Update on Xara's OS Vector Graphics Project

An anonymous reader writes "We first heard from Xara when they announced their plan to release their crown jewels, the Xara X source code under GPL. Now, 5 scant months since going Open Source, Xara has released Xara Xtreme Linux 0.7, a very functional, robust illustration program. What this means for the Linux Desktop is significant: a true professional grade graphics package. And for a glimpse at what Xara can do, you owe it to yourself to see the new Xara Xtreme Linux Screenshot gallery with amazing, unbelievable vector graphic art."

A few replies so far...

... and the server seems to be showing a very impressive vector graphic of a blank page. What great rendering!

Re:A few replies so far...

> ... and the server seems to be showing a very impressive vector graphic of a blank page. What great rendering!

The font in which "503 - Connection failed" is rendered happens to be vectorized. Does that count?

Re:A few replies so far...

I'm still using the X11 core font subsystem, you insensitive clod!

Better than Illustrator and Freehand?

I haven't used Xara extreme yet, but I have seen artists say that it's better than Adobe Illustrator and Macromedia Freehand (which is what this software competes with) in terms of performance, (some?) features, and ease of use. Sounds like a great new software in Linux' arsenal.

coral to the rescue

here's working coral cache

http://www.xaraxtreme.org.nyud.net:8090/screenshot s.html [nyud.net]

Call me when it does SVG

Just tried the Windoze version for a quickie look at features. No SVG support. As more of the OSS community and others start to create and deliver vector graphics in SVG (check out all the SVGs in Wikimedia Commons or OpenClipart.org), any illustration program without it will gradually lose its user base. It's not that SVG is so wonderful, but it's becoming a necessary tool to have in your arsenal.

Re:Call me when it does SVG

Well, if you'd tried the Linux version, you'd find out it DOES support SVG... It's still in early stages but they are working on full support and new builds are published daily...

Re:Call me when it does SVG

"Well, if you'd tried the Linux version, you'd find out it DOES support SVG... It's still in early stages"... Yeah, and my best friend could put on silk panties and tell me he was in the early stages of a sex change, but it doesn't mean I'd want to kiss him.

- Greg

Re:Call me when it does SVG

You failed to rule out kissing your best friend once the operation is complete, however.

Full opensource ?

IIRC the core of Xara Xtreme were put on some binary only libs. Did these libraries were released in a opensource license in new version ?

Re:Full opensource ?

IIRC the core of Xara Xtreme were put on some binary only libs.

Kind of. There are two renderers. They've open sourced the slower one, and are keeping the faster one closed, for now, at least. The software is fully functional, but it's slower than the closed source version (although still fast enough -- it's comparable to inkscape for the things for which I've been using it.

FWIW, I'm using 0.7 right now, and it's very impressive. There are still a few graphical glitches, and some things that I find easier to do in inkscape/sodipodi. Conversely, there are some things that I can do in Xara that are all but impossible in inkscape. Feathered variable transparency rocks my world. I think it's great that we have both options. Each have their strengths and weaknesses, and I use both for my projects.

The Google cache ...

... is right here [72.14.203.104] and still appears to be building. But at least it's not on fire.

Needless hype

"An anonymous reader" writes: ...crown jewels...5 scant months...a very functional, robust illustration program...a true professional grade graphics package...you owe it to yourself to see the new Xara Xtreme Linux Screenshot gallery...with amazing, unbelievable vector graphic art

Could "An anonymous reader" possibly be Xara?

Check out the source code, this thing is a monolith. I think I'm sticking to Inkscape for now, though I wish the Xara team the best of luck, and it was a nice gesture to release the source code under the GPL.

Slashdotted?

Good to see ./ has still is "magic touch". It's been a while since we slashdotted.

No Cache?

Useless without article... Didn't even make it past 10 comments, site down, mirrordot down, coral cache down, and google cache down...

Looks interesting

Wikipedia has more [wikipedia.org] on Xara (of course).

