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Microsoft Free, One Year Later
Posted by
kdawson
on Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:28 AM
from the year-of-linux-on-the-desktop dept.
from the year-of-linux-on-the-desktop dept.
madgreek writes "Last year I wrote of my switch from XP to Ubuntu at work. Now a year later, I am back to reflect on one year of being extremely productive at work using (almost) nothing but open source software in a Microsoft world."
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Linux has been business-desktop ready for years. (Score:5, Insightful)
Unfortunately, what's preventing business's adopting Linux or OS X is the fact that the various 'solution providers' & VARs make more money reselling Microsoft products.
Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Insightful)
The article was talking about interoperating with
Import the Cisco Symbols from DIA.
Why not just say "Linux has a Visio Clone: Dia"
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Insightful)
I find it interesting and a little aggravating that people always imply it is the open source software that isn't interoperable, i.e. "Kivio and Dia can't do that." Visio and the .vsd file format are the ones actively trying not to be interoperable, i.e. "the .vsd file format can't do that."
The problem goes away if the people you work with also use open standards. Even if they don't, usually all it takes is for someone to send you an exported image file instead of a .vsd file, as I rarely have to edit a file someone else controls.
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm not idealistic about open standards. I use them because they are convenient and free, not to protest capitalism or something, and I fully realize some people feel a compulsion to use closed formats. More power to them. I'd just like the blame for lack of interoperability to go where the blame is due.
Having done it successfully through two engineering degrees and 10 years in industry, I can tell you that getting around the compatibility barrier is easier than most people think. 99.9% of the time the following magic words work: "I don't have visio, can you export it to a png or something and resend it?" When you send a file to them, do the same thing. Formats specific to a certain software application are meant for the author or a small group of authors to use, who are likely going to be in the same office and therefore can easily use the same software. Export formats are generally much better suited for "publishing" the work to other people who will not need to edit it.
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Informative)
I use Koffice quite often, and Kivio is one of my favorite apps in there.
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Linux Visio Clone. (Score:5, Insightful)
This is the key. They *approach* functionality, but don't *exceed* it. What's the point of a tool if it half-asses it? Just because it's free?
I personally think the biggest Achilles Heel wtih OSS (on top of the crummy user interfaces that seem to be everywhere) is the mindset that *almost* doing it as well as the commercial closed counterparts is good enough, because hey! it's free! We end up with a ton of software that mostly does the same job, if you fidget with it just right, but it's "ok because it's free and open". Firefox got it right - they offer a BETTER product than their competition. Most everything else just feels like it's perpetually playing catch-up.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
A typical mainstream Linux distro is ready. It's often superior in many ways to MS, as MS seems to deliberately makes their OS do almost nothing useful beyond the basics it seems (or was it that Monopoly ruling that caused this?) It's now just 3rd party apps for most people. Web Browsing has reversed itself (there are enough people who wouldn't switch from Firefox due to plug-ins they can't get in IE).
On the Corporate Level, solution providers are slow to change if they're an MS only shop. I even know the university/college level has problems. Blackboard and other such garbage.
I suspect the oncoming economic shitstorm may finally get corporations to really tighten their belts and that company-wide OS licenses may just not fit in the budget anymore looking ahead 5 years in some places. I just hope the current/next generation of purchase managers learns from the past and looks to do away with vendor lock-in in so many areas as much as possible.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Informative)
A two minute search on Google yields CDBurnerXP [cdburnerxp.se] as a freeware CD burning tool and Daemon tools [daemon-tools.cc] as an image mounting tool for Windows.
It might not be free as in speech, but it sure is free as in beer.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Interesting)
Hell, check out that daemon tools page you linked:
"Dear DAEMON Community,
it come to our attention that someone released a fake DT PRO version that is
contaminated with trojans and viruses, among the fact it is only a DT Lite and
not a PRO version!
We cant underscore enough how important it is that you always download from our
official sites and affiliates!
Nowadays, and with the popularity of DAEMON Tools, it is not unusual to see such
attempts to harm others (and, after all, also our reputation).
Rest assured: we double-check all uploads to our official sites and frequently check
them further to make sure you get no harmfull viruses/trojans!"
