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Serious Bug In 2.4.15/2.5.0 498

John Ineson writes: "There is a bug in the latest kernel releases, that causes fs corruption on umount. A lot of people have already been hit by this, so for now I suggest you hold fire on booting those new kernels. More dead-duck than greased-turkey. Two possible fixes are being discussed on linux-kernel." Colin Bayer adds links to a story at the Register and Al Viro's fix. Update: 11/25 00:39 GMT by T : Tarkie writes "Linux 2.4.16-pre1 is out, as detailed at NewsForge. If you've been having the filesystem corruptions, might be worth a try so that 2.4.16 can be out ASAP!"
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Serious Bug In 2.4.15/2.5.0

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  • Re:Alan Cox (Score:4, Interesting)

    by linux_warp ( 187395 ) on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:20PM (#2607049) Homepage
    Also, straight out of alans diary:

    September 29th - Much kernel patching going on. The -ac kernel tree seems to be turning into the stable tree as Linus merges odder, weirder and more alarming things. I just hope he knows what he is doing.
    ---

    Sounds like confidence to me :)
  • Re:Filesystems (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Colin Bayer ( 313849 ) <<gro.sulucci> <ta> <nogov>> on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:21PM (#2607054) Homepage
    It afflicts every filesystem. However, rebooting with the file /forcefsck extant forces it to run an fsck (and fix the corruption) on boot.

    Also of help might be the Alt+SysRq keys; if you sync the drives and unmount them in single user mode before reboot, you should reduce or eliminate the corruption.
  • FS corruption? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by be-fan ( 61476 ) on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:21PM (#2607057)
    Dude. I hate to say this, but Windows 2000, while it may crash more, doesn't hose you're filesystem nearly as often as Linux seems to these days. At what point do we get to start making the LinSux jokes?

    PS> Don't flame me please. I just wiped Win2K off my harddrive this morning. Luckily, I downloaded the 2.4.15 tree but have been too lazy to compile it yet.
  • Re:quality assurance (Score:0, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:23PM (#2607065)
    As soon as you get a professional group of developers who are compensated for their work. You can't rely on the garbage thats being churned out be the long-haired communist hippies that are in charge now.
  • Re:Really... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Colin Bayer ( 313849 ) <<gro.sulucci> <ta> <nogov>> on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:34PM (#2607115) Homepage
    Just like so many things with Linux, you'd think that this would be true, but it isn't. ;) There are two trees that are in development at all times:

    The "stable" tree (which has an even minor version number), and the "development" tree (which has an odd minor).

    When kernel 2.2n.0 (n being a non-negative integer, in this case, 2) is released, development stops on 2.2n-1.x, and all newly-submitted-and-approved-by-Linus patches are applied to the 2.2n.x tree (because 2.2n-1.x is out of date). While 2.2n.x is still called the stable tree, it becomes the development tree (because some of the newly-patched stuff is untested, and there's no "development" tree to put it in). The "stable" role falls back to 2.2(n-1).0, in this case, the 2.2.x tree.

    As far as this goes, it was a stroke of bad luck and hurried timing that this bug wasn't ironed out in 2.4.15-pre9 before it went final (and somewhat of a stroke of stupidity on the parts of the early adopters, myself included).

    When 2.2n+1.0 is released, 2.2n continues development, making it the stable tree. Any fixes to bugs found in the 2.2n+1.x tree are back-merged to the current stable tree so that end-users can enjoy a stable, debugged kernel without riding the bleeding edge.

    The problem with the Linux kernel numbering system is that the "stable" tree is only stable when there's a "development" tree to test the uncharted waters for it... if there isn't one, it's best to stay back a few revisions unless you like running fsck. ;)
  • by fishebulb ( 257214 ) on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:35PM (#2607117)
    yes this is quite a serious bug, but 2 things set this apart from MS. It will be fixed within 24-48 hours. The frequency of these bugs are a bit smaller than MS's bug of the day (which very often are large holes).
  • Re:A Workaround (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 24, 2001 @01:47PM (#2607159)
    The strange thing is, out of habit (years ago, you always had to remember to sync on Unix, and due to a bug, you always had to sync more than once), I always sync, sync, sync, umount...
  • Comment removed (Score:2, Interesting)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Saturday November 24, 2001 @02:00PM (#2607216)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • grre (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 24, 2001 @02:23PM (#2607299)
    Grrr... Definitely time for a three-pronged development. STABLE, TESTING, DEVEL, trees, please!

