Cuba Switching to Linux 1149
Tony Montana writes "According to several news sites the government of Cuba is dumping Windows in favour of Linux. Cuba's director of information technology, Roberto del Puerto, says that Cuba already has approximately 1500 computers running on Linux, and is working towards replacing Windows on all state owned computers."
Are they really? (Score:4, Interesting)
I think this snippet sums up a lot of the recent Linux "migration" stories:
Which is sad, since I've had a fairly painless transition to Linux a few years ago. Given the state of WINE these days, there's very little that a Linux-only box can't do that a Wintel box can.
Nah (Score:3, Interesting)
That's cool... (Score:5, Interesting)
No surprise (Score:2, Interesting)
((invasion-happy US Govn't) * (API-hiding OS vendor)) ** (US Govn't allows OS Vendor to violate it own laws) = (run forest run)
Re:You consider this a win? (Score:3, Interesting)
Another reason is that putting any political agendas in software licenses is not leagally right (You can put them there of cource, but they have no effect)
Now wait a darn minute (Score:3, Interesting)
Linux might not be as good a fit as they think... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Lets start counting (Score:2, Interesting)
how many people will make a comment about communism and linux....
The FSF are denigrated as communists, yet they emphasize the free as in freedom of GNU/Linux constantly. It is ironic that the real communists want to use GNU/Linux because it is free as in beer.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:3, Interesting)
Windows 98 license says: (Score:5, Interesting)
7. EXPORT RESTRICTIONS. If this EULA is not labeled and the SOFTWARE PRODUCT is not identified as "North America Only Version" above, on the Product Identification Card, or on the SOFTWARE PRODUCT packaging or other written materials, then the following terms apply: You agree that you will not export or re-export the SOFTWARE PRODUCT to any country, person, or entity subject to U.S. export restrictions. You specifically agree not to export or re-export the SOFTWARE PRODUCT: (i) to any country to which the U.S. has embargoed or restricted the export of goods or services, which as of March 1999 include, but are not necessarily limited to Cuba, Iran, Iraq, Libya, North Korea, Sudan and Syria, or to any national of any such country, wherever located, who intends to transmit or transport the SOFTWARE PRODUCT back to such country; (ii) to any person or entity who you know or have reason to know will utilize the SOFTWARE PRODUCT or portion thereof in the design, development or production of nuclear, chemical or biological weapons; or (iii) to any person or entity who has been prohibited from participating in U.S. export transactions by any federal agency of the U.S. government. You warrant and represent that neither the BXA (as defined below) nor any other U.S. federal agency has suspended, revoked or denied your export privileges.
Re:WMDs (Score:1, Interesting)
Here's an interesting note, Audioslave played in Habana a couple of weeks ago to a crowd of 70,000 people. It was a few show. I thought that was kinda neat.
The saddest thing is that Castro really screwed things up. Cuba was one of the 3 wealthiest countries in the Western hemi-sphere along with the U.S. and Argentina. What a shame.
I am just curious to know... (Score:5, Interesting)
Microsoft is an American corporation, it isn't legally allowed to profit from or provide goods or services that are shipped to Cuba. If I am understanding the US Trade Embargo correctly...
Re:Positive Image (Score:5, Interesting)
Its tough to leave Cuba, its true, but even if you could leave Cuba would the US willingly accept everyone, provide them with green cards and citizenship etc? People risk death for a multitude of reasons, and its not just to escape the Castro boogey-man. I also submit that Cuban boat-people refugees make good media copy, but represent a small statistical segment of a) refugees risking entry to the US and b) segment of the Cuban population.
For the record, I've been to Cuba, toured the countryside ~alone~, and have been invited into people's homes and had dinner with 'normal' people. They're not living in constant fear of the Gestapo, they're not starving poor, and they're not uneducated hicks.
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:1, Interesting)
Their logic is: "We aren't allowed to have this, so we can't pay for it even if we wanted to".
The amount of pirated software/music/movies floating around Cuba is impressive. No one I have ever met down there has paid a copyright owner anything even indirectly. The closest they may have come would be if a RIAA or similar copyright owner vacationed in Cuba and bartered some CDs in exchange for cigars.
