BBC Launches Linux Powered Weather Format 214
nzkaha writes "BBC launches new weather format using Weatherscape XT. This may be one of the higher profile deployments of Linux based systems. Weatherscape XT supplies weather graphics for all UK BBC channels plus the BBC World Service. The system relies completely on openGL graphics and there are demonstration clips of the system in use at Metra.info . Developed in NZ by MetService as a cross platform system for Linux, OS X and Windows, the BBC solution has been deployed on Linux with MySQL DB. Data is replicated to remote studios and displayed live by the Weatherscape application using Nvidia Graphics and drivers. Future deployment options will depend on customer choice and platform support."
news credits (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:news credits (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:news credits (Score:2)
Re:news credits (Score:2, Interesting)
The new weather is an a
VR studio was great (Score:2)
The one thing I hate about most "modern" studio"s is the abundant use of plasma-sceens. These things are NEVER aligned properly with the rest of the design. I hate it. It's just more distracting clutter. Especially when they do live-interventions on these
Linux weather? (Score:3, Funny)
"Have a Sun-ny day! I'm Richard Stallman, and now for Mac Sports... take it away, Steve!"
not all that great... (Score:5, Informative)
People preferred the old format because it was clearer, didn't swoop around, and conveyed all the relevant information quickly and effectively. This new system is unnecessarily complicated and confusing.
Re:not all that great... (Score:3, Informative)
Annoucing: Google Weather (beta) (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Annoucing: Google Weather (beta) (Score:3, Informative)
No, pointless is standard English for without purpose. No Kiwi about it, and no euphony [princeton.edu] either, although the idea is amusing.
Surely you have heard, or asked, "What is the point of...?"
PS The word is euphemism.
Re:Annoucing: Google Weather (beta) (Score:3, Funny)
That should be terribly useful for people planning to picnic in tesseracts.
Re:not all that great... (Score:3, Interesting)
This is _not_ going to be good press for Linux...
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
Re:not all that great... (Score:4, Interesting)
The new "service" has been introduced on BBC World as well as in the UK. It looks horrible. It might be good if you're a climate scientist and want to watch animations of weather patterns. As far as I'm concerned, it's absolutely bloody useless for delivering information about the weather.
I really couldn't care less what they're running it on, the end result is that the Beeb is presenting something that emulates CNN Weather [cnn.com].
Oh, and the Forecast Cafe [bbc.co.uk] has some entertaining discussion.
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
Unless things stay exactly the same forever someone will complain (especially retired colnels in the Home Counties). Of course if they stay the same, someone will complain.
Re:not all that great...but wait (Score:2)
The old green colour was not only more pleasant to the eye, but more *ACCURATE*! Also, why do they have splodges that are darker than than others? I just think that looks terrible.
Re:not all that great... (Score:3, Informative)
Now that they've switched to a 3D globe representation, that distortion has been lost.
Re:not all that great... (Score:4, Informative)
No.
Here are the old and new weather maps [bbc.co.uk].
Here is a satellite photo of the UK [wikipedia.org].
Take Jersey and Shetland as an example. They're both about the same size on this map, but Shetland is far larger in real life.
Instead just use ... (Score:2)
Re:A TAF itself is not very useful (Score:2)
Ah, but for that you need a TV, which I don't have
Re:not all that great... (Score:3, Interesting)
To be fair, a cloud with raindrops beneath it and the sun edging round from the side which sat over most of central Scotland was never entirely clear either. What it said was: "Anything could happen." This was more representative of weather forecasting of days gone by, but it's constantly improving.
I've seen the new style, and I've watched with interest as the rain moves across the landscape. Yes, it still says anything could happen
Re:Huh? (Score:2)
Clearly you've not experienced the glorious weather we have here in the west of Scotland.
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
The new system shows the areas where rain is expected.
It would be greatly improved by better use of colour though, instead of making the entire country beige. Perhaps they were complaining about how PAL and NTSC have lower resolution in chroma than luma, but the relief can still be done in luma so I think it could be made t
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
Same old story (Score:2)
Cartographers spend centuries creating a vast toolbox of methods for representing the surface of the Earth
Re:not all that great... (Score:4, Insightful)
This is a crtical point that I think sheds some light on the whole fiasco. Far be it from
In the old system people would focus on the informative map in the background and pick up on the weather in their area. They'd tune in and out of what the presenter was saying as they talked about the UK weather, maybe picking up on something if they mentioned a place name near them or they said something of general importance. For the most part though, people would study the wind speed, temperature, front position and cloud cover for their area.
