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EDS' Secret Love For Linux Laid Bare 171

Posted by Zonk
from the wearing-flip-flops dept.
Ashcrow writes "'Only a day after flaming open source as insecure, unscalable and unfit for Australian consumption in its Agility Alliance, services vendor EDS has revealed it really does have a soft spot for the penguin deep in its heart.' Apparently the 'Linux environment provides a level of security and stability unavailable elsewhere' which differs from that they had said earlier."
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EDS' Secret Love For Linux Laid Bare

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:40PM (#11980881)
    Now let's all hug.
  • by ackthpt (218170) * on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:40PM (#11980882) Homepage Journal
    Only a day after flaming open source as insecure, unscalable and unfit for Australian consumption in its Agility Alliance, services vendor EDS has revealed it really does have a soft spot for the penguin deep in its heart.

    Left hand, meet right hand. We'll introduce you to brain later.

    In other news: EDS global vice president for Agility Alliance Rob Rasmussen was found not to be scalable.

    An anonymous insider said, "We still give him rubber pencils and an Etch-A-Sketch for a laptop, he's getting better about drooling, too."

    • Ha ha!

      Or more to the point, I believe EDS has demonstrated themselves to be unreliable and unscalable...
    • by Anonymous Coward
      Etch-a-Sketch technology eh, sounds like most of the UK Government contracts they've developed. :-)
    • by Apathetic1 (631198) on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:55PM (#11981006) Journal

      We'll introduce you to brain later.

      You haven't worked there, have you?

    • by eomnimedia (444806)
      Be careful what you wish for...give someone enough time and an Etch-A-Sketch and you'll end-up with this [gvetchedintime.com].
    • by demachina (71715) on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:04PM (#11981067)
      Agility Alliance is mostly an attempt by EDS in particular to form a consortium to counter IBM and its love affair with Linux. They offer Solaris Server's(SUN), Windows Desktops(Microsoft), and Cisco just wants to sell their Chinese made routers to anyone and will probably kiss up to IBM five minutes after walking out of the Agility Alliance press conference.

      EDS is just trying to be anti IBM, and since IBM is pro Linux that means their competitive analysis team unwisely told them to be rabidly anti Linux whether it made any sense or not. Obviously it didn't make much sense. Big consulting companies might form preferences, and offer recommendations, but they are supposed to pick the best solution for job and be willing to be open minded enough to offer the technology the customer wants.

      To put it another way by bashing Linux to this extent EDS has:

      A. Shown to their potential customers they have a religious bias, which will preclude them from being a good consultant.

      B. Shot themselves in the foot for any contract competition where Linux is prefered by the customer.
      • The anti-Linux comments from EDS didn't sound rabid to me, just like a sales pitch for Solaris.

        The conflicting claims make EDS look a bit stupid, but I don't think most objective people think criticism of Linux 'shows religious bias', even if it's vague and perhaps invalid.

        • "just like a sales pitch for Solaris."

          Yes, well, the difference between a sales pitch for Solaris and a rabid flame is sometimes hard to tell.

          But of course, it's been that way for as long as I can recall, so if you're used to it it wont sound that out of place.
    • You know, I hear Oracle is part of that group, now.

      [ducks]
    • Hm.. just sounds like EDS was just frivolous and changed their mind frequently: the real question is which were they more serious about, or do they really have what we might call an inconsistent view?

      Another possibility is that their executives were assimilated into the collective and replaced with duplicates, robots built to look like the humans, or clones to do the Linux community's bidding. (e.g.)

  • by Valiss (463641)
    Apparently Linux, in addition to providing a level of security and stability unavailable elsewhere, seems to be free!

    In related news, [insert MS joke regarding costing too much and not being nearly as secure].
  • by Dark Paladin (116525) * <jhummel@@@johnhummel...net> on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:45PM (#11980923) Homepage
    They'll pretty much say or do whatever people pay them to say or do.

    Wear the nun outfit and spank them with a floppy? Sure, they'll do that.

    Call you "Mommy" while wearing a swimsuit? For the right price, they're yours!

    And to say that Linux is good one day, and insecure the next, well, that's just another whore transaction. All in a day's work for EDS, I guess.
    • "Billable Hours" (Score:4, Informative)

      by gvc (167165) on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:53PM (#11980986)
      EDS is a consulting firm. They sell "billable hours." If those billable hours result in an accurate study or a system that works it is strictly because the individuals whose hours were billed happen to do a good job.
      • Sadly it has come to that at EDS. There are pockets of competence (I rub shoulders with a few), but over the last 10 years Dick Brown and other stock option milking Texans have squeezed it out of the corporation.

