Migrating Your Office from Windows to Linux? 682
bastiji asks: "I work at a mid-sized company, around 50 people and 90% M$ shop (10% being the Sun server doing our backups). Most of my users are using Office 85% of the time with some specialized apps thrown in for good measure. With the upcoming licensing changes from M$ my finance guys are worried about increased spending on even the software that we already own. I've been to told to look for alternatives and I'm asking for your help. How does one begin to do migration from a totally dependent M$ shop to the least expensive options. Are there any examples for mid-sized firms taking this route and any public examples of cost-savings?"
Good Luck (Score:5, Interesting)
Do only a partial change... (Score:3, Interesting)
Plus, changing business guys over to linux is no easy task.
Simple (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Open Office (Score:2, Interesting)
Move away from Windows or just Office? (Score:5, Interesting)
You're in for a real treat if you're going to try and get an alternative OS going in an environment that's not filled with techies....most of these people took years just to "learn" Windows, Linux (or whatever) is going to be a nightmare for them.
Maybe you should just look into a different office suite.
As a side note, it really bites my ass that M$ is trying to leverage companies into paying more money because of the fear of having to switch to new apps that possibly might be incompatible with other companies' documents. Yet another reason proprietary technology sucks. There needs to be an industry-wide switch to open document formats....RTF and whatever the spreadsheet and presentation software equivalents might be.
Slow transition (Score:5, Interesting)
If you're lucky, your custom apps will run with Wine or can even be compiled with winelib to be native on Linux, even if they are a pain to port to real Linux apps.
If you find you can't effectively transition your apps, you can stick with Windows, but drop Office in favor of Star/Open Office. Even if you get stuck paying more for OS licensing, you'll save a huge bundle on the other licenses. If you do that, just be sure you're very careful with not letting unlicensed copies of MS Office onto your systems, or you'll be in big trouble if a BSA audit comes along.
Why not make it a Sun shop? (Score:5, Interesting)
One way ... (Score:3, Interesting)
Whatever you chose professional training and a support deal with the distro manufacturer.
How about (IBM/LOTUS) SmartSuite? (Score:3, Interesting)
The other way around (Score:0, Interesting)
For over a year or so I'm thinking of moving from Linux to windows. Why? Because of the stability and usability. Windows 2000 and XP appear to be very stable and no one can deny that they are lightyears ahead of anything on linux when it comes to desktop comfort.
I just hate it when I encounter yet another website that doesn't load using Konqueror, mozilla, opera... you fill in the blanks. I just hate it that I can't play movies on my linux machine without five days of intensive configuration battles.
I've developed a lot of software for unix and am now seriously considering porting them to windows. Hell, it will be a lot easier to sell these things as well. Right now, I don't even have to bother.
About 10 years ago (remember kernel 0.99pl15?) I had to choose between adopting windows, OS/2 or linux, because Dos was dying. For quite some time I was happy to say that "at least linux crashed less often than windows". (never gave os/2 a try though). The last few years, windows gained on stability and user friendlyness. While making the move to the semi-professional desktop, linux became more unstable (I don't know how many times I've grunted after installing yet another 2.4.x kernel) and certainly couldn't keep up with the gains made by windows on the user friendly side. Before playing some video I still have to say a prayer...
Right now, I can't keep my development pc running for more than a week because of some application that leaks memory and uses up my entire memory after a few days.
So how about it... Porting my own software to windows. I can see a lot of problems. filesystem links, permissions. Most applications cannot be scripted...
Anyone have experience going from unix/linux to windows?
Re:Not so simple (you forgot the BSA) (Score:3, Interesting)
From the article
Our Company has Done it. (Score:3, Interesting)
Disclosure: we are an engineering company, so we have been doing some things on UNIX for a long time.
Having said that, our current mix is around 85% non-MS and 15% MS. For our engineering tasks, we use software that never did come from MS (although it was supported on the Windows platform, even though we never used it on Windows). For most of our "office" tasks, we use StarOffice 5.2 and will be moving to 6.0. All of this is now running on Linux based PCs.
The 15% MS portion is mainly for certain cases where we must use the same tool as our customer, and the customer want's to use MS tools (mostly spec. and project management related).
All-in-all, it works pretty well, and it definitely shaves $$ off your overhead costs, not to mention reduced audit worries.
users will complain (Score:2, Interesting)
So, try to figure out how to motivate people to use the new software. Maybe you can arrange for people to share in the financial rewards of the switch (a small raise for all the MS Office users, financed from the license savings). If people see and share in the financial benefits, that might motivate them. On the other hand, if they are forced by decree to use something they consider inferior, it's going to be a disaster.
Also consider introducing it gradually over the next year, requiring to use StarOffice for some peripheral business processes and getting people used to it without forcing them to switch cold.
I would probably go with StarOffice (as opposed to the free suites), though. That's not because StarOffice is necessarily better, it's because you can point out that this is a commercial program, developed and supported by a large software company. You probably don't want to fight the "switch from Office" and "switch to open source software" battles at the same time. Once your users accept StarOffice, you can then still switch to OpenOffice.