I'm a huge fan of vector drawing, even to the point of using Inkscape to animate stuff [revis.co.uk]. I can't wait to try this out, especially if it has better support for frame generation.

I owe it to myself...

But unfortunately, the server doesn't owe it to me.

mmmm screenshots.. slashdot..

*Poof*

Anyone got mirrors?

Based on wxWidgets == more than Linux

I'm probably going to make the server burn a little more by piquing Mac user interest in addition to Linux, but, as gleaned from the google cache of the text [72.14.203.104] (the images are still roiling in flames on a server somewhere), they are using wxWidgets [wikipedia.org], and they say they're looking for developers and testers for Mac OS too. I guess a port there is not far off. Presumably other platforms are possible too.

bitmap tracer

Does it have a bitmap tracer and if so how good is it. I do tons of manual vector tracing since all or most suck badly.

Pity about the server ...

... But they're a relatively small shop, which is probably the only reason they're having anything to do with Linux at all (trying to get leverage in a growing niche market). I'm sure they like the press regardless, but I'm guessing nobody's in the office now that it's nearly midnight in Britain.

I am doubtless one of the reasons that Xara LX exists at all -- I wrote their product manager a couple years ago to state I intended to switch to Linux, and would really love it if their product could at least run under WINE; at the time they said they had no intentions on working on a Linux version in the future and that "Linux users seem to expect everything for free". That they are upping the ante and actually making a Linux version that is indeed free is puzzling, but I'm not complaining: I've bought every revision of the software since 1.0 back in the 90s and still prefer it to Inkscape, Illustrator, and all the other competitors on the block.

My only beefs, if I could be said to have any:

• Inkscape has more intelligent handling of shapes. For example, the corner radius of a rounded corner is preserved once a shape is resized; in Xara it changes proportional to the altered dimensions from the original shape. Yuck.
• Inkscape also has a kick-ass calligraphy tool, which isn't useless -- I've already used it to design a product logo for a very real product of a relatively large company. No other vector-based tool for calligraphy comes close.
• I dearly, sorely wish that Xara would figure out how to get SVG support into Xara. It's a glaring omission that isn't going to fly with the Linux crowd. At all. And it's annoying not to have it in Windows, either. Strangely enough, SVG support was one of the excuses I was given by Xara's product manager for not making a Linux version of Xara (e.g. SVG had priority). I wonder how that's shifted now, and if SVG support is still on the agenda, and for which version(s) of their software.
• Finally, I know that Xara had earlier pledged to support another open-source application named UberConverter [scratchcomputing.com] which was supposed to be the Rosetta stone to format interoperability. According to the status page, "xar" file read and write capability is there (at least for the LX format) -- so when is the result going to be integrated directly into Xara?

All told, though, I am grateful to Xara for their decision -- and to all the developers who have contributed to the success of the project. If I could code my way out of a proverbial wet paper bag I would have helped by now, but unfortunately I am one of those individuals who is happy to use Xara's products without having the faintest idea of how to make them (or make them better, in this case).

Re:Pity about the server ...

I dearly, sorely wish that Xara would figure out how to get SVG support into Xara. It's a glaring omission that isn't going to fly with the Linux crowd. At all. And it's annoying not to have it in Windows, either. Strangely enough, SVG support was one of the excuses I was given by Xara's product manager for not making a Linux version of Xara (e.g. SVG had priority). I wonder how that's shifted now, and if SVG support is still on the agenda, and for which version(s) of their software.

Well, it's a tricky thing, because Xara does some rampant* things with vectors, that are often hard to reproduce in other formats. Speaking as the person who designed the original file format filter (import/export) system, I'd have to say that writing a basic SVG exporter isn't hard, and would cover a lot of cases. However, it wouldn't cope with some of the fancier features very well (or at all) - handling everything properly is a lot of work. And producing something that 'kind of' works results in a poor user experience, which is something Xara (the company and product) tries to avoid.

