Microsoft Axes 'Get The Facts'

tom66 writes "Seems like a long time coming, as Microsoft today has axed it's Anti-Linux campaign 'Get the Facts', and Microsoft has replaced it with a new campaign, called 'compare'. This article touches up on why they may have done it, and the criticism surrounding Get the Facts."

Out with the old FUD.

Out with the old FUD, in with the new FUD.

I'm not going to bother with a line by line rebuttal, I'll note on the compare Windows to Linux [microsoft.com] page (which actually is about Red Hat, not linux), the last paragraph reads:

Open Standards != Open Source
Open Source is a software development and distribution model, which does not equate to how easily the software interoperates with other software or how open or standardized the interfaces are.

If you look in the corresponding MS section however, it doesn't touch on Open Standards (and MS's disregard for them) at all.

Typical of the sickening dishonesty we get from this predatory company.

Re:Out with the old FUD.

How can "free" be this expensive? Red Hat's business is based on annual subscriptions for OS support--you pay a subscription for every server, every year. And, if you want 24/7 support, you'll pay more.

Did you know? Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5 Advanced costs $2,499 per server per year without add-on features, like an application server and clustering.

It is a good deal compared to (the lack of) Microsoft support. People who want support comparable to what is offered by Microsoft can download CentOS [centos.org] (fully redhat compatible) or some other completely free distribution.

Red Hat includes the Yum update tool to help you download packages and software updates, but doesn't address IT professionals' broader needs--managing applications and workloads, like mail and collaboration, database and business applications.

Thats funny, because I have built rpms for my own applications. and I use custom yum repositories to keep track of, and distribute new versions of this software.
I hope they are not trying to compare this to the customization built into windows update.

Re:Out with the old FUD.

Kickstart + yum pales in comparison the DDD + RIS.

Wow, I never thought of it that way. Your convincing argument totally changes my mind about everything. I'm never using Linux again!

Re:Out with the old FUD.

Under the "reliability" tab, I read the case study for Continental AG. Here's a quote:

Continental first tested a Linux solution, but the company decided instead on a platform based on Microsoft® Windows Server(TM) 2003 Enterprise Edition and Windows® XP Professional because of the opportunity to lower costs and improve security. The new system architecture has considerably reduced IT costs at Continental AG.

The way it's worded implies that they replaced Linux with WS2K3 and XP, which saved all this money. But a more careful read shows that the original platform is unidentified (probably NT or such). Further, the discussion seemed to focus on the 24,000 desktops, not the servers, making this case largely irrelevant for comparing servers. An actual server comparison is never presented.

The bottom line is that this alleged proof of Windows superiority was done by comparing an anonymous and out-dated server platform against a more recent Windows server and then declaring Windows the winner over Linux with no justification given. WTF? Pure FUD indeed.

Re:Out with the old FUD.

I was reading a while back that Microsoft does have internal communications problems between the operating system and applications divisions. I mean, sometimes the guys working on Office don't even have all the information on the secret APIs the OS folks come up with.

Re:What a stinking pile that site is.

Because, of course, a comparison between Windows and Linux written by you would be entirely unbiased and would take in the merits and demerits of each equally.

Company says things about competitor to sell product; news at 11.

Re:it's not advertisement o_O

I'd suggest you check the video for power shell:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver/compare/vid [microsoft.com] eos/windowspowershell.wvx
Any reason why this video is on the Microsoft website?

You've made a parsing error that's not windows power shell, but Windows Powers Hell, its an advert showing how one of their big clients has seen huge rises in productivity since they shifted the demons from Gentoo to Windows ME

obviously for this particular client increased productivity == increased suffering, but i understand a lot of companies use the same metric...

from microsoft:

Given that the /compare site will provide 3rd party information, Get the Facts will be retired as a destination."

Destination? It's a web page, not a tropical resort.

The facts?

I guess too many people actually were getting the facts, and the upshot has been erosion of MS's server market share.

-jcr

The original version:

Microsoft Axes 'Get the Facts,' Announces 'Kill the Penguin' - Will commission Metallica to record a song to be played on the site.

Re:Elmer Fud

It is a good thing the Linux mascot is a penguin and not a rabbit, or we would have had Elmer Fud singing 'Kill the Wabbit!'

"Be vewwy, vewwy quiet... I'm huntin' pwengins... hwaah haah haah..." [throws a chair]

Hmmm. It could still work.

What Linux!?

