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Finally: PC-to-Phone Calling from Linux 217

Posted by timothy from the that's-getting-very-slick dept.
Greg Herlein writes "There is finally a way to do direct PC to Phone calling from linux: GnomeMeeting now supports decent quality, low-cost VoIP calls to any real phone in the world. It's about time." The calls are through a company called MicroTelco; read this FAQ page to learn more about it. (And don't forget TheKompany's approach to IP-telephony-with-Linux, using a Sharp Zaurus plus Net2Phone.)
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Finally: PC-to-Phone Calling from Linux More

Finally: PC-to-Phone Calling from Linux

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  • SpeakFreely's been around for years. (Score:4, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:09AM (#5180726)
    And it supported strong encryption on the phone calls, too...

    Admittedly somewhat less user friendly, but it's been around for years.

    GnomeMeeting has potential, too.

  • Magazine article too (Score:5, Informative)

    by syphoon ( 619506 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:11AM (#5180731)
    Linux Journal [linuxjournal.com] had an article [linuxjournal.com] covering this in its Jan. edition.
  • Since the subject of this said phone calling from Linux i was thinking of some weird kernel patch. Since it was some Gnome software, it was not linux. Linux is the kernel, and only that. I bet that Gnome program would work just as fine on for example a BSD system that it does on Linux.
    • Your "insightfull" comment shows only that you did not read the article; the page explains that you require a hardware device from Quicknet in order to use the G.723.1 audio codec. The card has only linux drivers, so you lost your bet.

      • Re:Linux is still just a kernel. (Score:5, Informative)

        by termos ( 634980 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:21AM (#5180880) Homepage
        I have been rated down a lot now, and I am no longer sure who acually did read on their web-page. Quote:
        The libraries and applications should also compile on Windows 95/98, BeOS (thanks Yuri!), Linux PPC, FreeBSD x86, OpenBSD x86 (thanks Roger!) and Solaris Sparc & x86.
        It should mean that it available for many other systems than just Linux, I would claim my first comment to still be 100% true.
        • It should mean that it available for many other systems than just Linux, I would claim my first comment to still be 100% true.

          Welcome to learning the difference between a codec, library, and a driver.

          GnomeMeeting, which is the libraries and the application, will compile on all those platforms.

          The codec, is windows only, so you need hardware.

          The device driver, is a Quicknet Linux device, is.. well.. a Linux device. You can read about it at linuxjack.com [linuxjack.com].

          I have been rated down a lot now, and I am no longer sure who acually did read on their web-page.

          Awww, did the karma whore lose some points? Next time posting relevant not "Linux is a kernel!" posts, sheep.
    • The claim that it is the first solution for linux may be true; however, it may not be true that this works in *BSD.

      This requires a PCI card to work. There is an open source driver, but I don't know if it it has been ported to *BSD.

      This isn't to say that it will not work in BSD soon, but it has been tested and is known to work currently, without modificaition on Linux.

  • pc to pc (Score:3, Informative)

    by hfastedge ( 542013 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:16AM (#5180739) Homepage Journal
    Sorry, but i've yet to ever investigate this very interesting field.

    The faq and the features [gnomemeeting.org] page are not written too well.

    What tools can i use to do pc-pc calls over linux?

    • Re:pc to pc (Score:5, Informative)

      by Max Romantschuk ( 132276 ) <max@romantschuk.fi> on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:35AM (#5180767) Homepage
      What tools can i use to do pc-pc calls over linux?

      GnomeMeeting itself... it supports the H.323 standard, which for example NetMeeting supports aswell.

      This means that you can do PC-PC as in GnomeMeeting-GnomeMeeting, GnomeMeeting-NetMeeting, GnomeMeeting-AnyH.323CompliantSoftware. In theory at least...

      The PC-Phone thing is an additional service.

    • Re:pc to pc (Score:5, Informative)

      by MagicFab ( 7234 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:40AM (#5180779) Homepage
      Well...

      I attended a demo/conference about this [gulus.org] this weekend and there was WiFi access in the room. I connected to the same (external, public ils.seconix.com) server as the presenter's and we were visible to see each other's presence/config, while he was chatting with another GnomeMeeting user using video (both of them on Mandrake Linux). I was using Netmeeting under Windows 2000 pro.

