Open Source In Public Sector Meeting Opposition 425
Open Source movements have been gaining popularity everywhere, but not everyone is happy about that. Johans wrote to mention a ZDNet Asia story discussing a controversy within the Malaysian computer industry over the government's 'Public Sector Open Source Software Masterplan. From the article: " ... the government has stated that its first choice in IT procurement are infocomm technology solutions developed on the open-source platform. It states that 'in situations where advantages and disadvantages of open-source software (OSS) and proprietary software are equal, preference shall be given to OSS' ... However, some industry consortiums have stepped out to voice their concerns over this policy." Meanwhile, Anonymous Coward wrote to mention a Fox News article entitled 'Massachusetts Should Close Down OpenDocument', calling the attention of journalists to the 'huge mistake' that Massachusetts is making by switching to OpenDocument. From that article: "Officials in the state have proposed a new policy that mandates that every state technology system use only applications designed around OpenDocument file formats. Such a policy might seem like something that should concern only a small group of technology professionals, but in fact the implications are staggering and far-reaching. The policy promises to burden taxpayers with new costs and to disrupt how state agencies interact with citizens, businesses and organizations."
Pendergast is a lobbyist. (Score:5, Informative)
The Fox News article is by James Pendergast, hardly a friend of open source. More of his FUD-laced Fox articles can be found here [techleadership.org].
If you don't want to read any more of his tripe at least look at the Founding Members [techleadership.org] of his organization... ah Microsoft. He's just a shill protecting MS' monopoly.
Check out the OpenDocument author... (Score:5, Informative)
Can you say "Astroturfing"?
fox... fair and balanced! (Score:5, Informative)
I'm wondering if you pulled the thread through far enough starting with Fox News, then the reporter, all the way to the source of and the reason for the article warning about dangers of OSS that you would find some Microsoft shill pulling strings.
Oh wait, I just Googled James Prendergast, author of the story. Hey!, Guess what!, he's Executive Director of ATL [google.com], a virulently anti-OSS organization and web site.
Hey slashdotter's, you might want to visit that web site [google.com] a few times, and make sure you always have a fresh page by hitting SHIFT-F5!
WTF Fox?!? Fair and balanced news indeed!
Favorite quote (Score:5, Informative)
An interesting sentence that exemplifies the hypocrisy ripe within his arguments... we all know Open source is open and anyone can choose to support it as a 'technology provider'. Whereas Microsoft hand picks those companies it approves to have access to the information needed to be a good provider of it's technology.
This doesn't make any sense. In fact IMHO reality dictates that the situation is exactly opposite to this statement, excepting the fact that existing MS providers would have to adopt the Open format if they want to continue being a provider.. a choice they can freely make, but to say they would be 'locked out' is a flat out lie.
Damn this makes me angry (Score:3, Informative)
Hello? Microsoft office costs over $300!! And that's just for the "standard" edition.
Idiots.
James Prendergast (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.techleadership.org/ [techleadership.org] which Jim is said to be executive director partners with Microsoft and looks like a company meant to lobby MS software in government in the States and abroad.
Misportrayal (Score:5, Informative)
While I despise Fox News for any number of reasons, this is a misportrayal. The piece is posted in their editorial department at http://www.foxnews.com/views [foxnews.com] — as of 10:45 EST it's the lead over there. While I would certainly agree that a more responsible news organization [nytimes.com] would label such pieces [nytimes.com] more clearly and prominently on the actual article page, rather than letting the attentive figure out that the "MORE VIEWS HEADLINES" implies that this piece is yet another "Views" piece, it's not a particular breach of journalistic propriety. That is to say, it's as well (or poorly) labeled as any of the other pieces of crud from their editorial department. Fox's editors should be flogged, but not for this any more than the rest of their execrable web site.
"Fox News... we report, you decide" (that Fox is full of... something, anyway).
Look at the homepage (Score:1, Informative)
It's an OPINION article. Under the "Views" section (Score:3, Informative)
The blind leading the blind around here...
-everphilski-
Re:Damn this makes me angry (Score:2, Informative)
Fox News promoting a corporatist agenda? (Score:3, Informative)
Awry XML facts in the article (Score:4, Informative)
Notice how OpenOffice lags behind in technology, while Microsoft moves toward XML and meta files.
Hate to say it.. (Score:2, Informative)
Don't get me wrong, I'd love for this to work, but I just don't see it happening. Openoffice just isn't that good yet. (Unless there is another mature office suite supporting Opendocument and importing MS Word that runs on windows). Even for my own personal use, which is a couple letters, a couple presentations, and a couple lab reports, Openoffice is a pain to use. I use it almost exclusively when I can, mostly because I don't want to pirate MS Office anymore, but I routinely run into things that are harder or impossible to do in Openoffice than in MS Office.
So yeah, good luck Massachusetts, I hope you succeed, but I wouldn't count on it.
