HP Releases Linux-Based Notebook

SteamyMobile writes "As the article says, 'In a sign the Linux operating system may be gaining traction beyond server and other back-room systems, HP said Tuesday it will be the first major PC maker to ship a business notebook computer pre-installed' with Linux. This is great news because, as anyone who has ever tried to run Linux (or even Windows XP) on a laptop knows, laptops come with all kinds of funky hardware, and it's often a mess trying to find and configure the right kernel modules to make things like software suspend work correctly. Having it shipped pre-loaded, and with support, makes it easy for me to decide where I'm getting my next laptop. Linux has been ready for the desktop for a while now, but it is good to see companies like HP acknowledging that."

How about drivers for the current crop of hardware

[Craig Maloney]

I'd be more impressed with HP's Linux offerings if they'd support the current crop of laptops out there, specifically the ones with Broadcom wireless drivers and media card slots. Sure, I managed to wrestle the wireless drivers into submission and usability, but the media slots have no hope of ever being usable at this state.

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[wickersty]

Novices don't fix the wear and tear. They pay people to do it, buy new computers, or simply deal with - and complain about - the fact that their computer is slow, spy/adware ridden, and broken.

Not sure what the article author is talking about

[adzoox]

Apple Laptops run Linux with full hardware upport VERY nicely and have over a broad generation of laptops.

Tech Support.

[Eeknay]

And will HP be providing tech support for users who have problems with Linux (yeah yeah, I know there are few problems with Linux/Suse, but you never know...)?

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[Veridium]

What happens when it comes time for my annual reinstall?

If HP is smart, they'll do what they do for their windows products... Include a backup partition or a restore CD/DVD that you can restore everything too. I mean seriously, novices are in the dumper anyway when fixing wear and tear on their Windows boxes. I ought to know, about half my income from my consulting business is repairing windows machines for home users.

There is no reason at all that HP couldn't have a default restore utility that works exactly like their windows restore. Just wipes the drive, and puts everything back the way it was when they got it on day one. That is hardly unfeasible. I could write a perl script...

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[techno-vampire]

What happens when it comes time for my annual reinstall?

What annual reinstall? The only reason you have to reinstall Windows once a year or more often is that the Registry, .ini files and other system files gradually get corrupted because any program can alter them in whatever way they want. Linux doesn't have that problem because programs can only alter their own .configure files, not the basic system ones.

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[Txiasaeia]

Joe user types are not going down to Best Buy and buy a notebook with an unfamilar OS on it. They're going to say, "I want a windows laptop!" and the trained monkeys will dutifully point them in the right direction.

If somebody buys a laptop with Linux on it, they'll either 1) learn to use it because they know something about it in the first place, or 2) return it within fifteen days (at least, that's the legal limit here in Canada). Your point is moot.

Re:Not sure what the article author is talking abo

[Anonymous Coward]

I would assume so. Apple laptops are highly popular among geeks and their hardware doesn't change much after each release. The drivers stay the same across most of the line. PCs, on the other hand, change with each brand and model making it more difficult to write drivers to fit all of them.

Re:How about drivers for the current crop of hardw

[roror]

Supporting linux on all the hardware they have sold would be expecting way too much from a company. It'd be quite a large step if they make it a point to offer linux as a supported option in their newer models from this point on.

About time

[LittleLebowskiUrbanA]

ACPI and to a lesser extent APM are a struggle in Linux. I didn't realize this until I bought my 15" Powerbook. Now I know. The next killer app/functionality for Linux is laptop compatibility/wireless. Show me that sleep/sus[pend will work out of the box and my management will be sold since the release of Evolution/exchange connector.

Laptop trouble

[iamdrscience]

I don't really think laptops are as much trouble with linux as people make out. At one point they were a big hassle, but in my experience (admittedly, not particularly extensive) the difficulty of installing linux on a laptop over installing it on a regular PC nowadays is negligible. Sure, laptops still tend to come with weirder hardware, but really, most distros have gotten quite good at supporting most of it right out of the box.

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[Txiasaeia]

Actually, I buy my notebooks from IBM directly :) I *do* stand around a lot waiting for the monkeys to pull a printer or whatever down from their shelves while they try to sell their overpriced products to the unsuspecting masses :)

I think you're not giving the ignorant dummies enough credit. See, folks like my dad want to pay as little as possible, but still, he'd never pay over $1000 for a laptop with a foreign operating system. I really can't see it happening.

Besides, you and I both know Future Shop's policy on returns - 15 days for tech items. That means that, even if the monkey manages to sell the notebook to a customer, if the guy can't figure it out at all he still can bring it back. I really don't think it's in FS's best interests to sell products that are going to just be returned a few days later because the guy can't find the "Start" button ;)

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[pebs]

Is it really a selling point selling a laptop pre-installed with Linux because it's such a challenge otherwise?

The selling point, I think, is that it is a laptop that is intended for running Linux, so you don't have to worry about lack of driver support (presumably).

As mentioned elsewhere in this thread, it is an HP, which kinda negates any possible selling point :)

Re:Worth the price for Wireless

[Graymalkin]

Oh man, all you had to do was go to a website not listed anywhere in a card's documentation to figure out how to get the card working. That's so easy Aunt Millie could even do it!