With the new style system, they've basically forced everyone to pay attention to them as they take the map on a stomach churning ride around the UK at a speed that doesn't allow most people to get any appreciation of the weather in their area. If you tune in too late to the report you'll have missed your chance to hear about the weather in your area at all.
Most disconcertingly, the camera only seems to stay still for a couple of seconds. For those that haven't seen it yet, imagine that the camera was on a piece of elastic. As it reaches its maximum extension near, say, Cornwall it slows...comes to a stop...then accelerates away.
That's pretty much the way they've set it up so far.
The astonishingly London-centric decision to set the camera angle such that viewers have to strain to even read the temperature in the north of the UK was just profoundly stupid. I think what was most disturbing was the way that they didn't seem to even understand what people were complaining about. I used to feel sorry for the BBC being shipped up in some numbers to Manchester (and I still think it'll all end in tears/yet more wasted license payers money) but now I'm not so sure that it isn't the right thing to do.
That's just a small overview of a few of the problems with the approach. Makes you worry about where the Beeb is really heading....
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
Remember: only 5million of the 60million people in the UK live in Scotland, and that number falls every year by about 100,000...
Re:not all that great... (Score:2)
Scotland
Population: 5.1 Million
England
Population: 50 Million
Look, if you are a fisherman god save you if you are basing your fishing job off a TV weather show. Radio 4 LW has special broadcasts just for this, or they can go on the numerous websites with very detailed graphics and information, all designed just for fishing.
I have many friends who live in the North of England and they are not 'offended' and to be honest I don't blame them for putting the SE at the front of
a heck of a long time is how long? (Score:2)
Time given is for a complete copy of the Wikipedia database from one replicating sl
DIY Weather Channel (Score:5, Interesting)
Connect a 137-138MHz FM communications receiver or scanner to your soundcard and get colour images directly from overhead weather satellites. You can either build your own like I did or just buy a receiver.
For an explanation try:
http://www.emgola.cz/www_fa/meteosat_englisch_how [emgola.cz]
and for a great tool: http://www.wxtoimg.com/ [wxtoimg.com]
Re:DIY Weather Channel (Score:2)
Everywhere around us we see the old-fashioned analog communication services being shut down and replaced by new digital systems with access control. Even in situations where there is no real need, encryption is used because it is easy in a digital system.
Re:DIY Weather Channel (Score:4, Informative)
Note that while there are only 2 active NOAA satellites, there's normally two older satellites still transmitting in backup duty.
After 2010 or so the HRPT (High resolution picture transmission) digital system will be the only system in use, which requires a tracking antenna and a digital reciever at 1700MHz. The HRPT signal is not encrypted though, and does give better resolution (1x1km vs 4x4km) and more image channels (5 instead of 2)
Re:DIY Weather Channel (Score:2, Informative)
Re:DIY Weather Channel (Score:2)
Why spend time on all that when you can use a web based weather feed?
Re:DIY Weather Channel (Score:2)
Since I am not located in the Meteosat's footprint, I don't know off-hand what it provides, but I strongly suspect that it's best products are not avilable via 137-138MHz downlink. You most likely only get the poor quality WEFAX (WEather FAX) images.
Needless to say, you can DIY a simple downlink if you want to directly get weather data but it is not a
Controversial (Score:5, Interesting)
from the few times I've seen it I haven't been impressed. it looks like a nice virtual atlas, but I never seem to come away with any actual info from it.
never mind, nowadays I get my weather from the OSX Dashboard widget.
Weather-lite (Score:2)
Re:Weather-lite (Score:2)
Re:Weather-lite (Score:2)
The problem is that the newer charts are good, but almost to realistic leading you to think that a rain storm will cross overhead at 15:00. Even now weather is about probabilities and too much precision can be misleading.