Migrating from Linux to Windows (Score:2, Interesting)
I suggest you to spend 20 USD in CD-R and burn copies of OpenOffice, then start distribuiting throught our your perzonel and tel them to do some test days where all their activities will be done completely in OpenOffice and they can migrate their data more confortably.
Move new users first (Score:1, Interesting)
A smallish office can use a setup similar to a traditional windoze network, with high power clients. A large corp should consider using application servers and X terminals.
Install Linux for all new employees and stop upgrading existing users. Eventually, old users will plead with you to move them to Linux!
KDE and OpenOffice.org works purrrrrfectly for me. Together with MR Project, I can do whatever I want.
Your biggest problem is going to be the accounting people. Depending on the accounting package in use, they may have to stay with windoze, but everybody else can move to Linux tomorrow and will all be happy with the result.
Re:The other way around (Score:3, Interesting)
Before you go all crazy, at least try a Mac running OS X, first. If you like it enough, you'll have the best of both worlds: Soft chewy desktop supported by a name-brand computer maker, with a crunchy Unix backbone.
You may never have considered a Mac before, but you might like it now--it's worth at least a look.
I am doing the same thing !!! (Score:2, Interesting)
the first thing I did was bring in a linux. I have been able to easily manage the T1 for security, block inappropriate sites, and watch usage and traffic with Zero downtime
Yesterday our new server came in a Dual Athlon 360gig Raid5 monster! I will now integrate all the M$ servers, but one to this single server.
Third step is to switch the ERP system.. and here is where the trick comes in. We will get a new ERP system that runs a java client instead of a M$ client. that will leave the desktops only needing M$Office. to conduct business. we will have to look at Code Weavers CrossOver plugin and at Staroffice6.0 and see which is the better solution. when switching to Linux on the desktop we will of course go Thin client. this will dramatically cut administration cost. and save allot of man power.
In the engineering department we will be going to linux and ProE. YES ProE for Linux!! ProE for linux will be release at the end of this year. We will run redhat with acceleratedX drivers. just to keep it simple. (I don't think Xfree86 ever has full FireGL support any how). and then we are done
Re:The other way around (Score:5, Interesting)
For over a year or so I'm thinking of moving from Linux to windows. Why? Because of the stability and usability. Windows 2000 and XP appear to be very stable and no one can deny that they are lightyears ahead of anything on linux when it comes to desktop comfort.
For the last couple of months I've noticed an increasing amount of posts on Slashdot from people subtly promoting Microsoft and putting down Linux. They say just the right things to make sure their posts don't get modded down, but essentially try to persuade people to think the types of things Microsoft wants them to think.
Here's a very interesting article [guardian.co.uk] from the UK Guardian about corporations using fake people on newsgroups and email forums to rubbish their opponents. They use companies who promise to be very discrete and do it in such a way that it is very difficult to link the individuals back to the company concerned. The article cites the case of this type of tactics being used by Monsanto. Is it really so difficult to believe that Microsoft might pay one of these companies to post anti-Linux comments on sites like Slashdot? Read the article.
Ask what doesn't work (Score:3, Interesting)
I would install as many alternatives as you can, and make them the default. Open a doc in staroffice, and things should work. You can get at word, but not without going through a wrapper that requires you to email what staroffice cannot do that you need. Users will try to use staroffice where they can, where it fails they will tell you what doesn't work.
Or to save even more money, just start migrating people to linux/kde/koffice, after verifying that their applications will work.
Remember, you are a company, you have work to get done. Find out what tasks you really need to do, and then find a linux program to do it. For those who only use a few features of Word this is easy, koffice is there already. For those who need something complex, you might need wine, or devolpe your own solution.
Do not forget to do some practice runs. Take your backups, restore them to a equivelent systems, and convert that system to linux with the old data, and run some fake transactions. (be careful not to get this data into the real world). And don't convert anyone before a major deadline. Accounting gets converted right after payday, and nowhere near april 15th!
You don't have a hurry now, if the BSA does come knocking, or Microsoft does start demanding unreasonable fees, you have a plan in place to convert quickly, otherwise just convert as an open source alteranative is just as good as the windows equivelent. (Note, I said just as good for your pruposes, and Not as good. If you never use some feature, then there is no reason to wait for it)
The change is easy if you have the right catalyst (Score:4, Interesting)
he then asked me if there was another solution, and I wipped out my Redhat 7.3 laptop with open office..
Guess what... we're gonna switch to NON-MS.. all thanks to the BSA.
so basically... Use Microsoft's and the BSA's tactics to your advantage... push the fear,loathing and threats they are pushing... keep mentioning the 100,000 dollar fine PER incident. that the companies sensitive data will be accessable by strangers during the BSA visit, and the business disruption and public notification by the BSA that XYZ company STEALS.
works great..... Thanks Microsoft and the BSA for the BEST tools a Linux Advocate could ever want.
