2.5.4 Kernel Out 208
Saint Aardvark writes: "Just in time for my 30th birthday, the new kernel is out...how did he know? Thanks, Linus! Change log here. I usually stick to stable stuff, but I think I'll try this for fun." Reader Scooby Snacks writes: "Be sure to use the patches and pick from the fine list of mirrors."
A Minor update to a development kernel? (Score:1, Flamebait)
Re:A Minor update to a development kernel? (Score:2)
It may not be "Justice wins over Microsoft" but its still a notable event.
Patchdot (Score:4, Funny)
2.5.20 released
2.5.19 released
2.5.18 released
2.5.17 released
2.5.16 released
2.5.15 released
2.5.14 released
2.5.13 released
2.5.12 released
2.5.11 released
2.5.10 released
2.5.9 released
2.5.8 released
2.5.7 released
2.5.6 released
2.5.5 released
Expect all these articles on this site soon.
Slashdot, news for "nerds", notifying you of minor changes to the penguin!
Re:Patchdot (Score:3, Funny)
Did he do something to his hair ?
New Topic Please (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
Re:New Topic Please (Score:5, Insightful)
Just my $0.02 worth anyhow....
Re:New Topic Please (Score:5, Insightful)
Are you paying for your desktop real estate by the pixel or something?
I rather effectively screen out JonKatz by reading the headline, and seeing the big green JonKatz underneath. Then I know it's drivel and I move on.
I just don't understand the motivation behind, "I should be able to filter this out!"...It's not like they're forcing you to read the article and all the comments. Just move along if it doesn't pique your interest. Considering how many stories flit past the front page in a day (and more with judicious use of Slashboxes), it's not hard to find something more personally interesting.
Then again, maybe I'm just being obtuse. Anyone care to enlighten me?
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
I mean, I don't block anything. I don't like Katz, so I don't click on the link to his posts. Reading the headline and summary doesn't cause me undue distress. If it did (as it appears to do to some), I could check the box in my prefs and it would go away. Choice is good.
Some people seem to be very distressed about seeing repeated postings about linux development kernel releases. What is the harm in making a new category for these that can be filtered as well (especially if it shuts the ones that have to bring this up again each time).
Personally, I want to see posts about new kernel releases. I want to read comments about it that don't repeatedly say 'why is this on slashdot!?'.
Then again, me theory is that some people just need to have something to bitch about (over and over). Jon Katz and kernel releases are easy to avoid, yet they click on the links, read the posts and then express their outrage. I think it is a compulsion.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
I want to read comments about it that don't repeatedly say 'why is this on slashdot!?'.
I agree. Of course you have to appreciate the irony that one of the most compelling arguments for filtering is so that other people can filter the stories they are not interested in rather than bitch and moan about the fact that they can't filter it out!
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
Quick, someone tell Alanis Morissette! [mellowfellow.com]
*I* screen out JonKatz... (Score:1)
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
[OT] Re:New Topic Please (Score:3, Insightful)
There are those of use who do want to read Linux stories, but don't want to know about every release of the kernel. It's not as if theres a shortage of sites that have that information.
Yeah, but (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Yeah, but (Score:5, Insightful)
And life would be happy all around. See how nice that'd work if TPTB @ /. would just use the Slash engine the way it's designed to work? :-)
D
Designed? (Score:5, Funny)
The slash engine was designed? I thought it just sort of grew. Like a fungus.
A'course, I haven't actually looked at it in a few years. The first release was traumatic.
Linus Torvalds school of design (Score:2)
Like some other software out there. I qoute:
"Software "Design" is like a religion - too much of it makes you inflexibly and unpopular."
- Linus Torvalds
Like a fungus? Of course! Its OSS! (Score:2)
Isn't the point that future redesigns of the software are based upon the users' needs and that they can directly affect the process? In this sense, it sort of organically grows very much like a fungus.
Wasn't it Steve Balmer who said that Linux springs up "organically" as competition? Is this not one of the big strengths of OSS?
Re:Yeah, but (Score:1)
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
There is no need for topics on "Be", "Comdex", "Digital", "TurboLinux", "Upgrades", "Beanies", etc..
What is needed is a rethinking on how to categorize the news to make it more informative and useful.
I would like that there be some 100-200, or even more topics, and the user can either ignore certain topics, or select the topics that he is interested in. This way the frontpage can get really configurable.