      It's my understanding that GnomeMeeting is originally for PC to PC text/audio/video conferencing, compatible with H.323 clients (like Windows Netmeeting ), but has been extended for PC to phone calls. GnomeMeeting however didn't seem to have the following features Netmeeting has:

      • remote whiteboard
      • remote desktop control

      I also like all the configuration options, though somewhat too advanced for beginners.

      Cheers,

      F.

    • Re:pc to pc (Score:1, Informative)

      by (rypto* ( 641800 )
      The faq and the features [gnomemeeting.org] age are not written too well.

      FAQ

      1. 5.6. Is it possible to change the volumes for recording and playing when using a Quicknet device?

      2. Yes, you can simply do it like you would change your soundcard volumes in the "Audio" section of the "Control Panel" accessible through the "View" menu. >> u can adjust ur volume using ur speaker or headset volume control

      FAQ? was it
    • oh I don't know the features here from this [gnomemeeting.org] screen shot look fine?

    • Re:pc to pc (Score:2, Informative)

      by zannox ( 173829 )
      Try TeamSpeak [teamspeak.org] Tis still in ßeta BUT what software for linux isn't LOL. It's available for Win32 & Linux as either client or server.

  • No big deal... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:25AM (#5180749)
    ET got there first and all he had was a Speak 'n' Spell...

  • You have to buy a card though (Score:5, Interesting)

    by fruey ( 563914 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:27AM (#5180754) Homepage Journal
    There is finally a way to do direct PC to Phone calling from linux: GnomeMeeting now supports decent quality, low-cost VoIP calls to any real phone in the world. It's about time.

    What is lacking is the use of your soundcard + software codec to do this. I understand there are patent problems, but the best solution would be a net2phone-style software solution, ported to Linux.

    Windows for net2phone is one of the few uses I have left. Living in Morocco, it saves me $$$ every month to call Europe.

    • Man, you sure nailed it with that comment. Sure, I'm a Yahoo! Messenger user (trane608), under both Windows and Linux. Wonderful -- NOT -- that if I want to use Yahoo!'s Net2Phone component, I have to boot Windows. Sure, it's great that a hardware solution exists. The more options available the better, but what I really want is to be able to use my Yahoo! Net2Phone account under BOTH Linux and Windows.

      I'm really sick of dual-boot.

    • Re:You have to buy a card though (Score:5, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:08AM (#5181060)
      I have worked for Net2Phone for years. I can tell you that if enough requests came in, they would gladly make a Linux client. It is a simple cost/benefit equation.

      A lot of our hardware runs embedded Linux.

  • What I want to know is.... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by KCardoza ( 593977 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:35AM (#5180765) Homepage
    It seems nice to be able to make phone calls from my linux boxen, but what I want to know is, when will I be able to _recieve_ calls? I couldn't find that answer in the FAQ. Also, is it possible to have, say, more than one of these cards, to get the VoIP equivalent of multiple phone lines, using a broadband connection?

    • Re:What I want to know is.... (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Sho0tyz ( 147844 ) <Sho0tyz.wanadoo@fr> on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:56AM (#5180813)
      The site is very low on details, but on the linuxjack site it says that you can receive calls. It does not explain how this works though. Do you get a real phone number? Can you only receive calls from other microtelco users? I would use this in a second if you could get a real phone number in the country/area of your choice.
      • Well, in order to receive calls in your Linux box you either have to use a provider with that capabilitry, such as perhaps MicroTelco, or perhaps wait for the integration of all services and addresses under ATM.

        (Asynchronous Transfer Mode is now used extensively, especially now that ADSL, which directly links with ATM, is in fashion. But it has not really made it to the consumer end yet.)

        This applies also to the comment concerning cuting off the revenue from providers. If services are integrated like this there will be some other way of passing costs, depending on the service used, since there would be multiple service-providers sharing infrastructure.

    • For VoIP that lets you receive calls, check out Vonage [vonage.com] or Packet8 [packet8.net]. Both of these are based on appliances, not computers, but at least they don't require you to run Windows. I'm not paid to pimp these services and I haven't tried them, so I don't know if they suck or not.

  • Serious Poll Question... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by stev3 ( 640425 ) <`moc.liamg' `ta' `repsas'> on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @08:55AM (#5180810) Homepage Journal
    How many people ACTUALLY make calls from their computer? Although I understand it is free, the quality still doesn't compare to a regular phone (not even a cell phone -- don't get me started on those).