        This sort of about face should be no surprise. In Brown's last year before they sent him on his way tens of millions richer he explained a 1st quarter shortfall was due to the desktop services area which was impossible to make profitable and expecting a very short analyst attention span touted de

    • They'll pretty much say or do whatever people pay them to say or do.

      Well, in this case they deployed it in house and were sounding rather pleased with the outcome. But it's definitely a rapid turn-around.


      Wear the nun outfit and spank them with a floppy? Sure, they'll do that.

      Yeah, every salesman I've ever met would be all over that if they could book the revenue (and get their comission) this quarter.
    • They'll pretty much say or do whatever people pay them to say or do.
      Wear the nun outfit and spank them with a floppy? Sure, they'll do that.
      Call you "Mommy" while wearing a swimsuit? For the right price, they're yours!
      And to say that Linux is good one day, and insecure the next, well, that's just another whore transaction. All in a day's work for EDS, I guess.


      Wow, I don't know what to write. Somehow a story about EDS and their opinions on Linux has brought up:

      nun's in outfits spanking floppi

    • + 5 Funny? I would have said Insightful. Well, OK, maybe it's more Master-of-the-Obvious than Insightful. But you get the point, AOL!

      (mumbles to self, walks off to sit in corner next to shopping cart and bags of cans...)
  • by Andyvan (824761) on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:47PM (#11980931)
    In their case study, they state "Linux environment provides a level of security and stability unavailable elsewhere". Maybe that level is lower, not higher? ;-)
  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:47PM (#11980937)
    "I was against Linux before I voted for it"
  • by winkydink (650484) * <sv.dude@gmail.com> on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:47PM (#11980940) Homepage Journal
    Both will tell you just what you want to hear and do just about anything to make a buck.
    • by Anonymous Coward
      No...

      When a prostitute "finishes" with you, at least you got what you paid for.

      With EDS, you have to hire six more prostitutes just to maybe be able to get an erection again.

      In six months, after spending $20 million.

      Oh, and if they can find your original penis.

  • EDS - IT Provider of The Beast

    I'm just another happy EDS/NMCI end user.
    I'm sooo sooo happy I might start laughing and never stop.

    *Tries to strangle himself with ethernet cable*
    • I've heard that NMCI charges you a per-seat lease in addition to a flat fee site contract, and at least one site contract I know of involves giving ridiculous amounts of equipment to NMCI essentially for free.

      So they are paying NMCI money to have NMCI lease their own equipment to them. This includes quite a few high-end LCD monitors.

      And the rollout is something like nine months late, but NMCI still gets paid...

      I've also heard that EDS are whores, and that they'll say anything you want them to.

      But I

      • It's ridiculous! You're right about the lease, and them getting all of our "legacy" equipment. NMCI is the biggest burden I've ever had to deal with. Being the local IT, I'm prohibited from touching anything to do with it, and have next to zero rights. Typically when a customer has a problem, I have to submit a trouble ticket, which will eventually reach the local NMCI techs who will come and address the problem. Unfortunately this is usually a week+ later. Also if we need to add a printer, workstation, etc
        • I can confirm that the civilian contractors don't like NMCI either. I worked on the contract on and off for over a year and I have never seen anything as unorganized as the mess EDS made. It drove the civilian contractors nuts too. Nothing but lies. Your work schedule would change on a day to day basis, then they would screw up your hours and your pay and there was no way to fix it and then you would get laid off for a month or two. The sad thing... EDS loses money on the contract... if you are leasing
        • If you want your real job back, start documenting. If they're as bad as you say it shouldn't take too long for you to have enough data to prove it. Be sure to include a side-by-side comparison of how long it would take you to do the same thing, and if you're able to determine your burden rate, so you can give actual costs, that's even better.

          Now for my related annecdote: at my previous company some manager decided they wanted to outsource my department (or as much of it as they could, anyway). When writing
    • Evil Data Systems indeed.

      I have a NMCI computer on my desk that I log into it once a day to read my email. Expensive email reader. The rest of my work is done on my "legacy" machine where I can actually install open source and propriety specialized tools I need.

      In addition NMCI moved our lan server to over 2000 miles away. Now our NMCI machines are "click and wait" for most operations - makes me long for my 286 days.

      Our activity is still maintaining the "legacy" network and will continue to do so. So
  • Jeez (Score:3, Funny)

    by TupperTrenine (803932) on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:49PM (#11980956)
    Is it even necessary to try and make a joke at the expense of the article title?
  • Obligatory quote (Score:2, Insightful)

    by kko (472548)
    MARLA: You fuck me, then snub me. You love me, you hate me. You show me your sensitive side, then you turn into a total asshole! Is that a pretty accurate description of our relationship, Tyler?