The only good thing about the format is that it does mix well with some
Re:Controversial (Score:2)
You say that as if it's a new phenomenon. Take a look at the stuff Sky News [skynewscentre.co.uk] has been putting out for as long as I've watched it. Yes, it has graphics just as detailed as the BBC's new ones, and the rain and weatherfronts move in realtime, but it somehow looks nicer and doesn't have a silly 3d angle. This stuff is not new, except maybe to BBC zealots who refuse to watch any other
Though you gotta wonder why the ominous name (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Though you gotta wonder why the ominous name (Score:2)
Two questions. (Score:5, Insightful)
2D seems much more precise. Where are all those raindrops falling? You can't tell from a still image.
There have been a lot of complaints about this (Score:5, Informative)
See here on the BBC News site for more comments [bbc.co.uk].
(PS - Go Liverpool for the cup)
Re:There have been a lot of complaints about this (Score:2)
Re:Two questions. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Two questions. (Score:2)
Re:Two questions. (Score:2)
You think the forecasters know? I've lost count of the number of times recently that the forecast has said rain and it's held off, or vice versa...
Re:Two questions. (Score:2)
It's an extra "D", man. You gotta crank it up to 3! Doesn't your area have a TV station with the graphical "weather car" that "drives" you across the state? I hear their competitors are working on 5D.
Just think of it as the PowerPoint generation coming of age. Yes, it is a total waste of time, and, yes, 2D makes a clearer graphic. But hey.....
So the question is... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:So the question is... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:So the question is...Were's an Atlas? (Score:2)
Re:So the question is...Were's an Atlas? (Score:2)
And of course they could use metric measurements so that the USians couldnt understand them anyway.
Why would linux users care? (Score:2)
That's MetService... (Score:5, Interesting)
... not MetaService.
You know, met as in meteorological, as in that wet stuff we tend to call weather in New Zealand.
There were a lot of complaints when they started using it on TV in New Zealand too, but now everybody's pretty much used to it. Really it was just an attempt to make the "boring weather bit" on the nightly news into something a bit more interesting from a visual point of view.
That's nice, but the new graphics are useless (Score:4, Insightful)
The new graphics sure are pretty and I love to see Linux deployed, but it's now not possible to enterpret the map.
The graphics move constantly, so by the time you've looked in the corner to see that the map is talking about mid-day on tuesday, the map has moved again. Also, the forecasts no longer include important information like isobars or wind speeds.
Re:That's nice, but the new graphics are useless (Score:2, Insightful)
Old map:
-Already paid for
-No complaints
-Lots of information/not dumbed down
-World famous
New map
-£1 million
-No-one can understand it
-Scotland feels left out
-Obviously dumbed down, less information
-World suddenly turns off BBC
-Has no style, doesn't fit BBC graphics style
-Linux rules
-Not even developed in the UK!
Re:That's nice, but the new graphics are useless (Score:2)
What does that have to do with anything?
Re:That's nice, but the new graphics are useless (Score:2)
Re:That's nice, but the new graphics are useless (Score:2)
Also, although they may look pretty, I'm not sure that the new graphics are running at 50 frames per second... they look more like they're at 25 fps, which is really rather poor.
Not that it matters that much on anything but HDTV given that the average TV is running at 24-30fps and the normal human eye struggles to tell the difference between most things faster than 30fps.
Re:That's nice, but the new graphics are useless (Score:2, Informative)
25 fps? That's the normal frame rate of PAL TV.
25 interlaced frames is not 50 deinterlaced frames. Interlaced means that the picture is made up of 2 half-frames, which is easier and cheaper to record, so It's 50 half frames.
Will it work on Trumpet WinSock? (Score:2)
I'm so glad there is finally some software out there that caters to everyone! I'm very happy with my Windows 3.1, and now that Trumpet Winsock is out the Internet is finally easy to access!
Whew... (Score:2)
Maybe this could be useful (Score:2)
This could encourage ATI to get off their ass and release some decent drivers for Linux.
Re:Maybe this could be useful (Score:2)
Spending two days trying to hunt down the kernel sources, kernel patches etc. just so the installer can compile a kernel module that still won't be recognised by the system, is not my idea of a smooth install.
Re:Maybe this could be useful (Score:2)
Re:Maybe this could be useful (Score:2)
If you are running Ubuntu then:
apt-get install linux-restricted-modules-(your running kernel) nvidia-glx
will also take care of you with no need to compile the kernel driver. Otherwise do the following:
apt-get install (kernel-headers that match your running kernel) nvidia-kernel-common debhelper dh-make
apt-cache search `uname -r` will spit out the header package you need.