    I remember making calls back in... '98 when this was a new technology, and I stopped after about 2 weeks.

    Poll Question - Do you really make calls that often from your computer?

    • Re:Serious Poll Question... (Score:5, Informative)

      by fruey ( 563914 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:13AM (#5180861) Homepage Journal
      I make calls all the time. If you live in a place where international calls cost too much, then a quality sacrifice is fine.

      In my experience, net2phone is as good as some international phone calls I have made with a regular phone anyway. You *must* have good ping times to the phone provider's gateway though, otherwise it sucks. Also, a decent modem or broadband is needed. Software modems (winmodems) give crappy quality.

    • Re:Serious Poll Question... (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      I have used GnomeMeeting and the quality was just excellent, much better than a conventional phone.
      But it is true that it strongly depends on the codec used and your bandwith.
      As an example, I am sitting in Sweden and I did a call to a guy in Japan (he was using a 56K POTS modem), and the sound was perfect, he could even see my video!

      I use it regularly to connect to many friends outside the country, saving a lot of money on calls, it is just a great use of both your computer and the internet.

      • I have used GnomeMeeting and the quality was just excellent, much better than a conventional phone.

        Riiight..
        How could this be? Was the party on the other end using a hi-fi phone, over a special network?

        I don't see how it could POSSIBLY be higher, if the limit is on the remote side.

        S
        • I have used GnomeMeeting and the quality was just excellent, much better than a conventional phone.

          How could this be? Was the party on the other end using a hi-fi phone, over a special network?

          I assume the party on the other end was using a PC, since GnomeMeeting's PC-to-Phone feature won't be available until the end of this month.

    • I regularly call Australia (a real phone) from Germany using linphone [linphone.org], with the help of a friend in Australia who is willing to let me use his SIP gateway to route local calls.

      Reverse calls are supportable too, with people dialing a number there and reaching me on the computer, but I admit I haven't gotten around to arranging the SIP proxy at the Australian end.

      Linphone's interface is a bit primitive, and I admit that I don't get the quality of sound that I expect should be possible, but then the software is still very much under development. It certainly is usable though!

      Anyone know if gnomemeeting is planning to support SIP? With Cisco's big IP-telephony push based around SIP, I imagine it's only going to become more and more popular.

    • same story. i tried it out and got into it at first, but haven't done it in years. i tried the free windows java application (can't recall the name), and it worked nicely, but then they started charging for domestic calls.

      i also tried yahoo's and MSN's peer-to-peer talk over the messenger type thing to other users logged in. it was the same thing choppy sound, and barely audible.

      i don't have long distance on my home line (long distance phone company slamming) so we use a calling card. for .lt. .05$ per minute it can't be beat. that 10 minute internet call could be done in 5 on a real line, and would cost .25$. you really do get what you pay for.
      • i don't have long distance on my home line (long distance phone company slamming) so we use a calling card. for .lt. .05$ per minute it can't be beat

        Bigzoo.com. $0.029 or $0.039 a min.

        • Bigzoo.com (Score:3, Informative)

          by Futurepower(R) ( 558542 )

          Needs emphasis --

          Bigzoo.com: 2.9 cents per minute inside the U.S., 4.4 cents per minute to France from the U.S. Sound quality perfect. Honest company.
          • Bigzoo.com: 2.9 cents per minute inside the U.S., 4.4 cents per minute to France from the U.S. Sound quality perfect. Honest company.

            Nobelcom.com has phone cards I use to call to Japan (very frequently) at 3.9 cents a minute. Their rates to France: 2.9 cents a minute.

            Good sound quality, never any echos. More expensive to call to cell phones, I don't know why more people don't use them. I've purchased about 6 cards from them now, and will likely never buy another phone card from another company.

    • Re:Serious Poll Question... (Score:5, Informative)

      by JanneM ( 7445 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:35AM (#5180936) Homepage
      A major - and often overlooked - factor is the quality of the microphone used. The build-in mics of webcams or the mic of cheapskate headsets are really too lousy to make for decent sound quality, as they introduce so much distortion and noise that the codec is ill-equipped to handle.

      • Re:Serious Poll Question...Plantronics. (Score:2, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward
        That's why I use a Plantronics [plantronics.com] headset. Good build and good sound at a good price. There others are nice as well. I have one for my cellphone. And yes I'm a satisfied customer.