Also, the sections "apache", "bsd", "developers", etc are redundant! There shoud only be topics, and people who are interested in new apache releases can select that topic for their page. I really do not understand the reason behind the "sections", when everything can be handled usint "topics" alone.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
Theres already 77 topics. But I agree adding a kernel topic would be good.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
I'm so fed up of reading all this moaning crap - I want some of the advertised "stuff that matters". How fast does the new IDE subsytem go. Does the USB 2.0 patch make life worth living? I am actually interested in these things NOT in this "you're a troll", "no you're a troll", "NO YOU'RE A TROLL" noise. You are wasting my bandwidth. (and now I've wasted yours)
GNU/Linux (Score:2, Insightful)
So if we want to keep the terms right (and those who always complain about the use of the term hacker in a wrong context know we should) maybe there should be another topic 'GNU/Linux' or 'LinuxOS' (and also 'LinuxAPPS'?) to comfort those who want to read about Linux, but not about the kernel (so actually not about 'Linux'
I also wonder, how one can be interested in Operating systems based on the Linux kernel, without being interested in the development of the kernel itself (especially the unstable versions, since there is much more happening), and for a lot of readers the 'new kernel' news is the place to discuss these developments. So if you want to vent your complaints, that hardware x isn't supported, why patch y didn't make it in, express your happiness that z works now (z preferably being the VM), or just have a question these stories are the place to go. The kernel is the thing that all those LinuxOSes, LinuxDevices and whatnot have in common, and if you're interested in Linux on your Palm, or maybe in your coffee-machine, then you should be interested in the kerneldevelopment, since without a kernel allowing to be shrinked down to that size it's just not possible. If you're interested in 'Linux' running on big iron, like n-Processor machines, well, it's really the kernel and its development that makes it possible.
And finally, if you're really not interested in kernel development, it's not that hard to spot, that a story is about the new kernel, just ignore it, and be happy, these storys are there, because if they weren't people would just post things about new kernel developments in other Linux-stories (even if slightly offtopic).
--
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
Are you with me? It's not hard.
If you don't understand, then read on...
If a lots of slashdotters post the article, they must be interested in it. If slashdotters are interested in the story, it should be posted on the site. Even if there is a vocal minority that love to post complaints about the type of news.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
It's a vicious cycle; people post to get the karma, the editors use it because they think lots of people are interested, and then more people post because they know the editors will use it.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
If CNN had this cool engine built that allowed me to customize the news articles I saw, and then didn't actually USE that engine to the proper granularity, I think I'd call CNN and bitch, yes.
But since they don't, I'd change the channel.
However, since Slashdot DOES have the capability to customize the news so you see the things you WANT to see, doesn't it make sense for Slashdot to actually USE that capability?
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
The problem with your logic is that Slashdot is a free service. You don't really have any right to complain about it at all - let alone about something so trivial as story categories.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
Bzzzt... Wrong.
We have the right to complain about anything we want to, free or not.
Dinivin
Re:New Topic Please (Score:2)
You're right - being an asshole is your prerogitive.
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
I have another free service
A guy called Ramone comes around your house and punches you in the face.
It's a free service so please don't complain
Also available: The Ramone Diet (guess what happens if he catches you with a burger) or The Ramone Non-Smoking plan (You don't want to know where he shoves the cigarette, trust me).
Re:New Topic Please (Score:1)
Hmmm... to bring it back on topic, you think they could have mentioned that it WAS the unstable tree.... not everyone knows that (and don't start with the 'if they don't know, they shouldn't be compiling their own kernel' stuff, everyone ahs to start somewhere)
Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:3, Interesting)
Parsing the changelog, I don't see that many changes with potential enormous impact. Should I consider trying this version because many problems are straightened out or should I wait for a next "stable" 2.4.x?
I did see something regarding AGP (which I believe to be the source of my problems, as they go away if I disable 3D support) Linus said something about a workaround for AGP problems until a real solution was found. Doesn't look very encouraging, but hey...
Re:Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:2)
The problem is indeed with the combination of AGP and Athlon - disabling 3D support would probably help here, but is unlikely to make it go away completely.
I'd expect it shouldn't be too long (maybe it already happened, and I missed it) before there's a patch available for the problem (just disabling use of 4Mb mappings on Athlon should be the quick fix). When this is available, I imagine it'll go into both 2.4 and 2.5 fairly quickly.
Re:Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:1)
And the nopentium option slowing your computer down is in your head, I am running the same thing right now and it isn't noticible.
Re:Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:1)
Re:Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:2)
If the nopentium option helps, stick there. If you want performance inprovements try:
-Enable dma by playing with hdparms.
-Try some 2.4.17 patch that promises improvement. (low latency patch is still available for the 2.14 tree, but will not be maintained as it is included in 2.5 now.)
-Buy more RAM 8-)
Use Linux with "old" hardware (Score:2)
Then again, you can always use w2k or xp. Sadly, there are more drivers available there.