Re:Países tercermundistas... (Score:4, Interesting)
Third-world countries...
This are one more of the migrations than they will occur on the part of the third-world Latinoamericános countries (desire not to be contemptuous, since I am of Mexico).
This migration of Windows towards Linux in these countries (on the part of the GOVERNMENT) will occur for several reasons, first, because the countries will wish to spend less// in software, or símplemente to obtain _ more value by its money _ (as for me I believe that that is Linux, since although the TCO is equal or superior, long term Linux offers better valos than any propietary platform).
On the other hand, the governments also will wish to separate of Windows since is a fastening towards the American government (you do not have that Word do you), although Microsoft is directly not bound to the government, indiréctamente having licenses of software of this company promuebe the economic dependency of the country towards the United States.
Finally, the governments will begin to use Free Software within their systems by the nature of the same one, that is to say, the capital inverted in Free Software is a capital that goes (or can go diréctamente) towards the people who develop software and also the generated technologies disposition of ALL the citizens has left directly. Thus, a government can contribute bottoms for the development of some product that consider necessary (simpelemente to way of/bounty/) and see obtain the necessary programs.
This last one is plus a reason that I have thought. As citizen I would prefer that my taxes were used to subsidize Free Software instead of subsidizing to a Estadounidense company. And it is precise to indicate that between the Latin American citizens there is a resentment towards the government North American at issue economic (good... and in other questions who do not come to the subject).
As for me, it seems to me excellent that Cuba is optador by Linux, although like other people have written, in Cuba was not possible "To buy" Windows, but I am sure that the use of Linux in Cuba will generate a strong aid to the development of the same software, since Cuba has people and minds very, very able.
In addition, I must express that I would like much that my country (Mexico) followed the same route, although desafortunádamente Miguel de Icaza did not know to raise the situation (E-Mexico) arguing for the Costs like the advantage of Linux on the propietary software.
That is everything, I hope that it does not bother my commentary to them in Spanish, but, I considered pertienente.
Re:That's cool... (Score:5, Interesting)
And maybe you should keep in mind that a lot of these "innocent" dissendents that are being arrested were or are actively plotting to overthrow the Cuban govenment, or even the assasination of Castro. Look at that shady CIA Posada character that's here in the U.S. now for a great example of one of those "innocent" dissidents.
I suppose you think the U.S. government wouldn't arrest people plotting the overthrow of the government or the assasination of the president?
-Eric
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:I am just curious to know... (Score:5, Interesting)
Cuba used Windows. But they can't legally purchase Windows from Microsoft due to trade embargo, so they pirate it.
Now, Cuba does not want Windows any more. They want Linux.
So MS should be delighted that Cuba is no longer pirating their software. It's a win-win situation. I can't wait to hear MSs take on this.
Re:That's cool... (Score:3, Interesting)
> dicatorship and Cuba is a magical wonderland of sharing and human kindness.
It's Slashdot, where some people are aware that America has tried to murder the Cuban head of state several times. Can you imagine how the US would have reacted had Saddam Hussein acted the same way. I don't think that one would have been taken to the UN before action was launched. The lesson we learn from this is `might makes right`.
That still doesn't explain... (Score:3, Interesting)
If the copies are illegal and thus MS is not profiting off of them. Nobody in Cuba should be able to run Windows Update.
If the copies are legal, then MS Windows Update should check for and disallow any Windows running PCs from Cuba to access and run updates.
I am just saying...
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:That's cool... (Score:3, Interesting)
Cuba would be a de facto 51st state in less than 5 years if we dropped the embargo. Even if Castro remained in power (doubtful, but possible), in the end the country would become a democracy and Castro would eventually die and go to the flaming dung pits in Hell to hang with Mao and Stalin.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:2, Interesting)
Yes, the US has tried to kill Castro in the past. Yes there is an embargo in place. However, Castro himself is responsible for the great ills within Cuba. Yes, Cuba has a greater percentage of people who can read than other Caribbean countries. What good is that when all you can read are paens to Castro or descriptions of how evil the US is? Yes, Cuba has many trained doctors, but can they stock basic medicines?