"Compare Windows to Linux"
Even in the earlier campaign they just refer to "Linux" in the print advertisements and they never specify which version of softwares on which version of distribution that they have compared (Once they had compared Redhat Linux 7.1 with Windows XP!).
It is time that responsible people from Linux Mark Institute take a note of this and sue them for libel!

Re:What Linux!?

It seems to be a broad spectrum attack against many different Linux vendors, with most of the emphasis on attacking Red Hat Enterprise Linux. I did find some case studies highlighting people switching away from SuSE, something that I find interesting considering that Novell/SuSE is now a Microsoft partner.

Re:What Linux!?

it actually makes sense - SuSE and others are already occupied territory. So why bother emphasizing an attack on them? RedHat said they will not partner with M$, so of course the attack is focused on them...

As for them using SuSE switchers as example - the selection of examples is pretty limited. They had to take whatever they could get.

Peter.

Re:What Linux!?

(Once they had compared Redhat Linux 7.1 with Windows XP!).

Depending on when this comparison was done, and with what service packs and stuff for XP, this may have been a fairly reasonable comparison. If they were comparing XP sans-service packs, RedHat 7.2 would have been the most apples-to-apples comparison. Both were released in October of 2001. It's even quite possible XP was out before 7.2, which would have made 7.1 an even more reasonable choice (though 7.2 would still have been better).

Of course, if this is XP+SP2 for instance, then that's totally off-base.

If Microsoft says so, it must be true.

The guy at the Ford dealership told me that Fords are more reliable, safe, and powerful than Chevys. He showed me a bunch of charts he made, and that made me feel better. He also had a nice suit and really nice white teeth, and smiled alot. Nice guy. What reason did I have to check out the Chevy dealership?

New Focus

They are no doubt focusing all their PR efforts on their forthcoming new product [youtube.com].

Oh boy, it never ends...

"Customers want to consume this information in a variety of formats..."

ODF for me please!

Seriously this is just a new FUD campaign. Example:

How can "free" be this expensive?
Red Hat's business is based on annual subscriptions for OS support--you pay a subscription for every server, every year. And, if you want 24/7 support, you'll pay more.

Okay Microsoft, we've been telling you for years but you don't want to get it. Linux is "free as in speech" not "free as in beer." That means that the users get a whole lot of rights that you wouldn't give in your worse nightmare. The freedom to redistribute. The freedome to modify. etc, etc, etc.

Stop with the FUD websites until you know what you're talking about please. Oh, I forgot. You already know all of this but are just misleading your prospective users. Yeah, that's the kind of company with which I would want to do business. NOT!

Comparison of costs is extremely incorrect

Microsoft's fud site claims that the most expensive Red Hat Enterprise Linux version costs $2,499 per server per year for 24/7 premium phone and web support, unlimited users, no license restrictions, unlimited software upgrades, etc.

So how about we compare that to Windows Server 2003?
- $3,999/server for the enterprise version of Windows Server 2003 R2
- have to repurchase it every ~5 years when a new version is made available
- maximum of 25 users/workstations ($40 per extra user per Windows version)
...and wait for it...
- *NO SUPPORT WHATSOEVER!*

And we're not even getting into the real savings such as comparing MS SQL Server with an equivalent Red Hat offer, desktop Linux cost comparisons (including Office/Productivity applications), scaling costs up to 5000 users...etc

Red Hat Enterprise Linux (the product) is free. That is why CentOS exists. The only cost to using CentOS is having employees who can set it up and keep it running. But you have this exact same cost when using Windows Server as well! You pay Red Hat to provide support services to you - not for the actual product itself. If you go down the Microsoft path, you have to pay for the product AND the service (which Microsoft has conveniently ignored on their new fud website).

Their new website is self-damaging. If I was a potential Microsoft customer who was looking at the comparison between Linux and Windows, I'd instantly note Microsoft spreading fud and lies to make up for deficiencies in their offer. It is hardly reassuring that Microsoft is running scared at companies like Red Hat and feels the need to launch a big anti-Linux PR campaign based on lies and fud. The question I'd be asking myself is, "if Windows Server is so great, why can't Microsoft sell it to me based on features and facts?".

"Compare" singles out Red Hat

Although there is a "Compare Windows to Linux" tab on the new Compare site, nearly all the material there is targeted specifically at Red Hat -- one of the Linux distributors that is continuing to refuse to sign a patent-protection agreement with Microsoft.

Ah, so only the non-blessed distributions are inferior to Windows Server? As if Get The Facts wasn't bad enough; they've started to play real dirty. I don't see a page on redhat.com bashing Windows.