    JACK (V.O.): We've just lost cabin pressure.
  • by bunyip (17018) on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:53PM (#11980980)
    We have many hundreds of Linux boxes in our data center, run by EDS. We have a cluster of about 150 4-way Opteron machines, as well as several other clusters. This is in the US.

    I also need to say that our support for Linux & MySQL from the EDS team supporting us has been excellent.

    I was disappointed by the comments earlier this week, doubly so as I'm an Australian. I thought my countrymen would have smarter things to say about Linux...

    Alan.
    • by Art Tatum (6890) on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:48PM (#11981309)
      I was disappointed by the comments earlier this week, doubly so as I'm an Australian. I thought my countrymen would have smarter things to say about Linux...

      Why? Just because you have nationality in common? I'm American and half of my countrymen are frothing idiots. I won't tell you which ones--just pick the ones you like least and let them be "it." I'm not that interested in letting you know where I stand. You'd probably hate me for it anyway.


    • How are those Opterons working under Linux? I have a friend who turns his nose up at anything that isn't Intel. Says that if you want to get anything from AMD running with linux you always end up having to apply patches and special tweaks.
  • I'd rate this a +6: Potentially Misconstrued based solely on the title.

    Kudos to the submitter, propz unlimited and all that.

  • by geomon (78680) on Friday March 18, 2005 @07:54PM (#11980994) Homepage Journal
    I wonder why anyone would listen to EDS about anything.

    After all, they don't even listen to themselves.

  • Same that happends with SCO and others.

    They never had a legitim bussiness (or they did in the past, but now it's gone), so they are paid to spread FUD; and would just do anything to take the last bucks out of their company.
  • by l0perb0y (324046) on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:00PM (#11981039) Homepage
    Just after reading about EDS bashing Linux, I read this [rockymountainnews.com] article. about the myriad of glitches in EDS's software for the Colorado welfare office that is going to cost millions to fix.

    Now, they do say that colorado pushed the go live faster than was recommended, but the point is that EDS might not be the one to talk about stability and flexibility.
  • As I said here [slashdot.org] and as others have commented about. I guess now that SCO is mostly off the radar, we have a new 3 letter company to make fun of and hate.
  • by labratuk (204918) on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:10PM (#11981108)
    I really want to know how these 'Alliances' and think-tanks get formed in the first place. Does Sun come to IBM and say something like:

    Sun: Hey, wan't to go in with us on this joint think tank and study group? It will do industry analysis for all of us and we can get them to voice our opinons through their reports. I have a few friends I can pay to sit around and write articles.

    IBM: Wait, whose opinions would these be? Yours or ours?

    Sun: Does it matter?

    IBM: Not really. Ok, I'm in.

    Microsoft: Hey, my nephew's a philosophy major and is having trouble finding a job. He's quite a good writer - do you think you could get him a job in it?

    Sun: Sure.

    IBM: Wait, aren't we all mortal enemies?
    • Wow, there are a bunch of typos in there which I apologise for profusely.
    • Re:I want to know (Score:3, Interesting)

      Agility Alliance is a group consisting of EDS, Sun, Microsoft, and others mostly to battle IBM's IGS. Yes, they are mortal enemies, but in this case, it's the whole "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" thing.

      between posting on /. and actually writing code at work, i like to make good use of company time by um.. "dropping the kids off at the pool". During these "meditation sessions", i read whatever year old magazine or trade journal someone else dragged in there. today i happened to read a story about E
  • by sribe (304414) on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:17PM (#11981149)
    Look what Colorado got from EDS for our $200,000,000 in taxpayer money:

    Benefits plan assailed [rockymountainnews.com] - Lawsuit targets benefit system [rockymountainnews.com] - Benefits program hits predicted snags [rockymountainnews.com] - Loss of aid to poor feared [rockymountainnews.com] - Computer causing headache, heartache [rockymountainnews.com] - Computer upgrade in works [rockymountainnews.com] - Donate food, mayor urges [rockymountainnews.com] - Judge: Keep system running [rockymountainnews.com] - Company has other unhappy customers [rockymountainnews.com] - Computer glitch costly [rockymountainnews.com] - Food drives ramping up over weekend [rockymountainnews.com] - Pressure to go online [rockymountainnews.com] - Mixed results on rollout [rockymountainnews.com] - Living on the edge [rockymountainnews.com] - Glitch leaves poor out in cold [rockymountainnews.com] - Benefits system lawsuit revived [rockymountainnews.com] - Old system assisted payroll [rockymountainnews.com] - Woman desperate to get meds for son [rockymountainnews.com] - Needy could wait months for welfare benefits [rockymountainnews.com] - Federal report blasts state welfare backlog [rockymountainnews.com] - Benefits battle boiling [rockymountainnews.com] - Letter blasts benefits system [rockymountainnews.com] - Demand for food 'unprecedented' [rockymountainnews.com] - Consultant derides new benefit system [rockymountainnews.com] - Nursing home 'crisis' [rockymountainnews.com] - Counties faulted on benefits [rockymountainnews.com] - Mother deals with confusion on benefits [rockymountainnews.com] - Lawyers wrap up arguments on benefits system [rockymountainnews.com] - Judge: Clear backlog [rockymountainnews.com] - Family in downward spiral [rockymountainnews.com] -
    • Colorado doesn't have a proven track record of being efficient (or prudent) with anything. The city (Denver & Surrounding), county and state governments are so fucked up it makes me want to cry every time I think about it. Although EDS may deserve some of the blame, Colorado gets quite a bit just for being dumb.

      Yeah, I did something about it. I moved.

      Oh yeah, the big yellow pollution cloud didn't help
      either.
    • by dtfinch (661405) * on Friday March 18, 2005 @09:30PM (#11981548) Journal
      That has to be the most depressing thing I've seen all afternoon. A broken system is worthless, no matter how much it cost. Governments need to make that clear.
      • That has to be the most depressing thing I've seen all afternoon. A broken system is worthless, no matter how much it cost. Governments need to make that clear.

        Pardon me if I'm wrong, but I imagine no one had the patience to read all the articles, so I thought I'd summarize the latest. First, the governor has hired an outside consultant to evaluate EDS' performance. Although he's soft-selling it right now as looking for ways to help the system forward, I suspect it's the prelude to legal action. Second, s
        • I skimmed the titles and read the article "Loss of aid to poor feared".
        • Although he's soft-selling it right now as looking for ways to help the system forward, I suspect it's the prelude to legal action.

          Not knowing anything about the situation (other than skimming a few of those articles, and comparing those to past EDS fuckups), I can't really comment. But, this is /. afterall. But this sounds like typical ass-covering - politician gave a contract, then takes heat, then has to generate a report for an investigatory committe with a bit "lessons learned" section.

  • If they can't even properly manage their own public communications, I wonder how well they can manage their client's systems?
  • by jd (1658) <imipak&yahoo,com> on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:39PM (#11981272) Homepage Journal
    Linux is "unscalable, insecure and unfit for consumption" but is the most scalable, secure and "fit for consumption" product out there.


    Translation into Real English: Linux is as far below "perfect" as most other Operating Systems out there are below Linux.


    Translation of Translation: Linux isn't perfect, but it's heavenly compared to any of the alternatives EDS has tried.


    Translation of Translation of Translation: EDS need to see about getting on Prozac.

  • by Eternally optimistic (822953) on Friday March 18, 2005 @08:46PM (#11981301)
    An endorsement by EDS ? This could be the end of Linux.
  • They've got lots of eggs now -- they just have to scrape it off of their face very carefully and pull their foot out of their mouth. For desert, they can start eating their words.

  • Who cares what EDS thinks? Sure, they have their hands deep into the pockets of the Fortune 500, but they're no less vulnerable to the effects that Linux may have on the market.
  • EDS has been obsessed with being everything to everyone, and this is just another facet to the multiplicitous facade. Once they get someone to buy into either end of the argument, they get their consulting wing fully embedded in the customer and then suck them dry like a vampire on steroids (but not the kind of steroids that make you hit home runs ... no ... the kind that makes you into an egotistical shmuck who feels impervious to the ridicule from such factions of reality as customer satisfaction and cost
  • by Ridgelift (228977) on Friday March 18, 2005 @09:13PM (#11981463)
    First Article: From a corporate perspective, we are not confident where Linux is right now today. A large enterprise needs to be sure because it relates to securifying [sic] the environment.

    Second Article: Nearly a decade after it was first developed, Linux is gaining popularity with corporate IT departments that admire the operating system for its stability and security.

    If most corporations are considered psychopaths [thecorporation.tv], then these guys are schizophrenic.
  • Has anyone every tried to ask anyone at EDS why they don't have a copy of Unigraphics working on Linux yet?