You should *not* be having issues. (Score:2)
Re:You should *not* be having issues. (Score:2)
I can't verify the 'running kernels compiled for Pentium on Athlon causes problems' reports because... well, I haven't, and why would I anyway?
Thanks for the namecalling, but your wrong. (Score:2)
Still wrong. (Score:2)
Facts: (Score:2)
1.) This is an Athlon bug in handling 4M pages when dealing with Intel's extended-paging.
2.) This bug becomes apparent when using Pentium-class optimizations in the kernel.
3.) I never said this was not an Athlon bug.
4.) You *will not* have this issue if you do not compile as a Pentium.
5.) Calm down and stop acting like a child/children.
Look champ... (Score:2)
Notice the line explaining the kernel configuration? I do not compile as Pentium* therefore I do not have this issue. Nor does anyone else who follows in my footsteps. Shows over. Nothing to see here.
Have you ever compiled a kernel? (Score:2)
Why you threw a hissy originally is beyond me... especially over something as trivial as this argument. Go to
Re:Having trouble with 2.4.17, should I get this? (Score:1)
I have an Athlon with NVIDIA graphics card on my workstation. I switch it on at about 7pm each evening work in the evening and leave it overnight to do backup and switch it off again 7:30am in the morning
Before using the "nopentium" command line switch about 1 in 5 to 1 in 10 days I would find it frozen in the morning - mouse and keyboard locked and the screen blank (energy saving).
Since using the "nopentium" switch it hasn't happened once.
I'm definately waiting for a fix.
What's good about 2.5 (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:What's good about 2.5 (Score:4, Informative)
Follow the link to the posts if you want the details and discussions, if you don't, the items and a more human-readable explaination is below:
2.5.x API change summaries
o Shouldn't matter much as far as I could tell, mostly "heads up" to people writing programs that mess with the kernel.
o Block I/O layer changes:
The goal seems to be a more generic i/o scheduler while at the same time making it more efficient.
Typical "dont-understand-exactly-what-they-are-doing-but-
o initrd / initramfs:
initramfs is intended as a replacement for initrd. The basic idea seems to be to tack a
o SCSI changes
As always?
o driver model: driverfs
Driverfs seems to aim towards merging all bus-type weirdness that lives under
o reworking major/minor system
The currrent model of drivers having major/minor numbers is going to change to allow larger numbers (and therefore, more devices). May be some hairy details involved in changing such a "standard" size. Consent seems to be that apps that depend on a specific size are broken anyway.
o USB and WireLess API changes
I don't use any of these so I haven't got much to say, anyone with more interest/info?
o kbuild and CML2
The new configuration language and makefiles, these have been discussed earlier on slashdot (see here [slashdot.org]).
Re:What's good about 2.5 (Score:2)
And I seem to vaguely recall hearing about a new kind of IP mode to allow a single server to host tens of thousands of connections in a much more efficient manner than TCP allows. This would be useful for instant messanger and peer to peer clients.
Anyone know anymore about either of these two projects? If I remember it right it was from an article about the top Linux people getting together at a linux world and having a couple of days of meetings.
Re:What's good about 2.5 (Score:2)
This should make 2.5/2.6 "feel" much faster.
Congratulations! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Congratulations! (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Congratulations! (Score:2)
Think before you grab it (Score:4, Informative)
So, unless you wish to contribute to the kernel development or want a range of unknown problems, stick with the even middle-numbered kernels.
Re:Think before you grab it (Score:2, Offtopic)
odd number is 2*n+1, n in Z.
Don't run if you can't walk.
Re:Think before you grab it (Score:2)
hehe, look at what they call their stable kernels!
Re:Think before you grab it (Score:2)
Just ask people who ran 2.4.11 how "stable" that kernel was.
P.S. The proper way to say a number is odd is to say it is an x such than x%2=1 or x&1=1
This is GOOD news (Score:1, Insightful)
Thumbs up (Score:4, Interesting)
Not being anything remotely resembling a kernal hacker, it was great to see and compare some of the (proposed) changes between 2.4.x and the new 2.5 fork at the recent linux.conf.au [linux.conf.au]. The speaker, Rusty Russell, took us through the netfilter and scheduler code (2.4.13 vs 2.5.3) and it was a real eye-opener. I don't claim to be a C wizard, but I can tell elegance when I see it, and some of the code overhauls certainly have that ring to them.
I'm interested ... (Score:2, Interesting)
Or does everyone here REALLY run Win XP ??
Re:I'm interested ... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:I'm interested ... (Score:2, Insightful)
The pre-empt kernel patch is actually the most interesting feature in Linux as it suddenly turns a server OS with a sluggish UI into a really responsive workstation with still impressive network performance.