Frankly just googling and then downloading stuff that looks like it could help is bound to lead to a malware infested computer. One of the very clear things that good Linux distros have over Windows is the use of a centralized software repository.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Insightful)
DT Pro is the version that you have to pay for, thus getting it for free from some shady website should at least make you think twice, in the same way that you probably shouldn't download kernel sources from untrusted websites without checking the MD5/SHA checksum.
I haven't been infested with malware in the last decade, although this is only anecdotal evidence.
It is indeed convenient for installing various software packages --- which is sorely lacking in Windows --- although the usage of a centralized software repository does not guarantee that the binaries will be free of defects/malware either, since someone could poison the upstream source of software(which already happened in the past [slashdot.org]) and the maintainer would have no clue.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
True, but once the upstream project discovers the problem the distro repo. maintainer can release the fixed version as an update, which will automatically apply to all users of their distro.
With random Windows apps I'd have to keep checking their websites or news sites myself to keep track of these issues, or any other security issues with the app. And then manually download it.
The current method adopted by many Windows apps of each having their own 'update manager' process running in the tray is not a sustainable in any way.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
Someone should look at downloads.com for a model of how to present software to end users. It has ratings and reviews from the cnet editors and visitors, screenshots of the products, they test the binaries for malware and offer multiple download sites usually including the makers of the software.
If something like this existed for Linux, it would go a long way to getting more people on board.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Insightful)
Tried any bootleg copies of Microsoft compatable software lately? In Linux, malware is the exception. In Windows, you better have your AV up to date as malware, trojans, and viruses is pretty much standard on the shady side of town.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Informative)
http://weblogs.asp.net/pleloup/archive/2004/01/15/58918.aspx [asp.net]
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Informative)
- Windows Reskits have cdburn.exe and dvdburn.exe - very capable tools for recording media
- D-Tools is free and is an excellent tool
I have multiple machines running Linux and Windows (this particular laptop I am posting a reply from is a Linux only Thinkpad) and Linux is not really more desktop capable. I am playing the devil's advocate here: good for you if you managed to figure out that Linux works better for you.
It doesn't work better for everyone. I need Photoshop (Sorry, I am not too bright to use GIMP), I need a couple of my RTS games that I play casually and I need my Windows Rhapsody client. I use wine for Photoshop, Caesar3 and I use Vmware + Windows 2000 for Rhapsody. I also need Windows to watch streaming Netflix and I'll be creating an XP image in the near future just for Netflix (Netflix supports only WinXP and higher).
So now do you get an idea? Linux isn't desktop ready because a majority of the rest of the world isn't ready for Linux. This is a 100% Linux laptop and still I need to rely on wine and Vmware to use the applications I really want/need.
My first Linux distribution was Redhat 5.2 and it's been quite a journey - Ubuntu 8.04 for me is the closest I've seen to a perfect Linux desktop but as much as I love it and use workarounds to keep using it fulltime, the distribution isn't there yet. Linux *isn't* there yet. I want it to be and I'll rejoice the day I have to stop using my workarounds.
I love using my Linux laptop over my windows machines at home (one's a high end gaming machine, the other's a pretty decent Windows Media Center box) and I love using my Linux machines at work (5 boxes running Linux and one Windows notebook) but I do keep windows around for Windows does tasks that Linux cannot do for me yet.
I usually bash Microsoft and Windows freely but I also do acknowledge Linux's shortcomings. If you believe otherwise, well, there is this certain cliche about ignorance and bliss...
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Insightful)
Are you implying something is there yet? From what I've seen, Apple is closer to "there" than MS. Especially with Vista. MS may be close, but they are headed away from target. At least Linux and Apple are headed in the right direction.
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WINE as workaround (Score:4, Interesting)
As far as I can get the applications I want to run with WINE, I consider Linux desktop ready. WINE is technically a 3rd party app but easily enough available. Ubuntu actually has it as part of the distribution.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
That's all very well for you, but I still need to rely on Linux for my audio software, which just plain doesn't work in Windows. So, Windows isn't ready for the desktop either.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
If you want to compare raw out-of-the-box functionality, then I agree with you-- a default no-frills XP install is practically useless compared to the average default Linux install, which mostly gives you what you need, though there are exceptions.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
The Linux OS itself doesn't provide any of the functionality the GP talks about.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
If an app crashes on a Windows box, it must be Windows fault. If it crashes on a l/unix box, it must be the app's fault.
