e-file with this program?
Because of the lack of cooperation of the IRS and the API. When I wrote to the IRS regarding this, I received the following reply:
Thank you for your inquiry.
The government believes that private industry, given its established expertise and experience in the field of electronic tax preparation, has a proven track record in providing the best technology and services available. In addition, the government believes a partnership with private industry will: provide taxpayers with higher quality services by using the existing expertise of the private sector; maximize consumer choice; promote competition within the marketplace; and meet objectives in the least costly manner to taxpayers.
We hope the above information will prove helpful to you.
Sincerely,
The IRS Website Support Team
I suspect that there will either need to be an outcry, or we will need to present this project as a corporation of sorts for cooperation from the IRS. For more info, see the previous FAQ entry.
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Re:Stupid question... (Score:5, Informative)
I've often wondered that too. I asked a Russian co-worker about it though, and he said his experience with foreign systems that only use a payroll tax, is that they are much more likely to be corrupt. Since there's a lower compliance rate, they have to have a higher tax. I don't really buy into that though. I'd much rather just have the payroll tax and be done with it, as long as I can't be held personally liable for failing to pay it. If it's just a payroll tax, then who is liable though? It can't be the person who runs payroll. Those jobs don't pay very much, and people won't run the risk of personal bankruptcy for failing to carry a decimal. If the corporation or company is liable, then it's much harder to pin blame on a person. The corporation or company just goes bankrupt, so I think my Russian co-worker had a good point.
Historicly, taxes in the US were collected from individuals. I've been told that payroll deductions, called "witholding" here, were an emergency measure adopted because they needed funds during WWII. After the war, witholding continued. Some have actually argued that we get rid of witholding due to its history as a WWII emergency measure. It also feeds into some conspiracy theories regarding the "continual state of war" in the US. Anyway, the US is, in some sense, "pay as you earn", it's just that you have to file to reconcile the difference between what you've paid and what you actually owe.
What you owe can be less due to deductions (e.g., charity, marital status, etc.). Over the years, the US has used the tax code for social engineering. Those deductions are popular, entrenched, and backed by powerful lobbies and interests who have a lot to gain from the tax code as it stands. If I had to give a one-word answer to your question it would be:
Inertia.
Re:Nice Disclaimer (Score:4, Informative)
How would a bad linux version translate to a loss of market share when you have web apps that will work just as easily?
Re:Nice Disclaimer (Score:3, Informative)
"Honestly"? who is being honest? Who hasn't checked the 1040 form recently? The tax preparer gets his/her OWN line on the tax form that he/she signs. So there IS accountability for the preparer, if he/she does things incorrectly. There is no guarantee that you get all the best loopholes (though some DO guarantee this) with an accountant, but the IRS likely has never convicted anyone of paying too much in taxes.
I have posted this comment to other posters who don't know how taxes work (are you still a dependent?). Not sure about TurboTax or whatnot. But if someone prepares your taxes for you, they will be held responsible in some manner by the government, whether or not they want to be held responsible, once they sign on the line. Check out the 1040 form on the IRS.gov website if you want to see for yourself.
Comparison with Brazil (Score:5, Informative)
Brazil's equivalent of the IRS (Receita Federal) offers its version for federal income tax software for download for Windows, Linux, Macintosh and jar files for any other OS Yes, they use Java. It makes sense.
http://www.receita.gov.br/PessoaFisica/ReceitaNet
Re:You get to be the beta tester! (Score:3, Informative)
If neither the Freefile program or Turbotax/Taxcut software or their online versions fit your tax filing needs Mr. Moneybags then you just need to go talk to your private accountant like the rest of the rich people and leave the bottom 95% of us to our drudgery. ;-)
Re:A good year for open source and taxes... (Score:2, Informative)
If thats not open source, I'm not sure what is.
Re:A good year for open source and taxes... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:FreeFile; Public vs. Private (Score:5, Informative)
As the author of this program I want to reply to a couple of comments in this thread.
First regarding the issue of free-file: AARP will free file for you [aarp.org] no matter what your age or income level. At least this is how it has been presented to me by volunteers for the organization. This is noted on the TaxGeek website.
Second, regarding the coding of the US income tax forms, I agree that the tax code ought to be in computer code perhaps even written into the fillable PDF forms the IRS provides. This would be the most concise way to do it to ensure no mistakes are made. However, H&R Block, TurboTax and others feel that this is the government competing against private industry, and therefore, it won't happen.
Regarding this last point, I suspect that when TaxGeek actually becomes competitive with "real" tax programs, we will start having issues with the big companies who will feel that it is unfair that someone is providing software to the public for free (nevermind that it isn't the government). Imagine that our near term idea-list is completed. Specifically that we completely finish the 1040, can write to pdf using XUL-Javascript, and create an interview frontend. Should this happen, TaxGeek becomes platform independent and usable by a wider audience. Presuming that we have thousands of ./ers sending bug reports, TaxGeek may even be more reliable than some commercial products. (I know, in my dreams...)
Finally, regarding liability please see the following IRS publications:
Essentially, the fact that there is a dire warning regarding the software's abilities, and that the software is being given away offer protection to the developers (who are normally more protected than their CPA masters in the IRS standards of practice anyhow). The articles mentioned above don't even guarantee the company's liability in the case of mistake. They only say that the company may be liable under certain conditions. In short our line on it is that you didn't pay any money for this, you were warned about the software's status, and any mistakes are your responsibility, not ours. Also, we try to fix bugs that are reported to us in a timely manner which is also a developer's responsibility according to the IRS.Not entirely true (Score:5, Informative)
Re:You get to be the beta tester! (Score:4, Informative)
It means your employer withheld too much of your pay. So your employer and the government got to keep it, gaining interest on it, until you file your taxes and get the check for ONLY the amount they owe you - they keep the interest.
It's best to have no refund, because it means that you got the money when you earned it, not several months later.
Spread Sheet Alternative (Score:2, Informative)
I've been using this guy's spread sheet for the past three years. Labled as 'Excel' but I've actually used it in Open Office. Prints nice.
http://home.mchsi.com/~taxcalculator/ [mchsi.com]
This year I should donate a few dollars to his paypal account. If I get a refund of course.
Open Office tax form spreadsheet (Score:4, Informative)
I shouldn't do this [mchsi.com]. But please give the guy some cash. It is extremely useful, and works with OpenOffice. My taxes were fairly complex and they came out perfectly. Maybe you can help out and make an even better version.