    • Re:Serious Poll Question... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Lumpy ( 12016 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:45AM (#5180972) Homepage
      I do every day.

      Although I use the much better solution using fobbit and the Creative VoIP blaster. a small pentuim computer with USB, and fobbit+ linux in a self boot stuffed in my closet and plugged into my phone system gives me free internet calls to friends in other states and cities that are as good as my cellphone in sound quality.

      the hard part, getting the voip blasters... cince creative in their wisdom dropped them and morons on ebay have the prices too high.
      • I've got a couple of VoIP blasters that I'd like to make use of.

        The last time I looked, you basically had to have one on each side of the connection (that's why I bought 2).

        Has that changed?

    • I fail to see the point of your post - see the (admittedly rather obvious) parodies below.

      The amazing thing is not that this is popular now; the amazing thing is that the local telephone companies are poised on the brink of irrelevancy. Don't know about your area, but you can't GET data lines in my town from the telco without the sort of hassle you would have expected from Bell Telephone at the height of their monopoly. They simply don't get it. Meanwhile, you can call the cable company and they will have you set up with high-speed internet access THE NEXT DAY, regardless of your OS. The cableco's customer service is better than that of the telco, so when the inevitable screwup occurs, the cableco will keep you and the telco will lose you as a high-speed customer.

      The only real reason to continue sending checks to the telco is for phone access. Internet telephony makes that irrelevant (except for 911 location service). This kind of technology, as it becomes more widely adopted, will either make the local telco obsolete or a lot more responsive.

      Circa 1981...
      How many people ACTUALLY own a personal computer? Although I understand they're cheap, they're not as good as a mainframe.

      Circa 1881...
      How many people ACTUALLY ride in a horseless carriage? Although I understand they're nifty, they're not as useful as a horse.

      Circa 1985...
      How many people ACTUALLY use the protection features of Intel's 80386 CPU? Although I understand the concept, it still serves no useful purpose in DOS.
    • Stev3 wrote:
      How many people ACTUALLY make calls from their computer? ... quality still doesn't compare ... I remember making calls back in '98 when this was a new technology, and I stopped after about 2 weeks.
      Well, things have improved in 4-5 years. I know several people that spent most of those years installing hardware VoIP for businesses!

      Personal use is getting approachable, too. Someone recently had a column (eweek, ddj, infoworld... I read too much and can't find it!) that talked about links on dslreports.com [slashdot.org] that talked about switching to Vonage [vonage.com], a hardware VoIP vendor. Their base price is $25-40 per month, with lots of services, cheap int'l, and TRUE number portability!

      Poll Question - Do you really make calls that often from your computer?
      The more fair question is who uses VoIP and is it hardware? Since there's so much evidence (lag-times during generic phone calls (try counting in unison with someone on a phone call to measure lagtime), the mere presence of some sort of multiplexer between my home and the phone company's Central Office, and noise-cancellation effects (where the other side LITERALLY goes silent rather than transmit minor background noise) I think we're all using a lot more VoIP than we realize.

      Speaking of which, it really chaps my asterisk to think the phone companies managed to make this sort of massive savings (to datastreams rather than a copper pair per call) and our rates went up, not down. As much as people complain about the **AA's, telcos top my list of companies that have rip-off pricing. Despite my losing about $30k in value on my telco stock last year, I am thrilled to see them cratering.

      -- advaitavedanta

    • I have set up VoIP for a few small companies in the US. They don't seem to mind the lower quality vs. the tremendous savings they recieve. The most recent has a home office in Europe, and a shell office in the US of just a handful of people. Small revenue center that needs to cut costs wherever it can. The VoIP is set up on the local PBX with 4 trunk lines that it forwards to, so one line acts as 4. As I said, the quality is lower, but the communication is clear enough to make it a valuable tool.
    • I was in Japan for 6 months, and was able to spend a half hour on the phone with my new wife every day. She was in Maryland, U.S. I could lay on the couch with a headset jacked into my laptop. I used Net2Phone, which sold time by the block, but it was extremely cheap. There was an echo for the person being called, but it beat a $1300 phone bill. That was in 1999...I'm sure things have changed (probably for the better) since then.
    • How many people ACTUALLY make calls from their computer? Although I understand it is free, the quality still doesn't compare to a regular phone (not even a cell phone -- don't get me started on those).