If an app that runs on Windows has a price tag attached, it must be Windows fault. If an app that runs on l/unix has a price tag attached, the developer needs thier head checked.
If an app comes comes preinstalled in Windows it's bloat (and Microsoft's fault, even though most of the adware/shareware/freeware has nothing to do with them). If an app comes preinstalled with l/unix, it's a feature.
Yes, Windows is not free and it's not open source. When viewed purely as an OS, it certainly isn't perfect. But please, for the love of God, how is it Windows' fault that *any* other application is not free, and most app/security problems because of poor 3rd party coding? Yet every time this discussion rears its head, people trot out a list of free alternatives to applications that have absolutely nothing to do with Microsoft or Windows (as an operating system) as a reason for how much better thier lives are in Windows free world.
If anything, it's the community that should take the blame for the lack of free/open source software on Windows, not Microsoft.
*Disclaimer: I have nothing against either Windows or linux and use both. This rant courtesy of having had to work with some very rabid linux fanboys in the past. The kind that would regularly spend hours, or even days, fine tuning whatever shiny new app they'd discovered for thier linux box - and then turn around and use it as an excuse as to why thier actual work isn't done (and no, they were not sysadmins).
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Insightful)
And how joyous it would have been if IE were not so tightly integrated with Windows following that theory.
However, wanting certain capabilities bundled with the OS is not necessarily asking for it being integrated with the OS.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
While I wouldn't say that OSX isn't ready for the desktop, I would say it might not be ready for the corporate desktop.
One of the places Microsoft has put a lot of effort is into large-scale enterprise systems management. Features of Windows like Active Directory, Group Policy, WSUS, etc are what corporate clients really care about. They want to be able to easily and centrally manage users, permissions, operating system updates, and software restrictions. Unless/until there are tools that allow you to do these kinds of things with OSX and Linux, I think you'll see some hesitation on the part of large corporations.
I know you can do some of this stuff for Linux (user management with LDAP, customized package repos, etc) but I don't know about OSX. I do know however that there is a big difference between "ready for the desktop" and "ready for the corporate desktop".
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Informative)
It is also possible to authenticate against an open ldap server (actually osx uses open ldap) and setup kerberos. The LDAP schema (i suck with ldap) has two fields that are used to push down policies. Apple uses an XML format to describe all the policies which can be used even without OS X server.
The reason I feel that OS X is not ready for big environments is that it's inflexible. You can only hack around so many "features". For instance, we had a hack that's worked for 10.4 to bind to a Novell eDir server on campus without using Novell's schema changes for Mac support. We do not control the Novell servers. However, this appears to be broken in Leopard (10.5).
For the most part, we've had good luck migrating from a windows and mac environment to Mac only. I work for the computer science department at a university. I did not make the decision to migrate as I would have chosen BSD or maybe Linux based on our needs.
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Informative)
"Linux can and does work well in a corporate environment."
Agreed (or at least it does where I work), however it's still along way from breaking the MS 'lock' on the corporate desktop and there doesn't seem to be any 'killer app' to drive the corporates toward a Linux desktop (unless your counting Vista). .
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:5, Insightful)
It's not just the Microsoft products that keep businesses using Microsoft products...it's the business processes that are wrapped around the existing software. Upgrades are expensive, but less expensive than conversions to new software (and processes). There are also costs (and questions) regarding conversion of legacy data.
Until businesses can migrate to systems that are agnostic to specific processes (and applications) , it will be difficult to show a positive return on investment for the large expense.
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Visio, 'ey? (Score:4, Informative)
I think if that was the only thing keeping me on MS's suckware, I would find a way around it.
The main reason businesses run Windows is the same exact reason most home owners run Windows, because it is the default OS. They never give it much consideration to begin with, it's just what comes in the box.
The fact that this monopoly has been allowed to continue all these years is outrageous, really. If 90% of people owned Fords, it would mean that either Fords are way better or that they have unfair competitive advantage.