Every time I see some goofball walking around with a Che Guevara t-shirt, I want to shake him by the shoulders and say, "Do you know this guy threw people into camps and then had them shot?"
Castro "nationalized" American-owned businesses when he came to power. One may argue that the property was stolen by the Americans from the Cuban people to begin with. I would argue that no business is a charity, and that if Castro really wanted foreign investment he could allow it. But he really doesn't want it, he wants to maintain all power. Besides, who would invest money in a place where the government could seize it at will.
Castro is a terrible leader with a terrible management style. He micromanages everything in the country and, as a result, nothing of any consequence gets done without his approval. So as a consequence nothing gets done. For a time no private enterprise was allowed at all. No private workshops were allowed. So what does this mean in practical terms? As one PBS special put it, "Fixing a toaster became a matter of state."
He looks for silver bullets to "fix" the countries economic problems. He declared, "Cuba will make more cheese than Switzerland" and came up with this goofy, naive, expensive program to turn Cuba into a giant dairy farm. When the cows got sick he moved onto some other program. He decided then that Cuba needed to produce the "Highest Amount of Sugar Cane EVER!!" He pulled kids out of schools and generally disrupted society for a year so that everone could produce sugar, and they didn't meet their goal. He fought and funded a war in Angola. He tried to become the leader of the entire third world instead of fixing the problems in his own country.
Now, after 46 years of rule, if Castro is not responsible for the problems of Cuba then no one is.
(oh, and if that guy blew up a plane he should get sent back for trial, the US should not harbor terrorists)
Re:Are you talking about the US or Cuba? (Score:3, Interesting)
I have lived for a number of years in America, though, and my experience is that ordinary citizens there aren't afraid of their government(s) in the same way that they are in Cuba. Any comparison in terms of repressiveness between the two countries is largely silly, even despite the current overreaction to terrorism. There's a spectrum of human rights issues, and no country on Earth is perfect, and particularly no English-speaking country (if there was one, I would live there). Smooshing the spectrum to make all violations equal to each other is only useful as an extremist rhetorical tactic.
I don't buy the pot smoker comparison, either: show me the pot smoker (not dealer) who is in jail for one to four years for mere possession of single-person quantities. At least such a person committed a crime, though, even if it shouldn't be a crime: they get due process under the law, unlike Cubans imprisoned for pre-crimes. You can't have due process when you don't know what actions might trigger your arrest and imprisonment.
Regarding US imprisonment rates, that seems to be largely a racial thing [wisc.edu]. Amazing how long the legacy of slavery has lasted. So yes, it can suck to be black in America. In Cuba, it sucks to be Cuban.
The Real Cuba (Score:3, Interesting)
If you want to know more about what life is really like in Cuba, check out this web page and read about human rights violations:
http://therealcuba.com/ [therealcuba.com]
This is also a particularly good time to keep an eye on news coming out of Cuba because tomorrow a large group of dissidents in the island are preparing to meet despite goverment opposition in what they are calling the Assembly to Promote Civil Society [asambleaso...lcuba.info].
Others here have mentioned how people are not allowed Internet access. But it doesn't stop there. Books are censored too. People who try to operate private libraries [friendsofc...raries.org] from their homes are often arrested and have had their books confiscated and destroyed.
The stories go on and on. I could tell you about my relatives who were arrested for buying or selling things like meat or car tires. Or my own father who jumped from a moving train to escape his military captors because they were going to make him face a firing squad for handing out anti-Castro propaganda. It amazes me how little of this is known or covered in the news.
Re:You consider this a win? (Score:3, Interesting)
The great counter-example: Microsoft and their infamous Word EULA, stating that the software may not be used to write anything critical of Microsoft. Once you start down the road of "you can't use my software unless you think exactly like me," where does it stop?
<Yoda Voice>
Dark Side that way lies!