Re:Cost of retraining? (Score:3, Interesting)
With my knowledge of Windows 3.1, I couldn't figure out anything at all about Windows 95, let alone anything more recent. Had I taken the time to learn Windows 95, I would have had little advantage in learning 2K, let alone XP. Furthermore, there's so much fragmentation in windows software that, when I was using Word at one point, experienced people using the same version on a different computer couldn't explain how to do things.
Cost of retraining is a significant factor, and you shouldn't do it until you have to. But sticking with MicroSoft doesn't reduce the cost, and it means that you'll get hit with it again in 2-3 years.
Re:50 people == mid-sized??? (Score:2, Interesting)
that has been my experience as of late.
We were in the same boat - here's what we're doing (Score:2, Interesting)
Step one is become really comfy with Linux, you haven't already done so. Heck, get Linux for Dummies if you gotta; or people here can suggest some good newbie books.
Step 2, build a free workstation, load up Star Office and Netscape, and see how much of your old stuff will run.
Step 3, build a free server, and see how much of your old server functions you can get to run.
Step 4 - here's the sneaky part: After steps #1 - 3 you'll know what migrates and what doesn't. Instead of jumping through hoops to migrate everything - start phasing out everything which won't migrate anytime soon. Don't put any more work into other than keeping it reasonably alive. Or even purposely sabatoge it every week or so if you're pressed for time
And instead of trying to find a Guinea Pig to run a whole Linux workstation - start installing cross platform applications on people's Windows workstations. A good start is to roll out Netscape or another email program "to protect the company against all those Outlook viruses". Then just keep introducing more and more cross platform apps on peoples desktops - not instead of, but in addition to M$Office. Make a point of sending around important documents which will open in these programs by default.
The idea of course is to slowly build up your users familiarity with apps which run on Linux, so that when you've weeded out all the stuff that can't be moved over - they'll barely notice it when you switch the underlying operating system. The main thing is to try it as soon as possible, so that you don't make more work for yourself by putting development time into projects or features which won't move over easily. Make sure you're staff *neglects* those things, while supporting the he11 out of the ones you can move over. Do the simplest ones first - if there's a really crucial Windows only feature you need - odds are there will be plenty of folks working on a way to migrate it to Linux while you're moving over the easy stuff. And figuring out what can be migrated on the servers, and what "isn't really needed anyway".
Naturally there are some things which aren't going to be ready to move to Linux by the time you are - but if you've played your cards right (oh it's just *such* an instable product - we can't seem to get it working right); your staff will have ceased relying on those products by the time you take them away for good.
And it never hurts to relay panic-mongering information about Windows security holes, privacy breaches, pending price increases, and BSA audit horror stories to the appropriate channels. Or to take on yourself to convert vital documents to formats only open software can read. Believe me, Microsoft wouldn't hesistate to do it you...
Oh wouldn't it be nice if Red Hat and Netscape release a Linux "assimilation" package, that would just convert a whole M$ network to Free Software through a nice little Tux Wizard interface? Mmmmm, I'll bet they could recoup their costs just by offering same day delivery of the discs to people on the BSA's mailing list.
Re:Before you switch... (Score:3, Interesting)
The trick is educating the users WHY to use OS (Score:2, Interesting)
We have found in the office here, that new employees are a little shocked when they learn that they must use "linux" with "openoffice", because most of them have never touched anything besides microsoft windows. BUT, after a couple weeks with some help from other users, they get comfortable and very productive.
We share offices with one of our suppliers (this is in China), and they have about 8 Windows boxes. I just chuckled when the Kletz virus hit not long ago. Their entire network was infected and totally messed up. We were just whirring away working as normal, although we all had sore right hands from hitting the delete button for Kletz emails all day!
Everytime we set up a new box, I just smile when I think off all the money we are saving. I just don't understand why some of the largest companies in the world (including some of our customers) are willing to put thier most valuble information in proprietary format files (MS Office). Are the guys at the top REALLY that blind?
We have four developers now, and these are the guys that I am having the hardest time with converting over to linux. I am still trying to figure out why, and how to convert them........
You go first (Score:2, Interesting)
Right or wrong, that's how they feel and it's worth a few hundred extra dollars per person in software purchase price to avoid adding more "computer stuff" to the things most professionals have to pay attention to.
Most companies will gladly pay the MS tax if the alternative is today's Linux. Why would they subject their employees to a steep learning curve leading to significantly reduced functionality (as a business client machine) for the sake of a few hundred dollars per person?
They're almost all hoping, though, that someone else will go first and make Linux such a great business platform for non-computer types that it will be well worth the learning curve for the average business desktop/laptop user. Increased functionality would almost have to mean more savvy at figuring out what you want to accomplish with less required input from you. (Hardly the state of today's Linux, which prides itself on being amazingly customizable if you have the time, interest, and expertise to spend working on it.)
At that point, saying goodbye to MS will just be frosting on the cake, but until then most businesses will say, "you go first".