Installing a wireless card is not a piece of cake until you've spent a couple days finding and reading documentation. Then it is a piece of cake since you don't have to do it all over again.

Re:hp laptops

[Drakon]

IBM did this for about two years, if you search the archives you can find where they cut it off, since it turned out to be cost prohibative. You can still order new IBM laptops with linux preinstalled, they're just not going out of their way to support every piece of hardware on every laptop they sell anymore, like they used to.There simply wern't that many people willing to shell out what IBM charged at the time for a laptop, even if they are the best laptops on the planet. HP will probably NOT make a lot of money from this because anyone interested enough to buy a laptop with linux preinstalled is skilled enough to install it themselves, on any laptop they choose. (Choise is very important in laptops. I personally value light weight and long batteries (Thinkpad X40) whereas my boss values speed and screen size (Dimension M60)

PS: Comparing HP/Compaq laptops to quality laptops is not the process of a rational mind. They're good at being cheap, and that's about all

Re:Not sure what the article author is talking abo

[sp0rk173]

which is dumb and stupid. I know it's true...but it's lame-ass mass marketing taking a toll on our society.

Stupid business majors.

Get Windows Bugs Worked Out First

[Anonymous Coward]

I've discovered that Windows HP laptops don't work perfectly all of the time. It would be nice to have a Linux HP laptop in which all components work, but if HP can't get it perfectly right for Windows, then I'm not too eager to switch to an OS that is notoriously complicated when it comes to unusual parts.

You see, I'm working at a law school that has a WEP-encrypted 802.11G network. We've got two IBM loaner laptops while we get everything prepared for the school year. Both of them got online fairly easily. A student brought in a Dell yesterday, which also was pretty painless to get on the network. HPs? No!

We've had two HP laptops come in over the past two days. I don't think the network is broadcasting an SSID or is otherwise blatantly open (talking outside of encryption, too), but the IBMs and Dell didn't have a problem getting online. We're going to have to call HP to find out why their laptops aren't cooperating.

Now, two laptops is no biggie. However, we're going to have around 200 people at the school, trying to get online, in about three weeks. I would guess a significant portion (20+, perhaps?) will have HP laptops. We *have* to get them on the network, and Windows isn't working right as it is. Buy a Linux HP laptop? I would be extremely cautious to do so, from what I've seen so far.

Re:How about drivers for the current crop of hardw

[Craig Maloney]

Actually, I'm referring to the multiple media slot on the ZD7010. This device would probably have been supported as a mass storage device if it was a USB device, but the way HP has integrated it into the laptop, it's not a supported device.

Re:How about drivers for the current crop of hardw

[Craig Maloney]

I'm not asking for them to support some funky ISA bus card cage docking station (or worse), I'm asking them to support current hardware that enjoys Windows support. I don't think that's unreasonable to ask for. I'm sure they're not re-inventing their product line by offering a Linux compatible machine (and if they are, perhaps they should make the hardware changes across the board to all of their laptops).

I'd prefer...

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd prefer that they didn't install Linux. I'd like to install the distro of my choice.

Instead, I'd be impressed if a manufacturer did the following:

• Certified that the laptop was Linux-compatible.
• Provided a web-page with configuration information, including a list of hardware and associated kernel modules, sample XF86Config file, etc.
• Provide open source drivers for any odd bits of hardware (e.g. strange wireless adapters).

If a laptop manufacturer did that, I'd be so impressed that I'd purchase from them on principle!

Re:Worth the price for Wireless

[Bull999999]

In Slackware, spending 5 minutes with man iwconfig was all the documentation I needed to set up a prism based wireless card.

As for Aunt Millie types, I dobut that she'll be able to properly setup a wireless network even with her Windows computer.

*yawn*

[Anonymous Coward]

When HP ships FreeBSD (or any laptop vendor) then I'll care.

History lesson: Back in 1995 time frame HP said Unix was dead and the future was NT. Why support HP now, they turned their back on UNIX and gave Microsoft a big wet loving kiss years ago?

Re:this is nice, but...

[CAIMLAS]

re: 1 - The hardware isn't the issue with IBM. Their 'default' hardware configuration is mostly supported from what I've seen, or is in short order, it's just that ordering directly from IBM is prohibitively expensive unless you're a reseller or buying in bulk.

Re:Ahhhhh....One Second Please

[kfg]

>> .....and BonziBuddy doesn't run on it.
>>
>Not Yet!

Ya ever hear people complaining that it can be difficult to install some new software on Linux, what with permissions, dependencies and every distro arranging things differently and all?

As it turns out, there's also an upside to that.

KFG

Re:Linux is NOT ready for the desktop

[spitzak]

Although I agree that the desktop needs some work, your complaints are almost all irrelevant to an HP laptop with Linux preinstalled.

Its clunky to configure irrelevant if it is preinstalled as it is already configured.

has issues with even common hardware (many manufacturers still refuse to ship Linux drivers) hopefully this is not a problem for the preinstalled version, though there have been examples of linux laptops shipped with hardware that just does not work.

comes with an RTFM mentality for support Apparently this comes with HP support.

and requires you to fiddle with initialization scripts again irrelevant for a pre-installed laptop.

What's more open office is a poor replacement for MS Office, and the same is true where there are apps to replace the industry standard. This complaint is the only one of 5 that is legitimate for a preinstalled machine.