Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments
Search

News for nerds, stuff that matters

Ballmer Says Linux "Infringes Our Intellectual Property"

Posted by Zonk on Fri Nov 17, 2006 08:38 AM
from the oh-it-is-so-on-now dept.
Microsoft Patents Businesses Linux
Stony Stevenson writes "In comments confirming the open-source community's suspicions, Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer Thursday declared his belief that the Linux operating system infringes on Microsoft's intellectual property." From the ComputerWorld article: "In a question-and-answer session after his keynote speech at the Professional Association for SQL Server (PASS) conference in Seattle, Ballmer said Microsoft was motivated to sign a deal with SUSE Linux distributor Novell earlier this month because Linux 'uses our intellectual property' and Microsoft wanted to 'get the appropriate economic return for our shareholders from our innovation.'" His exact wording is available at the Seattle Intelligencer, which has a transcript of the interview. Groklaw had an article up Wednesday giving some perspective on the Novell/Microsoft deal. Guess we'll have something to talk about in 2007, huh?

Related Stories

[+] Microsoft To Announce Linux Partnership 534 comments
Carl Bialik from WSJ writes "Microsoft is entering into an unusual partnership with Novell that gives a boost to Linux, people familiar with the companies tell WSJ.com. From the article: 'Under the pact, which isn't final, Microsoft will offer sales support of Suse Linux, a version of the operating system sold by Novell. The two companies have also agreed to develop technologies to make it easier for users to run both Suse Linux and Microsoft's Windows on their computers. The two companies are expected to announce details of their plan today at a press conference in San Francisco. In addition, Microsoft won't assert rights over patents over software technology that may be incorporated into Suse Linux, the people said. Businesses that use Linux have long worried that Microsoft would one day file patent infringement suits against sellers of the rival software.'"
[+] Is the Microsoft/Novell Deal a Litigation Bomb? 342 comments
mpapet writes "According to WINE developer Tom Wickline, the Microsoft/Novell deal for Suse support may one day control commercial customers' use of Free Software. Is this the end of commercial OSS developers who are not a part of the Microsoft/Suse pact?" From the article: "Wickline said that the pact means that there will now be a Microsoft-blessed path for such people to make use of Open Source ... 'A logical next move for Microsoft could be to crack down on 'unlicensed Linux' and 'unlicensed Free Software,' now that it can tell the courts that there is a Microsoft-licensed path. Or they can just passively let that threat stay there as a deterrent to anyone who would use Open Source without going through the Microsoft-approved Novell path,' Wickline said." Bruce Perens dropped a line to point out that most of the content actually comes from his post.
[+] Microsoft/Novell Deal Could Create Two-Tier Linux Market 375 comments
Rob writes writes to mention a Computer Business Review article about the recent Microsoft/Novell Linux deal. Article author Matthew Aslet warns that while some may see the announcement as a step forward, it may ultimately be very divisive for the Linux community. From the article: "Microsoft made it clear that only SUSE users and developers, as well as unsalaried Linux developers, are protected. 'Let me be clear about one thing, we don't license our intellectual property to Linux because of the way Linux licensing GPL framework works, that's not really a possibility,' said Microsoft chief executive, Steve Ballmer. 'Novell is actually just a proxy for its customers, and it's only for its customers,' he added. 'This does not apply to any forms of Linux other than Novell's SUSE Linux. And if people want to have peace and interoperability, they'll look at Novell's SUSE Linux. If they make other choices, they have all of the compliance and intellectual property issues that are associated with that.'"
[+] Novell Gets $348 Million From Microsoft 308 comments
An anonymous reader writes, "Novell has published additional details about its agreements with Microsoft concerning Windows and Linux interoperability and patents. It seems the company is receiving an up-front payment of $348 million from Microsoft, for SLES subscription certificates and for patent cross-licensing. Microsoft will make an upfront payment to Novell of $240 million for SLES subscription 'certificates' that Microsoft can use, resell, or distribute over the term of the agreement. Regarding the patent cooperation agreement, Microsoft will make an up-front net payment to Novell of $108 million, and Novell will make ongoing payments totaling at least $40 million over five years to Microsoft."
[+] Dvorak On Microsoft/Novell Deal 218 comments
zaxios writes, "John C. Dvorak has weighed in on the recent Novell-Microsoft pact. Among his insights: 'Microsoft has been leery of doing too much with Linux because of all the weirdness with the licenses and the possibility that one false move would make a Microsoft product public domain at worst, or subject to the GPL at best.' But now, 'the idea is to create some sort of code that is jammed into Linux and whose sole purpose is to let some proprietary code run under Linux without actually "touching" Linux in any way that would subject the proprietary code to the GPL.' According to Dvorak, it's only a matter of time before Linux is 'cracked' by Microsoft, meaning Microsoft figures out a way to run proprietary code on it."
