Red Hat Proposes Alternative Settlement To MSFT 532
cwsulliv writes "Red Hat, Inc. has proposed an alternative settlement to the Microsoft class-action lawsuit in Maryland. Microsoft originally proposed supplying a limited number of poorer school districts in the US with PC hardware and limited-license Microsoft software.
The alternative proposal submitted by Red Hat would have Microsoft supply NO software but dramatically increase the number of school districts receiving hardware. Red Hat in turn would supply ALL the software (Open Source) and unlimited support via their Red hat Network.
"
Deja vu (Score:5, Informative)
Well played. (Score:3, Informative)
Each machine is probably around $1000, but they will get them for significantly cheaper, but they can install $1000 worth of software on those systems for almost free.
I like RedHat's point. I'd really like to see the actual numbers on this, e.g. the percentage of the settlement that results from hardware versus software expenses. Also, the limited licences are a scam.
Wow... (Score:3, Informative)
I am sure to be modded down for trolling, but I think this is a valid point.
Re:Go Redhat! (Score:2, Informative)
This proposal put forward by one of the Plaintiff 's Lawyers, NOT Microsoft as so many people here seem to think it was.
Here are relevant quotes from the Wired Article:
Michael Hausfeld, representing a group of private plaintiffs in Washington, D.C., said he thought of the unorthodox settlement idea about nine months ago after realizing that each of the 65 million computer buyers eligible to gain from a $1 billion settlement would receive little more than $10.
Hausfeld and other lawyers consulted with academics and other education experts, then worked with Microsoft to hammer out final terms of the deal, he said.
So again, this "deal" was proposed by the Plaintiff's Lawyers, not Microsoft, and it pertains to the Private Class Action Lawsuits, NOT The DoJ Anti-Trust Trial.
Re:./tted (Score:1, Informative)
The 's' in https explains all.
Hemos should have linked to this URL:
http://www.redhat.com/about/presscenter/2001/pres
-J
Re:Touche (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Kids wont have a problem with Linux (Score:1, Informative)
why? because it was neat to make your own game.. and because you grew up looking at it so when you hit 10-12 you could figure it out a bit easier..
frankly, educational software, today, is the cheapest built software on the market.. its buggy, its quickly made with macromedia, etc.. probably very easy to port if a company really wanted to do it.
if they are going into highschools then they dont even need educational software.. all highschools teach nowadays are spreadsheets and the rare school that has a C or basic class..
Re:Kids wont have a problem with Linux (Score:1, Informative)
When I was in fourth grade they taught us to use logo to draw shapes and stuff. And I could code in basic by the time I was 10.
For a first computer language though, I would reccomend something like logo instead of C because it's more visual and also builds math skills (geometry and so on).
you don't get it (Score:3, Informative)
- the schools might already have licenses to windows software, what's stopping them from installing windows on the newly donated hardware? Also, if they at some point in time scrounge up enough loot for the MS software, what's stopping them from installing it then? Hardware would just be one less thing to buy.
-the schools might not have hardware in the first place (we're talking poorer areas here) and maybe, just maybe a hard to use by the layperson (but ultimately rewarding) computer is better than no computer at all. Am I right or am I right?
There are a few things I can think of right off the bat that schools could use under linux.
Star Office/Open Office, GIMP, the INTERNET for crying out loud, various programming languages (high school mostly). Shit, they could even get MAYA if they had the cash. I'm sure there's plenty more. The only thing lacking would be the kiddie "educational" and "edutainment" software.
These would be very usable computers no matter what OS they end up running.
I don't think this is going to happen but it would be really, really nice.
Re:Red Hat will Settle For The Children (Score:1, Informative)
This is not a punishment by the DOJ. This is a settlement in private suits that states have filed against Microsoft. Microsoft and the states worked out this deal, the DOJ had nothing to do with it. Microsoft was not convicted of anything by any states, this is an out of court settlement. Do you see the difference? Two totally different trials, there wasn't even a trial for the states. The states thought they were overcharging for software, so they are giving a bunch away to schools for free. That is called a settlement. This was not mandated by any government or justice agency. This was a deal worked out by MS and states, a contract of sorts. There was no case, no conviction, no one was found guilty of anything. The US Justice system has nothing to do with this, there was no double standard. There was no loss of integrity. Please understand the basics of law before addressing this matter in future posts. Thank you.
Re:This would be the death of Red Hat (Score:2, Informative)
Red Hat is going to support 1 million PC's for free. How much would that cost?
