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It's Not the 15th Birthday of Linux
Posted by
CmdrTaco
on Thu Mar 19, 2009 07:45 AM
from the burn-the-cake dept.
from the burn-the-cake dept.
Glyn Moody writes "There's been a spate of celebrations of Linux's 15th birthday recently. What they're really marking is the 15th anniversary of version 1.0. But do version numbers matter for free software? The 'release early, release often' approach means there's generally little difference between version 0.99.14z, say, and version 1.0. In fact, drawing attention to such anniversaries is misguided, because it gives the impression that free software is created in the same way as traditional proprietary code, working towards a predetermined end-point according to a top-down plan. So how should we be choosing and celebrating free software's past achievements?"
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Who cares? (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Christmas is based on non-Christian traditions that were absorbed by Christianity because they could not get people to stop celebrating them.
Although that's true, you're glossing over a little history there. The church couldn't get the countryfolk to stop celebrating Saturnalia, Solistice, etc. so they simply scheduled a Christian service for the same time, and anyone who didn't show up was subject to sanctions (note the root of that word, eh?) up to and including being burned at the stake as a pagan idolater.
Hahahaha! My captcha is "oppress"! Jung wins again!
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Who cares? (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
'So how should we be choosing and celebrating free software's past achievements?'
Well, there are enough projects so that, like saints' days, there is something to celebrate every day. For, celebration involves tasty alcoholic beverages and comfy women (well, woman really; my wife).
Re:Who cares? (Score:5, Funny)
For, celebration involves tasty alcoholic beverages and comfy women (well, woman really; my wife).
Wow, so good of you to offer to share her around! Are you sure she'll be up for it?
Parent
Re:Who cares? (Score:5, Funny)
You better believe in Santa or the Coca-Cola guys are gonna come to your house and make you believe.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Yeah Yeah Yeah (Score:5, Insightful)
Free software isn't developed according to the same models as proprietary software. We get that. It's just backwards to complain about how people take the time to celebrate the achievements of free software developers.
LK
Re:Yeah Yeah Yeah (Score:5, Informative)
i'm going to become rich and famous after i invent a device that allows you to stab people in the face over the internet [bash.org]
Parent
"Release early, release often" (Score:5, Insightful)
I've always thought "release early, release often" is a terrible idea. That just means all your end-users will see the crap you're working on before you do the testing, and get a bad impression of your software right from the get-go. It makes sense to do that *after* you hit 1.0 and have a pretty clean product, but why would you want people forming their first impression of your software from untested development releases?
Re:"Release early, release often" (Score:4, Insightful)
Because waiting YEARS for Vista sucked, and the end product sucked even harder after all that wait... that's why.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
You know, announced before it was begun, released before it was stable, out of date before it was fixed, over-priced, under-supported, and just plain crap !
Me, I'll choose evolution over revolution because it seems to work well for other complex systems too.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
At least it worked. That's better than most "released early" open source software I've tried.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Parent item is an uninformed Microsoft troll.
"Release early, release often" doesn't mean you push non-working software into production channels.
The point of "release early, release often" is that a wide and open circle of potential users can become collaborators in the development process.
That doesn't mean they write code or even follow good formal test practices. Even without technical skills, users can contribute materially to the development of a well-run open-source project.
If you won't want to sign up
Re:"Release early, release often" (Score:5, Interesting)
Release early, release often, release statements of current functionality. Seriously, no non-geek is going to be installing software that isn't test by some bff geek anyway. So release early and often so the geeks can help guide its direction and give feedback.
Parent
Re:"Release early, release often" (Score:5, Funny)
I've always thought "release early, release often" is a terrible idea.
My wife tells me the same thing.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
? Strange. Your wife tells me something completely different.
Re: (Score:2)
I don't seem to remember many people complaining about Mozilla Phoenix/Firebird, not-so-many years ago when it hadn't even reached 1.0 ...
Re:"Release early, release often" (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re:"Release early, release often" (Score:5, Funny)
well, the point is to get people to test it so you can know if it's carp or not
Damn straight. I always want to know if there's anything fishy about the software I use.
Parent
Re:"Release early, release often" (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
You don't want to flounder if an unscalable version comes down the pike, though.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Not so hasty. There are some non-obvious benefits to fishy software.
Right now I'm working on Fishix, a *nix based OS that eats it's own bugs!
Which will be real handy. Since I don't know how to program, I'm expecting a lot of bugs!
Linux' Birthday is ... (Score:5, Funny)
Here's one that will last forever... (Score:4, Funny)
Ummm yes... (Score:4, Insightful)
Version numbers matter to the average user. If you have a product that takes years to break version 1.0, the uninitiated will wonder why it took you so long to "get it working." This question is another example of how many FOSS developers and advocates don't understand the basic psychology of the masses.
Re:Ummm yes... (Score:4, Insightful)
Right... the masses... Lets perform a psychology "experiment" here. Ask any non-geek what version number of any piece of software they are running. Hell, ask them for the name of that software. Most cannot answer either. Generally, "the masses" only know a couple things "this is my internet", "this is how I type stuff", "this is how I email", etc.
Parent
Usenet post? (Score:5, Insightful)
Isn't the most logical Linux birthday when Linus first posted his code for others to improve upon? If memory serves me correctly it was a Usenet post?
Re:Usenet post? (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Re:Usenet post? (Score:4, Funny)
That post is more akin to Linus announcing he was pregnant. I would regard the 1.0 release as the birth, with initial coding of the 0.x releases akin to baby showers and painting nurseries.