</Yoda Voice>
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
She went to school one day, and the class was told to bow their heads and pray to God for some candy. After they did that, they waited for a while - no candy. Then the class was told to bow their heads and pray to Castro for candy - then a government worker handed each of them a piece of candy. Brainwashing starts in kindergarden in Cuba - she was in that class.
Perhaps what the US is doing is also bad (though I personally beleive that placating evil is to become evil yourself), but Cuba cannot claim the moral high ground either.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Hatians more free. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Can Microsoft even legally sell Windows in Cuba (Score:1, Interesting)
Now, hands up here everyone that's read copyright/patent law, ok, and how many of you know that the US government is exempted from any copyright/patent that it wishes to use? Yep, that's right, Uncle Sam has no requirement to respect the intellectual property they recognise, and can use it for their own means. This isn't to imply in any way that they do, but the loophole is sitting right there.
It's just as likely that Cuba buys their software and hardware legitimately, though non-US suppliers, all because of a couple of Senators that have a bug up their collective ass about property expatriation back in 1957.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:2, Interesting)
Communist Part (Score:2, Interesting)
Amazing...
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
Interesting. When I was at school in Britain, every morning we said a prayer to God. In America I believe your kids pledge allegance to the flag of the United States of America. Now you might just accept that as a normal thing, but from this side of the pond that looks rather like like "brainwashing starting in kindergarten."
Sure, but a daily prayer to god is also a form of brainwashing starting in kindergarten on your side. I mean, if it weren't for brainwashing, how would anyone believe in this "god" concept as being an unassailable, yet unverifiable truth?
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
In about 3rd or 4th grade I tried not participating, just staying quietly in my seat, and was scolded for it. I figured if I pushed the issue they'd drop it, but at that age I didn't have the strength of conviction to do it on principle alone. From then on I stood quietly with my hands behind my back, which, evidently, was acceptable.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:2, Interesting)
Just for my own amusement, I counted the number of times each speaker (the high school principal, various members of the administrative and teaching staff) mentioned God or faith, and compared it to the number of times they mentioned learning or education.
Afterwards I had to take a shower. I honestly don't think anyone else noticed - except possibly a Hindu gentleman, who was clearly as uncomfortable as I was.
It's gotten noticeably worse since the WTC atrocity; there are "God Bless America" stickers all over the damned place. And every school in the district still says "under God" in the pledge of allegiance every morning, and the atheist kids who won't say the pledge still get beaten up by their peers just like they did when I was a child.
Re:cuba facts (Score:2, Interesting)
Even if not executed, being jailed in Castro's Cuba is not exactly a joyride. Amnesty International's annual reports (http://www.amnestyusa.org/countries/cuba/index.d
Fidel may not be responsible for all the ills of Cuban society. But he is responsible for the political system's consistent oppression of the cuban people. I'm not here to defend the embargo, but I certainly don't have any affection for bully and won't waste any time trying to figure out what percentage of the oppression is his fault. Cuba Libre... But it won't happen under Castro (Fidel or Raoul).
Re:cuba facts (Score:3, Interesting)
Also, the Castros can't last too much longer; even the younger brother, Raoul, is almost 74 (Fidel is 78). Frequently, the passing of an oppressive leader heralds in major reforms - lets hope that this is the case in Cuba.
Re:Nice Anti-Usian Propaganda, Now Some Facts (Score:3, Interesting)
Top tax rates in the US and many European countries are actually comparable. Perhaps the biggest difference is that European governments are fiscally more conservative than the US and still manage to provide more services with the money they do have available. How that reality translates into your myth of "European socialists" is a mystery to me.
The US gov't's problem with Cuba is narrowly limited to its practice of oppression.
That's total bullshit--the US has no qualms about doing business with far more oppressive regimes than Cuba. Furthermore, lots of other nations have serious concerns about US treatment of its own citizens, but that doesn't give them the right to launch assassination attempts against US heads of state or to orchestrate economic embargoes against the US.
Re:Lets start counting (Score:3, Interesting)
As an American atheist, your custom looks pretty much the same from here.