If you are running a custom ke
Re:Maybe this could be useful (Score:2)
Turns out that the kernel module had the wrong kernel version name (2.6.11.1 instead of 2.6.11).
Editing version.h in the kernel source did the trick . (bit of a dirty hack, I know, but it seems to be running fine.)
Waiting for .ogg (Score:3, Interesting)
For those in the know; is it true that for a company like the BBC, adding another format like OGG considerably takes resources and time? If this is the case, slashdotters in the UK could volunteer valuable time and intellectual capital.
Re:Waiting for .ogg (Score:2)
They ran ogg streams of a few radio shows and stations for quite sometime, but had to pull them in the end.
It's not their fault, because unlike their news coverage (for example), the music they broadcast isn't their property. There is also the fact that the beeb doesn't work as one big company, different "divisions" have to pay other "divisions" for services.
Re:Waiting for .ogg (Score:2)
1) Speex isn't implemented by Real Producer/Server/Player yet so it is only good for broadband where the Vorbis codec can be used. The narrow-band streams need 8kbps audio streams.
2) Users need to have a recent version of Real Player. They probably have enough problems trying to get people to use Real Player at all with Microsoft constantly trying to cu
Re:Waiting for .ogg (Score:2)
I'm not sure this is a valid point... one of the reasons given is so that they focus on more modern services... such as online streaming I guess.
Re:Waiting for .ogg (Score:2)
VP3 patent license? (Score:2)
They won't, because Theora is too patented.
Haven't the VP3 patents that cover Theora been licensed for free use for any purpose by any person as a condition of getting the tech into Theora?
NHK tried this for a while in Japan (Score:2)
Dumbed Down T.V. Down Under. (Score:2)
NZ Version (Score:5, Informative)
People have mentioned a lack of isobars, wind direction, strength, muddy colours etc.
On our version we get an isobar map first, which shows the bars changing, fronts coming through etc. Then a broad sweep over the country showing weather effects like cloud/rain + temperature/wind info overlayed by town.
Then a close up on the major centres (6 are shown).
The weather is very nice showing what the temperature will go down to tonight, in the morning, and afternoon.
Perhaps the BBC is doing something different and leaving out some of the info we see here. That would be their decision.
As for the muddy colour of the map. Perhaps the British should wake up and realise that their green-and-pleasant land isn't a vibrant shade of green any more. AFAIK it uses true colour satillite images of the landscape. So that mud colour is what your country looks like.
Re:NZ Version (Score:2)
Maybe on your version it does, but this [epsaweb.org] is a satellite image of the UK. OK, so its not all green, but the majority is.
The brown colour was apparently chosen for clarity, as it provides more contrast for the overlay of the graphics. This is necessary because they show cloud just by a shadow on the map (no cloud pictures).
Not Quite the same (Score:3, Informative)
The big difference is the code base & design philosophy.
The TVNZ one is the original & alot older ( '96 written ), based on a web UI, using perl scripts to start up & trigger events ( unix signals ) & hand drawn regions for clouds, able to be tweaked every hour, generally every 6, then interpolated in real time. It also is tightly coupled data
Re:NZ Version (Score:2)
Hey, when you have millions of people who support your organization blindly and without question, assuming that yours is always 'the best in broadcasting', and a culture secretary assuring you that the abolition of your free-ride licence fee is "between improbable and impossible" [bbc.co.uk], who cares about accountability?
Pity it's shit (Score:3, Informative)
TWW
Great Technology - badly implemented (Score:3, Informative)
It is also very reliable, I can only remember a few times when it failed to work properly, mainly due to poor operators rather than a machine crashing.
The BBC has done a terrible job of it- they have made Britain a dull brown colour, (its is quite a green and pleasant land outside London!) the animation is hard to follow and they don't show clouds- just their shadows.
They are about to fine tune it tomorrow from the feedback they have received, so we'll see what they come up with. In any case its a vast improvement from the "sunny, with some rain" forecasts of old...