      All depends on the codec. Sure G.723.1 quality isn't that good but there are better options (with a bit more bandwidth). GnomeMeeting already supports Speex (blatant plug) which can give much better quality, and even wideband (16 kHz sampling), which is much better than normal phone (though not used by GnomeMeeting yet). [speex.org]
    • I totally agree with you. The problem here is not that the tech isnt available - or even that the quality is not quite as good as a POTS yet...

      The problem is the mindset of the consumers who actually use this stuff.

      For example -

      The biggest hurdle that things like this have to overcome is the way that this technology is simplified and pushed out the the end consumers (the ones who dont think about technology at all)

      The thing is that when Joe User goes to use the phone his goal is to TALK to someone. The regular phone is so established and so easily understood that the challenge is getting new and better ways of making communications fit *perfectly* into the existing public image of the phone and how calls are made.

      Here are the problems with doing this:

      Form Factor: You need to get these devices to look exactly and work exactly like the ordinary phones that people are used to.

      Industry Resistance: Major telcos will resist this technology as long as they possibly can - because the regular phone systems that they have in place make them so much money that making any changes to the communications industry is going to be difficult. They will only start accepting these things when they are in a position to monopolize it. For example these systems can work so easily in a wireless IP based network - but getting the industry to start pushing for that will not happen (I wont go into all the billing and security issues of wireless at this point - even though that is the reason why the major telco's wont push WISPs for a while).

      The communications companies dont want you to be able to have one device for calls, organizer, music, internet access, camera etc *unless* they control it and make money on it.

      If you want to have this stuff become widespread and cheap - you need to get a company to start doing this *before* its too late and the only companies with enough money and all the control to make is a reality are companies like AT&T and their subs (cometa).

      I know that I dont want a company like SBC, AT&T, pac bell or any cell company to handle *all* my traffic in the future. These co's have a proven history of abusing consumers over charging and just having crappy customer service.

      Here is the opportunity to bring the communications industry closer to the consumer - and setting up a new model. The opportunity to have a company come in and setup a wifi based telco/isp in major metro areas is perfect right now... the only worrying thing is that the telcos are the only people with the cash and current infrastructure to implement at this point.

      anyway - as you can probably tell I dont like AT&T or telcos that much - and I think that now is the best time to go after them. There is more - so much more - but I am tired... you get the idea.

  • Gateways outside the US? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by egghat ( 73643 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:05AM (#5180837) Homepage
    Does anybody know of any IP/POT-gateways like the one mentioned in the article, that are outside the US? For example in Germany? In the UK?

    TIA

    egghat.

  • Handset? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by WPIDalamar ( 122110 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:12AM (#5180858) Homepage
    The FAQ makes it sound like the only way to place one of these calls is with a normal phone plugged into this special hardware device. Is this true?

    Oh sure, it looks like I can dial with gnome meeting, but do I have to talk through the normal analog phone? If this is the case ... what does using gnome meeting do for us? Just give a gui to configure & dial the phone? Doesn't sound like news, but maybe I'm missing something.

    • According to the pictuires on the linux123 site, it has what look like microphone and speaker jacks on the card, too. So, no, you can make "Conference Call"-style calls with this card, using a mic and a good set of speakers.

  • Killer App (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:21AM (#5180883)
    A killer app would be PDA-PDA calls encrypted over IP.

    • Re:Killer App (Score:2, Insightful)

      by perly-king-69 ( 580000 )
      Would this be significantly different from a phone with a built in pda - ie what we use today?
      • Yepp would be encrypted.

        bye egghat.
        • Don't all modern cellphones use encryption? At least the digital ones. And true it's only the wireless portion, rather than end-to-end. But given people's lack of interest in encrypting email, I doubt end-to-end encryption is a killer app.
          • No, not really. Nothing that compares to 1024 bit 3des or what we computer users think, what's secure.

            But you're right that this isn't the killer app for the masses, although some people might like it.

            Bye egghat.
    • The tkcPhone [thekompany.com] product can do PDA-PDA (or PDA-any-VoIP-device) on a Sharp Zaurus. AFAIK the program doesn't support encryption directly, but there is IPSec for the Zaurus via FreeSWAN.