All of which will be on standardized software and in groups of 70 or so per school. To support 70 identical PCs is no different from supporting 1 PC; the additional cost is only 69 more records in the database.
Do they realize the beating these machines take? Do they think that school teachers and librarians (who usually do the first line support) have any computer knowledge?
(Keep in mind, I don't work for RedHat, and don't even live in the same state as their offices)
I personally happen to be using RedHat now (7.1; I haven't taken the time to get 7.2 yet), and RedHat Network is a very high-class support scheme, possibly falling second only to Microsoft's omnipotent and ubiquitous Windows Update (which is only good because you're talking about a homogenized, monolithic OS, with an update program you can't escape). I prolly have about 100-150 non-standard packages installed on my computer (many being very, very alpha) and RHN keeps track of what's there well enough so that I can keep my system up to date.
Any school district worth its salt will have at least one technology professional. Even if they have to admin 700 boxen, all of the boxen are identical, so it can be made largely a "set-and-forget" affair with RHN.
This is insane. It's just a PR stunt.
IMHO, it isn't necessarily suicide. Consider the following:
1) This counterproposal most likely caught Microsoft off guard, and with the holiday season here, they may not have an official statement for a while.
2) This offer hasn't gotten much press (not even on the local news; I live near Seattle, btw) due to the events in Afghanistan.
3) If M$ accepts the counteroffer, they lose approximately 5 kids per computer per year that the computer is in operation... that's 5 kids who won't use Microsoft software times 1,000,000 boxen times maybe 3 or 4 years (at the least) that the boxen will be up.
All M$ will win back is the runoff, so to speak; the kids who grew up with Linux, hated it, and have now become Luddites. These children will require extensive hand-holding and support in the future when they are forced to use M$ products, which means their boxen will cost *far* more to maintain than those in a closed school environment.
4) If M$ declines the counteroffer, this whole mess is revealed to be nothing but some shady back-room dealing by Microsoft in an effort to escape monetary losses. This will leave them holding the bag for:
- 1 million personal computers
- Software to outfit these computers
- and, likely, the same case as before, as public outrage would prompt massive backlash at M$ *and* the DoJ
This will offend all school administrators offered these computers, not to mention pretty much every technology-informed person on Earth, or at least those who can put 1 and 1 together.
5) If their official statement comes after the Afghanistan situation cools down somewhat, then M$ will also lose every non-informed consumer who has access to a media outlet.
In summary:
- If M$ accepts the counteroffer, they lose 20 million prospective customers. RedHat gains every OS manufacturer's dream: a million boxen, running on standardized configurations, and all in the hands of children. *Big* PR boost; Linux cause furthered; pays back big dividends, even if they have to take loans out.
- If M$ declines, they lose a damn sight more than 20 million customers, not to mention lost revenues from *giving away* their own software. They'll prolly still be stuck with the case, and the DoJ won't take it easy on them this time.
Once again, RH gains a big PR boost (amongst those who can read between the lines, at least), doubts are planted in the minds of loyal Microdrones as to the actual practices of Microsoft, but this is a lesser victory, as any gained customers will be in non-controlled environments, meaning total maintenance cost is through the roof. OTOH, they are the same customers who don't know how to do anything but click buttons and look at pretty colors, so they sell big volumes of boxed sets, and all the How-To guides sell off store shelves.
Hope this post provides useful info.
-- Colin
Re:Touche (Score:3, Informative)
Microsoft is a monopoly. Legally speaking they are not only a monopoly, they are abusing that status. Schools are funded by the government. Punishing Microsoft by extending their monopoly further is a bad idea.
Pushing a government funded institution into helping break that monopoly is a good idea.
As far as whether the schools would install it themselves if they wanted to, that option doesn't even show up on their radar 99.99% of the time. That is the power of a monopoly.
I've also seen a lot of comments about how there isn't any educational software fo linux. To that I call bullshit. Given any subject there is something out there that some geek has whipped together, and it may not be produced by Mattel or Disney, but Linux is a much better tool for actually instilling the ability to learn than Windows.
I think this is a great publicity stunt by RedHat, and it won't go anywhere, but I'd love to see Linux in more schools. Yes I said more. There are quite a few schools that are already using it. do a google search for 'Linux education schools'
some useful(Karma Whoring) links:
http://www.seul.org/edu/ [seul.org]
http://www.riverdale.k12.or.us/linux/ [k12.or.us]
http://scnc.holt.k12.mi.us/techplan/index.html [k12.mi.us]