Re:It is an OPINION piece (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Wake up call (Score:2, Informative)
Microsoft Shills self appoints themselves. (Score:2, Informative)
http://www.isac-m.org/Default.aspx?tabid=60 [isac-m.org]
These people self-appoint themselves to represent Malaysia's software architects (shameless bunch) and their organisation is CLEARLY FUNDED by MICROSOFT.
Microsoft was gloating while their shills did the hijacking at the government initiated OSS masterplan dialogue event.
They are a shameless bunch of wannabes who're pandering to Microsoft and shamelessly appoint themselves to represent the masses of Malaysian software developers/architects.
They call themselves the The Independent Software Architects Council of Malaysia.
They're not so Independent after all, as we can confirm at least 4 of them work for microsoft and the rest of them are MS Shills.
Microsoft needs to stop planting their brainwashed shills and troops and telling lies to the public that these are the industry representative of the entire software developer population.
Spreading lies in the media and public will bring very bad reputation to Malaysian software developers. These people listed at the website are not qualified to represent us Malaysians. They serve the interest of Microsoft, not Malaysians.
Re:Does it really matter what format you use? (Score:3, Informative)
Uh, PDF is "crackable" because there is a very detailed published specification. You can download yourself a copy from this site [adobe.com]. The latest version is here [adobe.com]. Adobe owns the trademark, meaning that nobody can call something that deviates from Adobe's spec PDF, but its just as open as the Open Document format. There are no secrets about PDF (though it does take some work to grok the complex 1200 page spec) and no license or royalties are necessary to use it. Prendergast's claim that PDF is not open is nonsense. It is open in all ways that are important.
Microsoft Word format is both proprietary and an actual secret. There isn't a published spec. Furthermore, it is very complicated and changes frequently. We know that it is "crackable" because people have successfully reverse engineered it sufficiently to make MS Word documents readable in programs such as OpenOffice.org Writer, but the fact that talented reverse engineers can't get it quite right shows that it isn't easy.
Sourcewatch: Americans for Technology Leadership (Score:5, Informative)
<SNIP>
Americans for Technology Leadership was founded by Jonathan Zuck in 1999 as a "grassroots" organisations for concerned consumers who want less regulation in the technology sector. It also campaigns on general tech issues such as spam.
It has been frequently described as a Microsoft front group. [1] (http://weblog.siliconvalley.com/column/dangillmo
[2] (http://www.aaxnet.com/news/M010823.html [aaxnet.com])
[3] http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~lambert/blog/computer
In August 2001 the Los Angeles Times reported that a ATL was behind a "carefully orchestrated nationwide campaign to create the impression of a surging grass-roots movement" behind Microsoft. "The campaign, orchestrated by a group partly funded by Microsoft, goes to great lengths so that the letters appear to be spontaneous expressions from ordinary citizens. Letters sent in the last month are printed on personalized stationery using different wording, color and typefaces--details that distinguish those efforts from common lobbying tactics that go on in politics every day. Experts said there's little precedent for such an effort supported by a company defending itself against government accusations of illegal behavior."
According to the Times, the campaign was discovered when Utah's Attorney General at the time Mark Shurtleff received letters "purportedly written by at least two dead people
Eighteen state's attorneys general were joining with the Justice Department in its anti-trust suit against Microsoft. Iowa's Attorney General Tom Miller reported receiving more than 50 letters in support of Microsoft during the summer of 2001. "No two letters are identical, but the giveaway lies in the phrasing," the Times wrote. "Four Iowa letters included this sentence: 'Strong competition and innovation have been the twin hallmarks of the technology industry.' Three others use exactly these words: "If the future is going to be as successful as the recent past, the technology sector must remain free from excess regulation."
Dewey Square Group and DCI Group sibling firm DCI/New Media are credited with assisting Microsoft with its "grass-roots" campaign, according to the Times.
</SNIP>
I wrote an e-mail to Foxnews using my gmail account. Besides answering some of Pendergast's claims, I quoted sourcewatch and said a couple of things to them. Let's see how they answer.
Re:Blind knee jerk self-defence reactions.. (Score:2, Informative)
Check my memory here... (Score:3, Informative)
So then we have an organization whose founding members include Microsoft, two Microsoft fronts, and at least two outfits that sell Microsoft software. Nice. And it proceeds to act like a Microsoft front itself. Real big surprise there...
This was one funny article. (Score:4, Informative)
Jim Prendergast is executive director of Americans for Technology Leadership.