    And would it kill them to use a versioning system ??? - CVS is great, but there's other options, too...

    This sort of thing is NOT good, in a supposedly "stable" tree, and gives MS, BSD, and proprietary Unix folk lots of Ammo against Linux.

    To be fair, people adminning production boxes should be using the kernels from their Distro's site, since, really, it's the distro that is the OS, and RH, SuSe, and Mandrake all heavily regression-test and fine tune their kernel, it's not necessary to be on the bleeding-edge.
  • by stefanlasiewski ( 63134 ) <(moc.ocnafets) (ta) (todhsals)> on Saturday November 24, 2001 @02:43PM (#2607372) Homepage Journal
    Did the marketing people take over the Kernel release process?

    Why the rush between the pre9 and final versions? Why the lack of QA? Are the kernel developers rushing to meet a deadline or something?

    Alot of people complain that Open Source projects develop too slowly, and cite the slow pace of Mozilla and Gnome as an example.

    Pro-OSS folks say "That's a BENEFIT to the OSS model, we don't rush things through the door before they are ready, therefore there are less bugs in our released products.

    But here we are, with a product that was rush, and that was released with a serious bug.
  • Re:quality assurance (Score:2, Interesting)

    by KagatoLNX ( 141673 ) <kagato@@@souja...net> on Saturday November 24, 2001 @03:35PM (#2607540) Homepage
    Finally some good points. This probably shouldn't be a reply to this
    message but it's too late now.

    I would point out that this bug does not turn up readily.

    This bug allows a system to boot up normally, run fine, and then when you
    reboot (and only when you reboot) some files are missing if (and only
    if) their buffers were dirty when you rebooted.

    This is NOT easy to catch. The average Linux system has upwards of 50,000
    files. A few disappearing is not easy to notice. In addition, buffers
    tend to get flushed pretty well during the shutdown process, so it
    wouldn't show up too often either (I avoided on accident it due to a
    peculiar RAID shutdown script I have that sync's and sleep's for a bit).

    For the M$ zealots out there be careful to practice what you preach. One
    of the core arguements of the Slaves of the Empire is that the Linux
    zealots bash M$ but can't take criticism themselves. If you'll check your
    precious windowsupdate.microsoft.com on a fresh Win98 install, you'll find
    the IDE Hard Drive Cache Update. For the uninitiated, this patch fixes a
    problem where Windows doesn't write all of the data to disk on
    shutdown. Ironically, this tended to completely hose Win98 systems
    beyond fixing by Scandisk (usually registry damage).

    So, Win98 and Linux have similar problems. In a week, the Linux bug will
    be history, but the M$ one is still being minted on CD and requires an
    Internet download (because it's a "minor problem", the fix is to "wait
    before shut down so the data is written"). I don't remember too much
    babbling on Slashdot about that bug and it's been there for YEARS.

    Gosh, I guess I should write this off as being dribble by "Linux
    Bashers".

    Oh, and to completely trash my karma, I've had disk corruption in a stable
    FreeBSD due to a bug in FreeBSD code, so don't get too high on your own
    superiority yet. You've got older code--sometimes it's a strength,
    sometimes it's a weakness. Like the FreeBSD development process isn't
    ever rocky.
  • Re:Please spare us (Score:2, Interesting)

    by VividU ( 175339 ) on Saturday November 24, 2001 @04:22PM (#2607697)
    "Name one that has not had this same problem in the last year? Just one"

    Windows 2000

    Take this post as a challenge. Reply with a link that shows that there is/was a bug in Windows 2000 that caused the loss of a ENTIRE FILE SYSTEM ala Linux or Apples iTunes.

Intel CPUs are not defective, they just act that way. -- Henry Spencer

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