So it is quite good news to hear that it will be possible to determine whether we want our kernel user or services oriented by just checking a box in the Linux-compilation-tcl box.
Re:I'm interested ... (Score:2)
This patch has been needed for a long, long time, and with the new O(1) schedualler linux is now as scalable as any other OS in the world. I am really interested in seeing how Linux 2.4.6 will do on an 8 way or 32 way machine. Are there anymore limitations left in scaling linux to high numbers of processors and large amounts of RAM? If so, how hard will it be to fix these issues, without affecting a user on a single processor box?
I don't think we need to fork to support both the high end and low end with a single kernel.
Werid day... (Score:4, Informative)
2.0.40-rc2
2.2.21-pre2
2.4.18-pre7-ac3
And, of course, 2.5.4.
Granted, only one was a full revision bump, but to see updates in so many trees is neat.
Re:Werid day... (Score:1)
However, Linux 2.5.3-nsa1 [nsa.gov] did come out today so you are right. 4 kernel trees out today!
Uh, where were you? (Score:1)
--R
Re:Werid day... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Werid day... (Score:2)
Re:Werid day... (Score:1)
Infinite diversity in infinite combination.
I've been reading Dune too much..
Ratings (Score:1, Funny)
Re:Ratings (Score:2, Funny)
wow (Score:1, Troll)
--------
I usually stick to stable stuff
--------
Wow, there is a stable version of linux?? gimme gimme
Re:wow (Score:2)
I'm sick of it... (Score:4, Insightful)
Collective scream... (Score:5, Funny)
7:59 - "Bleeding edge" kernel hackers start downloading it
8:30 - download finally is over, start unpacking it
8:35 - ooh and ah over new features in config
8:40 - start compiling, so far so good
8:55 - kernels done, reboot
8:56 - system is as fast as ever and that leet hardware is now supported
8:59 - file system gets fscked due to some small oversight
9:00 - a large scream is heard through country
9:10 - screaming stops
9:20 - hacker finally remembers that its the 2nd #, not the 3rd that means the kernel is unstable
9:30 - i laugh
Re:Collective scream... (Score:3, Insightful)
...and that's as far as you'd get on an x86. Although those _actually_ interested in developement kernels would have no trouble locating a suitable patch posted to kernel mailing list by Andrew Morton.
Also vesa frame buffers users will have difficulties linking it together, because of few bus_to_virt instead of phys_to_virt
(Patches for the x86 headers below...)
--- linux-2.5.4/include/asm-i386/processor.h Sun Feb 10 22:00:29 2002
+++ 25/include/asm-i386/processor.h Sun Feb 10 22:21:53 2002
@@ -435,14 +435,7 @@ extern int kernel_thread(int (*fn)(void
extern void copy_segments(struct task_struct *p, struct mm_struct * mm);
extern void release_segments(struct mm_struct * mm);
-
-/*
- * Return saved PC of a blocked thread.
- */
-static inline unsigned long thread_saved_pc(struct task_struct *tsk)
-{
- return ((unsigned long *)tsk->thread->esp)[3];
-}
+extern unsigned long thread_saved_pc(struct task_struct *tsk);
unsigned long get_wchan(struct task_struct *p);
#define KSTK_EIP(tsk) (((unsigned long *)(4096+(unsigned long)(tsk)->thread_info))[1019])
--- linux-2.5.4/arch/i386/kernel/process.c Sun Feb 10 22:00:28 2002
+++ 25/arch/i386/kernel/process.c Sun Feb 10 22:26:35 2002
@@ -55,6 +55,14 @@ asmlinkage void ret_from_fork(void) __as
int hlt_counter;
+ * Return saved PC of a blocked thread.
+ */
+unsigned long thread_saved_pc(struct task_struct *tsk)
+{
+ return ((unsigned long *)tsk->thread.esp)[3];
+}
+
+/*
* Powermanagement idle function, if any..
*/
void (*pm_idle)(void);
Well actually... (Score:1)
The 2.5.x series don't cause any corruptions at all.
Just in case you didn't know....
Re:Collective scream... (Score:1)
My apology for my ignorance, but I always thought a dork without a girlfriend is a geek, and a geek with a girlfriend is considered (by her) a dork.
Re:Collective scream... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Collective scream... (Score:2)
(3.1415926535898...)
This will probably be modded down, but.. (Score:1)
And my 14th, and thousands of other peoples' birthdays. What better present than a new kernel
Why are development kernels news? (Score:2)
Or is slashdot just desperate for news on Monday morning?
- A.P.