Americans for Technology Leadership Founding members
* Association for Competitive Technology
* Citizens Against Government Waste
* Cityscape Filmworks
* Clarity Consulting
* CompTIA
* CompUSA
* Microsoft Corporation
* 60Plus Association
* Small Business Survival Committee
* Staples, Inc.
http://www.cagw.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&i
itizens Against Government Waste (CAGW) today urged Congress to eliminate the National Institute of Standards and Technology's Advanced Technology Program (ATP), which funds private sector research and development
These are the other tech programs CAGW doesn't like.
http://www.atp.nist.gov/gems/listgems.htm [nist.gov]
Who is Association for Competitive Technology?
http://www.actonline.org/aboutus.htm [actonline.org]
While ACT members include some household names like eBay, Orbitz and Microsoft, our members are primarily small and mid-size companies. Smaller, entrepreneurial technology firms like Sax Software,
http://www.actonline.org/principles.htm [actonline.org]
ACT and its members believe that the best way to achieve a healthy Tech Environment and a thriving technology industry is to apply free-market principles that promote innovation, investment and competition. ACT is committed to core free-market principles including:
1. Consumers, not governments, should pick winners and losers in the marketplace.
2. Small tech businesses thrive on innovation, not regulation and litigation.
3. The law of regulation includes the corollary of unintended consequences.
60 Plus has set ending the federal estate tax and saving Social Security for the young as its top priorities. Why should they be against this? It would save money in the long term.
The Small Business & Entrepreneurship Council (SBE Council) works to influence legislation and policies that help to create a favorable and productive environment for small businesses and entrepreneurship. By educating policymakers, elected officials, the media and the public about the critical role that small businesses play in our economy--and how government actions can positively or negatively affect the small business community.
I don't know about you, but I'd want a refund from the SBE Council if they are supporting not going to an open document standard. A standard means that every small business could work and bid on any part of the project. Odds are most of the work would be done locally and not outsourced overseas. This is a great move for small business. (It is a bad move for those small businesses that store everything in their own little data format that only they know about. Which is exactly what this effort is trying to get rid of in the government realm.)
Um, it IS an editorial... (Score:3, Informative)
Why did you bother Googling for him? If you look at the end of the article, it expressly states that he works for ATL. Now, howling about googling them and finding what flavor bastard is implied might be worthwhile, but don't make it seem like they were hiding something that they came right out and said themselves.
WTF Fox?!? Fair and balanced news indeed!
It's over in Fox's "Views" Department (note exact URL before clicking) [foxnews.com], making it an editorial-- or more exactly an "opinion" piece. (Editorials are written by on-staff editors. Opinions are written by anyone who wants to vent... much like Slashdot, actually.) Traditionally, Editorials and Opinion columnists are allowed much more latitude from the ideal of the neutral journalistic voice. Of course, traditionally editorial and opinion pieces are labeled much more clearly than Fox News does with theirs, so better to distinguish them from the more factual and less subjective elements of the news.
Re:Does it really matter what format you use? (Score:1, Informative)
Keep in mind these are BOTH Microsoft products yet Excel cannot import the old works spreadsheets. and without an old PC running an old version of MS Works so the sheets can be exported to Lotus 123 format so that Excel can then import the file and use it.. Does this really make sense to you ?
I won't bother to mention the various file format incompatibilities in the different versions of office.. Oh wait, too late...
a Standard file format that is Open so it can be implemented by anyone is a great step in the right direction. I look forward to many visionary companies embracing this move to enhance data interchange. and may help prevent these ancient file formats from becoming stale and unusable.
Looks Like Microsoft is Behind This One (Score:2, Informative)
Now I know why....
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Americ
We need to get in contact with Fox News and see that this stops here.
foxnewsonline@foxnews.com
gotta love google (Score:4, Informative)
Americans for Technology Leadership
Read all about the pro-Microsoft jobs they do:
here [sourcewatch.org]
Re:Fox News! (Score:3, Informative)
Fox News freely mixes opinion and fact without clearly differentiating between them, and often runs with the "talking points" published by a daily memo from the RNC - this is a known fact, not an opinion and not a speculation.
People who use them as their primary news source have been shown to disporportionately believe inaccurate things about reality that believing the wrong thing on supports the current administration. Such things as "Have we found WMD in Iraq?", "Was there a Link between Al Aqaeda and Iraq?", "Is there widespread international support of the War in Iraq?" - 70% of individuals that use fox news as their primary news source answer atleast one of these three incorrectly. [Source: PIPA Study]. Furthmore Individuals who hold misconceptions on these dispronportionately support(ed) the administion more than individuals who did not. [Source: PIPA Study] The breakdown of individuals holding these misconceptions was also extremely partisan with the vast majority of individuals holding th ese misconceptions being right-wing republicans. [Src: PIPA Study]
I cited the PIPA study because i have much of it's information memorized, but it's not the only study that shows this
Re:Relative FUD ? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Can you actually state (Score:3, Informative)
2) PDF being right out with this proposal? Do you even think about what you type? PDF is a generic format that is pretty much readable by anything that most people would be using. Word DOC format ISN'T, and as such, has no business in government procedures or documents- PERIOD. It's about being able to provide usable, consistent access to documents for decades in many cases. You can't do this with MS Office- PERIOD.
Re:Pendergast is a lobbyist. (Score:3, Informative)
From what I've understood, the government of Massachusetts isn't telling any consumer what they must use; goM is simply deciding that they will use OpenDocument from now on. It is certainly in the power of government to decide what file formats it uses internally, and what file formats it accepts and publishes data in; and even if it wasn't, they most certainly would have no obligation to use a Microsoft format over some other format.