  • buying hardware, ew =/ (Score:5, Insightful)

    by truffle ( 37924 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:24AM (#5180899) Homepage
    I don't mind paying service charges for VOIP, but I'm surprised I need to buy hardware.

    Even if it doesn't work as well, VOIP should be accessible with a soundcard and a microphone. I'm not so excited by this announcement.

    • I don't mind paying service charges for VOIP, but I'm surprised I need to buy hardware.

      The hardware is for implementing the codecs in DSP where you have sub-ms delays for the encode and decode. That is essential for decent qualty (i.e. not "I'm calling overseas and it's going around the globe 3 times" lag) audio.

      I run Quicknet's Internet PhoneJACK PCI cards. Works great, but I don't get g.729a on the PCI version -- ISA only. :-(

      • You don't need special hardware to get decent quality.

        I call frequently from Canada to Belgium using Net2Phone and never encounter perceptible delays.

        The only way you could probably get delays would be to run some application that take all he juice from the CPU while making your call (or if your PC is swapping like hell).

        • Re:buying hardware, ew =/ (Score:3, Informative)

          by GiMP ( 10923 )
          Because the Net2Phone software has the algorithm implimented in software. It is a patented algorithm and cannot be used in free software, hence free software must currently use a hardware-based solution.

          The hardware apparently has some advantages over software-only implimentations, including the usage of a real telephone.

          vonage.com will work for those without Microsoft Windows as it is a hardware-only solution, it connects to your hub/switch and 'just works'. The nice thing you get with GnomeMeeting is the ability to dial from the computer and the option to use the computer to speak or process the audio data.

          The advantage with Quicknet vs Vontage.com is that Quicknet does not (currently?) have a monthly access fee. Vontage will charge you a monthly fee, for unlimited calling (or less for 500 domestic minutes).. Quicknet charges per-minute and is blind to national borders.
  • Now these guys are true Marketing guys..

    The chick in the screen shots is hot.

    • Re:Marketing Genius (Score:4, Informative)

      by Xerithane ( 13482 ) <xerithane AT nerdfarm DOT org> on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:32AM (#5181153) Homepage Journal
      The chick in the screen shots is hot.

      Here's some links:
      • # 1 [gnomemeeting.org]
      • # 2 [gnomemeeting.org]
      • #3 [gnomemeeting.org]
      • #4 [gnomemeeting.org]

      And she is visibly more literate than Ellen Feiss. Now I'll stop posting pictures before Jonita kicks my ass.

      Jonita, you've been on slashdot and you are prettier than Ellen Feiss. I should apologize for subjecting you to geek-fantasy love, but you will be petrified shortly, and you won't care.
      • hehe, thanks :)
      • God i hate PNG - it never shows up in MSIE - though i hear it should be able to do that, anybody know how?

  • VoIP with Linux? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by blitzrage ( 185758 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:44AM (#5180966) Homepage
    Is there a way to do kind of the same thing, but call from my computer to another computer with an IP phone attached to it? I'd love to just get rid of the phone company all together, and use the internet as my phone service. Just get all my family setup on VoIP phones attached to their broadband internet connection, and just give them a call that way.

    Anyone know if that is possible? (I havn't googled yet, but plan to, so if you know, let me know of a link or whatever)

  • Mitel Networks doing some cool stuff (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:46AM (#5180978)
    Mitel Networks [mitel.com] is doing some cool stuff with VoIP and Linux. They're not very good at marketing it, but still, check it out. Especially the tie-ins with their SME Server product (Linux-based small office server - see E-Smith's [e-smith.com] old site.

    Unfortunately, most of it is commercial ... although the SME server software is open source and available from the E-Smith developer site [e-smith.org]. Still, their voip stuff looks standards-based, so hopefully it interoperates with other stuff.

  • why computer? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by qoncept ( 599709 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:50AM (#5180995) Homepage
    Linux? Great. When is the hardware coming out? Forget pc based calls. When am I going to be able to plug a phone in to my router and call around the world for free?

  • Card v/s software-only (Score:5, Informative)

    by sonamchauhan ( 587356 ) <sonamc.gmail@com> on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @09:57AM (#5181023) Journal
    From the article [gnomemeeting.org]:

    5.2. Why do I currently have to buy a Quicknet card if I want to do PC-To-Phone calls?

    All providers need the G.723.1 audio codec to be able to do PC-To-Phone calls. That codec is patented and can't be added directly into the GnomeMeeting code. However, buying a Quicknet card offers you other features that will also be useful if you are not doing PC-To-Phone calls.
    (Emphasis mine).