The conception, like most, was the result of a drunken night in front of a computer terminal, filled with unwise and hasty decisions. When Linus woke the next morning, with the most schocking hangover, he saw before him the beginnings of an x86 OS kernel, with drunken documentation and to do lists, and no memory of how any of it came to be on his hard drive. He took it from there.
I mean, no one honestly decides to write a kernel when they're sober, do they?
Parent
Honestly? (Score:2)
To be honest, I think that this might be part of the reason half the world is having trouble adopting to open source software. It's like a freshman trying to date a senior. GROW UP!
Major versions matter (Score:2)
As long as the developer still has the human trait of assigning meanings to numbers, any major version X will have a gravity that version X-1.9.Z does not. Barring minor versions that happen to match up to pi, prime numbers, fibonacci sequences, etc.
Consciously or subconsciously, someone is saying "what happens next is different", otherwise they'd just make it a point release, or pick a different versioning system.
2000 all over again (Score:5, Funny)
How? That's easy. Why? Because we can. (Score:5, Funny)
So how should we be choosing and celebrating free software's past achievements?"
Booze. Lots and lots of Booze. And strippers. Lots of strippers. And pie. Gotta have some pie.
Whole numbers in versions = big deal (Score:2)
I've been using it longer than 15 years. (Score:4, Informative)
free as in speech or free as in love? (Score:3, Funny)
So how should we be choosing and celebrating free software's past achievements?"
Declare it must be 5-o'clock somewhere, start drinking.
Much older then 15 years. (Score:4, Funny)
We all know that Linux was made in 1979 [wikipedia.org].
[yes this is a joke post]
In Korea (Score:5, Insightful)
It's a different way of counting.
You can consider software (such as Linux) beginning as the first line of code is written, or when the idea was first conceived, or when it was first on the internet, etc. Most people consider version 1.0 to be more of the official "birth" of software.
It's a different way of counting.
Both are correct when thinking of them from different perspectives. To understand this requires mental flexibility in your ways of thinking.
As a further illustration:
The argument presented in both the article and summary:
there's generally little difference between version 0.99.14z, say, and version 1.0
There's generally little difference between a fetus the day before it's born and the day after it's born. But culture generally starts counting after it's born and not at conception. Computer culture often starts counting at v1.0
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
In Korea, you are 1 year old the minute you are born.
China too, but it might be better to translate it as "in your 1st year".
Remember the Millenium (Score:3, Insightful)
Despite the quite correct statement by a few people that the millenium changed Jan 1 2001, the vast majority of people ignored that and celebrated the arrival of 2000 as the new millenium. No matter how right you are about Linux's age etc., the vast majority will completely fail to notice you and your dogmatic assertions, and will enjoy themselves in spite of you.
Thanks for pointing this out (Score:4, Funny)
I, for one, do not plan to attend the parade, now that I know it's all a misguided sham...
I think you're analyzing it too much (Score:4, Insightful)
Perhaps "anniversary" would be a better term. A marriage rarely has its beginnings at the altar or in front of the justice of the peace. The persons involved typically began interacting with each other, learning, and growing together before the date of the actual ceremony, yet we celebrate their anniversary on the date they made their public vows in front of witnesses. I can see a parallel between pre-release and beta editions culminating with a public 1.0 release (or whatever the given name or number of a product may be). I don't see it as a disservice to the open source community to mark such milestones. In fact, if they were to describe the development process similarly to how I described it here--as an ongoing, growing, developing thing--it might actually mean more to some people.
In any case, observing a birthday or anniversary holds powerful meaning regardless of the context (human or inanimate): it means the person or the thing survived the test of time. That's why so many businesses are quick to proclaim "...since 1933", "...established 2006", or similar sentiments that convey age. They understand that people tend to trust established brands, thinking (consciously or subconsciously), "if they've been around that long, they can't be too bad," or, "if they've been around that long, there's a good chance they'll still be around in a few years if I need to exercise my warranty rights."
So, for me, I'll say happy anniversary Linux. You've had a good start. I'm looking forward to what the next 50 years will bring.
A lack of planning (Score:3, Insightful)
A lack of planning and having defined goals is not the same as working in a new and different way. If a survey of the most successful open source project was to be done I would put money on every single one having a strong plan and good leadership. Fair enough that leadership might be technical rather than the typical management type but it would be there.
This whole "we won't call it 1.0 till it does everything perfectly" thinking smacks of childishness to me. Set some goals and publish them along with version numbers so that people know what to expect when. FFmpeg is a prime example of a project that should be 5.0 not 0.5. It's a mature, feature rich and stable lump of code that is in widespread use. Give it a version number that reflect that.
What's so special? (Score:5, Insightful)
a proper linux milestone... (Score:3, Insightful)
the first time a slacker sneered derisively at a red hat user. a.k.a. the beginning of the distro wars.
For Linux 1.0 was NOT the beginning (Score:3, Informative)
For Linux using the release of 1.0 was something that happened late. the .9 series was long lived and mature. I'd been using Linux for a long time before 1.0 was released.
In people years, Linux 1.0 was more like a high school graduation than a birth. It meant that Linux was mostly grown up,
For Linux we do have a very good and well defined "birthday". The day Linux posted on usnet. Use that.
Let's Celebrate! (Score:3, Funny)
Linux: 15 years of being 5 years away from taking over the desktop!