ChangeLog got hacked? (Score:1, Informative)
For people that do not read Russian: 'pizda' in Russian stands for 'C-word' and 'ninka' is a short form of female name.
Re:ChangeLog got hacked? (Score:2)
For me, this really is not funny.
detailed Change log (Score:2, Insightful)
I's detailed and clear.
ChangeLogs in adult filter??? (Score:1, Informative)
<davem@pizda.ninka.net>
The problem is that the word 'pizda' is one of the most rude curses in the Polish language (used to name women vagina). This is problably some kind of humor of Dave Miller (whose wife is Polish) but
After all, in case some 'adult filter' is implemented for Polish language, it will filter out the Linux change log.
Re:ChangeLogs in adult filter??? (Score:1)
No signs of ALSA (Score:1)
Extremly offensive language in 2.5.4 ChangeLog (Score:2, Funny)
few patches posted from "davem@pizda.ninka.net"
In Russian the word "ninka" is a female name
while the word "pizda" is a very dirty slang for a female genitals. To a Russian this email address sounds very offending!
You know Linus cannot be proficient in all world languages. Therefore some ethics on the side of
Linux contributors is very much appreciated.
+Leo+
Mandrake 8.2 Beta 2 also became available today. (Score:2, Informative)
Very few 'really ugly' bugs have been found in the first beta, and we have been able to concentrate on hardware recognition, improving the *drake* tools, and updating the packages. For more details about what has changed since the beta1, and what should be tested, please wait for the articles in the "test this" serial.
Silent Kernel (Score:1)
Re:Silent Kernel (Score:2)
Major breakage in this kernel. (Score:5, Informative)
Even if you don't see the above problem, this kernel will not compile (atleast on most i386 systems) without the following patch:
--- linux-2.5.4/include/asm-i386/processor.h Sun Feb 10 22:00:29 2002
+++ 25/include/asm-i386/processor.h Sun Feb 10 22:21:53 2002
@@ -435,14 +435,7 @@ extern int kernel_thread(int (*fn)(void
extern void copy_segments(struct task_struct *p, struct mm_struct * mm);
extern void release_segments(struct mm_struct * mm);
-
-/*
- * Return saved PC of a blocked thread.
- */
-static inline unsigned long thread_saved_pc(struct task_struct *tsk)
-{
- return ((unsigned long *)tsk->thread->esp)[3];
-}
+extern unsigned long thread_saved_pc(struct task_struct *tsk);
unsigned long get_wchan(struct task_struct *p);
#define KSTK_EIP(tsk) (((unsigned long *)(4096+(unsigned long)(tsk)->thread_info))[1019])
--- linux-2.5.4/arch/i386/kernel/process.c Sun Feb 10 22:00:28 2002
+++ 25/arch/i386/kernel/process.c Sun Feb 10 22:26:35 2002
@@ -55,6 +55,14 @@ asmlinkage void ret_from_fork(void) __as
int hlt_counter;
+ * Return saved PC of a blocked thread.
+ */
+unsigned long thread_saved_pc(struct task_struct *tsk)
+{
+ return ((unsigned long *)tsk->thread.esp)[3];
+}
+
+/*
* Powermanagement idle function, if any..
*/
void (*pm_idle)(void);
-
-
Re:Major breakage in this kernel. (Score:2, Informative)
cd
However, since people use different conventions for naming their kernel source directory it is usually better to do:
cd
patch -p 1 -d your-dir-2.5 < file.patch
So, for example, if you keep your source in a directory called "linux-2.5" in
# cp file.patch
# cd
# patch -p1 -d linux-2.5 < file.patch
Anyway, hope this helps. If you want to read more on this, you might want to check out www.kernelnewbies.org.
Re:Major breakage in this kernel. (Score:2)
add
"diff -Nru linux-2.4.5 25"
to the first line of your patch file
Re:Uh, who cares? (Score:1)
As somebody replied to the last Troll-ish post relating to kernel 2.5.3: it shows that there's forward progress towards the next stable kernel. So it does in fact mean something. To further reply to your post, nobody asked you to use this kernel. All kernels in the development tree are strictly for testing for the few brave enough, or with the curiosity and time to try it.
If the open source/Linux development holds up on this one, with any luck, there will only be 220 more notices before we see 2.6.0. Yay!
220? Hmmm, seems a bit high of a guess.
Re:Can't compile it (Score:1)
Me too. Debian sid system here, so it's not Redhat-specific.
Ok, it's a development beta kernel, but you'd think they'd at least make sure it compiles before handing it out?
Re:Can't compile it (Score:2, Informative)
Re:The code police (Score:1)
graspee