    Hm, only one vendor is listed on the Gnome meeting website -- their cheapest card is US$109.

    On a Windows PC, you don't need a card - the soundcard and CPU are sufficient for PC-to-Phone.
    I guess Microsoft pays the codec royalties -- and a copy of Windows XP Home off pricewatch.com is US$90.

    *Grin* I think only hardcore Linux users will followup on this article.

    I wonder if it's possible to convince the telcom company they're using as their gateway ("MicroTelco") to accepts voice calls using a free codec (the new Ogg Vorbis voice codec comes to mind).
    • Since the license for G723.1 is around ~$1, hardware seems overkill in an era where p3s and p4s abount. G723.1 is a stretch for slow processors, but luckily in an era where video compression is feasible, audio compression no longer requires hardware.

      Is this hardware purchase a scam?
    • I don't know why they don't support G.711 (aka uncompressed); that can't be patented and people with broadband should have no trouble handling 64kbps.
      • The costs of bandwidth for the carrier side (where the call gets delivered) is prohibitive. AND many many users still are on various forms of dialup. End result is that carriers don't support that format, usually, for VoIP services unless being paid for on a private network. BUT (!) the software and hardware do support G.711 AND the harwdare gives you echo cancellation, auto gain control, and telephone device integration.

  • security flaw in linux? (Score:4, Informative)

    by (rypto* ( 641800 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:08AM (#5181058)
    "H.323" gnomemeeting is it gona be a security threat

    H.323 is more complicated than other protocols because it uses two tcp connections and several UDP sessions from a single "call".Only one of the tcp connections goes to a well known port; all the other ports are negotiated and thus temporary. Furthermore the content of the streams is far more difficult for firewall to understand than existing protocols, becuase h.323 encodes packets using Abstract Syntax Notation (ASN.1) [techtarget.com]

    • Re:security flaw in linux? (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Only one TCP connection is used if you are enabling H245 Tunneling. All ports are fixed in GnomeMeeting. Don't make the confusion between Netmeeting and GnomeMeeting.
      • 1) About the ports that are used by GnomeMeeting and Netmeeting.

        * What ports does GnomeMeeting use for H.323 if H.245 Tunneling is
        enabled?

        - 1720 TCP for the H.225 and H.245 Channels
        - Random UDP port for audio (it will take the first free port above
        5000)
        - Random UDP port for video (it will take the first free port above
        5000)

        Those ports are used for incoming calls, i.e. if you receive an incoming
        call from a GnomeMeeting user using H.245 Tunneling, that remote
        GnomeMeeting will open those ports.

        If the user doesn't use H.245 Tunneling for some reason, another random
        TCP port will be used for the H.245 Channel.

        If the user uses H.245 Tunneling (the default in the preferences), it is
        enough to allow TCP port 1720 and UDP ports 5000-5004 on your firewall
        (for a single call).

        * What ports does Netmeeting use for H.323?

        - 1720 TCP for the H.225 Channel
        - Random TCP port for the H.245 Channel (Netmeeting doesn't support
        H.245 Tunneling)
        - Random UDP port for audio
        - Random UDP port for video

        That is for incoming calls, i.e. if you receive an incoming call from a
        Netmeeting user, that remote Netmeeting will use those ports. Most of
        them are totally random, so if you want a secure firewall, you will have
        to forget about the idea to be able to be called by remote Netmeeting
        users.

  • Time to blow the dust off the VoIP Blaster (Score:4, Interesting)

    by linux11 ( 449315 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:21AM (#5181103)
    Well, for those of us that got sold on the Slashdot article on the Creative Labs VoIP Blaster [slashdot.org], I have good new! The diary for Damien Sandras (the author of the GnomeMeeting project) indicates that GnomeMeeting supports VoIPBlaster [advogato.org] which provides GM access to the patented G.723.1 audio codec without having to buy a $100+ LinuxJack [linuxjack.com] card. If only MicroTelco could convince SB to mass produce the VoIP Blaster again...

  • Already possible (Score:3, Interesting)

    by supz ( 77173 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:23AM (#5181110) Homepage
    This was always possible, using a Cisco 3660 with a voice card, and SIP.