[+] A 5-Year Deal With Microsoft To Dump Novell/SUSE 174 comments
Nicholas Petreley writes, "Wake up little SUSE, wake up. No, that's not good enough. Wake up SUSE customers, wake up. Novell is jeopardizing the future of Linux for its own short-term rewards. If you want to see Linux flourish, let alone survive, after Novell's five year deal with Microsoft expires, I suggest we make an alternative five-year deal with Microsoft. In this case, our part of the deal is to spend the next five minutes, months, or years migrating away from every shred of Novell/SUSE software in our home, office, or enterprise."
[+] Eben Moglen To Scrutinize Novell-Microsoft Deal 102 comments
An anonymous reader writes "Novell is providing Eben Moglen's Software Freedom Law Center with confidential access to the legal terms of the Novell-Microsoft partnership, allowing to organization to verify if the deal is compatible with the GPL2 and GPL3 licenses. Moglen in the past has alleged that the patent license between the two companies could be in violation with section 7 of the GPL. Novell on Tuesday published a document on its website, explaining that they circumvented the GPL provisions by providing a patent license to the end user rather than between the two companies."
[+] Novell Responds To Microsoft's IP Claims 317 comments
Azul writes "Ron Hovsepian, Novell's CEO, has posted an open letter to the Community, where he explicitly states Novell's disagreement with Steve Ballmer's claims of Linux infringing on Microsoft's intellectual property. From the letter: 'We disagree with the recent statements made by Microsoft on the topic of Linux and patents. Importantly, our agreement with Microsoft is in no way an acknowledgment that Linux infringes upon any Microsoft intellectual property. When we entered the patent cooperation agreement with Microsoft, Novell did not agree or admit that Linux or any other Novell offering violates Microsoft patents.'"
[+] Microsoft Taking Heat For Patent Stance 226 comments
Yesterday Novell released a statement disavowing Steve Ballmer's claim that Linux infringes Microsoft's IP. Linux-watch.com reports that Microsoft quickly responded with a statement of its own that softened, but did not entirely back away from, Ballmer's claim (but the article offers no link to such a statement). xtaski writes, "Everyone took notice when Ballmer spewed forth FUD about Microsoft and Linux IP. Now CIOs are asking just what did Ballmer think he was doing? They are not fooled — but rather, a little angry. ComputerWorld covers the news including one CIO who says 'There were some applications I had been thinking about moving to a Microsoft platform, but this has now totally alienated me from Microsoft.'" And an anonymous reader points us to the statement by the Open Invention Network — whose investors include IBM, Novell, Sony, Red Hat, Philips and NEC — on the Microsoft-Novell agreement. From the statement: "OIN continues to support the Linux community's ability to collaborate and innovate. Through the accumulation of patents that may be used to shield the Linux environment, including users of Linux software, OIN has obviated the need for offers of protection from others."
[+] Novell "Forking" OpenOffice.org 370 comments
l2718 writes to mention that In the wake of their recent deal with Microsoft, Novell has announced a new version of OpenOffice.org which will support Microsoft's planned Office formal, Open XML. From the article: "The translators will be made available as plug-ins to Novell's OpenOffice.org product. Novell will release the code to integrate the Open XML format into its product as open source and submit it for inclusion in the OpenOffice.org project. As a result, end users will be able to more easily share files between Microsoft Office and OpenOffice.org, as documents will better maintain consistent formats, formulas and style templates across the two office productivity suites."
[+] Your Rights Online: Mr. Ballmer, Show Us the Code 462 comments
DigDuality writes "A new campaign, Showusthecode.com, requests every leader in the Linux world, and companies invested in Linux, to stand up and demand that Steve Ballmer show the world where Linux violates Microsoft's intellectual property. He has been making these claims since the Novell-Microsoft deal. If Microsoft answers this challenge — by May 1st — then Linux developers will be able to modify the code so that it remains 'free' software. If such infringing code doesn't exist, we will have called Microsoft's bluff. And if the campaign garners enough attention and if Steve Ballmer maintains silence, then the community and companies behind Linux can take the silence for the admission that it is."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Ballmer Says Linux "Infringes Our Intellectual Property" | Log In/Create an Account | Top | 820 comments (Spill at 50!) | Index Only | Search Discussion
Display Options Threshold:
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
(1) | 2 | 3

  • Alright, own up (Score:5, Funny)

    by LiquidCoooled (634315) on Friday November 17 2006, @08:39AM (#16882772)
    Who merged the Linux Genuine Advantage code into the tree?
    Come on, speak up - I know it was one of you.