The Microsoft monopoly in the OS market is the single greatest problem in technology today and the negative effects of the monopoly cascades in every direction.
Visio became popular, not based so much on its merits, which I'm sure it's a fine piece of software, but more because MS leverages the Windows monopoly to push software of every sort. People then used Visio and the closed, proprietary formats of Visio and now because they have so much work stored in these formats it is a deterrent to considering an alternative OS. The problem comes full circle.
So there's my anti-Microsoft rant for the day
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Re:Linux has been business-desktop ready for years (Score:4, Interesting)
Good point. The linux community needs to target startups. If the businesses start with linux, maybe they'll get tied to FOSS. This will create a demand for linux software, and we might see replacements for some of the aging windows software so many businesses use.
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Technologically inclined person successfully uses (Score:5, Funny)
Film at 11.
Re:Technologically inclined person successfully us (Score:4, Funny)
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What I dont get.. (Score:5, Interesting)
Negotiating a seat deal with MS leads to a very nasty possible outcome: invasion by Business Software Alliance. If you refuse, you invalidate all your licenses... and they always find something "illegal". It's one thing to switch because of some perceived wrong or being high and mighty, but a corporation is a corporation. When it comes to software, they literally open themselves up for heavy liability if they accept MS and other COTS software.
GPL means something else too: if you dont create software, you can ignore any "bad side effects". Only violators who refuse to share source are gone after. Usage is truly free of legal ramifications.
Re:What I dont get.. (Score:5, Insightful)
But...You are right...kind of... (you must be a CISSP?)
The funny thing is that the compliances you speak of, are from more respected UNIX/LINUX sources than you think (or care to Google). Just because "Microsoft" is stamped on the box doesn't mean you get a free pass from the NSA or other government security office.
True UNIX and Linux admins don't (and won't) fit into most company IT budgets. Which is why 90% of them are consultants (such as myself), and are treated like rogue warriors, and don't necessarily warrant a full time position. At $75-$125 per hour, they are the true guru's who fix your HP-UX and AIX machines that run your accounting software and gets your numbers to your "precious" shareholders. They are the admins who come in and do "forensics" to figure out where the DOS attacks came from, or how to get your systems running in a hurry.
MSCE's on the other hand ARE $0.10 per baker's dozen, and fit well within the 25K-40K budget for most company IT wages. (And they get the double bonus acting as Windows Help Desk personnel for regular end users.)
They are the ones pointing to the "mystery box" that holds the magical number software as I walk in. Quite often I deal with horrified executives that wonder "Why can't Joe Mcse get it up and running, he's got a certification?!?!" The answer is because it's above their "Geeks" head, and they don't have time to do the research because their phone is ringing off the hook, answering why Outlook isn't responding, or some guy lost his "Start" button.
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You're not the first. (Score:5, Funny)
*Gasp*
Re:You're not the first. (Score:5, Informative)
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Open Source is nice (Score:4, Interesting)
over 45 days... (Score:5, Interesting)
Preventing Linux's 'Last year' (Score:5, Insightful)
Linux has had many years, and for what it has been up against, an illegal government coerced monopoly with more and more stress being put on it from every direction, it has not disappointed me in the slightest. With a dignity I hope that I have a tenth of when I die, Linux users and Linux developers have fought, and some died defending the vision of Linux and the FSF to preserve a future where some of us still do control how our computers are used.
To that end, every year Linux stays alive and relevant is the year of Linux. You see, Linux is fighting constantly a war against complete eradication. Not just Microsoft, but many software vendors, hardware makers, governments, and yes, a malevolent user base hate Linux, and every minute of every day seek to find ways of eradicating Linux from this world. A world where Linux is quarantined into certain sectors like server environment, is a path to extinction like Netware.
As far as Linux in the social arena. Linux as a social movement in its aspect as a social reform movement need not die out. In the Internet world, Linux is a symbol of transparency, of honest behavior, and accountability. Without Linux we would all be staring at a dark Palladium filled future.
So, in the name of the secular Linux social movement for transparency, property rights, freedom of speech and what not. Try and see what you can do to prevent Linux the OS from going into that quite good night. Develop. Write code, fix drivers, create new ideas. That driver for that hardware, that new application may be the driver or the program that changes history.