    Simply dial sip:1800429739@1.2.3.4:5060 with any software SIP phone for Linux, and you're good... granted the hardware would cost you around 10,000 plus the monthly service fee for a 4 channel BRI (at least).

  • Not ready yet. (Score:5, Informative)

    by Penguinoflight ( 517245 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:23AM (#5181112) Journal
    PC-to-Phone calls are still not ready on Linux, and they cost money to do. According to the GnomeMeeting FAQ: Step 3: Register a MicroTelco account on http://www.linuxjack.com.

    However, when you go to linuxjack.com, it says that they will be adding accounts for MicroTelco on their site SOON (marketing word for "whenever"), and you can't just use a regular MicroTelco account like you would on Windows.

    This is only really good news if you'd use voip-voip, or if all this proprietary technology actually works.

    • Re:Not ready yet. (Score:2, Informative)

      by Multispin ( 49784 )
      Hardly!
      I'm constantly connected via gnophone (using IAX, another VoIP protocol) to an Asterisk [asteriskpbx.org] PBX (GPLed) on a DSL connection in FL. I shopw up as an extension, just like any of the other 20 VoIP desksets (phones) in the office. We all share a couple analog lines connected to X100P cards from Digium (look on the asterisk hardware page).
      This stuff works great!

  • Why use a desktop computer at all? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by IGnatius T Foobar ( 4328 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:39AM (#5181184) Homepage Journal
    Why use a desktop computer at all? I'm more impressed by services like Vonage [vonage.com]. They give you a little POTS-to-Ethernet gizmo that you plug in anywhere behind your firewall, and you just connect any phone to it. Pick up the receiver and you hear a dial tone. Dial a number and it goes out over the Internet. You never have to bother with the computer. The computer doesn't even have to be turned on. Let's face it, if you're a geek, or even a lesser gadget freak, you've already got multiple computers sitting behind a firewall or mini-router on a broadband connection. So you just plug this thing in and go.

    QuickNet's service appears to be cheaper. I was going to sign up for it, but I don't like the idea of having to have a program running on a desktop to keep the dial tone available. That's the problem with most Windows-based programs that do things like this, and it's no better when someone does it on Linux. (Ok, it's a little better, but this type of thing belongs either in a daemon or in dedicated hardware.)

  • My idea (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mschoolbus ( 627182 ) <{travisriley} {at} {gmail.com}> on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @10:43AM (#5181204)
    I have actually been working on a hardware/software solution for this. Instead of buying a Quicknet Internet Line Jack [quicknet.net] for $600, I am working on a few mods to this [rainbowkits.com] kit so it can be controlled via the parallel port instead of by the telephone hook.

    On the software side, I am using some RTP software I am working on to transfer audio between machines. So what does this all mean? With some custom hardware and software I will be able to have household (neighborhood) telephone service using any computer on my network.

    If anyone is interested stop by www.magicicecreambucket.com in a few weeks for information on building this device for yourself for under $60 and some software for it.

  • Dude, this was a mistake! (Score:3, Funny)

    by OpCode42 ( 253084 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @12:08PM (#5181902) Homepage
    http://www.gnomemeeting.org/screenshots/latest/Gno meMeeting_In_A_Call_With_Stats.png

    Now ever horny net geek on slashdot will be emailing her...

    Next time BLANK OUT THE EMAILS! ;)

  • Looks like AT&T have gone one better (Score:3, Funny)

    by Chocolate Teapot ( 639869 ) on Wednesday January 29, 2003 @12:10PM (#5181919) Homepage Journal
    According to this article [bbspot.com], AT&T have devised a technology that won't even tie up your Linux box. I am having one hell of a time keeping pace with the latest innovations.
  • Um... doesn't it require GTK 2.0 at the very least?
  • The only link that matters in any discussion of linux telephony is

    www.asteriskpbx.org

    I am on the mailing list. It is an _awesome_ project. I'm just waiting for enough disposable income to buy the 24port FXO devkit.

    If you've ever wanted to build your own customizable, modular PBX system, asterisk is the thing to have. That it happens to be in production _today_ at multiple homes and businesses as an H.323 to POTS gateway is what makes it related to this story.

    If you want to use gnomephone for _free_, use asterisk, _today_.

    Someone could setup an IAX box in each of the NXX/NPA's in the usa and build thier own FREE ld network _today_ if they wanted to.

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