But it would be nice to have a basic exporter for people who want SVG, as I still find Xara the easiest program to use for knocking up diagrams and illustrations (I admit I may be susceptible to some bias here). I still remember trying Visio (when it first came out!) to produce some architecture diagrams for Xara, and wishing that I had a good diagram/illustration package to use for the purpose (talk about catch-22). I try Visio every couple of years, but the UI is still akin to being poked in the eye with a sharp yacht.

* I use the word advisedly, as any of the original Xara developers will know :-)

How does this compare to inkscape?

Inkscape [inkscape.org] seems to be a pretty capable package already (and it supports svg)

Fedora Extras

For Fedora folks, XaraLX and XaraLX-examples are in the Extras repository, which is enabled by default. Just:

yum -y install XaraLX and XaraLX-examples

Debian debs

As no one with Debian uses it, or looks in it, but XaraLX is in "non-free" for Etch and Sid. Looks like the maintainer upgraded it to 0.7 in Sid, Etch is 0.6 currently.

That's not amazing vector artwork

Now THIS [blogspot.com] is some amazing photorealistic vector artwork.

Got it, runnin it.

Running the 0.7 version under Fedora (build 1560) and it looks good so far but haven't done a great deal with it. It's still missing a lot of the bells and whistles (animation, color management), but basic functionality is there. Xara EPS exports open right up in Ghostscript/Scribus so it's already useful on some level.

Apparently, the crew over at Inkscape http://www.inkscape.org/ [inkscape.org] are collaborating in some way with the Xara people so it will be interesting to see if/how this changes/improves either app.

* * * * * *

Adobe Illustrator is a software engineer's misconception of how an artist works.
CorelDraw is an artist's misconception of how a software engineer works.

Xara vs Inkscape

I don't mean to start a "this is better" thread, but does anyone know of a review showing the strengths and weaknesses of Xara vs. Inkscape (besides the latter supporting SVG). In other words, if I'm looking for a vector graphics tool on Linux (used to use Illustrator on Windows before moving to Linux) which should I use?

Inkscape and Xara are comrades

"Xara vs Inkscape" is a silly notion. I have been a member of the Inkscape project for years now; since before it began. We have recently started collaborating with the Xara guys. Inkscape and Xara have a wonderful relationship. There is no "vs." We are basically attacking the problem from different angles, that's all.

Superb GUI

As others already have mentioned Xara has a superb GUI and is easy usable. This is due the fact that Xara tries to be wyoGuide conformant (see http://wyoguide.sf.net/projectlist.php [sf.net]).

O. Wyss

Re:pics mirror?

KWouldK KyouK KratherK KitK KhaveK KaK KonK KeveryK KwordK K?K mmmK?

Re:pics mirror?

GNo.

Re:pics mirror?

You iDiot, we've patented preceding words with a letter. Sincerely, Apple

Re:pics mirror?

But Xara is more than 10 years old, it was the name given in 1995 to the PC orientated side of Computer Concepts, an Acorn orientated company started in 1981. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xara [wikipedia.org]

Re:But does ot run on linu...

So, in 2006, Linux finally caught up to the graphics capabilities of GDI+ and Quartz from six years ago?

Does this mean it's the "year of desktop Linux?" :-P

GIMP

GIMP. Have you heard of it? Not as good as photoshop, but free and works in Linux.

Re:Nice, but...

CorelDRAW was once the industry standard. Things change.

Re:Snore.

The Mac OS X version is still in development (as the Linux version). In the meantime, perhaps this information is helpful for you: Xara Xtreme on Paralles Desktop for OSX: http://www.talkgraphics.com/showthread.php?t=22691 [talkgraphics.com] - Remi

Completely different domains

Uhm... you do realize that Blender is a 3D modelling and rendering program, right? And that Xara is a vector-based drawing program, right?

These are two completely different domains. You use them for different reasons.

Don't get me wrong-- I love Blender. I've been working on using it for special-effects animations, and now I'm attempting to create models for games. Absolutely love it.

But Xara is something else: it's more like Inkscape, or Corel Draw!, or Adobe Illustrator.

Just thought someone should clarify, since you seem to be a bit confused.