I'm very glad Red Hat is standing up to Microsoft and their shit. I hope people can see through this campaign the same as they did with Get The Facts.

No techie will believe this!

But I guess that's the problem... techies know the truth, but they have to battle against the ignorant manager who believes the shit MS writes.

No big deal

If you care to dive into the article, download and read the .doc format 'case studies', you will see there is nothing much to crow about.

If you are looking for hard empirical stats on a real comparison of Linux vs Windows, then these case studies are not for you. If you are looking for fuzzy feel-good buzzword-laden coffee table anecdotes, then its worth the download.

In the comparison cases presented, the reasoning is basically as follows :

"I went out with a Blonde once, and she was cool, except she had no job, and was stuck at home with 3 noisy kids - so we rarely got out together. Then I met this independent Brunette chick with a rich Dad and no ties, and we had a ball together. Therefore, based on my extensive experience with such a broad variety of women, I must conclude that in 100% of cases Brunettes make better girlfriends than Blondes'.

SwissAir's initial problem was that their existing Java/Oracle web site was less than optimal, and the code mixed presentation with business logic at all levels of the spaghetti triangle. So they went for a ground-up rebuild using their newly aquirred experience in how not to build a system. The operating systems hosting the bad-build / good-build of their web site are not even relevant to the study, but they happen to be Linux the first time around, and Windows the second time around.

Its a good article if you are interested in the subject of system development lifecycles .. but its hard to build a case for operating systems around it. You could just as easily say that the original Java/Oracle first cut (which ran on HP proliants) was replaced with a .NET rebuild (running on Dell), and therefore Dell is a better choice than HP.

The State of Illinois story is no better. Their initial problem is an aging hulk of a Groupwise messaging system running on Novell Netware. They chose to go to an unspecified line of Microsoft products, the prime deciding motivation being 'Because of Microsoft's position in the market'. The IT director even goes so far as to admit that 'We are not a science outfit - we just need something to get the job done', and they forgot to edit out the comment that 'For us, security was not a driving issue'. In other words, here is an organisation that is flat out doing whatever it does, and it just wants to outsource all of it's IT problems to a big outside company, and get on with the business of .. whatever it is that it does. Linux doesnt even come into the discussion - they never used it at all, so its hardly even a comparison. Very lame choice of stories to include in the 'Comparison' site I would have thought.

The REAL facts

if you want to get the facts from people who know what they are talking about then check wikipedia. this is the ONLY way to get unbiased results. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Windows _and_Linux [wikipedia.org]

yes, this is a spelling flame

It's written its Anti-Linux campaign (not "it's"). By not proofreading even the abstracts of your stories, you are adversely affecting the spelling abilities of your readers, leading to more badly written submissions ...

Re:Let's Compare!

1) Linux is free, why would it need anti-piracy measures?

It isn't that they do or don't need 'anti-piracy measures', after all plenty of non-free software have no 'anti-piracy systems' either.
It is about the pain in the ass that 'anti-piracy measures' bring with them.

2) Microsoft does not monitor what you're listening to, unless you choose to allow them.
Played DVDs lately?

Yes, VLC plays them just fine thank you. It's only in the USA where software patents mean anything (ok Japan has software patents too). The rest of the world has no legal issue with DVD playback using Free software. And do you know how terribly hard it is to get VLC in the USA? It's easier than getting official DVD software for MS Windows which costs extra. Just download it from the VLC webpage in France the same way you would download it for MS Windows.

3) The DRM is not intrusive, driver support is the widest available, Windows was built for backward compatibility and Microsoft Update / WUS is leading industry.

DRM, by its very nature is intrusive, it is a restriction after all, isn't it? But DRM's intrusion even goes above and beyond that, or perhaps you missed this recent example [slashdot.org]?

Driver support being the 'widest available' is arguable. Sure, everyone and his brother targets MS windows. But once the product is end-of-lifed, the drivers don't keep up with new versions of windows. They do with linux. So plenty of old hardware won't work on vista but will work with the latest linux kernels.

As for "Microsoft Update" leading the industry? WTF? Leading them to hell perhaps? MS Update reports back all kinds of information about each system that is unnecessary. The various updaters for Ubuntu, Suse and Redhat all do the same job without the same loss of privacy.

6) Prove they spy on China? And prove that Linux doesnt

Not just China, everyone. See NSAKEY. As for proving that linux doesn't, that's easy enough since anyone who cares has full access to the source code which they can then compile themselves in full confidence. The BEST MS will do is let you look at some, incomplete, source code, under very restrictive NDA licensing and they sure won't let you compile it and use the end result.