    Lots and lots of engineering application vendors have their software running on Linux. EDS doesn't ... I wonder why that is?
    --
    v2sw4UPChw6ln64prOck6ma4u7Lw2m6l7GCi2e4t2AMRb8Oen5 g3Ca2Xs6r0p8 hackerkey.com [hackerkey.com]

  • by Shoten (260439) on Friday March 18, 2005 @09:25PM (#11981519)
    I work for EDS, and I have to point a few things out. For one, it's a HUGE corporation...it's a world unto itself. We've got over 120,000 employees all over the planet, on nearly every continent and in every time zone. You always have to take what one guy says with a grain of salt; there are very few universal truths that cover all of EDS, and none of them have to do with a preference for a kind of technology, one way or the other. For gods sake, I'm sure there's a linux beowulf cluster somewhere, and a whole lot of Windows ME somewhere else.
    I'd also like to point out that the previous article about the EDS "stance" was very likely taken somewhat out of context by the reporter. You've got a guy high up in EDS saying that in enterprise environments, linux doesn't match up to Solaris 10, and in a lot of ways he's right. If you doubt that, check out Solaris 10 and its new features. It rocks like mad, and I do prefer linux to Solaris.
    No large enterprise on the planet is all of anything; even Microsoft got caught running linux and a BSD variant at times. So let's get over the notion that one guy out of 120,000 may not like linux so much yet still have it in his corporate environment?
    Oh, and I use linux daily in my work at EDS, just to be clear on the subject, and rarely touch Solaris.
    • You always have to take what one guy says with a grain of salt; there are very few universal truths that cover all of EDS

      Then maybe he should have been careful not to make it sound like he was speaking for EDS as a whole? And maybe EDS (, mgmt. of) should be careful about lettings spokesmen speak for EDS as a whole about things that do not cover all of EDS?

      If an official company spokesman makes a contextless statement like that, it's usually meant to convey a truth about the company as a whole, and thu

      • If it truly is this guy's personal opinions, or the opinions of the part of EDS he works for, then he ought to make that clear, and it is the responsibility of the company to make sure that he does not speak as if on behalf on the company as a whole.

        Ah, this is where I point to the realities of the media. How do we know what he said that didn't get quoted? And let me point out that in a multi-billion dollar corporation, the PR department has extremely limited power to tell a Vice President to shut up.

    • i work for EDS too. as an RHCE, GSEC and CISSP, i sure hope to hell they're not abandoning linux. let's go get a beer if you're in DC, maybe you can explain their employee review process to me.
    • > You always have to take what one guy says with a grain of salt;

      When that guy is a VP, like "Robb Rasmussen, vice president of EDS Global Alliances" he is presumed to speak for the company. That fact that what he said demonstrated a complete lack of knowledge in his supposed area of expertise does reflect poorly on EDS and all of its employees. Like any other large company, there are some good people working there, but if I were you I'd be looking for another position with a company whose management
      • The "supposed area of expertise" for someone in charge of alliances between massive technology companies isn't technology. It's legal and strategic planning, plus the diplomacy needed to get everyone to get together on the same page. For the love of god, man, you quoted his title yourself; did you not read it?

        EDS is the most complex organization I've ever seen; they have entire divisions that do billions of dollars of business just for single industries. Partners of ours have entire departments just to
    • This makes me wonder if what this side of EDS said about the good of Linux Security will quickly be squashed by another side, the side that deals strictly with Microsoft.

      How high does the dislike of Linux really go within EDS? Theoretically the highest-ranking voice wins, so what do the real high-up execs think?
  • the facts (Score:1, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    i) EDS are a fucking joke. Check their track record on UK Government projects if you don't believe me.

    ii) anyone who thinks linux offers security and stability unavailable elsewhere has never seen Unix before.
  • They didn't receive the promised cheque from Microsoft, and, as such, has a spontaneous bout of truth-telling.
  • EDS's heart is in the right place, but their remark "The new Linux environment provides a level of security and stability unavailable elsewhere.", is incorrect.

    {Free,Open,Net}BSD provide no less security and reliability than Linux. You certainly cannot forkbomb them to death, for instance, whereas that's true of some Linux distros [slashdot.org].
  • EDS... (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 18, 2005 @11:50PM (#11982244)
    Eventually Deliver Something.
  • Give me a break, I was a Systems Engineer at EDS in the late 90's till 00's in the "Internet and New Media" division (also known as C20, Chaos to Order) and I had written a proposal to upper managment about how Linux would be the next breaking wave and we should start some initiative into it. I got shot down and told "Linux was a fad and would never amount to anything". Of course this was the same company that said "IP would never amount to anything, mainframes are where all the money and buisness is at, mi
  • the .aspx extension should give you a clue :)

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