The new forecast is horrible and I hate it (Score:2)
In my case, I fly hang gliders and I sail. The BBC has said that "isobars will still be shown where helpful to viewers". Which viewers? I need the isobars shown every time. I feel like paradi
Re:The new forecast is horrible and I hate it (Score:2)
TV weather doesn't even tell you where the cloud bases are going to be or what the
Heh (Score:5, Funny)
Linux users rejoice at finally knowing what the weather's like outside!
Re:Heh (Score:2)
Linux users rejoice at finally knowing what the weather's like outside!
but i have windows, you insensitive clod!
Re:Heh (Score:2)
Then look out the window, yeesh!!
Bad new look of BBC TV weather forecasts (Score:2)
Now instead of that they are using cheap-looking fly-over views of Britain generated from a weirdly chosen vantage point somewhere over North Africa(!) which has the effect of making Scotland look tiny in the view compared to the south of England.
Even worse, they now use animated rain drops w
Re:Bad new look of BBC TV weather forecasts (Score:2)
But it is tiny, in terms of number of viewers. There must be four times as many viewers in the south of england as in scotland, why should scots get more of the screenspace (or more of the tax money, or more of the members of parliament) than those in the south?
:ducks:
Not a project to trumpet involvement with (Score:3, Informative)
(1) Even by its own criteria it does not work well. In terms of presenting information it is a disaster. Masterfully clear and concise icons evolved over decades have been ditched for a series of children's animations that manage to be both impenetrable and suggestive of absurd accuracy at the same time.
(2) Worse though is the BBC's retreat from providing an informative and educational forecast. Over decades skilled forecaster-presenters subtlety explained synoptic charts and the large scale weather story so that the UK weather - and the uncertainty in that forecast - was skillfully conveyed. This meant that you were never in dark - rain not arrived by lunchtime? the front must have slowed, it will be along later.
Now there is no structure or intelligence to the forecast - it is a goldfish view of the weather. One result of this was that, regardless of education, many could make a basic interpretation of isobars, etc: quite possibly the only scientific chart they would encounter. I am not sure that losing this literacy is a good thing.
And why have they done all this? It is a puzzle: the bbc web page condenses the rationale to "Today's media industry is like a shark, either you keep moving forward or you are dead in the water.". Perhaps the weather forecast, previously a high point of the BBC's output - has been handed over those who design programme idents and trailers.
high profile? (Score:2)
Good lord, I thought we'd made more progress than that!
(In truth, we have. Linux is running lots of critical systems, and people know this.)
Low profile is often better. (Score:2)
Similar trend in Kansas (Score:2)
Let's face it - weather is usually BORING, and can usually be summed up in very few words: "It was sunny and hot today. Tomorrow will be sunny and hot at first, with the possibility of storms in the evening. Over the next week it will probably be sunny and hot, with possible storms in the evenings, until midweek, when it may rain."
However, since "news" is no longer news but infotainment, t
Re:Similar trend in Kansas (Score:2)
In Kansas, maybe that's true... in the UK, you really can't expect the weather to stay the same for more than a few hours at a time.
Of course over there you get the occasion
Re:Similar trend in Kansas (Score:2)
However, *normally* the weather is such that the average Kansas is just as able to predict it as the meteorologists on TV for all that matters - what will happen in the next couple of hours.
And as for our signature piece - again, any Kansas can look at the skys and say either "No immediate threat" or "Uhhhh....", and most of us have s [google.com]
Re:Similar trend in Kansas (Score:2)
As a license payer, I am ashamed... (Score:2)
Seriously, I have not met a single person with a single good thing to say about the new-look weather at the BBC.
For a couple of years, I've been silently congratulating the BBC for their clear, no-nonsense style when all around (ITV, yes, I'm talking about you) were changing to stupid, over-detailed, animated rubbish.
Looks like I should have been less silent about it.
As far as I can tell, the new maps are the product of someone at the BBC graphics department
Re:Just no.. (Score:2)
The problem with the old symbols is that you would get one symbol for the whole of Kent, which is one of the reasons weather forecasts are perceived as being inaccurate. The new system, whilst not without some problems, can at least show that it is dry in Dover when it's raining 15 miles away in Canterbury.
Reading through the complaints on the BBC website it seems the single biggest issue the public had was the colour of the map. After all, England is supposed to be a "green and pleasant land [newi.ac.uk]". This is
Re:Just no.. (Score:2, Insightful)