Yes there are aspects of Linux that are difficult. So, lets make sure this year isn't the last year of Linux, the year Linux became as obscure as DR-DOS, and Amiga, and the Z80. because, I'm sorry, but some things have to be fought for.
Re:Preventing Linux's 'Last year' (Score:5, Funny)
I didn't realize that free software was such a dangerous thing to get into? Did someone overdose on pizza and coke while kernel debugging late one night or something???
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Re:Preventing Linux's 'Last year' (Score:4, Insightful)
Come back down to Earth. The fight is about getting people to look at software differently in order to facilitate more productivity and ultimately better business.
How do you think the general public, let alone a company, would respond to your sci-fi inspired, quasi-revolutionary imagery? You would either be dismissed as delusional or dangerous. In either case, you wouldn't be helping your cause.
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Yay Ambiguous titles (Score:4, Funny)
Was it:
1. Microsoft Free (a year ago Microsoft was released from prison after making a deal with DA which included the real scoop behind flying chairs)
2. Microsoft Free as in Pick Your Free Tibet Joke
From the article, towards the end he mentions he uses XP and enjoys it as well but also mentions All I can say is that for the last year, I have been using Open Source exclusively and I am loving it!...
Quick, someone hire him?
Microsoft free years later (Score:4, Interesting)
He he... Lemme guess... (Score:4, Funny)
Day 365, "Microsoft-Free":
I'm so glad this sham is over. I can't *wait* to get back to using a fully-featured OS with productivity applications capable of handling actual, real-life, grownup business needs.
Oh, and I can't wait until I don't have to f-ing hack my own drivers for new "cutting-edge" (and by "cutting-edge" I mean 2-year-old, in common use my the majority of PC users) hardware.
To be honest, I actually didn't even *use* Linux except to boot, start a VM, and run Windows to actually get the Grown-Up Work done for the last nine months.
Re:Oh sweet, MS Free! (Score:4, Funny)
I'll keep that in mind for the next time my girlfriend have a "headache".
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Re:Oh sweet, MS Free! (Score:4, Informative)
Of course he probably has a couple of pets on the thing now seeing that it took him quite a while to even get it into a state where it would accept updates and we all have external IPs.
For reference, on the latest Ubuntu I have my 3D acceleration ( on both screens ) and wireless on the laptop out of the box. My main gripe is the flash plugin for firefox crashing every now and then, but I'm guessing that is really adobe's fault.
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Re:I went the opposite direction (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes. The Civic is cheap, fuel-efficient, probably more reliable than the BMW these days, and gets me from A to B without making a fuss about it. Why would I want the more expensive BMW? For a few extra toys? Fuck that.
Of course in this analogy the Civic is Linux and the BMW is Windows (though I believe everything I said is true about Hondas and BMWs too). I do have a real-life anecdote though to make this post more meaningful.
I got two pieces of new hardware recently. A Kodak EasyShare P850 digital camera and an Epson Stylus E66 printer. Neither is exactly new, but the Kodak is still available first-hand.
The Kodak was an easy one. The instructions for Windows entailed installing the software FIRST (bad things can happen if you plug it in first apparently) and then doing stuff with the camera. Under Linux, installation involved plugging in the camera. Kubuntu detected the camera, and offered to start up digiKam for me so I could get the pictures. Worked first time.
The printer was a slightly more involved issue. My mum and the seller (both Windows people) were fussing about drivers. They knew the CD only included Windows drivers, but I ended up with an e-mail linking me to the website, where one or both thought I may find Linux drivers. As I expected, nothing was present (only Windows drivers, not even Mac OS X drivers, shame on Epson). So I plugged it in, went through drivers in KControl, found the printer, selected Epson Stylus E66 drivers, gave the printer a name, and found that it now worked.
The lesson I've learned with all this is that Linux either works with your hardware, or it doesn't. There's no driver installation or anything. It it works, it works right away. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work and won't work until it's in the kernel. So it's either perfect usability, or no usability at all. My idea of hell being forever made to try and get non-kernel supported hardware working with Linux. It's that bad.
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