  • Samba (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Ice Wewe (936718) on Friday November 17 2006, @08:40AM (#16882784)
    This coming from the guy that's requiring SMB2 in Vista so that people using Samba on Linux server's can't use them for file storage.
    • Re:Samba by Anonymous Coward (Score:3) Friday November 17 2006, @08:47AM

    • Re:Samba (Score:5, Interesting)

      by udderly (890305) * on Friday November 17 2006, @09:00AM (#16883014)
      Is it just me or does it sound like MS is going to charge a per seat charge for some enhanced ability to connect from a Windows machine to Linux servers? Or is it just straight blackmail for exemption for future litigation? Or both? I can't tell.
      [ Parent ]
      • Re:Samba by C-Shalom (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @09:48AM

      • Re:Samba (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Jason Earl (1894) on Friday November 17 2006, @10:19AM (#16884166)
        (http://jearl.0catch.com/)

        Actually, Microsoft's plan is even stupider than that. Microsoft wants to charge a per seat license for Linux users, but they aren't really offering enhanced interoperability. Novell and Red Hat are both going to include the same software. It's not like Novell is going to have its own version of Samba, for instance. The primary difference is that Novell customers are going to be able to "sleep easy" because Novell is paying Microsoft so that Microsoft won't sue Novell's Linux customers.

        Microsoft isn't going to sue Red Hat's customers either, but that's only because suing Red Hat customers would be ridiculously foolish. At its heart the real issue is that Microsoft has such a poor relationship with its customers that many customers are worried that Microsoft will drag them into patent court. These customers are willing to pay money, not for any sort of patent license, but for a short term commitment from Microsoft that they won't be sued.

        Next thing you know Microsoft execs will be brutalizing school kids for their lunch money.

        The truly ironic bit is that Microsoft is not going to sue anyone over patents. Microsoft execs know that if they did this the various organizations that have a stake in the success of Linux (which is essentially everyone but Microsoft) would pay for a well-funded defense. Millions of dollars would be spent, and in the end the patents in question would either be shot down or removed from the Free Software product in question. Depending on who Microsoft chose to attack it could even trigger retaliation from other large players with huge patent repositories. What's more, Microsoft's patent aggression would start a wholesale migration away from Microsoft's technologies.

        If Microsoft started suing folks using its technology then its technology would become much less popular virtually overnight.

        This is why Microsoft has wisely chosen a middle road. Instead of actually taking people to court, it is simply going to threaten to take people to court and hope that they'll throw money Microsoft's way.

        [ Parent ]

        • OT: Lunch money (Score:4, Funny)

          by Captain Sarcastic (109765) * on Friday November 17 2006, @10:47AM (#16884706)
          Next thing you know Microsoft execs will be brutalizing school kids for their lunch money.


          That remark touches a nerve for me. There was a girl in my elementary school who kept taking my lunch money. Worse yet, she took it from other kids in the school.

          However, I was the first one to stand up to her, and tell her that she wasn't going to get MY money, and that I was going to keep it!

          So she told me to put my tray back, and turned to the next kid in line.

          But I could tell that I'd had some effect from the way she kept looking at me funny for the rest of the year, and the whispering of the other kids told me that I'd made an impression on them as well.

          [ Parent ]
          • Re:OT: Lunch money by rizzo420 (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @11:00AM
            • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.

          • Re:OT: Lunch money (Score:4, Interesting)

            by Locutus (9039) on Friday November 17 2006, @11:42AM (#16885684)
            Microsoft has gone after "lunch money" before. When they were attempting to get as many school systems on Microsofts License 6 scheme, they used the BSA to trigger clauses in the Microsoft Windows EULA to force expensive audits on various school systems across the US. Many caved in and paid for MS License 6 instead of the 10's to 100's of thousands it would cost for th audit only to have a handful of illegal copies still cost them millions. But, a few fought back and dumped MS Windows for GNU/Linux and then started telling other school systems about it and how it was much cheaper than MS License 6 or the audit.

            Google for Oregon school Linux Microsoft BSA or similar terms and you should get some hits on the topic.

            Microsoft just might be forcing an 'event' in the market they really don't want to occur. The fact that they are even using the "L" word and signing/paying off a "L" word company is amazing enough and shows they are having a 'problem' with GNU/Linux and probably FOSS too. IMO.

            LoB
            [ Parent ]
          • Re:OT: Lunch money by Harry Coin (Score:3) Friday November 17 2006, @12:16PM
        • Re:Samba by treak007 (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @11:09AM
        • there is nothing to defend against by oohshiny (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @12:55PM
        • Re:Samba by Dracos (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @01:28PM
          • Re:Samba by Jason Earl (Score:3) Friday November 17 2006, @03:13PM
        • Samba's not it. Think SGI by Anonymous Coward (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @02:18PM
        • all your lunch money is belong to MS by number6x (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @03:45PM
        • Re:Samba by soundvessel (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @04:08PM
        • Re:Samba by TemporalBeing (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @05:41PM
        • Re:Samba by non (Score:2) Saturday November 18 2006, @02:28AM

        • Re:Samba (Score:4, Informative)

          by jschrod (172610) <jschrod AT acm DOT org> on Friday November 17 2006, @11:56AM (#16885922)
          (http://www.schrod.org/)
          According to Novell, you don't buy any MS license when you buy SUSE. They say that there is no reason to because SUSE does not infringe on any MS patents, to their knowledge. They also promise to throw our any infringing code immediately, it it gets known, so there won't be cause for you licensing it from MS in the future.

          According to Novell, what you get is indemnification against potential lawsuits from MS, just like you do when you buy Linux from HP or other sources. (HP also indemnifies their own customers and not others. RH doesn't indemnify, it has a limited legal defense fund.)

          The main difference here is that it was publicized how Novell realized that indemnification, by a contract and payments to MS, and that way doesn't resonate well with many free software proponents.

          NOTE: I'm not connected to Novell, but I informed myself by reading the available publicized material.

          [ Parent ]
        • 2 replies beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:Samba by Anonymous Coward (Score:3) Friday November 17 2006, @10:07AM
      • Re:Samba by asapien (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @11:19AM
        • Re:Samba by hendersj (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @11:38AM
          • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
        • Re:Samba by chemaja (Score:1) Saturday November 18 2006, @04:49AM
      • Re:Samba by Zaiff Urgulbunger (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @11:48AM
      • Re:Samba by Lodragandraoidh (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @02:08PM
      • Microsoft and the EU by falconwolf (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @03:58PM
    • SMB2 in kernel, requires Vista AND longhorn by AgentPhunk (Score:1) Friday November 17 2006, @10:16AM
    • I beg you, somebody, explain this. by jotaeleemeese (Score:2) Monday November 20 2006, @08:02AM
    • Re:Samba by Lonewolf666 (Score:2) Friday November 17 2006, @11:12AM
    • 4 replies beneath your current threshold.

  • Listen closely (Score:5, Funny)

    by deadhammer (576762) on Friday November 17 2006, @08:40AM (#16882788)
    That rhythmic thudding sound you hear is the sound of every computer professional on the planet simultaneously laughing their balls off.

  • Microsoft Brand FUD (Score:5, Insightful)

    by eldavojohn (898314) * <my/.username@@@gmail.com> on Friday November 17 2006, @08:40AM (#16882790)
    (http://slashdot.org/~eldavojohn/ | Last Journal: Tuesday October 16, @03:26PM)
    "Novell pays us some money for the right to tell customers that anybody who uses SUSE Linux is appropriately covered," Ballmer said. This "is important to us, because [otherwise] we believe every Linux customer basically has an undisclosed balance-sheet liability."
    Do me a favor, disclose your 'undisclosed balance-sheet liability' and then we'll listen to you bitch about Linux.

    I haven't seen patent one infringed upon let alone a whole balance sheet's worth so you'll have to excuse me if I seem a bit pessimistic about you strong arming me into using SuSE.

    That's right, you can spin it anyway you want ... but what I see is that Novell just lost all their street cred by selling out to you. What they sold was their future in the open source community. Why do I have this strange view of it all? Well, because I have this sinking feeling that a year or two from now you're going to package some form of Linux (maybe with Windows maybe separately) and you aren't going to release the source code & you're going to earn a profit on supporting it. And people will be pissed and there will be a court case. But you'll hire a thousand and one lawyers and they'll show up and they'll point out to the judge that Linux kernel "infringed upon Windows anyway" and the deal you made with Novell only confirmed it and admitted that they were facing lawsuits from you. The whole time, there won't be any patents cited, no logic will be used but at the end of the day the judge, bless his computer ignorance, will probably agree with you and allow you to continue to release & profit from Linux. But that won't be enough, you'll go after ever user using non-Microsoft-mutated-SuSE Linux and sue every other Linux distro. If that's not your motive, why are you already issuing warnings to users of other distros?

    It's not just any old regular FUD, it's new improved Microsoft FUD.

    Enjoy your $500 million, Novell.